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How many WDCs will Alonso win?


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#101 Spunout

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 01:13

No, you can almost yount people who object my posts on the fingers of the one hand: you, Weber, HSJ, menace, tojack, Tubbs. If I forgot somebody, sorry, I din't mean to.



From this thread alone you forgot BorderReiver.

Now, if we list the most active participants of this "was Renault/McLaren best car this year" debate - again, from this thread alone - we pretty much have Speed_A (die-hard Alonso fan) vs the rest.

Basically your claims are A) Alonso is better driver than Räikkönen, and B) McLaren was better car than Renault this year

You are entitled to your opinions, but if you seriously claim everybody except the 6 posters listed above agree with you...

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#102 Bravo

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 01:30

Originally posted by jokuvaan
Maybe FIA will screw some teams and get goodyear or somebody to do the job more neutrally.

I hope so.

Originally posted by Spunout


From this thread alone you forgot BorderReiver.

Now, if we list the most active participants of this "was Renault/McLaren best car this year" debate - again, from this thread alone - we pretty much have Speed_A (die-hard Alonso fan) vs the rest.

Basically your claims are A) Alonso is better driver than Räikkönen, and B) McLaren was better car than Renault this year

You are entitled to your opinions, but if you seriously claim everybody except the 6 posters listed above agree with you...

If you think Speed_A is the only who agrees with those 2 points you are missing the reality of this forum. It's true Speed_A sometimes tends to exagerate the point and may be that weakens his stance but I realize how many many people (obviously non-Alonso fans) got the belief that this year Alonso's was the best performance. Maybe his race in Japan and his win in China helped to change a perception about his true character. Thence they are not interested in taking part of a fierce fanboyism argument. Me neither.

#103 Makarias

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 01:51

It's funny (well actually not funny) how so many RC threads all end up looking the same after a while.

My guess is 2 to 47 WDCs for Alonso. 1 is also a possibility, but I'm going out on a limb here.

#104 skittt

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 05:17

Originally posted by Bravo
Quite the oposite I would say. Ferrari has a preferece treatment from Bridgestone and I don't think they are going to lose this condition in the next years. Recall cases like McLaren and B∙A∙R scaping from Bridgestone. Actually I believe this is what will happen with a single (Bridgestone) tyre supplier. The boy in red will be very lucky in the future.

Not without Rory Byrne and without Tombazis... They are both gone from Ferrari, BTW... Ferrari's problems are so much more than only tyres, it is the chassis and the aerodynamics....

#105 skittt

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 05:19

Originally posted by jokuvaan
Maybe FIA will screw some teams and get goodyear or somebody to do the job more neutrally.

Agree, the single tyre supplier in the near future will not be Michelin or Bridgestone...

#106 boostpressure

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 05:28

Originally posted by Tubbs


You are pathetic.


:rotfl: :rotfl:

take a look in the mirror..... :D

#107 boostpressure

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 05:33

Originally posted by Menace
I have no idea how many championships he might win, but he will not win anymore unless he happens to sit in the best car over the season. That includes both reliability and outright speed.


Same goes for Kimi.

Everyone is beating the drums of Kimi and Alonso, I'd say the man to watch out for next year is Mr Montoya, provided McLaren get it right.

#108 skittt

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 05:44

Originally posted by boostpressure


Same goes for Kimi.

Everyone is beating the drums of Kimi and Alonso, I'd say the man to watch out for next year is Mr Montoya, provided McLaren get it right.

According to the numerology thingy I posted a while ago, Montoya is one of the drivers that could win the WDC in 2006. The others are Michael, Ralf or one of the Williams drivers...


http://forums.autosp...y=&pagenumber=3

#109 boostpressure

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 05:45

Originally posted by skittt
According to the numerology thingy I posted a while ago, Montoya is one of the drivers that could win the WDC in 2006. The others are Michael, Ralf or one of the Williams drivers...


I reckon were both onto something....... :up: :D

#110 skittt

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 05:52

Originally posted by boostpressure


I reckon were both onto something....... :up: :D

:up:

#111 Ricardo F1

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 07:08

Is Kimi getting injured next season to make up for this? :smoking:

#112 chak

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 10:27

it's these playschool arguments that make BBs worth visiting :D

if i started a thread called.. " who is faster? - FA or KR?", it'd hit 450 pages in two days.

#113 Tubbs

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 11:10

Originally posted by boostpressure


:rotfl: :rotfl:

take a look in the mirror..... :D


I see no reason to so why should I? Would you say Renault was only a decent car? :rolleyes:

#114 boostpressure

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 12:01

Originally posted by Tubbs


I see no reason to so why should I? Would you say Renault was only a decent car? :rolleyes:


The Renault was more than a decent car, no doubt.

Simply though, you think Kimi has some sort of phenomenal speed advantage over the rest of the field when, in reality, he dosen't. His car was superquick and once Montoya got it working the way he liked it, he was basically just as quick, sometimes quicker.

don't get me wrong, Kimi is very good, very fast. However put Alonso (and others) in the MP4/20 and they would seem phenomenally quick also.....

the Renault simply didn't have the McLaren's pure speed more often than not. On the occasions it did, particularly early on in the season, Alonso was the pacesetter.

#115 Spunout

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 12:05

If you think Speed_A is the only who agrees with those 2 points you are missing the reality of this forum.



No. Speed_A seems to think EVERYBODY except the 6 people listed by him agrees with those 2 points.

It's true Speed_A sometimes tends to exagerate the point and may be that weakens his stance



Really?

but I realize how many many people (obviously non-Alonso fans) got the belief that this year Alonso's was the best performance.



Sure. But even if majority of people believe Alonso was the better man, it´s still far from "everybody except 6 people". And I have never claimed "general consensus" here - in this thread or forum - actually means anything.

Maybe his race in Japan and his win in China helped to change a perception about his true character. Thence they are not interested in taking part of a fierce fanboyism argument. Me neither.



I would love to see him in the same position with KR this year: being forced to race that way most of the time. Could he pull that off (without making more mistakes)? I don´t know. But it would be interesting...and entertaining, as well.

#116 pRy

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 12:13

1

#117 magicalonso

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 12:46

Originally posted by Makarias
It's funny (well actually not funny) how so many RC threads all end up looking the same after a while.

Right..Some people don't seem to be able to discuss Alonso without making a 3+ page thread out of it. :p

#118 Bravo

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 13:54

Originally posted by Spunout
No. Speed_A seems to think EVERYBODY except the 6 people listed by him agrees with those 2 points.
Really?
Sure. But even if majority of people believe Alonso was the better man, it´s still far from "everybody except 6 people". And I have never claimed "general consensus" here - in this thread or forum - actually means anything.
I would love to see him in the same position with KR this year: being forced to race that way most of the time. Could he pull that off (without making more mistakes)? I don´t know. But it would be interesting...and entertaining, as well.

I would love as well. Even if that means my fav driver doesn't win the championship. :)

#119 Blaka Da Uglav

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 14:02

To rise just a little bit over the FA vs. KR "who is better" arguing, here is my opinion:
I'm a fan of FA but that is just a matter of taste. Beside that fact, I rate FA an KR pretty equally. In my eyes they are both on the same level, they're both superb drivers. Therefore I also predict that they will both win approx. same number of WDC's. The only thing that will make the difference are the general ciurcumstances (quality of the car, quality of the team, strenght of opponents, number of opponents, accidents and last but not least: plain luck).
How many for Alonso: I hope as many as he can get :D
Peace

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#120 Speed_A

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 14:15

Originally posted by Spunout


No. Speed_A seems to think EVERYBODY except the 6 people listed by him agrees with those 2 points.

In fact, the six or so of you are the only ones who think I'm crazy because I don't believe KR performed better than FA and consider McLaren the best car. It seems like KR fanatics react very strongly when any of those two claims appear. For them, it's a sacrilege to doubt KR as the supreme driver and to proclaim McLaren to be the best car. If the truth turns out to be the opposite, well, they don't care.

#121 Arrow

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 14:18

He will be a multiple WC no doubt. Hes only 24.

#122 Jason

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 14:49

Originally posted by gerry nassar
It depends on the cars he is in and the circumstances. He could only win 1 or he could win 10. Same goes for the other top drivers.

I thought I read somewhere he has no interest in racing as long as Michael Schumacher has. Given that, I'd put his upper limit somewhere in the 6 title range.

#123 Spunout

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 14:49

In fact, the six or so of you are the only ones who think I'm crazy because I don't believe KR performed better than FA and consider McLaren the best car. It seems like KR fanatics react very strongly when any of those two claims appear. For them, it's a sacrilege to doubt KR as the supreme driver and to proclaim McLaren to be the best car.



No. Whether KR performed better than FA is difficult question. They have never been teammates and thus we have no direct comparison. Whenever KR is few tenths faster per lap we say McLaren is few tenths faster per lap. And vice versa. But we cannot know for sure if that´s the case. IMO both were brilliant this year.

Now, saying McLaren was better car simply suggests you know very little about racing. You underestimate the importance of reliability and overestimate the speed advantage of McLaren. Having faster car approx 2/3 of the time helps very little if you give dozens of points away because of mechanical gremlins.

The reason I think you are "crazy" is the way you back up your opinion. It changes every 2 minutes, depending on how you can make your heroes (MS & FA) look good. This thread is brilliant example. Whether it´s stats, equipment or history, everything depends on whether "your man" (your expression) won the battle.

And, like all good fanboys - you want to win the battle here.

If the truth turns out to be the opposite, well, they don't care.



I don´t care either. I like racing. Simple. May the best package win.

This year it was Fernando Alonso & Renault, and that´s great.

If the truth turns out to be the opposite? What truth?

#124 SeanValen

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 15:05

Originally posted by Arrow
He will be a multiple WC no doubt. Hes only 24.



What if he wants to retire at 30 , Michael's longativity in f1 isn't for everyone.


Can never really guess what anyone's can do with their life, what if Alonso gets married, and thinks he has nothing more to do in f1 etc.

He talks mature already, he maybe 24, but there's a old soul in there, along with brash attitude with youth, perhaps that will make him feel more older at 30-33. I can see why drivers like DC, Rubens continue, they'll probabley continue since they've haven't won as much as they would of liked, nor a championship etc If Alonso has a tough season next year and year after, and then maybe wins it in 3-4 years time, he could see leaving then as going out on a high, and young enough to move on, he's been racing karts and stuff since a young age, but the way he talks, f1 and driving, he looks like he can enjoy life outside f1 when he's done with it.



Another way to look at it.

#125 chak

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 04:23

Originally posted by SeanValen



What if he wants to retire at 30 , Michael's longativity in f1 isn't for everyone.


Can never really guess what anyone's can do with their life, what if Alonso gets married, and thinks he has nothing more to do in f1 etc.

He talks mature already, he maybe 24, but there's a old soul in there, along with brash attitude with youth, perhaps that will make him feel more older at 30-33. I can see why drivers like DC, Rubens continue, they'll probabley continue since they've haven't won as much as they would of liked, nor a championship etc If Alonso has a tough season next year and year after, and then maybe wins it in 3-4 years time, he could see leaving then as going out on a high, and young enough to move on, he's been racing karts and stuff since a young age, but the way he talks, f1 and driving, he looks like he can enjoy life outside f1 when he's done with it.



Another way to look at it.


sad but true... good post

#126 Weber

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 16:38

Originally posted by Speed_A
No, you can almost yount people who object my posts on the fingers of the one hand: you, Weber, HSJ, menace, tojack, Tubbs. If I forgot somebody, sorry, I din't mean to.


The long list of your mistakes just grows and grows.

I'm not a KR fan, just a casual F1 spectator. The reason why I object your posts is simply because you crystallize in them mostly colossal stupidity, ignorance, fanboyism, double standards and arrogance, just to name a few. So it makes it very difficult for me to not stop and mock them. :lol:

#127 bl-f1

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 17:57

Originally posted by Rob Silver Speed


IMO you'd have seen renault dominate because fisico wouldn't be playing second fiddle


:rotfl:

#128 Cosmograph

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 18:17

I'd agree that the new crop of drivers probably won't be racing late into the 30's. However, they will probably still have a similar run of years given the fact that they are entering the sport at a younger age. What will play against Alonso's (or any driver's) attempts to match Schumi is the odds that Ferrari's unparalleled advantage won't be replicated anytime soon.

#129 Jack Rabbit

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 18:58

Originally posted by Jason

I thought I read somewhere he has no interest in racing as long as Michael Schumacher has. Given that, I'd put his upper limit somewhere in the 6 title range.


I think he said something along the lines of he wouldn't want to keep racing for another ten years if he wasn't winning. So if he got into a position like schu at ferrari, we might see him keep racing until his mid/late thirties.

#130 skittt

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 20:34

Alonso started in F1 at 19, there is no way he is going to drive until he is 39. Nobody drives for 20 years in F1.....

#131 Jason

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 05:41

Originally posted by Jack Rabbit


I think he said something along the lines of he wouldn't want to keep racing for another ten years if he wasn't winning. So if he got into a position like schu at ferrari, we might see him keep racing until his mid/late thirties.

What I read him say was he had other interests outside of F1, and that he finds it hard to imagine himself racing when he gets into his 30s. It was something I read towards the beginning of the season and it surprised me to hear him say because I had him pegged as the one guy to could challenge some of MS's records, if he raced in F1 long enough. That's why I remembered it. Although, I can't remember his exact words, it was something to that affect.

#132 Arrow

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 06:38

Originally posted by Jason

What I read him say was he had other interests outside of F1, and that he finds it hard to imagine himself racing when he gets into his 30s. It was something I read towards the beginning of the season and it surprised me to hear him say because I had him pegged as the one guy to could challenge some of MS's records, if he raced in F1 long enough. That's why I remembered it. Although, I can't remember his exact words, it was something to that affect.


I wouldnt take too much notice of what he said, because at 24, 30s are a long way away and its natural for him to think he will want to move on by that stage, but im pretty sure once he gets to that age he will see nothing has changed and that he still has the hunger.

#133 Speed_A

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 07:53

Originally posted by Weber


The long list of your mistakes just grows and grows.

I'm not a KR fan, just a casual F1 spectator. The reason why I object your posts is simply because you crystallize in them mostly colossal stupidity, ignorance, fanboyism, double standards and arrogance, just to name a few. So it makes it very difficult for me to not stop and mock them. :lol:

And mock yourself in the process ;)

#134 Lagonda

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 14:13

I can see him going off to the States in a few years just for the hell of it. We know he doesn't want to stick around as long as Schumi. I think after he has won the WDC a couple of times, maybe with another constructor, he'll take off and find a new challange, or just retire - Maybe he'll become Spanish Prime Minister, who knows! - It really is a "How long is a piece of string?" question.  ;)

A racing drivers future is full of if's, buts and maybe's but I reckon he's got the passion and talent for another one, maybe two if next years MacLaren isn't as consistant as it should be. Kimi will be his closest rival for the next couple of years.