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The cutaway drawing and its artists


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#3751 Tony Matthews

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 12:41

Posted Image

This should be clearer and a better colour than the earlier posts - fear not, no more Pennzoil Lolas to come! Edited to reduce the size, even this is bigger than the artwork, which in my view is Not A Good Idea.

Edited by Tony Matthews, 14 February 2010 - 12:54.


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#3752 RTH

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 12:42

When I look at the above picture, it is so astonishing I still find it hard to comprehend that this is created by the human eye and hand , it is talent so great as to be almost unbelievable and must rank at least with the greatest painters of all time the detail and can only be marvelled at. People getting multiple tens of millions for a singe art work recently are not even remotely in Tony's league. Equally Andrew Kitson's incredible ability with painting on a wide variety of subjects takes your breath away.

#3753 Alan Cox

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 12:54

When I look at the above picture, it is so astonishing I still find it hard to comprehend that this is created by the human eye and hand

Hear, hear!

#3754 macoran

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 12:54

From Inside 100 Great Cars and issue 25 of The Car magazine, Jim Allington's Frazer Nash Shelsley
Posted Image
That double chain drive is really well detailed.
Seeing the date Allington signed it off with, I wonder which magazine/who commissioned the drawing!

#3755 Tony Matthews

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 12:57


Very kind words Richard. Thank you.

#3756 macoran

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 12:59

I hope no one minds me posting yet another Pennzoil 91 Lola,

I mind so much, I think I'd whack you one (oops!!!, :yawnface: I think you're a lot bigger than I am) if ever I found out you had held this beauty from us.

Great Índy brickyard feel to it Tony

#3757 Tony Matthews

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 13:22

From Inside 100 Great Cars and issue 25 of The Car magazine, Jim Allington's Frazer Nash Shelsley
Posted Image
That double chain drive is really well detailed.
Seeing the date Allington signed it off with, I wonder which magazine/who commissioned the drawing!

I worked alongside that car for years, Marc! Jim's 'studio' was originally his father's workshop, and after the big table-saw and various other bits were taken out there was room for three or four drawing boards and a car! The Shelsley FN was aquired from a friend - I think the deal was a Vincent Black Shadow and some cash - but the FN needed a lot of work. Not least the making of patterns and castings of all the supercharger inlet manifolds, a new radiator shell, new supercharger internals, complete re-trim in green leather and respray. That list is far from complete!

The drawing was originally B&W, so the colour was added years later - whether it was commissioned or not I don't know, but Jim did this with quite a few early cutaways in later years. The B&W version appeared along with an article about the car in Automobile Quarterly Volume 23, number 1, from 1985 but the artwork is undated, like all Jim's early drawings. He may have done it for AQ and the feature, or they may have done the feature because the artwork existed!

Edited to say that I've now been back and checked the date on the colour version! Jim must have added the colour almost straight away, but the AQ version is B&W and undated! At least I dated mine, a boone to me now as detail gets lost in the mists of time...

Edited by Tony Matthews, 14 February 2010 - 13:26.


#3758 Tony Matthews

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 13:29

Great Índy brickyard feel to it Tony

:lol: Actually, the paviours outside the then newish Lola factory!

#3759 ibsenop

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 19:15

NSU Prinz 4 1967 by Schlenzig (from the web)

Posted Image

and NSU 1200C 1971 by Schlenzig (from the web, also)

Posted Image

Ibsen

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#3760 onelung

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 22:37

I'll put this in as a link (hope it works), as I'm unsure about copyright, but the vehicle is certainly new to me, and ... just how does the transmission function? (and that question coming from a Sizaire owner..!) Hope it's of interest to you. What a fascinating thread this is.

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#3761 Tony Matthews

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 23:18

I'll put this in as a link (hope it works), as I'm unsure about copyright, but the vehicle is certainly new to me, and ... just how does the transmission function? (and that question coming from a Sizaire owner..!) Hope it's of interest to you. What a fascinating thread this is.

Visit My Website

That is a fascinating engine and final drive layout!

#3762 macoran

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 23:25

and ... just how does the transmission function?

Very interesting beast !!
As to how the transmission works ....it is described in the article text.

#3763 Tony Matthews

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 23:32

As to how the transmission works ....it is described in the article text.

Oi! Marc, you are supposed to say - "It's obvious from the technical illustration!"  ;)

#3764 macoran

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 23:37

Oi! Marc, you are supposed to say - "It's obvious from the technical illustration!" ;)

Goes to show.......I haven't a clue about technical illustration

#3765 Tony Matthews

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 23:50


It is not exactly clear from the drawing, but it should be - probably another case of a rush job without enough information. But it served it's purpose at the time.

#3766 macoran

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 00:21

It is not exactly clear from the drawing,

It is, but I love a bit of provocation now and then........
ah ...my spare ribs are done, and the wine has been poured
Olympics !!!!

#3767 onelung

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 05:46

It is, but I love a bit of provocation now and then........
ah ...my spare ribs are done, and the wine has been poured
Olympics !!!!


Apologies Marc, but it is not clear to me, either from the drawing or the text .. " ...from the rear of the transmission via three helical gears.." blah blah blah..

Does it have sliding pinions somewhere in the train, or what?

You lucky man, having spare ribs - is it a genetic thing, perchance? :wave:

#3768 Tony Matthews

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 05:55

You lucky man, having spare ribs - is it a genetic thing, perchance? :wave:

He's built like a snake...

#3769 Duc-Man

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 10:02

I just checked if those two have been posted before. They haven't.

Posted Image

Posted Image

For both pictures: artist unknown and not bigger available.

#3770 Tony Matthews

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 10:29

Posted Image
Acknowledgments to McLaren Cars/Mail on Sunday

Not a cutaway, but a technical illustration - anyone notice the 'deliberate' errors?

Edited by Tony Matthews, 15 February 2010 - 10:32.


#3771 eldougo

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 10:36

the top and bottom wishbones are the wrong way around ti fit onto the upright

#3772 Tony Matthews

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 10:56

the top and bottom wishbones are the wrong way around ti fit onto the upright

Exactly! How fundamental is that? I would send you a coconut, eldougo, if I had one.

The rear wishbones are OK, but both front and rear spring/damper units are shown as being horizontal, which is unlikely - but then I suppose it's a case of who cares as long as it looks pretty. I hope the lads in the build shop don't use this as a guide...

Edited by Tony Matthews, 15 February 2010 - 11:01.


#3773 Tony Matthews

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 12:26

For both pictures: artist unknown and not bigger available.

First one must be a Betti, most likely Bruno, second one is a name I know but won't come to me - the oracle that is macoran will know.

#3774 macoran

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 20:00

Posted Image

Posted Image

For both pictures: artist unknown and not bigger available.

I'm with Tony on Bruno Betti having done the 1984 Rallye Quattro
and since the 1985 S1 Quattro is a Technical Art drawing, I think the signature should read Norbert Schäfer

Edited by macoran, 15 February 2010 - 20:00.


#3775 ibsenop

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 20:14

Tony and Marc, You are right.

The first Audi is a Bruno Betti.

Posted Image

and the second is Thechnical Art by N. Schäfer

Posted Image
(Not the same cutaway but the same signature)

Ibsen

#3776 TWest

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 20:36

The knowledge that gets dredged up from the depths of this group is spooky on occasion. The logic and observation of the comparative technique is amazing, but the retrieval of information is even stranger.
Almost verges on stalking behavior, except that I can't believe that Tony or any of the other heroes of the "sport" ever had to chase guys out of the bushes in the morning.
I spent the last four days at the opening race for NHRA here in Pomona, and I would get the news that some tall sort of skanky looking guy with bad teeth is looking for you. Went through the whole weekend with guys coming up to meet me or have me sign something, and they were (gads) my age ... and ever one was a guy. How depressing is that?
Will presume that this group is much classier than that, but this activity doesn't, as we have discussed, seem to engender voluptuous young women as fans somehow.
Ever feel like you took a wrong turn somewhere, Tony?
Tom West

#3777 Tony Matthews

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 20:53

... except that I can't believe that Tony or any of the other heroes of the "sport" ever had to chase guys out of the bushes in the morning.

I have, but it wasn't me they were after...


Ever feel like you took a wrong turn somewhere, Tony?

Yep, got married twice.

#3778 ibsenop

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 21:03

Arrows FA1 by Giogio Piola

Posted Image

Ibsen

Edited by ibsenop, 15 February 2010 - 21:03.


#3779 Tony Matthews

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 21:12

Arrows FA1 by Giogio Piola

Posted Image

Ibsen

Bloody Hell, that's brought back some unpleasant memories... I was involved in the High Court plagarism/copyright case involving Arrows and Shadow. Not much fun...

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#3780 ibsenop

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 21:40

Sorry, Tony. It was not my intention.
But... I'm curious, why? was you an Arrows's spy?
Feel free to not reply.

#3781 macoran

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 21:48

But... I'm curious, why? was you an Arrows's spy?

Ibsen, Tony just admitted to chasing people out of bushes !!!
:p

#3782 Tony Matthews

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 22:48

Ibsen, Tony just admitted to chasing people out of bushes !!!
:p

Well, I have chased people into bushes too!

Not a spy Ibsen, but I was asked by Arrows to prepare some drawings to prove that certain aspects of most F1 cars of that time were similar, so the Arrows looking like a Shadow was coincidence. I had a call from a lawyer, or court official, asking me to attend court, and as I didn't know better I agreed. Apparently I should have refused, and then been forced to attend. By agreeing it made me look as though I was supporting Arrows, rather than just being an 'expert witness'. In court I found myself sitting immediately behind Don Nichols, who turned and glared at me with pure hatred...

The case was a farce, the Arrows was a copy, I knew it, everyone knew it, and I was like a lamb to the slaughter when it was my turn to be cross-examined. Totally unprepared for the onslaught, I didn't get a chance to defend myself, or even say that it didn't matter who had commissioned my drawings, Tony Southgate or Don Nichols, they would have been the same, and it was not for me to interpret them. Just an embarrassing thirty minutes, and I felt I'd been left to my own devices with no word of warning or advice. All I got was character assasination - I don't blame the barrister, he was just doing his job, but forwarned I could have given as good as I got. On reflection I probably didn't do too badly, but I was angry that I had even been involved. I am fairly sure I didn't get paid, but there is a chance that I was.

In those days it was possible to park near the Court, and as I was leaving, wearing the nicest bespoke suit I've ever owned, fit, tanned and Rayban'd, crossing the road to my Lotus Cortina, a sight-seeing coach-load of foreign girls drove slowly past. A stunning blond did a genuine-double take when she saw me, waved and screamed, at which point most of her friends turned and did the same, so my spirits were lifted. Life goes on...

#3783 TWest

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 00:14

When we started our company in diecast, the company that my partner and I had worked for sued us just to try to keep us out of the business. They actually made statements that this was their business and they could determine what anyone else did in it.
I went through something like 8 hours of deposition, although I ended up having to come back, so it was probably more like 12 ... you would that thought this was actually important stuff. After we took the first break, our lawyer took me to a conference room and said I was killing him. Quit trying so hard to tell the truth; if you don't remember, just say that. It can be interpreted that you are trying to make something up. I stopped trying so hard and he almost threw me a party.
Best part of the deal was when the opposition lawyer was talking about how we owed them part of the proceeds since we stole the designs from them ... which wasn't even close to true. I told him that he should have his client write us a check if that was the case, and pulled out a little accounting sheet that showed we hadn't made anything from the project because of their interference with our client. Looked like someone had shot his puppy.
Was also asked to be an expert witness at one point for an exploding Pinto case. I had worked for General Motors in one of the assembly plants, and was pretty familiar with assembly process and procedure. I went under this thing and saw a whole series of straightenings and welding that had happened under this thing ... would have been called Frankenpinto if I had been doing comedy about it. I dug in with them a bit to find that this woman had a habit of pulling out in front of cars and had been rear-ended in this thing four times, including the incendiary incident. I told them that this had nothing to do with Ford, or their pathetic pictures of the victim (the woman's son who was in the back seat). This was exclusively her fault and that the integrity (whatever there was) had been so compromised by all the crappy repair work that I wouldn't even talk about it. And, if I could tell it by looking under there for two minutes, so could anyone the defense would bring in. Case closed, although I think they actually made a run at it anyway.
And, of course, there is the divorce process ...
We, of course, claim to have the best legal system in the world. Must be with all the damned lawyers about ...
Tom West

Now, what this has to do with Cutaways I am not sure.

#3784 Tony Matthews

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 00:33

Now, what this has to do with Cutaways I am not sure.

It means everything we have earned doing them has gone on wives and lawyers. And to think people assume we just sit at a drawing board, sharpening pencils and looking out of the window...

#3785 TWest

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 01:24

It means everything we have earned doing them has gone on wives and lawyers. And to think people assume we just sit at a drawing board, sharpening pencils and looking out of the window...


Well ... I have frosted glass here, and the board tilts to block the view of that, so I have gotten into the habit of not staring out the window.
Before losing the house, I had a look up at a hillside that always had California quail, roadrunners, coyotes ... a live-action Warner Brothers cartoon out there to watch ... although I should not know that if I hadn't spent some time looking ...
As to the wife ... she is certainly doing fine, it seems.
TW

#3786 Duc-Man

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 10:39

Here are two that haven't been posted here for sure. Both were done for Motor Klassik in 1989/90 by Antonio Eiras.

Chaparral 2F

Posted Image

Mercedes 300SL

Posted Image

And guys don't wonder about the quality/look, I did them with a digital camera (since I don't have an A3 scanner).

:wave: I fixed the links. They work now. :wave:

Edited by Duc-Man, 16 February 2010 - 17:40.


#3787 macoran

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 17:16

Here are two that haven't been posted here for sure. Both were done for Motor Klassik in 1989/90 by Antonio Eiras.

Chaparral 2F

Posted Image

Mercedes 300SL

Posted Image

And guys don't wonder about the quality/look, I did them with a digital camera (since I don't have an A3 scanner).

Your thumbnails don't work for me

I don't have an A3 scanner either, I always make two A4 scans and splice them

Edited by macoran, 16 February 2010 - 17:18.


#3788 Tony Matthews

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 17:44

Your thumbnails don't work for me

Nor me - I've been disappointed for hours.

#3789 ibsenop

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 18:34

The thumbnails don't work for me either.

An A3 scanner is very expensive here in Brasil, so I always make two or more A4 scans if necessary and splice them also.

You can do A4 scans of them and send the parts to me. I splice them for us.

#3790 Duc-Man

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 18:46

Guys I fixed the links about an hour ago and they do work in my post.

For some reason they do not work in Marc's quoted post.

I scanned them before and tried to splice them together but it just won't work.
If somebody wants to do it let me know. But I tell you straight away: the files are big!

Edited by Duc-Man, 16 February 2010 - 18:46.


#3791 macoran

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 20:13

Guys I fixed the links about an hour ago and they do work in my post.

For some reason they do not work in Marc's quoted post.

I scanned them before and tried to splice them together but it just won't work.
If somebody wants to do it let me know. But I tell you straight away: the files are big!

They wouldn't work in my quoted post because the links weren't repaired then yet. computers are only "so" smart !
I think I've spliced something for you before ?

Edited by macoran, 16 February 2010 - 20:14.


#3792 werks prototype

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 00:47


Illustrations by SIGS (Semcon Informatic Graphic Solutions) Scania.

Edited by werks prototype, 28 April 2010 - 17:43.


#3793 werks prototype

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 01:07

Tony was there much of an interesting back-story associated with the production of your March Buick 85G cutaway?

#3794 werks prototype

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 04:04


LOLA/MAZDA T616 (Mazda-Motorsports)

Edited by werks prototype, 28 April 2010 - 17:49.


#3795 Tony Matthews

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 08:25

Tony was there much of an interesting back-story associated with the production of your March Buick 85G cutaway?

Not really, wp, and I had a look yesterday - no working drawing, it was done straight on the board. For some time the 85G and 84C cutaways hung in Reception at March Engineering in Biscester, until one day when, so I was told, a member of one of the teams running an 85G said to Robin Herd that he liked it, and RH took it off the wall and said "Here, you can have it!" I wonder where it is now.

I would have liked to have done more big sports-racers.

#3796 eldougo

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 09:18

Bloody Hell, that's brought back some unpleasant memories... I was involved in the High Court plagarism/copyright case involving Arrows and Shadow. Not much fun...

Posted Image

While you were in Court i was in the factory building the first 2 DN-9 for Don Nichols and working with John Baldwin in the drawing office to change small parts etc etc, to complete the car ready for the" Race of Champions" at Silverstone .All i remember it was a bloody cold winter that year working 12 hour day. And John was a great chap I enjoyed our time together .

Come race day it all went well Hans Stuck was leading the race until it went onto 7 cylinders and that was that. said for me not for others i guess.

#3797 smarjoram

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 10:00

Not sure if anyone's seen this yet (and I'm afraid it's planes not cars). There's a book called 'The Vintage Years of Airfix Box Art'. On amazon you can view a few of the pages - it looks like there are some quite nice cutaways and a biography of the the author Roy Cross...

http://www.amazon.co.../ref=pd_sim_b_1



#3798 Tim Murray

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 10:03

Come race day it all went well Hans Stuck was leading the race until it went onto 7 cylinders and that was that. said for me not for others i guess.

This was the very wet International Trophy, not the Race of Champions. We've discovered (see the YouTube thread) that many TNFers were there. I was rooting for Stuck, and ISTR that he continued to lead the race for a while even on seven cylinders - he lost out only when a few more cylinders went on the blink.

#3799 werks prototype

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 11:19

Not really, wp, and I had a look yesterday - no working drawing, it was done straight on the board. For some time the 85G and 84C cutaways hung in Reception at March Engineering in Biscester, until one day when, so I was told, a member of one of the teams running an 85G said to Robin Herd that he liked it, and RH took it off the wall and said "Here, you can have it!" I wonder where it is now.

I would have liked to have done more big sports-racers.


I would say, find that particular 85G and we will find that particular work of art! :up:

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#3800 Tony Matthews

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 11:38

Posted Image

While you were in Court i was in the factory building the first 2 DN-9 for Don Nichols and working with John Baldwin in the drawing office to change small parts etc etc, to complete the car ready for the" Race of Champions" at Silverstone .All i remember it was a bloody cold winter that year working 12 hour day. And John was a great chap I enjoyed our time together .

Come race day it all went well Hans Stuck was leading the race until it went onto 7 cylinders and that was that. said for me not for others i guess.

The Shadow/Arrows was/were great-looking cars, but I never got the chance of doing a cutaway of either - all I did was a small, grubby 'impression' of the Arrows based on, I think, the wind-tunnel model - that, or some full-size bits and some engineering drawings. I know I did it at the factory, and it may have appeared in Autospurt, possibly MN. I wasn't expecting to do it, so didn't have the right stuff with me, only a 3H pencil, and I think it was drawn on office stationery.