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#551 Stephen W

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 14:00

.303 rounds will punch holes in boilerplate and should make a mess of an engine. Plus every so often there were tracer rounds so if you hit a fuel tank with a prolonged burst it could be devastating.



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#552 werks prototype

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 17:55

I think that was one of the programme's major cock-ups, Mk 1 Spits, even the later ones all had 8 x .303" Browning machine guns, later versions had 2 x 20mm Hispano cannon added, losing 4 machine guns at the same time. It was several years later that 0.5" machine guns first appeared on the Mk IX and XIV variants. They told us that the machine gun that made a mess of the BMW was a 0.5" Browning, but given the factual accuracy of the rest of the programme, who knows? I can't see standard 0.303" rifle bullets causing that much damage, even on exiting the car, having made the expected small neat hole on entry.

 

Wasn't this mechanism originally a Colt 0.30in, re-chambered (By Browning) for use with the British 0.303 rimmed cartridge?



#553 kayemod

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 18:57

Wasn't this mechanism originally a Colt 0.30in, re-chambered (By Browning) for use with the British 0.303 rimmed cartridge?

 

I think that Colt was the original manufacturer, and John Browning the inventor responsible for the design, my dad always used to refer to them as Colt-Browning machine guns. There were a number of different makers due to WW2 demand, and most people seem to refer to them just by the designer's name, "General Motors Browning" or in the UK "BSA Browning" wouldn't have quite the same ring to it.



#554 werks prototype

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 19:28

A nice bit of custom engineering.

 

I remember reading, with the Vickers 0.303in not really being up to the job, they also tried out the Colt 0.5in, but it just had too low a rate of fire, and a short barrel life.



#555 JtP2

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 01:15

too much is made of the Spitfire/ Hurricane armament in TV programs. Like "it only had 15secs ammunition unlike the 109 with 55 secs". So its 15secs with 8 guns or 55 secs with 2, which do you think is better? Prototype 20mm cannon Spitfires were being supplied to sqds on a specific basis in 39, but did not reach general service till 41. The only fully equipped sqd was still having gun jamming problems during the BoB.

Armament for each wing is as follows A= 8 brownings, B = 2x 20mm and 4 Brownings or 4x 20mm, C = universal to take either gun arrangement, but normally the B armament with 2x20mm and 4 x303. The E wing allowed for the replacement of the 2x303 in each wing with a 0.5" Browning, the 20mm was moved to the outboard bay and the .5 fitted in the inner bay.

No armament mention ever seems to be made of a D wing, so I suspect that it was fuel tank wing for PR Spitfires or it was possibly the proposed 6x20mm armament wing



#556 Glengavel

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 05:48

too much is made of the Spitfire/ Hurricane armament in TV programs. Like "it only had 15secs ammunition unlike the 109 with 55 secs". So its 15secs with 8 guns or 55 secs with 2, which do you think is better? Prototype 20mm cannon Spitfires were being supplied to sqds on a specific basis in 39, but did not reach general service till 41. The only fully equipped sqd was still having gun jamming problems during the BoB.

Armament for each wing is as follows A= 8 brownings, B = 2x 20mm and 4 Brownings or 4x 20mm, C = universal to take either gun arrangement, but normally the B armament with 2x20mm and 4 x303. The E wing allowed for the replacement of the 2x303 in each wing with a 0.5" Browning, the 20mm was moved to the outboard bay and the .5 fitted in the inner bay.

No armament mention ever seems to be made of a D wing, so I suspect that it was fuel tank wing for PR Spitfires or it was possibly the proposed 6x20mm armament wing

 

The Bf109 had either 4 guns, of slightly larger calibre than the .303, or 2 guns and 2 20mm cannon.



#557 GreenMachine

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 06:49

The Bf109 had either 4 guns, of slightly larger calibre than the .303, or 2 guns and 2 20mm cannon.


Depends.

Some later model 109s ('F'?) had a 20mm or 30mm firing through the propeller. Then there were the ones with extra 2x30mm in underwing mounts for anti-bomber work, as well as the internally mounted guns.

#558 werks prototype

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 08:51

too much is made of the Spitfire/ Hurricane armament in TV programs. Like "it only had 15secs ammunition unlike the 109 with 55 secs". So its 15secs with 8 guns or 55 secs with 2, which do you think is better? Prototype 20mm cannon Spitfires were being supplied to sqds on a specific basis in 39, but did not reach general service till 41. The only fully equipped sqd was still having gun jamming problems during the BoB.

Armament for each wing is as follows A= 8 brownings, B = 2x 20mm and 4 Brownings or 4x 20mm, C = universal to take either gun arrangement, but normally the B armament with 2x20mm and 4 x303. The E wing allowed for the replacement of the 2x303 in each wing with a 0.5" Browning, the 20mm was moved to the outboard bay and the .5 fitted in the inner bay.

No armament mention ever seems to be made of a D wing, so I suspect that it was fuel tank wing for PR Spitfires or it was possibly the proposed 6x20mm armament wing

 

I think there was a wing type designated, or referred to as, 'New Wing' too? Came in right at the end of the war, carrying four of the lighter, Hispano Mk. V's.



#559 JtP2

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 10:18

New Wing too , laminar flow wing for 21/22/24?



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#560 werks prototype

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 11:00

New Wing too , laminar flow wing for 21/22/24?

 

 http://spitfiresite....ng-types.html/3

 
The revised wing

Beginning with the Mk. 21, the Spitfire had a new, restructured wing design. The design work on the new wing started as early as 1942, but it found its way into production only by the very end of the war.

New, larger area ailerons were deemed necessary to increase the agility of the aircraft in the rolling plane. To accommodate them, the wing planform was enlarged with wider chord towards the wingtips, and its internal structure revised to strengthen the wing in torsion and thus increase the useful diving speed and raise the speed limit for aileron reversal. The wingtips were gently squared-off making for a noticeable a departure form the perfect elliptical outline of the original Spitfire wing.

The new wing was armed with four 20 mm Hispano Mk II or V cannon. No other armament configurations were incorporated as the RAF standardised on all-cannon armament for its post-war fighters.

The Hispano Mk. V was lighter, had a higher rate of fire and a shorter barrel, leading to the protruding gun fairings being shortened even more. Also, the cannon and their belt were staggered, and consequently, the inner and outer blisters for feed motors were of different shape.

Other changes included widening the undercarriage by 7.25″ (19.6 cm), with its wells placed correspondingly further away from the centerline. In order to enable larger propellers to be fitted while providing adequate ground clearance, the undercarriage legs were also longer by 4.5″ (11.4 cm). The undercarriage could be also fully enclosed in flight due to the new outer undercarriage covers.

No official designation was ever given to this wing type. It was most often referred to in official letters as the “new wing”.

spitfire-21-wing_small.jpg

The new wing introduced on the Spitfire Mk. 21 was only superficially similar to the preceding wing types.
Internally, all aspects of its construction have been revised.
Click to enlarge image
[Crown Copyright]

 

 

 

I always associate the supermarine laminar flow wing with the development of the Spiteful.

 

I think 'New Wing' with an arrangement of four Hispano Mk. V's, was in use proper, only with the late production Mk. 24?



#561 JtP2

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 18:02

Spitfire 21 = laminar flow wing (244sq ft) and conventional canopy. Spitfire 22 = 21 with bubble canopy, Spitfire 24 = 22 with increased internal tankage.

 

Spiteful = laminar flow wing, tapered planform  (210sq ft) with undercarriage in wing retracting inwards.



#562 elansprint72

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Posted 03 May 2015 - 22:09

16739452903_2af870be85_h.jpg

 

 

:wave:

 

Someone once said that a picture is worth a thousand words... or something about a face that sank a thousand ships... I forget which; perhaps I should have paid more attention in my History lectures?  ;)


Edited by elansprint72, 03 May 2015 - 22:15.


#563 JtP2

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Posted 04 May 2015 - 00:07

twas said about Helen of Troy whose face launched a thousand ships, or in a scuba diving photo from the end of a Skye expedition "Susan P, the face that sank a Humber attaque"

 

Looks like a MkV or less likely a MkII and unlikely to have carried Invasion markings historically.



#564 DogEarred

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Posted 04 May 2015 - 06:20

Despite bad weather, a Spitfire & a Eurofighter Typhoon made low passes over the Williams factory at Grove yesterday, for the benefit of Sir Frank. (There was the Abingdon Airshow nearby)

 

He encourages & enjoys such things. Quite often military helicopters manoeuvre over the site & occasionally land for lunch.

 

Neat.



#565 retriever

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Posted 22 May 2015 - 20:37

Great picture on the front page the Telegraph today - pity that the Hurricane depicted was captioned as a Spitfire!

 

Later editions (we get the early edition here in the west country) have had the captioning corrected.



#566 rasimmo

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Posted 25 May 2015 - 09:48

The roundels should be blue and white not black and white. The lack of the red centre is correct for the Pacific Theatre where it was removed to avoid confusion with the Japanese red disc. But was the "night fighter" camouflage used there? the shark mouth just looks wrong.

But I'd sooner see a Spitfire in strange colours than not see one at all.

The roundels  are blue and white, maybe the shadow makes them look darker.



#567 Allan Lupton

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Posted 25 May 2015 - 10:24

twas said about Helen of Troy whose face launched a thousand ships

Yes, and the derived scientific unit of female beauty is the milliHelen. i.e. enough beauty to launch one ship

:yawnface:



#568 kayemod

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Posted 12 July 2015 - 17:32

I almost hate myself for enjoying this, but let's all enjoy some politically incorrect amusement from this clever bit of advertising.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

 

Inevitably, there were some complaints, but as far as I know, none of these came from Germans, who I've always found to have a sense of humour very like ours.

 

Wouldn't be too surprised if this has featured on TNF before, but a quick search couldn't find it, so apologies if you've all seen it before.


Edited by kayemod, 12 July 2015 - 17:50.


#569 David Birchall

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Posted 12 July 2015 - 17:58

Bloody luverly! :)

#570 Rob29

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Posted 13 July 2015 - 06:39

Bloody luverly! :)

Seconded :drunk: How have I missed seeing these clips before-love the Vulcan-remember first seeing one on TV live from the Farnborough air show c1953.



#571 Vitesse2

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Posted 19 July 2015 - 12:15

They say that any landing you can walk away from is a good one, but this is a seriously good wheels-up pancake, coming in at virtually stalling speed.

 

http://www.telegraph...out-wheels.html



#572 Allan Lupton

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Posted 19 July 2015 - 13:24

Not a real Spitfire, of course, so of less importance as the cause will not affect genuine Spitfires still flying.



#573 GreenMachine

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Posted 19 July 2015 - 13:33

They say that any landing you can walk away from is a good one, but this is a seriously good wheels-up pancake, coming in at virtually stalling speed.

http://www.telegraph...out-wheels.html


Agreed.

However that is a "Spitfire", not a Spitfire, and an 80% sized one at that. Belly landing the real thing would be a lot more dramatic than that. (Ooops! Allan beat me to it!)

And while I am here, this:

.303 rounds will punch holes in boilerplate and should make a mess of an engine. Plus every so often there were tracer rounds so if you hit a fuel tank with a prolonged burst it could be devastating.

is quite misleading.

The .303 was discarded because of its lack of hitting power, being defeated by self-sealing fuel tanks and armour plate.

Edited by GreenMachine, 19 July 2015 - 13:34.


#574 Mistron

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 10:58

Another forced landing yesterday at Biggin Hill, thankfully without serious injury to the pilot. Appears he lost power immediately following take off on a test flight. Photos on the news / social media appear to show the plane on its side on the edge of a wooded area.

 

http://www.telegraph...sing-power.html

 

Yesterday was a sad day for historic flying.

 

Al


Edited by Mistron, 02 August 2015 - 11:09.


#575 uffen

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 12:46

Couldn't help but notice that, "no one else was on board when the single seater plane crash landed."

Hate to lose a Spitfire. Hopefully it can be repaired and get another C of A.



#576 Pullman99

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 12:47

 

Yesterday was a sad day for historic flying.

 

Yes indeed.    Tragic day at Oulton Park that  claimed the life of pilot Kevin Whyman and the serious accident - thankfully without serious consequences for its pilot - at Biggin Hill.    The media's reporting of both does, however, seem to be well below standard with the Daily Mail (amongst others) referring to the Folland Gnat and its pilot as a "stunt plane" and a "stunt pilot".    The Daily Telegraph - on the Spitfire story - has helpfully quoted the Police and ambulance services referring to a "single engined" Spitfire and that "no-one else apart from the pilot was on board the single seater aircraft."      The Daily Mail's comments board has several contributions inevitably calling for a ban on flying historic aircraft.


Edited by Pullman99, 02 August 2015 - 15:32.


#577 Vitesse2

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 13:51

Well, Mail and - increasingly - Telegraph writers do tend to be a bunch of uninformed and ignorant something that rhymes with stunts ...

 

(There are of course very honourable exceptions, given that we have amongst our number here at least one DT contributor from whose illustrious keyboard such egregious tripe would never spill!)



#578 kayemod

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 14:22

Well, Mail and - increasingly - Telegraph writers do tend to be a bunch of uninformed and ignorant something that rhymes with stunts ...

 

(There are of course very honourable exceptions, given that we have amongst our number here at least one DT contributor from whose illustrious keyboard such egregious tripe would never spill!)

 

You're absolutely right, much of what the Mail prints is a journalistic disgrace, but a more telling guide to online papers are the comments their readers leave, as these are the people that the Mail and others believe they are catering for. Many Mail comments seem to originate from people with only double-digit IQs if that, and in very many cases it's clear that they either haven't read or more probably haven't understood the article they're commenting on. Be fair though V2, though not what it used to be, Telegraph journalism is still much better, though they should employ more experts and do more fact checking. Their reader comments are usually worth looking at, especially on serious topics like Greece's finances. The real weirdos are The Guardian of course. Articles with a next-planet liberal stance, and the comments! Unlike the Mail, most of them clearly come from intelligent educated people, but deluded would be the kindest way of putting it. I'll admit though that I scan all of these online papers most days, and usually get as far as the comments, or at least the first few on any topic that interests me, and I quite often add a comment or two of my own, so I suppose that makes me no better than the rest of them.



#579 Allan Lupton

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 16:53

Some of the comments can be used as data for the Dunning-Kruger effect - see here:  https://en.wikipedia...g–Kruger_effect



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#580 kayemod

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 17:27

Some of the comments can be used as data for the Dunning-Kruger effect - see here:  https://en.wikipedia...g–Kruger_effect

 

I think you're right, but would add that the online readership of 'popular' papers like the Daily Mail, and even The Guardian, probably has a significantly different profile to that which buys and reads the paper version. It's the Twitter & Facebook effect, everything's so easy and obvious when you're sitting at a keyboard, it makes some commenters feel so clever and powerful. There's the added benefit that however outrageous the comment, no-one is likely to come around to punch you, in fact no comebacks at all. I'd better stop there, I'm getting dangerously close to Racing Comments territory. They've currently got a thread running "Should front wings be banned?" Now although I have some basic knowledge, I'm no aerodynamicist. You wouldn't believe some of the theories that have been suggested, apparently meant perfectly seriously in that thread. Or seeing where it is, maybe you would.



#581 Mistron

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 17:35

The Daily Mail's comments board has several contributions inevitably calling for a ban on flying historic aircraft.

And I'm sure they think Historic racing's terrible too.

 

Maybe they should remember that many Historic planes were used to protect our shores from Johnny Foreigner - they seem to like that sort of thing.

 

Must be horrid to have no soul.......

 

Al



#582 kayemod

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Posted 02 August 2015 - 17:51

And I'm sure they think Historic racing's terrible too.

 

Maybe they should remember that many Historic planes were used to protect our shores from Johnny Foreigner - they seem to like that sort of thing.

 

Must be horrid to have no soul.......

 

Al

 

Back to the wonderful Spitfire. Some years ago I was in the centre of Bournemouth a couple of days before their Air Show. That unmistakeable sound, a Merlin. Almost everyone stopped and gazed skywards to see a Spitfire flying over, quite low and heading for Hurn, the local airport. Apart from the plane, the silence was uncanny, almost everything stopped, the area is largely pedestrianised, so no traffic noise to spoil things. A moving experience, I'll be kind and say that there are rather more pensioners here than the national average, many looking up, women as well as men had possibly flown a plane like the one they were looking at, but younger people were affected as well. Whatever the comments in the Daily Mail may make you think about this Country, never lose faith in The Great British Public, they have soul all right.



#583 Doug Nye

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Posted 03 August 2015 - 11:51

Curiously enough, on Saturday morning here I was fixing new soffit-boards on our garage when I heard the distinctive growl of a Merlin, looked up and at about a thousand feet an invasion-striped Spitfire cruised overhead, east-bound. The sound and sight still command attention...though the most distinctive aircraft noise I ever remember issued from the Saro Princess here in the '50s.  I think you can still hear it somewhere on Youtube? (Yes - here:  ) - at about 3:33 through the piece.

 

DCN


Edited by Doug Nye, 03 August 2015 - 11:57.


#584 kayemod

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Posted 03 August 2015 - 12:14

Curiously enough, on Saturday morning here I was fixing new soffit-boards on our garage when I heard the distinctive growl of a Merlin, looked up and at about a thousand feet an invasion-striped Spitfire cruised overhead, east-bound. The sound and sight still command attention..

 

DCN

 

I hope you stood to attention and saluted Doug, though hopefully without falling off your ladder. I always do when I see a flypast like that.

 

Back in the real world, it must have been at least ten years or fifteen ago, but when I experienced the Bournemouth Square Spitfire flypast I mentioned a couple of posts back. One elderly gentleman in front of me really did stand to attention when he heard that unmistakeable sound. He had a big moustache, could well have been ex-RAF, it might even have been his old plane.

 

PS, thanks for the link, what an astonishing piece of work that Princess was, imagine a flypast with that monster accompanied by the Brabazon.


Edited by kayemod, 03 August 2015 - 12:16.


#585 exhillclimber

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Posted 03 August 2015 - 13:24

Well, Mail and - increasingly - Telegraph writers do tend to be a bunch of uninformed and ignorant something that rhymes with stunts ...

 

(There are of course very honourable exceptions, given that we have amongst our number here at least one DT contributor from whose illustrious keyboard such egregious tripe would never spill!)

 

The Mail and Telegraph writers can't be the things that rhyme with stunts. They don't have the warmth or the depth.



#586 Odseybod

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Posted 03 August 2015 - 14:30

Gosh, I really am ancient - remember seeing the Princesses cocooned on the Isle of Wight (from the same ferry that we watched the Queen Elizabeth and United States liners leaving Southampton for New York).

 

A different age.



#587 RogerFrench

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Posted 03 August 2015 - 15:26

Gosh, I really am ancient - remember seeing the Princesses cocooned on the Isle of Wight (from the same ferry that we watched the Queen Elizabeth and United States liners leaving Southampton for New York).
 
A different age.


Indeed it was. I was at Farnborough in 1953 when the Princess flew over, making quite an impression!

#588 doc knutsen

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Posted 03 August 2015 - 20:09

You're absolutely right, much of what the Mail prints is a journalistic disgrace, but a more telling guide to online papers are the comments their readers leave, as these are the people that the Mail and others believe they are catering for. Many Mail comments seem to originate from people with only double-digit IQs if that, and in very many cases it's clear that they either haven't read or more probably haven't understood the article they're commenting on. Be fair though V2, though not what it used to be, Telegraph journalism is still much better, though they should employ more experts and do more fact checking. Their reader comments are usually worth looking at, especially on serious topics like Greece's finances. The real weirdos are The Guardian of course. Articles with a next-planet liberal stance, and the comments! Unlike the Mail, most of them clearly come from intelligent educated people, but deluded would be the kindest way of putting it. I'll admit though that I scan all of these online papers most days, and usually get as far as the comments, or at least the first few on any topic that interests me, and I quite often add a comment or two of my own, so I suppose that makes me no better than the rest of them.

 

Thank you ever so humbly for putting us Guardian readers firmly in our place. "Weirdos", "next-planet liberal stance", and "intelligent educated people, but deluded"... My my.


Edited by doc knutsen, 03 August 2015 - 20:13.


#589 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 06:38

Yes indeed.    Tragic day at Oulton Park that  claimed the life of pilot Kevin Whyman and the serious accident - thankfully without serious consequences for its pilot - at Biggin Hill.    The media's reporting of both does, however, seem to be well below standard with the Daily Mail (amongst others) referring to the Folland Gnat and its pilot as a "stunt plane" and a "stunt pilot".    The Daily Telegraph - on the Spitfire story - has helpfully quoted the Police and ambulance services referring to a "single engined" Spitfire and that "no-one else apart from the pilot was on board the single seater aircraft."      The Daily Mail's comments board has several contributions inevitably calling for a ban on flying historic aircraft.

Yes, they should all be no older than 2 years. And have four engines too. And be flown by pilots over 50 years old! on dry sunny days only.

A bit like motorcars to the idiots in the suburbs. They go on holidays though flying on a 20 year old passenger plane flown at night in the rain by a 25 y/o. But it does have 4 engines!

Though how many of those air borne buses we lose a year is a very large worry.



#590 Gary Davies

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 08:52

The Daily Telegraph - on the Spitfire story - has helpfully quoted the Police and ambulance services referring to a "single engined" Spitfire and that "no-one else apart from the pilot was on board the single seater aircraft."  

Yes. Plod does go in for the bleedin' obvious with their public statements from time to time. 

 

Many years ago now, I recall my late father's best chum recounting a story of his brother, at the time the Chief Constable of a county in west Wales, attending the scene of a ghastly murder - blood everywhere, witnesses, the whole thing - and telling reporters that "We are treating this as a case of foul play."



#591 kayemod

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 10:55

Yes. Plod does go in for the bleedin' obvious with their public statements from time to time. 

 

Many years ago now, I recall my late father's best chum recounting a story of his brother, at the time the Chief Constable of a county in west Wales, attending the scene of a ghastly murder - blood everywhere, witnesses, the whole thing - and telling reporters that "We are treating this as a case of foul play."

 

True, and why does almost no-one other than Plod and Premier League football managers speak in the present perfect tense when making statements or giving interviews? "He has flown his Spitfire into the ground, but he has survived unhurt". Any normal person would say "He flew and he survived", but they all seem to do it, is it something in Police training?



#592 Gary Davies

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 11:11

:rotfl:  :rotfl:

 

"I was proceeding along the High Street in a westerly direction at approximately 7pm when I observed the defendant and two other male persons loitering in a suspicious manner outside the John Collier gents outfitters. Upon my approaching said parties, they departed on foot in the direction of Admiral Street. I immediately sounded my whistle in order to apprehend them, whereupon the defendant (excuse me while I refer to my notes, m'lud) cried out: "Come on, filf, let's see ya do the 'undred yards in under a minute then."

 

Upon reaching the corner of the High Street and Admiral Street, I observed that all three parties had disappeared. In the light of my torch, I noticed a paper packet containing an unidentified substance which I am now given to understand is commonly referred to as marry-juarna."



#593 kayemod

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 11:21

"And then Your Honour, I escorted the accused to the Police Station, where he was remanded in custard..."

 

(Pause while PC turns the page of his notebook, coughs and composes himself), "...y"



#594 Charlieman

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 13:42

Any normal person would say "He flew and he survived", but they all seem to do it, is it something in Police training?

The UK police yack about car "index numbers". I've had a look at my V5 form and my MOT slip and my insurance certificate, all which record my registration number and my VIN. What is this "index number" about? I'm sure that my cars don't have any... Given that the DVLA, the authority responsible for vehicle identity in the UK has already defined "registration number" and VIN, why have the police created "index numbers"?

 

The likely explanation is that you can't be an insider unless you speak the right jargon. So in current F1, tyres are defined as "prime" (harder, in English) and "option" (softer). But some weekends, the "prime" tyre -- which suggests superiority and longevity -- isn't the best option. If F1 took the time to understand casual viewers of the sport, they'd talk about super-softs and mediums, versus softs and hards.

 

[For the benefit of readers unfamiliar with UK police speak, index number means registration number.]



#595 Allan Lupton

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 15:32

Sorry to continue a bit OT, but:

It doesn't do to be too dogmatic about what to call what the numberplate says!

Whatever your V5 calls it, the one I'm looking at calls it "Registration Mark" but the later V5C does call it "Registration Number". The 1957 revision version of the RF60 that preceded the V5 (colloquially known as the "log book" but actually "Registration Book") had used "Registration Mark"  - I haven't the earlier version to hand.

 

I think you will find that the originally allocated one and two letter codes of the UK were called "Index Marks" and one can speculate that the Index Mark plus a number became known as the "Index Number" in some circles


Edited by Allan Lupton, 04 August 2015 - 15:34.


#596 Charlieman

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 16:17

I agree completely that we are off topic, Allan, but the UK ceased to use Index registration numbers for cars before my parents wore nappies. As you note, the expression "registration number" has been used for years in the UK. So why do our coppers not talk about the "reg"?  



#597 Bakeryman

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 17:01

Curiously enough, on Saturday morning here I was fixing new soffit-boards on our garage when I heard the distinctive growl of a Merlin, looked up and at about a thousand feet an invasion-striped Spitfire cruised overhead, east-bound. The sound and sight still command attention...though the most distinctive aircraft noise I ever remember issued from the Saro Princess here in the '50s.  I think you can still hear it somewhere on Youtube? (Yes - here:  ) - at about 3:33 through the piece.

 

DCN

The Princess as it flew away sounded rather like the V1 Doodlebug, a noise once heard never forgotten.  One came down nearby in Bushey Heath and we managed to scrounge a few, still warm bits before the area was cordoned off.  They had a very distinctive smell which I have never encountered since but would recognise instantly were I to do so again.  High explosive I presume.



#598 Allan Lupton

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 17:17

The Princess as it flew away sounded rather like the V1 Doodlebug, a noise once heard never forgotten.  One came down nearby in Bushey Heath and we managed to scrounge a few, still warm bits before the area was cordoned off.  They had a very distinctive smell which I have never encountered since but would recognise instantly were I to do so again.  High explosive I presume.

I have no idea which aeroplane you are referring to, but it can't have been the Saunders-Roe Princess. All three were withdrawn from flying and cocooned and finally broken up (in 1967 I think it was).



#599 Vitesse2

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 17:25

I think he was referring to a V1, Allan.



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#600 Allan Lupton

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Posted 04 August 2015 - 17:57

I think he was referring to a V1, Allan.

Ah, it didn't (and still doesn't) read like that to me.