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Michael Schumacher's antics in Monaco qualifying (merged)


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Poll: Michael Schumacher's antics in Monaco qualifying (merged) (906 member(s) have cast votes)

  1. Yes (591 votes [65.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 65.67%

  2. No (164 votes [18.22%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.22%

  3. Can't tell (138 votes [15.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 15.33%

  4. Other (7 votes [0.78%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.78%

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#51 dujshebaev

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:21

Justice.
MS may be second (or worst) tomorow in pit lane. Alonso's lat lap was clear better than MS. With no mistakes, he wa a clear tenth fastest.
Alonso must start in dirty side tomorrow when he deserved the pole.

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#52 Arska

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:21

Originally posted by TailG
FIA - it's your chance now to prove you have some balls.


Not really. It was so obvious that they HAVE to react. If they do, it still doesn't prove they treat Ferrari the same as the rest.

#53 jimpo

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:22

Originally posted by PhilKerr
Senna deliberately crashed at Magny Cours once to get pole so your point is ?


Oh my god you have SO good point there. No point discussing this at all since Senna supposedly did the same thing.

#54 Hellenic tifosi

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:22

I think that Ferrari now has to prove that MS entered the corner much faster than on his previous Qualifying lap.

In any case, Schumacher stands to lose MUCH more than the potential benefits of such a move. I fail to find a motive in deliberately blocking other cars, when he had a 2nd position in the bag, and it was not absolutely sure that FA would bump him.

#55 themark

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:22

Originally posted by PhilKerr
Regardless of what Schumi did Alonso wasn't impeded, he drove around Schumi's car so did Alonso get any loss of time ?


Everyone lifts when they see a yellow flag, in a race measured in thousandths of a second, don't you think time was lost? If he did it on purpose, he should get canned. But I doubt the Stewards have the guts.

#56 rileyl

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:23

Originally posted by micra_k10
Nothing new here to see. He has done it always.

Cheap :down:


:down: :down: :down:

That's why no matter how good his driving is, I am never a M Schumacher fan!

Dirty Dirty Dirty

#57 De Weberis

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:23

Even Burti commenting on TV broadcast - looking by the in car camera - said that MS could have done that bend easily. :eek:

#58 Bruce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:24

Senna "crashed" (rather spun) at Magny Cours because he figured out that by inducing a spin, he could spin across the finish line (which immediately followed the final corner) - his spin didn't cost anyone else anytime . Also, his spin was taken in the pursuit of a better time. If MS's action was on purpose, one can't say the same for him.

#59 JForce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:25

Originally posted by themark


Everyone lifts when they see a yellow flag, in a race measured in thousandths of a second, don't you think time was lost? If he did it on purpose, he should get canned. But I doubt the Stewards have the guts.


Alonso didn't lift for double waved yellows, caused a huge accident, and wasn't punished. Obviously the FIA favour Renault.

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#60 Tenmantaylor

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:25

CHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAT!

Im flying out to monaco tonight for the race tomorrow.

F*** the clothes- im taking an A-Board with "Schumi Act 2- Back in The Habit" plastered all over it.

If Villeneuve got a slapped wrist at Nurburgring schumi whould be put at the back of the grid for this stunt.

Regardless of how obvious what he actually did was, his reaction in the press conference should be damning enough to deserve punishment. He was so guilty and lying through his teeth he could barely contain it.

A schumi win tomorrow on this note will ruin his senna equalling record and my first visit to the GP.

What a dick!

#61 pkrash

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:25

The Red Baron locks a tire and then misses the corner. Then stalls the engine!!!
He saw he was 2/10's down and FA behind him on a flyer. FA was 1/2 faster!!
The Weasel does it again!!!!

#62 Arska

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:25

Originally posted by PhilKerr
Regardless of what Schumi did Alonso wasn't impeded, he drove around Schumi's car so did Alonso get any loss of time ?


Look mr apologist, in those situations they do this thing called slowing down for safety's sake.

#63 dujshebaev

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:25

You only must look MS and FA faces in PC. MS knew he did a very bad thing.
What about say "I didn't think there were cars in fast lap rear mine".
Just PATHETIC

#64 Fredd

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:25

My initial thought was no way was that deliberate, but after watching the replay I think it might have been. He straightened his steering for a second time that didn't seem necessary, bringing himself too close to the barrier.

Engineers up and down the pitlane think he did it on purpose, according to the ITV chappy. Considering his past record of dodgy moves, this one's got to be extremely suspicious at least.

And yes there can be no doubt that Alonso and co lost time there Phil.

#65 Jackman

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:25

They've just shown the second half of Schumacher's lap on FOM TV, and normally the sound is down but we turned it up, and you can hear by the engine note that it was deliberate: it will be astonishingly easy to prove if the stewards ask for the telemetry. He also sat there with the engine running until the two following cars passed him, and then switched it off.

They also had Flavio making some very inflamatory remarks about Ferrari and the FIA because he didn't realise the camera was recording his comments, too :D

#66 Arrow

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:26

Originally posted by Hellenic tifosi
I think that Ferrari now has to prove that MS entered the corner much faster than on his previous Qualifying lap.

No they dont. You can make a mistake without going faster. If it looks as obvious as everyone says then the stewards should not play games and just penalize him. Considering the FIA is blatantly corrupt, i think they will play the 3 stooges act and somehow explain the incident away. Its better for the Wc after all.

#67 JForce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:26

I've watched it a dozen times now, and I can't really see too much wrong with his line into the first part of Rascasse. Just as he goes past the apex, it slides, he turns into it, which pushes him wide.

#68 just me again

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:26

Originally posted by Group B
IF it was deliberate he should get penalised, but proving it's pretty tricky.


Do they need to prove it!!. I think it´s enough they "know" it. It is not a court, just a decision by some stewards.

Bjørn

#69 stuck-in-first-gear

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:26

Originally posted by TailG
Looking at the replay it's even more obvious.

Totally wrong line in Rascasse, doesn't even try to to go wide but turns intentionally to inside. Then he straightens the wheels quickly before turning them to right again, that little move made sure he couldn't turn in time.

Notice how he doesn't touch the wall so that the car won't be damaged.

If FIA fails to punish MS, it's only further evidence of double-standards.


He still locked up the right front tyre, so obviously he left the racing line. But why he attempted twice to turn in to make the right hand corner is truly strange.

#70 MacJack

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:26

Originally posted by Hellenic tifosi
I think that Ferrari now has to prove that MS entered the corner much faster than on his previous Qualifying lap.

In any case, Schumacher stands to lose MUCH more than the potential benefits of such a move. I fail to find a motive in deliberately blocking other cars, when he had a 2nd position in the bag, and it was not absolutely sure that FA would bump him.


Schumi's last flying lap wasn't anything special, he was already 1 second behind his best time at second sector. Same time Alonso was making the fastest time to the first sector. Maybe this information was given to Schumi and he decided make sure Alonso's last sector wouldn't be anything special.

#71 AndrewNystrom

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:27

Originally posted by PhilKerr
Regardless of what Schumi did Alonso wasn't impeded, he drove around Schumi's car so did Alonso get any loss of time ?


Yes, ofcourse!. The rules say you cant drive the fastest when its yellow flag. You need to slowdown.

#72 Tuffy

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:28

Originally posted by MCH
When he turned the wheel left for the second time he wasn't correcting anyting (car wasn't sliding at all) he was just making sure he couldn't make the corner anymore. Hope he'll get reprimanded for this.


You are listining Niki Lauda on RTL. Did say more or less exactly the same. Not very clever for a 7times WDC to make sure to get the best starting position for himself after making a small mistake, which could have costs some time on his lap, but he makes sure to destroys all followers lap too, to get the maximum for himself. Really bad behaviour. :down: Hopefully he will get a big penalty for his arrogant behaviour after this situation.

#73 se7en_24

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:28

Originally posted by JForce


Alonso didn't lift for double waved yellows, caused a huge accident, and wasn't punished. Obviously the FIA favour Renault.

You're starting to sound like a JV fan. Most people here were up in arms when Alonso got away with that, but do 2 wrongs make a right?

#74 Teez

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:28

Oh, yeah. On purpose. And risk crashing out. :drunk:

#75 le chat noir

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:28

Brilliant stuff from Michael. Love it. SO obvious.

He's always done this kinda thing, I used to love seeing him work out where to park the car on the first lap in order to get it red flagged and restarted. Doesn't happen anymore, so amusing to see him take this opportunity.

Now how often does he muddle his words in press conferences? Hardly ever.

Oh, and what the hell is going on with his overalls? Looks like he's had some kind of accident...

#76 AD

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:29

Did he almost crash on purpose? No.

Could he have got out? Probably. :

Ok he couldn't reverse, that would be stupid, and he'd be disqualified straight away for trying to revers on that spot.

Therefore could he have got around the corner from where he was? I'm not sure, he'd have to go very, very slow to get steered out ... but even as a MS fan, I think he could possibly have go out by going forwards ... but I'm not a F1 driver so I don't know for sure.

#77 Arska

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:29

Originally posted by 100cc
Smart


Dangerous. Unsporting. Dirty.

#78 michaelab

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:31

Originally posted by Arska
Wanna back that up with a source or video?

It definitely happened allthough I can't find any details on the web right now, can't even remember which year it was. Senna noticed that the position of the timing beam was right on the corner and that if you didn't slow down to try and make the corner and just took a straighter line you would still cut the timing beam and get a quicker time, even though you would be inevitably crash afterwards. He did this, and crashed on his last lap attempt.

However, whether Senna did that or not is irrelevant to this topic. IMO Schumacher didn't do it deliberately. There's just way too much going on to be able to deliberately plan and execute such a move deliberately. Even if it was deliberate it would be almost impossible to prove.

Michael.

#79 JForce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:31

Originally posted by se7en_24
You're starting to sound like a JV fan. Most people here were up in arms when Alonso got away with that, but do 2 wrongs make a right?


Of course not. I was only commenting on the whole "Alonso had to slow for yellows".

Of course Alonso's time was impeded. That sucks for him. But I can't believe that MS would be good enough to fake a slide going into a corner, run wide just enough to ensure he can't make the corner, and yet not slide into the barrier. On the slippery outside of a corner full of marbles. :

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#80 Chris G.

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:31

Flavio bitching on TV. :lol: :lol:

#81 JForce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:32

Originally posted by Chris G.
Flavio bitching on TV. :lol: :lol:


What did he say? :D

#82 Tuffy

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:32

Originally posted by Rallimies Kujala
ALONSO SAY IT!!!



What is he saying ? The MS station RTL did only show the arrogant behaviour of MS and Ross Brawn.

#83 logic

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:32

Originally posted by jnp
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :up: :up:

MS is always in the race...

Smart move.

jnp

Why people think it is smart? If it is smartness, everyone of them could to do that if they so decided, but MS is the only one who is stupid enough to decide to play dirty games. There is something in schumacher that he cannot control and that is when he sees opportunity for personal gain, not to be himself better, but to prevent other people doing their best. And that is dirty and obsolutely not tolerated.

#84 PhilKerr

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:32

As far as I am concerned Shit Happens

Schumi got no points for it, he didn't ram any drivers off the road, he merely used creative means to protect a qualifying position, even if he keeps his pole there is no certainty he will win or even finish the race tomorrow so to me its no big deal

One of the reasons why Schumacher has been so successful is his ability to think outside of the box and today was an example of that

#85 Lontano

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:32

i think he made a genuine mistake entering the first turn, and then just let the car stop. If Villeneuve was penalized, Shumacher should be penalized even harder (by the way there were blue flags being shown on Qualifying!)

#86 TailG

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:33

Originally posted by JForce
I've watched it a dozen times now, and I can't really see too much wrong with his line into the first part of Rascasse. Just as he goes past the apex, it slides, he turns into it, which pushes him wide.


If you can't see anything different in his line choice AND the fact that he straightens the wheels for a second before turning right again - you're officially a) blind, b) MS fan or c) both.

#87 pRy

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:33

It seemed a repeat of the Massa incident. Massa was seen turning his wheel prior to getting out of the car. He may have just done it in frustration or he may have been trying to check his steering. Schumacher had full lock on and his car wasn't turning much at all.

Plus a marshal seemed to feel the need to spray fire extinguisher onto Schumachers front left tire as it was sat in the parc after quali ended so maybe there is an overheating issue on the brakes? Schumacher didn't seem to refer to a problem so perhaps not.

Either way, I don't really see the huge crime in not being in a hurry to get going after a spin. As far as I know there is no rule that states you must be moving within a certain time frame and some may suggest it was simply quick thinking.. sort of like the "Quick park the car before you pass the flag" incident at Australia.

#88 Mosquito

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:33

To me it seems like he overcooked it.

Let's not forget Schumacher is a very sly fox, I don't think he planned it on purpose, but it is possible that being caught up in the situation, it was suddenly convenient to slide wide.

It's impossible to tell if he did it on purpose. Possible, but one would have to make a hard case to DQ his times for this.

#89 Fat Fighter

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:35

After watching the in car replay of the incident Schumi lost it, selected reverse, you could see the car stalling and then he threw his hands up in the air out of frustration...

Not the actions of a person doing something dirty on purpose...

The FIA will naturally review the situation, if they believe he is up for a penalty he will receive it, let the experts decide, they have access to a lot more information then we do...

#90 miniman

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:35

Deliberate? no way! MS is the smartest driver out there and he knows there couldn't be a favorable outcome from something like this.

That said, I have to admire Alonso's composure and maturity at the press conference, the man is all class.

#91 chak

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:35

first time i saw it, i thought for sure it looked intentional, and that he was a cheating bastard.

After thinking about it a while, I thought maybe 2nd place wasn't really worth taking a risk of a penalty (in the bigger scale of things, it sounds positively ludicrous), unless the whole thing was staged just to get people talking about what is usually a boring-ass race.

Gets you thinking, doesn't it?

#92 Kenaltgr

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:35

Originally posted by PhilKerr
Regardless of what Schumi did Alonso wasn't impeded, he drove around Schumi's car so did Alonso get any loss of time ?


Extreme MS Fanboys like you are the main reason why people dislike schumacher.
Alonso couldn't even use the fastest line through the turn MS deliberately blocked. He lost 3 tenths compared his best last sector time.

#93 Bruce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:36

Originally posted by Teez
Oh, yeah. On purpose. And risk crashing out. :drunk:


On a corner that slow, the risk would be minimal. Note, he didn't even touch the wall. It looked like a rookie mistake, which is why I suspect that it was no mistake at all...

#94 K-One

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:37

His "I have problem"-manouvre was amateurish and of course the team kept him updated about Alonso. He should get a rasberry for that :down: :down:

#95 prty

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:37

Funny how MS moved his hands after stopping and stalling on purpose the same way he did in Austria to try to bring a red flag after he spun in the first corner, like saying "I'm so angry I stalled!". Sad and pathetic at the same time. Having watched the onboard there is no way he had to leave the steering wheel in the centre for so long. Silverstone, Austria... there are precedents, even Barrichello did it in Silverstone.

#96 stuck-in-first-gear

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:38

Don't we all love controversy :D :D :D

Imagine what it's going to be like without the enemy number 1 :wave:

#97 Freek

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:38

Originally posted by MacJack


he was already 1 second behind his best time at second sector.

On his last lap MS was 0.190s behind his best time.

#98 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:38

Originally posted by Bruce


On a corner that slow, the risk would be minimal. Note, he didn't even touch the wall. It looked like a rookie mistake, which is why I suspect that it was no mistake at all...


What would you rather him do? HIt the wall trying to make the turn, thus damaging his wing and with parc ferme rules, starting from pole tomorrow with a bent front?

#99 Calorus

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:38

Originally posted by JForce


Of course not. I was only commenting on the whole "Alonso had to slow for yellows".

Of course Alonso's time was impeded. That sucks for him. But I can't believe that MS would be good enough to fake a slide going into a corner, run wide just enough to ensure he can't make the corner, and yet not slide into the barrier. On the slippery outside of a corner full of marbles. :


If he had done it whilst locked up, i'd agree. but he coasted twice during the whole "incident".

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#100 Teez

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:39

Originally posted by Bruce
On a corner that slow, the risk would be minimal.

Aw, c'mon! A couple of inches more and his tyre would've hit the wall, damaging his suspension. Minimal risk? At a place like Monaco?

Note, he didn't even touch the wall. It looked like a rookie mistake, which is why I suspect that it was no mistake at all...

Why? You Schumi bashers claim he makes rookie mistakes all the time!