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Michael Schumacher's antics in Monaco qualifying (merged)


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Poll: Michael Schumacher's antics in Monaco qualifying (merged) (906 member(s) have cast votes)

  1. Yes (591 votes [65.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 65.67%

  2. No (164 votes [18.22%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.22%

  3. Can't tell (138 votes [15.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 15.33%

  4. Other (7 votes [0.78%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.78%

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#101 Rallimies Kujala

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:39

Originally posted by Tuffy



What is he saying ? The MS station RTL did only show the arrogant behaviour of MS and Ross Brawn.


I hoped he would have said MS did that deliberately but unfortunately he was totally PC in his comments. Looked pissed though.

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#102 Mosquito

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:39

The thing that makes me doubt if he did it on purpose is that he didn't crash it. If he planned on crashing, it would have been waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyy easier (and less suspicious) if he had just ran the corner too fast, overcooked it a bit and understeer into the wall. Repairs would have been minimal.

#103 SlateGray

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:39

Originally posted by Mosquito
It's impossible to tell if he did it on purpose. Possible, but one would have to make a hard case to DQ his times for this.


Malice aforethought not required recall fisi fit and JV penalty

#104 WACKO

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:40

Originally posted by SlateGray


Recall JV fisi gate!


You mean if you scream and complain the loudest, you'll eventually get it your way. As if that politiking of Renault is a clean way of taking advantage.

#105 bushgold

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:40

The teams should lodge an official complaint if only to watch the race stewards squirm with embarassment when they inevitably anounce that "it was not deliberate".

#106 JForce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:40

Originally posted by prty
Funny how MS moved his hands after stopping and stalling on purpose the same way he did in Austria to try to bring a red flag after he spun in the first corner, like saying "I'm so angry I stalled!". Sad and pathetic at the same time. Having watched the onboard there is no way he had to leave the steering wheel in the centre for so long. Silverstone, Austria... there are precedents, even Barrichello did it in Silverstone.


Yeah you're right, he should habe just reversed into the middle of Rascasse, how silly of him.

#107 nja

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:40

I have no idea whether it was deliberate.

Unfortunately there are no winners out of this:
1. If MS keeps the pole and wins, it is "tainted"
2. If MS drops and FA wins tomorrow, it is "tainted" for FA as many will argue that the MS DQ handed him a win.

The whole damn thing is tainted - this sucks.

Anyway, go Webber!!

#108 tagy

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:41

yes it was on purpose imo.

He locked a wheel on purpose then parked it pointing at the barrier. He was too carefull not to damage the car, if he had done it faster and just stopped almost touching the barrier it might of looked ok but he would of risked hitting the barrier.

Should start from the back.

#109 Spunout

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:41

I've watched it a dozen times now, and I can't really see too much wrong with his line into the first part of Rascasse. Just as he goes past the apex, it slides, he turns into it, which pushes him wide.



Taking into account Schumi´s speed at the time he choosed to straighten the steering wheel for the second time, give me any regular road car and I´ll promise to make the corner without any problems whatsoever.

His car was almost stopped, and somehow 5-times Monaco winner "forgets" to turn right :lol:

The funniest part is based on replay, he didn´t even run out of space...

Perhaps "Silverstone staged spin" tactics would have been better? Choose some relatively safe place, switch the brake balance on rear wheels...and voila. Oops, sorry Fernando I just ruined your lap ;)

I hope he will be punished, otherwise I´m afraid we will see more of this in the future.

#110 Mosquito

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:42

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld


What would you rather him do? HIt the wall trying to make the turn, thus damaging his wing and with parc ferme rules, starting from pole tomorrow with a bent front?

Repairs would be allowed by the stewards.

#111 Hyatt

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:42

Alex Wurz on Premiere made clear that he thinks that this stinks ...

#112 Naushad78

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:42

Originally posted by PhilKerr
Senna deliberately crashed at Magny Cours once to get pole so your point is ?


That we're not talking about Senna.

#113 Hellenic tifosi

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:43

In any case, there is a very big probability that MS will be 2nd after the start, due to the excellent starts of FA. If Schumacher did it intentionally then, apart from being dirty, it was a really stupid and useless move.

#114 WACKO

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:43

I think the title of this thread is actually very preoccupied. :rolleyes:

#115 Bruce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:43

Originally posted by Teez

Aw, c'mon! A couple of inches more and his tyre would've hit the wall, damaging his suspension. Minimal risk? At a place like Monaco?

Why? You Schumi bashers claim he makes rookie mistakes all the time!


As Mosquito points out rightly, dmage would likely have been exceedingly minimal (and fixable) if he had have stuck his wing or suspension into the wall - lets face it, he wasn't going to damage the chassis or the engine in that corner...

secondly, it doesn't matter what us "schumi bashers" say - the guy is a professional and a 7 times WDC who is set to equal Senna for wins at Monaco... he is the most mature driver on the track and the timing for such a "mistake" is highly suspect.

I'll be interested to see what the powers that be do.... knowing them, probably award him a case of champagne... :lol:

#116 Spunout

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:44

Aw, c'mon! A couple of inches more and his tyre would've hit the wall, damaging his suspension. Minimal risk? At a place like Monaco?



His car was barely moving at the time. That was about as risky as parking your family sedan in London :D

#117 Simioni

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:44

Originally posted by Bruce
Senna "crashed" (rather spun) at Magny Cours because he figured out that by inducing a spin, he could spin across the finish line (which immediately followed the final corner) - his spin didn't cost anyone else anytime . Also, his spin was taken in the pursuit of a better time. If MS's action was on purpose, one can't say the same for him.


If Philkerr is talking about the incident we´re thinking of (which is dubious since Senna never had pole for the france GP), it´s worth recalling that:

- a car had just dumped oil all over the final sector;
- Senna was NOT on pole, he was 3rd behind Patrese and Prost;
- he was supposed to open his last attempt when he spun, which should potentially have given him a better time.

Seems a warp of imagination to assume Senna did it on purpose. Not that the old "Senna did it before" routine ever had any point to begin with.

Michael Schumacher is a stupid cheating c*nt. Just when his past deeds are becoming eroded with the passing of time, he proceeds to take a dump in his reputation for a pole position? After 7 WDC?

If he doesn´t get punished after what happened to Villeneuve at Nurb it will be a travesty :down:

#118 prty

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:44

Originally posted by JForce


Yeah you're right, he should habe just reversed into the middle of Rascasse, how silly of him.


Well he engaged reverse didn't he? Anyway he shouldn't have been in that position anyway, if he didn't need to... cheat to retain pole. Wether you like it or not.

#119 AD

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:45

3 great posts by pRy, Mosquito, and miniman :up: ... I detect the usual flamefighting for another couple of pages now!

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#120 Don Speekingleesh

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:45

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld


What would you rather him do? HIt the wall trying to make the turn, thus damaging his wing and with parc ferme rules, starting from pole tomorrow with a bent front?


Repairs can be made in parc ferme. Or do you think Massa will be starting the race in a three wheeled wagon?

#121 jonpollak

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:46

THIS JUST IN...

NO PENALTY


It would spoil Slavica's birthday party tonight.

Jp

#122 angst

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:46

Originally posted by PhilKerr
As far as I am concerned Shit Happens

Schumi got no points for it, he didn't ram any drivers off the road, he merely used creative means to protect a qualifying position, even if he keeps his pole there is no certainty he will win or even finish the race tomorrow so to me its no big deal

One of the reasons why Schumacher has been so successful is his ability to think outside of the box and today was an example of that


"...ability to think outside of the box...", that's just code for ' he's happy to cheat.'

Just like driving your opponent off the road, deliberately stopping the car on track is cheating. That's why there is a specific point within the regulations to cover that. By the way, if he isn't penalised it will mean either a) the stewrds really can't see a problem with what happened - but anybody with eyes in their head can see what Schumacher did, or b) that the 'show' is more important than the 'sport'.

#123 JForce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:46

If he wanted to crash surely he would have just crashed? How can you engineer a slide like that, at that exact moment etc?

#124 Mauseri

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:46

Originally posted by PhilKerr
Senna deliberately crashed at Magny Cours once to get pole so your point is ?

It's Schumacher in question now.

PS. if one doesn't like Schumacher, he doesn't need to have liked Senna.

#125 Simioni

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:48

Originally posted by PhilKerr
As far as I am concerned Shit Happens

Schumi got no points for it, he didn't ram any drivers off the road, he merely used creative means to protect a qualifying position, even if he keeps his pole there is no certainty he will win or even finish the race tomorrow so to me its no big deal

One of the reasons why Schumacher has been so successful is his ability to think outside of the box and today was an example of that


He should just smash Alonso´s legs with a baseball bat. He´d get no points for it and it´s not like he´d be unfairly pushing a driver off the road or anything, it´s just thinking outside the box.

#126 Spunout

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:48

THIS JUST IN...

NO PENALTY


It would spoil Slavica's birthday party tonight.

Jp



That´s bad news. There is no question Renault will pay him back.

Fisi: "I tried to let Schumacher by, unfortunately I had some brake problems..."

#127 Timur

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:48

Originally posted by AndrewNystrom
Yes, ofcourse!. The rules say you cant drive the fastest when its yellow flag. You need to slowdown.

May be they need, but they not always do that. Hakkinen got a pole in Monako under yellow. Alonso ignored yellow flags in Brazil (and caused a huge accident, which eventually gave Fisi his first win).

#128 michaelab

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:49

There's no way anyone can prove he did it deliberately. It's natural that there would be a stewards investigation as there is with any controversial incident but that doesn't mean anything. They will investigate and nothing will happen.

If exactly the same thing had happened with Coulthard or Rosberg no one would have raised an eyebrow and people would have just said it was a silly mistake and a pity that it ruined a couple of other drivers laps. It would also have been investigated by the stewards. It's only because it was MSC that suddenly it must have been deliberate :rolleyes:

Michael.

#129 Fat Fighter

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:49

Originally posted by Rallimies Kujala


I hoped he would have said MS did that deliberately but unfortunately he was totally PC in his comments. Looked pissed though.


Not on the post qualifying show on Supersport in Africa, Flavio was fuming, waving his arms about saying "He parked it, he parked it, you could see him park it"...

#130 j00j

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:50

Schumy cheating again....not new

#131 prty

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:50

Originally posted by JForce
If he wanted to crash surely he would have just crashed? How can you engineer a slide like that, at that exact moment etc?


Give me a Formula 1 and I'll slide everytime I'd want. Plus lots of other times I don't want. You seen Martin Brundle's "drivng school" program? He slided or spun when he wanted to.

#132 nateshan

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:51

I have recorded the qualy on my DVR, I watched the incident 100 times now, and it does look like it was not intentional.

On the approach to the turn where MS stalled, He really was out of control. The right turn before that, when the car approached it, it lost the backend of the car, this caused him to take the wrong line as he was trying to correct and went straight. As he was going straight, he tried to turn into the right corner and his right tyre locked up and made him go towards the barrier and then stopped there.

However, whether he stalled the car engine deliberately, I dont know, but everything that lead up to te stop was not intentional.

#133 fer312t

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:51

The FIA could never prove that this was anything other than a mistake...
If they penalize him, it would be solely in response to the other teams hysterics and an act of extreme cowardice - grovelling before the crowd lest they be accused of the ubiquitous 'Ferrari favoritsm'...

#134 Don Speekingleesh

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:51

Originally posted by JForce
How can you engineer a slide like that, at that exact moment etc?


The inital lock up was an accident I think, and that was when MSC decided to make the most of it.

#135 Mauseri

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:51

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld
What would you rather him do? HIt the wall trying to make the turn, thus damaging his wing and with parc ferme rules, starting from pole tomorrow with a bent front?

In first place, the lock up and steer near inside wall looked purposeful.

#136 angst

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:52

Originally posted by jonpollak
THIS JUST IN...

NO PENALTY


It would spoil Slavica's birthday party tonight.

Jp


"The Show" must go on. It's pathetic really. It's as bad as that time the winning car passed the finish line in the pits serving it's ten second stop-go penalty. Utterly ridiculous. If it was the same driver or team that this happened to over and over again then you'd think people would start to get a bit suspicious........ HANG ON!!;)

#137 Rallimies Kujala

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:53

So FIA again decided to suck Ferrari?`Pathetic.

#138 magicalonso

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:53

Originally posted by jonpollak
THIS JUST IN...

NO PENALTY


It would spoil Slavica's birthday party tonight.

Jp


Well...Why would the F(errari)IA punish MS when they desperately changed the tyre rules to try and make him win again?
There was no way they'd ever have given him a penalty..

#139 Ludovic McCoulth

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:54

I don't think measures will be taken. I mean, if they do it good, then both schum and alonso should go back on the grid. We can't put webber on pole, can we now.

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#140 TailG

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:54

So far we have numerous tv-commentators, ex-f1 drivers, teammanagers and other experts say he did it on purpose and then we have the usual MS-yahoos at AtlasF1 saying it was an accident.

Gee, it's so hard to pick sides here... :rolleyes:

#141 Don Speekingleesh

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:54

Originally posted by nateshan
I have recorded the qualy on my DVR, I watched the incident 100 times now, and it does look like it was not intentional.


So have I and I come to the opposite conclusion. The back of the car barely stepped out - MSC would have had no problem making the corner if he'd wanted.

#142 K-One

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:54

Originally posted by JForce
If he wanted to crash surely he would have just crashed? How can you engineer a slide like that, at that exact moment etc?


Why would he need to crash? Just a slight slide about the time Alonso is taking pole is just enough. He is good enough to pull that one off. Unfortunately his acting and post-qualifying comments are not on the same level.

#143 MaxScelerate

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:54

Originally posted by Fat Fighter
After watching the in car replay of the incident Schumi lost it, selected reverse, you could see the car stalling and then he threw his hands up in the air out of frustration...

Selected reverse?!? F*ck, that was impossible with Gilles' Ferrari, I doubt very much it is with the 2006 offering. It's not a computer game where you have only two buttons on a joystick.

#144 Mila

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:55

MS's true colors are as ugly as his Monaco overalls.

he's stuck around long enough to top Senna's pole record. now he can do us a favor and quit.

#145 nja

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:55

Can someone post a link to some footage of the incident
I'll be lucky to see it in Ch10's 8 second highlight package before the race tomorrow

#146 Simioni

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:56

Originally posted by nateshan
I have recorded the qualy on my DVR, I watched the incident 100 times now, and it does look like it was not intentional.

On the approach to the turn where MS stalled, He really was out of control. The right turn before that, when the car approached it, it lost the backend of the car, this caused him to take the wrong line as he was trying to correct and went straight. As he was going straight, he tried to turn into the right corner and his right tyre locked up and made him go towards the barrier and then stopped there.

However, whether he stalled the car engine deliberately, I dont know, but everything that lead up to te stop was not intentional.


I just hope the stewards aren´t as naive as you. Of course it looked eventful. But there was no reason whatsoever to reach rascasse out of shape like he did to begin with. It´s almost a straight approach these days, yet he was totally off line.

#147 JForce

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:56

Originally posted by angst


"The Show" must go on. It's pathetic really. It's as bad as that time the winning car passed the finish line in the pits serving it's ten second stop-go penalty. Utterly ridiculous. If it was the same driver or team that this happened to over and over again then you'd think people would start to get a bit suspicious........ HANG ON!!;)


How is that relevant? He didn't cheat then, and he didn't cheat here.

#148 Naushad78

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:56

Originally posted by TailG


If you can't see anything different in his line choice AND the fact that he straightens the wheels for a second before turning right again - you're officially a) blind, b) MS fan or c) both.


ROFL - classic!

#149 BiH

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:56

let the flame wars begin.

#150 Group B

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Posted 27 May 2006 - 13:56

Originally posted by Don Speekingleesh


The inital lock up was an accident I think, and that was when MSC decided to make the most of it.


That might be true - I don't think the initial mistake was intentional, but hard to tell afterwards.