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S.Q.T. (stupid question thread)


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#1001 Harry

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 21:06

2. No idea. Maybe they don't want to transport so many chairs around? Or maybe they want a more relaxed atmosphere?

This question made me laugh. In response to your theory as to why Sauber have no chairs, could it possibly be the opposite and they want everyone kept on their toes (so to speak), and not relaxed in a comfy chair?

Either that or Esteban is late with the Telmex money.

Edited by Harry, 02 March 2013 - 21:06.


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#1002 300KPh

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 22:02

3. IIRC, the top four or so teams usually get bigger garages. Therefore it is a matter of whether the biggest garages are closer to the pit entrance or the pit exit. In 2008 Bernie wanted McLaren to receive one of the bigger garages despite being excluded from the last year's constructor's championship and therefore being the lowest ranked team in the field.


i think the constructor champions choose the pit garage according to the easiest garage to pull into . thats why its usually the first garage they choose . i dont think they choose it according to size

#1003 Kalmake

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 03:42

3-why sometimes redbull (WCC) choose the last spot in the pitlane not the first (silverstone) ?


Apparently it was a mistake as they couldn't get up to speed before the speed limit ended. http://adamcooperf1....for-british-gp/

Edited by Kalmake, 05 March 2013 - 02:24.


#1004 Risil

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 16:30

How do I know whether that NASCAR race was good or not when I always fall asleep in the middle?

#1005 Andrew Hope

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 16:31

How do I know whether that NASCAR race was good or not when I always fall asleep in the middle?


By how angry or happy you were to have woken up.

#1006 Skinnyguy

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 16:50

Apparently it was a mistake as they couldn't get up to speed before the speed limit ended.


But that´s exactly what you want when you pick the last garage: NOT getting up to the limiter before the line. It´s a mistake if you DO reach 100 km/h before the line.

#1007 Beamer

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 20:15

But that´s exactly what you want when you pick the last garage: NOT getting up to the limiter before the line. It´s a mistake if you DO reach 100 km/h before the line.

No it isn't. Not hitting the speed limiter is like braking befor you reach the limit line on entry. It means you're going slower than allowed.

#1008 Dolph

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 21:10

It´s a mistake if you DO reach 100 km/h before the line.


How's that then?

#1009 flatlander48

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 21:33

How's that then?



Pit lane speeding...

#1010 OfficeLinebacker

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 00:00

No it isn't. Not hitting the speed limiter is like braking befor you reach the limit line on entry. It means you're going slower than allowed.

But by the same token, exiting the pits is easier--just nail the gas and disregard the pit road limiter. Or rather, disengage it during the pit stop.

In NASCAR, pit selection is by qualifying position. The pole winner always chooses the last pit stall because he can just tear ass out of it without having to worry about pit road speed.

P2 almost always chooses the FIRST pit stall, for the same reason, you just get there as fast as you can, in order to stop in your box you'll have to be below pit road speed by the timing line, then you accelerate out of there smoothly up to pit road speed.

In both instances you only spend one interval at pit road speed rather than two, it simplifies things.

#1011 Kalmake

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 02:20

But by the same token, exiting the pits is easier--just nail the gas and disregard the pit road limiter. Or rather, disengage it during the pit stop.

In NASCAR, pit selection is by qualifying position. The pole winner always chooses the last pit stall because he can just tear ass out of it without having to worry about pit road speed.

P2 almost always chooses the FIRST pit stall, for the same reason, you just get there as fast as you can, in order to stop in your box you'll have to be below pit road speed by the timing line, then you accelerate out of there smoothly up to pit road speed.

In both instances you only spend one interval at pit road speed rather than two, it simplifies things.


In NASCAR they don't have a speed limiter button, so its harder for them.

It's worth pointing out that speeds are checked by time between scoring loops. This means you can enter at over the speed limit if you are coming to a stop near the second scoring loop. And same in reverse at the exit (although it seems the last gap is always so short you can't go much over limit).

#1012 eronrules

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 02:21

why are the driver's thread closed????

#1013 Brawn BGP 001

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 02:32

why are the driver's thread closed????

If you looked at the rules, you'd know.
http://forums.autosp...=...p;f=2&id=12
http://forums.autosp...howtopic=179385

#1014 flatlander48

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 02:35

In NASCAR they don't have a speed limiter button, so its harder for them.

It's worth pointing out that speeds are checked by time between scoring loops. This means you can enter at over the speed limit if you are coming to a stop near the second scoring loop. And same in reverse at the exit (although it seems the last gap is always so short you can't go much over limit).



That's why during the parade laps they will come down pit road. The pace car is driving the pit road speed so everyone knows what the RPMs will be for that speed and the particular gear they're going to use.

#1015 eronrules

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 02:52

If you looked at the rules, you'd know.
http://forums.autosp...=...p;f=2&id=12
http://forums.autosp...howtopic=179385


i've read those ... i was asking for fan's and fellow forumer's answers :smoking:

#1016 Brother Fox

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 03:16

How do I know whether that NASCAR race was good or not when I always fall asleep in the middle?

Dude, its the internet ... just take a side, it doesnt matter if you know what youre talking about or not

#1017 OfficeLinebacker

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 03:42

Dude, its the internet ... just take a side, it doesnt matter if you know what youre talking about or not

One of the best comments ever.

#1018 Nigel Beresford

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 10:05

But by the same token, exiting the pits is easier--just nail the gas and disregard the pit road limiter. Or rather, disengage it during the pit stop.

In NASCAR, pit selection is by qualifying position. The pole winner always chooses the last pit stall because he can just tear ass out of it without having to worry about pit road speed.

P2 almost always chooses the FIRST pit stall, for the same reason, you just get there as fast as you can, in order to stop in your box you'll have to be below pit road speed by the timing line, then you accelerate out of there smoothly up to pit road speed.

In both instances you only spend one interval at pit road speed rather than two, it simplifies things.



After those pits are taken, then the next best choices are the pits each side of any breaks in the pit wall, since entry or exit is easier.

The other reason for wanting the last (or latest) pit box is that you can see the opposition coming along pit road, so you can short fill and release the car to beat them out of the pits. This is particularly applicable in IndyCar or sports car racing.

Edited by Nigel Beresford, 05 March 2013 - 10:24.


#1019 Beamer

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 10:21

But by the same token, exiting the pits is easier--just nail the gas and disregard the pit road limiter. Or rather, disengage it during the pit stop.

In NASCAR, pit selection is by qualifying position. The pole winner always chooses the last pit stall because he can just tear ass out of it without having to worry about pit road speed.

P2 almost always chooses the FIRST pit stall, for the same reason, you just get there as fast as you can, in order to stop in your box you'll have to be below pit road speed by the timing line, then you accelerate out of there smoothly up to pit road speed.

In both instances you only spend one interval at pit road speed rather than two, it simplifies things.

No it isn't. They pick first or last to have an advantage with the release. Depending on pitlane layout. Not to skip the limiter. You want to have max speed in the limiter section, so on the exact limit from entry to exit.

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#1020 mprtc

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 10:56

why every season on this forum is called ' silly season ' ???

#1021 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 11:51

But by the same token, exiting the pits is easier--just nail the gas and disregard the pit road limiter. Or rather, disengage it during the pit stop.

In NASCAR, pit selection is by qualifying position. The pole winner always chooses the last pit stall because he can just tear ass out of it without having to worry about pit road speed.

P2 almost always chooses the FIRST pit stall, for the same reason, you just get there as fast as you can, in order to stop in your box you'll have to be below pit road speed by the timing line, then you accelerate out of there smoothly up to pit road speed.

In both instances you only spend one interval at pit road speed rather than two, it simplifies things.


I think the advantage in NASCAR is under yellow flag conditions, because you only have to get to the pit-exit timing line to freeze your position. So if you're doing 25mph and an inch ahead of the guy(or gal) doing 60mph, you win the spot. Under green though, you'd still lose the position because they'd be allowed to pass you. Danica seemed to struggle with the first stall at Daytona under green stops, in my opinion because she was just dumping the clutch and over-wheelspinning out. Which would have been the thing to do under yellow.

I think in Red Bull's case it was that the first stall was too close to the exit so they couldn't get away with breaking the limit legally to make full advantage. Because it's your average speed in that section, not your top speed. So if the limit is 80mph but you start at zero mph, you can go over 80 to maintain an average of 80. Hell if it includes the time in your pitstop in that zone you could go even faster and still be within the legal time/distance requirement.

#1022 Beamer

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 11:52

why every season on this forum is called ' silly season ' ???


'Silly season ' doesn't refer to the season itself, it's the nickname for the yearly shuffle of drivers and teammembers.

#1023 DampMongoose

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 12:34

I think the advantage in NASCAR is under yellow flag conditions, because you only have to get to the pit-exit timing line to freeze your position. So if you're doing 25mph and an inch ahead of the guy(or gal) doing 60mph, you win the spot. Under green though, you'd still lose the position because they'd be allowed to pass you. Danica seemed to struggle with the first stall at Daytona under green stops, in my opinion because she was just dumping the clutch and over-wheelspinning out. Which would have been the thing to do under yellow.

I think in Red Bull's case it was that the first stall was too close to the exit so they couldn't get away with breaking the limit legally to make full advantage. Because it's your average speed in that section, not your top speed. So if the limit is 80mph but you start at zero mph, you can go over 80 to maintain an average of 80. Hell if it includes the time in your pitstop in that zone you could go even faster and still be within the legal time/distance requirement.



That's rubbish I'm afraid, F1 pit lanes are limited to something like 60kph in practice and Quali and 100kph in the race (apart from Monaco which is slower), not an average for the pitlane! If you exceed the speed limit in place you will be penalised, fined or suffer a penalty.

#1024 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 12:48

Has that been changed? I know back in Brawn/Schumacher days there was some segment records, so having the right pit stall mattered because you could 'speed' in portions of it to keep your average up when entering/exiting your stall.

But if the limit is just 100kph at all times and RB's pit stall is too close to the exit, they may never even get to 100kph before the exit.

#1025 DampMongoose

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 14:52

Has that been changed? I know back in Brawn/Schumacher days there was some segment records, so having the right pit stall mattered because you could 'speed' in portions of it to keep your average up when entering/exiting your stall.

But if the limit is just 100kph at all times and RB's pit stall is too close to the exit, they may never even get to 100kph before the exit.


Not to do with speeding more the braking distance and acceleration time, it's never been based on an average only a maximum speed limit since it was introduced in 1994, the speed has altered but not the method. Depending on the position you could be quicker to the first pit box because the driver would not have to engage the limiter on his way over the pit lane line as he would already be slowing for the box plus he can drive in at a shallower angle because he doesn't have to avoid the next team alongs hydraulic lines etc, he can then stamp on the accelerator to get up to the limiter on exit, but some circuits the first box is more problematic to drive into at speed so they would select the opposite end and make the most of the straightforward exit... The other factor is that in this day and age it matters that some pit boxes have better access to the paddock and therefore make it easier to entertain corporate sponsors etc...

#1026 Anders Torp

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 18:39

I think the advantage in NASCAR is under yellow flag conditions, because you only have to get to the pit-exit timing line to freeze your position. So if you're doing 25mph and an inch ahead of the guy(or gal) doing 60mph, you win the spot. Under green though, you'd still lose the position because they'd be allowed to pass you. Danica seemed to struggle with the first stall at Daytona under green stops, in my opinion because she was just dumping the clutch and over-wheelspinning out. Which would have been the thing to do under yellow.

I think in Red Bull's case it was that the first stall was too close to the exit so they couldn't get away with breaking the limit legally to make full advantage. Because it's your average speed in that section, not your top speed. So if the limit is 80mph but you start at zero mph, you can go over 80 to maintain an average of 80. Hell if it includes the time in your pitstop in that zone you could go even faster and still be within the legal time/distance requirement.

Is that the longest ever Ross Stonefeld post?

#1027 Dolph

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 19:15

Pit lane speeding...


100k isn't speeding

#1028 Dolph

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 19:18

But by the same token, exiting the pits is easier--just nail the gas and disregard the pit road limiter. Or rather, disengage it during the pit stop.

In NASCAR, pit selection is by qualifying position. The pole winner always chooses the last pit stall because he can just tear ass out of it without having to worry about pit road speed.

P2 almost always chooses the FIRST pit stall, for the same reason, you just get there as fast as you can, in order to stop in your box you'll have to be below pit road speed by the timing line, then you accelerate out of there smoothly up to pit road speed.

In both instances you only spend one interval at pit road speed rather than two, it simplifies things.


Yeah, but in Nascar the pits are very tight and everybody comes in at the same time. Pulling out of pits is already a huge risk. If you choose the last box you can drive straight out and don't have to pull into the traffic.

F1 has rearely such traffic. Max 12 cars at onece. vs Nascar 30

#1029 Dolph

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 19:22

Not to do with speeding more the braking distance and acceleration time, it's never been based on an average only a maximum speed limit since it was introduced in 1994, the speed has altered but not the method. Depending on the position you could be quicker to the first pit box because the driver would not have to engage the limiter on his way over the pit lane line as he would already be slowing for the box plus he can drive in at a shallower angle because he doesn't have to avoid the next team alongs hydraulic lines etc, he can then stamp on the accelerator to get up to the limiter on exit, but some circuits the first box is more problematic to drive into at speed so they would select the opposite end and make the most of the straightforward exit... The other factor is that in this day and age it matters that some pit boxes have better access to the paddock and therefore make it easier to entertain corporate sponsors etc...


sorry, I'm likely wrong but how the heck do they measure max speed? Isn't average speed between various segments 10 times easier?

#1030 SpartanChas

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 19:32

Telemetry, gps, speed traps. Pit lane speeding is generally someone maximising entry speed and getting it wrong, being slightly too fast when they cross the line.

#1031 DampMongoose

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 19:41

sorry, I'm likely wrong but how the heck do they measure max speed? Isn't average speed between various segments 10 times easier?


It is measured by a distance of the total pit lane from entry to exit so that part is very much correct as I rememberthe fallout from Vettel cutting the entry and being given a penalty in the past despite nottravelling over the limit... however I believe they also have a speed gun to check as far as I remember...

#1032 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 20:09

That would seem to support that it is an average rather than an instantaneous speed.

#1033 Kerch

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 21:39

How are the rules on engine mappings enforced? i.e how would an illegal mapping be detected.

#1034 Clatter

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 21:44

How are the rules on engine mappings enforced? i.e how would an illegal mapping be detected.


Via the standard ECU that all teams have to use.

#1035 DampMongoose

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 22:14

That would seem to support that it is an average rather than an instantaneous speed.


Yes, but if you go over the limit at any point you are penalised, Vettel complained that he didn't go above the limit at any point but was caught out by jumping the pit entry calculation point... if you exceed the limit you get penalised! So it's both...


#1036 Lotusseven

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 18:58

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How much does a front wing end plate cost ?

#1037 Lotusseven

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 19:12

Question No2:

Is F1 testdrivers allowed to compete in GP2 ?

#1038 SpartanChas

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 19:24

Yes. Robin Frijns looks like he'll be saubers reserve and a GP2 driver this year. Same with Gutierrez last year.

#1039 Clatter

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 19:25

Question No2:

Is F1 testdrivers allowed to compete in GP2 ?


Depends.

If they have previously won the GP2 championship or driven a complete season in F1 then no.


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#1040 charly0418

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 19:31

Question No2:

Is F1 testdrivers allowed to compete in GP2 ?


Yes, but it's nearly impossible for them to do a Free Practice 1 AND race in GP2.

#1041 Lotusseven

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 19:36

Yes. Robin Frijns looks like he'll be saubers reserve and a GP2 driver this year. Same with Gutierrez last year.


I´m not too sure about that , if he hasn't found fundings by now ? Read here.

#1042 HaydenFan

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 19:56

I´m not too sure about that , if he hasn't found fundings by now ? Read here.


That was before any plans to test GP2. And what would be the point of driving a GP2 car for as many teams as he did (completely different than an F1 car), if he had no intention of shopping around for the best chance at a race seat?

#1043 Lotusseven

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 20:00

Yes, but it's nearly impossible for them to do a Free Practice 1 AND race in GP2.


So in other words F1reserve/test drivers can race in GP2, if they avoid FP1´s and not replace a permanent F1 driver.

#1044 HaydenFan

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 20:07

So in other words F1reserve/test drivers can race in GP2, if they avoid FP1´s and not replace a permanent F1 driver.


The change over in just time itself from the end of a session for Practice or qualifying in GP2, or FP1 just makes it logistically difficult. The session for GP2 gets over, and would he have enough in him/her to climb behind a F1 car?

#1045 Lotusseven

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 20:16

That was before any plans to test GP2. And what would be the point of driving a GP2 car for as many teams as he did (completely different than an F1 car), if he had no intention of shopping around for the best chance at a race seat?


Yeah, I fully agree with you. Hopefully he find a budget for GP2.

#1046 Vibe

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 20:49

I am a fresh F1 fan,2012 season was the first I actively followed and fell in love with the sport.Therefore I have tons of stupid questions as I mostly don't understand the technical stuff.Commentators don't focus on that at all here,so I had nowhere to learn this stuff and I'm burning to know.Let's begin...

1) Difference between pull-rod and push-rod

2) What exactly is the diffuser on the car(and explain Red Bull's blown diffuser)

3) Double DRS/Passive DRS

4) What is this on top of the car and what does it do?

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#1047 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 21:00

1. It's the bit of the suspension that pushes the damper. If it's low on the wheel and high on the car it's a push rod, because you're pushing up on it to move the springs and dampers. If it mounts to the car lower than the point where it mounts on the wheel it's a pullrod. Pullrod usually means you can get the springs and dampers lower in the front of the car which is better for the center of gravity. But it can take longer to make setup changes in practice because it's not as easy to get to with tools.

2. It's just part of the aerodynamics really. You create downforce through differences in air pressure(this is really oversimplified) and the diffuser does the same thing as the rear wing, but in a slightly different way because it's interacting with the air that is running close to the ground. Exhaust blown diffusers are normal diffusers really. They just run the exhaust gas over them to help speed up the airflow in that section, and the difference in speed above/below helps make the downforce. So adding the exhaust gas is kind of like adding to the car speed, it's making the air in that area flow quicker.

3. Active DRS is the flappy wing you see moving around. Passive DRS uses ducting and air pressure at different speeds to stall the wing. Even though the wing is still pushing through the air, if they can make it have less downforce it has less drag. And you want this at top speed, not in the corners. So you use your ducting so that at say, over 175mph as the air pressure builds in the tubes it suddenly flows down a second tube(or not flow, or whatever it's designed to do) and that disrupts the air hitting the rear wing.

*A really good way to try to visualise some of this stuff is to turn your kitchen sink on, and have the water flow into a corner or the bit on the side. You'll see different speeds of water flow as it sloshes around the sink into the drain. You'll see high speed water flow, medium speed, and boundary layers. Just dip the tip of your finger into a part of it and watch how it changes the water moving around and its speed.

**Or just look at an F1 car driving in heavy rain, the spray shows you a lot of what's going on with modern aerodynamics.

4. It's an air speed sensor, like on an airplane. The one at the very very top of the black bit is out in 'clean air' so gives them a 100% accurate airspeed recording that isn't affected by the turbulence and other things flowing off the front wing and front tires.

#1048 Vibe

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 21:13

That has been more than helpful actually,thanks a lot.Very well explained,my previous googling attempts usually left me even more confused.

Also,about the DRS,you didn't say anything about Double DRS.Is it the same thing as Passive DRS?I heard the term Double DRS much more often during the second part of last season,this year Passive DRS is usually mentioned so I'm not sure whether it's just renamed now or is it a whole new concept.

Edited by Vibe, 09 March 2013 - 21:16.


#1049 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 21:29

Double DRS is a form of passive DRS, but I think to qualify as double it needs to stall the front wing too?

#1050 okochajj

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 21:34

yeah , that is what Double DRS do , it stalls the front wing along with the rearwing when the drivers activates the Usual DRS