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S.Q.T. (stupid question thread)


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#201 rce

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Posted 04 March 2007 - 23:52

Originally posted by Rexx Havoc
during the "tire war years" my understanding is all tires were recalled by michelin and bridgestone after the race weekend or test

afaic it was to reduce industrial espionage

now that we have a control tire ... they may become available again after the race


Thanks...still has me wondering what exactly happens to them.

HBoss - I do believe that qualifying is the same this year as last year.

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#202 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 22 March 2007 - 13:46

If I block some one and
someone that isn't blocked quotes that person ...

will the blocked person's quote be visible?

#203 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 22 March 2007 - 14:09

Yes, because it's just quoted text.

#204 jondoe955

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 15:15

Good thread!

Is a safety car really necessary...
The unofficial, but most important reason - every SC lap is an ad for Mercedes, just like the watches and caps.
And to help lead the field through the minefield of CF shards.

do teams that buy engines from manufacturers...
For the few hyphenated teams, like BMW-Sauber, it seems like the engine manufacturer should be leasing the car team for the season.

Where does the little man in the TV go...
In the States, it's Atlanta, Wisconsin, and (wherever Steve M resides).

My smart-ass SQ -
I saw a shot of a (Ferrari?) sitting in the pits with a tub filled with dry ice for extra cooling. It was made of carbon fiber. Excluding the small savings in transportation costs -
Does F1 have more money than brains?
(or morality - like McLaren's $2M rollout)

#205 Rob G

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 15:30

I know this is an old question, but...

Originally posted by Rexx Havoc
can a cup car be tight and push?

because the guy on speed just said that

"Tight" and "push" are synonymous and refer to understeer. An oversteering car is loose.

#206 Clatter

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 15:51

Originally posted by jondoe955
Good thread!

Is a safety car really necessary...
The unofficial, but most important reason - every SC lap is an ad for Mercedes, just like the watches and caps.
And to help lead the field through the minefield of CF shards.


There are 2 reasons why we have the safety car.

The 1st is to ensure that the race runs within its alloted timeslot. Stopping the race is now very much a last resort. The second is to protect the track workers who are cleaning up the mess, and are only at risk because they don't want to stop the race.

#207 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 19:17

ok I watched the vision F1 animation of the begining of the race and noticed thAT HEI was mostly2 seconds ahead of LEW and ALO was about 2 seconds adrift from LEW

so my questions begs... do you need to run 2 seconds behind to be in clean air?

so is that the reason Ronzo claims that his guys were being held up, redardless of the fact that they were 2-3 seconds adrift?

if so why was Massa able to hang under Wurz' gearbox for what seemed like more than a lap without losing enough downforce to make a pass impossible?

#208 united

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 20:03

Originally posted by Rexx Havoc
ok I watched the vision F1 animation of the begining of the race and noticed thAT HEI was mostly2 seconds ahead of LEW and ALO was about 2 seconds adrift from LEW

so my questions begs... do you need to run 2 seconds behind to be in clean air?

so is that the reason Ronzo claims that his guys were being held up, redardless of the fact that they were 2-3 seconds adrift?

if so why was Massa able to hang under Wurz' gearbox for what seemed like more than a lap without losing enough downforce to make a pass impossible?


Well, FIA claims to have telemetry proof that Alonso held up Massa in Monza'06. I think this 2 second thing refers to the fact that both LEW and ALO was not ready to take major risk before pit-stop waves.

#209 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 20:31

Originally posted by united


Well, FIA claims to have telemetry proof that Alonso held up Massa in Monza'06. I think this 2 second thing refers to the fact that both LEW and ALO was not ready to take major risk before pit-stop waves.


well telemtry is one thing then visual proof is another
there is a youtube that makes the telemtry claims incredulous

#210 Lukin

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Posted 26 March 2007 - 04:40

Originally posted by Rexx Havoc

can a cup car be tight and push?

because the guy on speed just said that


Yeah it can be. They are different as Rob alluded to but you can have different balance in different parts of the corner. One can cause the other and if the driver/team aren't onto it things can go downhill very quickly.

Entry/Mid push can cause oversteer on exit. (side note: tyre must have a slip angle to generate lateral grip. A tyre will build up lateral grip as the slip angle increases up until a point then the grip drops as slip angle increases) As the car pushes the steering lock is applied, sending the front slip angle well over the optimum for the conditions and reduces lateral grip (creating further understeer) while the rear slip angle will be much closer to the optimum. Once the driver passes the middle of the corner and begins to pick up the throttle and wind off the steering lock the front and rear slip angles reduce. As the front slip angle is reduced the tyre will go through it's optimum point (which it passed on corner entry) and as it does it will produce more lateral grip. At that point the front will have more lateral grip than the rear and the car will step out/wheelspin/fly off the track backwards.

Conversely entry OS can lead to mid corner push. If the rear is loose/nervous on entry the driver can't begin to turn as the brake pedal is released without the rear stepping out and sending him off backwards. So to counter this he waits for the rear to settle before turning in. The problem he then has is he has 90% of turning still left to do whereas if the car was better on entry he would of already done 50% of his turning (arbritary numbers by the way). So with 90% of turning to do when you should only have 50% to do overloads the front tyres massively and the car will plough through the turn with the driver whinging of massive understeer. The bad thing here is if the driver only says about the push so they make a balance change to give it more front grip, only the problem was actually a lack of rear grip, so the problem gets worse. Pretty soon you can end up with the car that is loose on entry, pushes badly mid corner, then snaps to oversteer on exit. Hell of a lot of fun eh!

#211 HBoss

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Posted 26 March 2007 - 12:21

In what race of the 1994 season did this happen?


#212 Ilaya

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Posted 26 March 2007 - 12:41

Free practice French GP, demolished a couple of McLaren TV monitors

#213 Andy Donovan

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Posted 26 March 2007 - 16:15

:eek: I bet that woke up the McLaren management.

#214 HBoss

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 11:33

Is it possible to know how many laps, in average has it taken the leader to lap the first backmarker?

#215 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 28 April 2007 - 17:50

Originally posted by HBoss
Is it possible to know how many laps, in average has it taken the leader to lap the first backmarker?


reasonable question no takers?

I'd answer it but I've put my subscription on hold as I try to financially navigate pending bankruptcy due to some tax liens

if not next month I will restart my sub and will answer it for you because I think it is a good question

guessing out of my bung I'd say 12-15 laps on average

maybe you should start a thread called G.Q.T. (good question thread)
maybe some people may look at it ... that otherwise don't frequent this one

#216 dinky

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 10:52

Originally posted by HBoss
Is it possible to know how many laps, in average has it taken the leader to lap the first backmarker?


I've had a look at this on Forix' lap chart data for 2006. There are two difficulties in analysing the data. Firstly the results are often skewed by first lap incidents. Someone comes in for repairs on lap one and goes a lap down right away. Secondly, the back markers seem to pit and go a lap down on the same lap quite often. This suggests that they were lapped in the pits rather than on the track. They've still been lapped but by their own stategy rather than out right performance to the leader.

I plugged all the figures in and tried to ignore first lap pitting incidents. For 2006, the results were about 17 laps on average. That may be nonsense though. If you didn't discount, shall we say, nonscheduled pit stops the average is about 13.

Which is right in Rexx's guess range. And he didn't spend 20 minutes of his life coming up with that guess.

Ho hum.

#217 HBoss

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 12:12

Thanks guys.
I've asked about it because if was trying to armchair-guestimate an ideal strategy for the drivers at Barcelona. Since qualifying seems even more important than ever, it would be a disaster for any Ferrari or McLaren driver to have his race ruined because he met backmarkers right before his first stop. But they just can't go too absurdly light or too heavy.
I think and hope we'll see one of the tightest and most exciting qualifying session in years (the race will probably be more of the usual).

:)

#218 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 12:15

Originally posted by dinky


And he didn't spend 20 minutes of his life coming up with that guess.

Ho hum.


don't beat yourself up about it man... those 20 minutes you spent running your organic processor at 100% CPU usage
I was analyzing the substance secreted from an ingrown hair on my chin :| :lol:

... how I wish my forix was active so I could account for a more useful 20 minutes

anyways Dinky thanks for crunching the numbers ... and it was cool that you went as far as factoring out first lap incidences ... good work :clap:

#219 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 12:17

Originally posted by HBoss
Thanks guys.
I've asked about it because if was trying to armchair-guestimate an ideal strategy for the drivers at Barcelona. Since qualifying seems even more important than ever, it would be a disaster for any Ferrari or McLaren driver to have his race ruined because he met backmarkers right before his first stop. But they just can't go too absurdly light or too heavy.
I think and hope we'll see one of the tightest and most exciting qualifying session in years (the race will probably be more of the usual).

:)


the blue flags and charlie should pretty much avoid the scenario you are envisioning

now Monaco... yes MAJOR issue

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#220 dinky

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 13:16

Originally posted by HBoss
Thanks guys.
I've asked about it because if was trying to armchair-guestimate an ideal strategy for the drivers at Barcelona.


OK, must be bored. For Barcelona the numbers look like this for the last 10 years:

Year/First Lapping
2006 14
2005 17
2004 13
2003 19
2002 19
2001 17
2000 18
1999 18
1998 17
1997 15

In '04 the first car lapped was a minardi. It had stopped early on lap 4. The next non Minardi to be lapped was on lap 22.
In 1998, and 1999 Diniz and Panis respectively had first lap incidents. The figures are for the next car to be lapped other than them.

Average then is about 17 laps. In the first three races Lewis (picked at random) pitted as follows:

% race distance (oz/mal/bah) 39.5 35.7 33.3
Lap equiv Barca 26.07 23.562 21.978

He was the first to pit (of the main contenders) in Bahrain and was considered to be "light" in Q. Even if he adopted the same strategy in Spain, he'd have potentially 5 laps of traffic to deal with before the first stop.

#221 HBoss

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Posted 30 April 2007 - 13:26

Great, thanks. :up:
So there is a trend, Lewis is stopping earlier each race. If McLaren take it a bit further for Spain and Alonso also goes light, they might clinch the first row and then the win. Or Ferrari might try the same and who knows what next?
I just can't wait for the race!!!

#222 scheivlak

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 22:18

Inspired by the "Hamilton crosses a line" pics in the Monaco race comments thread:
Why is the Monaco pit exit line yellow and not white?

#223 Risil

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 23:04

Originally posted by scheivlak
Inspired by the "Hamilton crosses a line" pics in the Monaco race comments thread:
Why is the Monaco pit exit line yellow and not white?


I would imagine it's so that the driver can distinguish it from the plethora of white road markings on the track.

#224 Nasty McBastard

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Posted 29 May 2007 - 23:09

at a guess....because the rest of the track is covered with white lines, and could be hard to pick from the rest of the markings.


as opposed to most tracks, wheres theres no other markings, so a white line is obvious enough as it is.

#225 metz

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 14:50

Here's another interesting question.

Is Ghosn, the president of Renault, not aware that Alonso has left the team?
This is what he says in todays Autosport article;

"And I would like to tell you the team is the same. The only thing that has changed is the tyre, that's all. The engineering is the same, the technical staff is the same, the management - everybody is the same. So I'm very confident."

Ghosn

#226 Limits

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 15:19

Originally posted by metz
Here's another interesting question.

Is Ghosn, the president of Renault, not aware that Alonso has left the team?
This is what he says in todays Autosport article;

"And I would like to tell you the team is the same. The only thing that has changed is the tyre, that's all. The engineering is the same, the technical staff is the same, the management - everybody is the same. So I'm very confident."

Ghosn

Hush! As long as Ghosn belives they are doing good when he sees Alonso on the podium Renault will stay in F1!

#227 howardt

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 15:42

Originally posted by Limits

Hush! As long as Ghosn belives they are doing good when he sees Alonso on the podium Renault will stay in F1!


Better still, even their Friday driver is picking up points here and there !

#228 Risil

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Posted 30 May 2007 - 20:18

Originally posted by howardt


Better still, even their Friday driver is picking up points here and there !


You've lost me there... Allan McNish? :confused:

#229 howardt

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Posted 31 May 2007 - 11:52

No, sorry. I mean, that if Ghosn still thinks that Alonso is a renault driver (as per last year), then he must be delighted that even Heikki (last year's Man-Friday) is picking up some WDC points.
Never mind, any humour there may have been has long since drained away with the explanation...

#230 Risil

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Posted 31 May 2007 - 12:04

Originally posted by howardt
No, sorry. I mean, that if Ghosn still thinks that Alonso is a renault driver (as per last year), then he must be delighted that even Heikki (last year's Man-Friday) is picking up some WDC points.
Never mind, any humour there may have been has long since drained away with the explanation...


Right-ho. :lol:

#231 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 17:15

Is Massa admitting he rammed Alonso, with this statement

"Something happened that I wish it won't happen again," Massa said.

"But I don't regret what I did, as in the end I had a normal reaction. We are there fighting for positions, fighting for the championship, and sometimes you can't just control your nerves so easily."

robo-schummie

taken from

#232 David M. Kane

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 17:48

No I don't think so, I just think his English is just not perfect. Give the kid some credit, this just isn't the same Massa as in the past. He showed signs last year right now he's in the top 2 IMO.

#233 Risil

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 17:58

Is there any chance he's talking about his and Fernando's altercation after the race, where they were caught arguing quite heatedly by the TV cameras?

#234 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 18:13

Originally posted by Risil
Is there any chance he's talking about his and Fernando's altercation after the race, where they were caught arguing quite heatedly by the TV cameras?


that's what I was wondering also

#235 wingwalker

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 21:29

it's widely rumoured that jordan team used traction control in the days when it was banned. so, what years exactly? 98? (1-2 during the wet spa race?)?


are there any stats for 'proper' overtaking moves per race?

#236 scheivlak

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Posted 29 July 2007 - 21:36

Originally posted by wingwalker
it's widely rumoured that jordan team used traction control in the days when it was banned. so, what years exactly? 98? (1-2 during the wet spa race?)?

Not that I know of, remember they were a bit lucky as well that time.
The rumours concern 1999 because of some cryptic remark from Max Mosley early in 2000 IIRC about the use of TC by a 'midfield team' i.e. not McLaren or Ferrari. Stewart, who were also remarkably competitive all of a sudden, was the other team associated with this.....

#237 Rexx Havoc

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 02:07

didn't want to start a thread so i'll make this post On Topic

Could this be Micheal's No.1 Fan?

#238 David M. Kane

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 02:23

REXX:

If he had a paddle-shift, he might have been able to make it home!

#239 Atreiu

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Posted 01 August 2007 - 20:09

Where can I find good info on the circuit near Eurodisney that might recieve the French GP?

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#240 le chat noir

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 18:02

when in germany which channel do i need for the monza race? and when will it start?

(and OT, what one thing should be seen in berlin?)

is there a good bar in town, or should i go back to the hotel?

#241 Knuckles

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 20:11

Originally posted by le chat noir
when in germany which channel do i need for the monza race? and when will it start?

(and OT, what one thing should be seen in berlin?)

is there a good bar in town, or should i go back to the hotel?


You can watch on RTL, but the coverage is not that great, as they have ad breaks during the race. They have Lauda commenting pre- and post-race, but to be honest, Lauda is a disappointment on TV as he will often go with whatever direction he thinks the wind blows. Oh, I guess you don't understand German anyway, so it does not matter.

Many bars (and hotels) show the feed by Premiere, which is pay TV without ads and with extra feeds such as a mid-pack camera (however, bars probably won't use that). There are so-called "Premiere Sports Bars", who have a dark-red/yellow/white Premiere sign outside. They are often normal bars, sometimes however they have more of a sports focus overall. You can search for them here ("Ort" is Berlin, "PLZ" is the zip code) http://www.premiere....sbars_start.jsp
You might still want to call in advance to ask whether they show F1, some premiere sports bars just show football.

Your question "is there a good bar in town" is very funny :) There is a huge number of great bars in Berlin, and Berlin prouds itself on being a party city. You should try the districts Mitte, Prenzlauer Berg, and Friedrichshain. I remember that I once read that just the 6 blocks around Simon-Dach-Straße in Friedrichshain are host to more than 200 bars and restaurants, and many of them are great. Prenzlauer Berg is a bit more expensive and a less alternative/student area (actually it was just that a few years ago, but people have grown older), and Mitte is the most upscale area (if such a thing exists in Berlin at all ;)

Here are zip codes in which you will find great bars on the premiere site:
10243 Berlin-Friedrichshain
10245 Berlin-Friedrichshain (highest bar density)
10247 Berlin-Friedrichshain
10249 Berlin-Friedrichshain

10405 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10407 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10409 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10435 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10437 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10439 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg

10115 Mitte
10117 Mitte
10119 Mitte
10178 Mitte
10179 Mitte

Berlin is in the same time zone as Monza, so race will start 14:00 local time, pre-race on RTL starts 12:45, dunno about Premiere. Qualifying will start 13:00 IIRC (that's always quali start time, isn't it?)

#242 Knuckles

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 20:17

Originally posted by le chat noir
(and OT, what one thing should be seen in berlin?)


Impossible to tell, what are you interested in? Personally, I'd say just party through the night in Friedrichshain or Prenzlauer Berg.

#243 Atreiu

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 20:19

Stupid question:

- Do you guys think the races would become more exciting if pilots could drop their worse results again? For example, if Raikkonen new he could dropp his worse results, do you think he'd risk overtaking or colliding with Hamilton or Massa at Hungaroring or Istambul?

#244 Clatter

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 20:32

Originally posted by Atreiu
Stupid question:

- Do you guys think the races would become more exciting if pilots could drop their worse results again? For example, if Raikkonen new he could dropp his worse results, do you think he'd risk overtaking or colliding with Hamilton or Massa at Hungaroring or Istambul?


Nope.

What good would it do him anyway? They would both be able to drop their worse result as well, so he would be no better off.

#245 Atreiu

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 20:40

Originally posted by Clatter


Nope.

What good would it do him anyway? They would both be able to drop their worse result as well, so he would be no better off.


At least he'd be more encouraged to try, I guess.

#246 brunopascal

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 20:51

Originally posted by Clatter


Nope.

What good would it do him anyway? They would both be able to drop their worse result as well, so he would be no better off.

Back then only 11 of 16 races mattered for the WDC, 5 worst had to be dropped.
Let imagine only the best 12 of this seasons 17 count for each driver.
Then it would matter.

KR's five worst so far is worth 10 points, LH's five worst so far is worth 30 points. Since LH has finished in the points more often, this means LH has to drop more points than KR for each point they score. It would make it tighter, and would also make the win more important each race.

Possibly this would be an incitement for more daring moves, but not much would change really. It's too difficult to overtake for that I think.

However I think that was an unfair system, each point should count.

#247 le chat noir

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 23:33

Originally posted by Knuckles


You can watch on RTL, but the coverage is not that great, as they have ad breaks during the race. They have Lauda commenting pre- and post-race, but to be honest, Lauda is a disappointment on TV as he will often go with whatever direction he thinks the wind blows. Oh, I guess you don't understand German anyway, so it does not matter.

Many bars (and hotels) show the feed by Premiere, which is pay TV without ads and with extra feeds such as a mid-pack camera (however, bars probably won't use that). There are so-called "Premiere Sports Bars", who have a dark-red/yellow/white Premiere sign outside. They are often normal bars, sometimes however they have more of a sports focus overall. You can search for them here ("Ort" is Berlin, "PLZ" is the zip code) http://www.premiere....sbars_start.jsp
You might still want to call in advance to ask whether they show F1, some premiere sports bars just show football.

Your question "is there a good bar in town" is very funny :) There is a huge number of great bars in Berlin, and Berlin prouds itself on being a party city. You should try the districts Mitte, Prenzlauer Berg, and Friedrichshain. I remember that I once read that just the 6 blocks around Simon-Dach-Straße in Friedrichshain are host to more than 200 bars and restaurants, and many of them are great. Prenzlauer Berg is a bit more expensive and a less alternative/student area (actually it was just that a few years ago, but people have grown older), and Mitte is the most upscale area (if such a thing exists in Berlin at all ;)

Here are zip codes in which you will find great bars on the premiere site:
10243 Berlin-Friedrichshain
10245 Berlin-Friedrichshain (highest bar density)
10247 Berlin-Friedrichshain
10249 Berlin-Friedrichshain

10405 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10407 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10409 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10435 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10437 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg
10439 Berlin-Prenzlauer Berg

10115 Mitte
10117 Mitte
10119 Mitte
10178 Mitte
10179 Mitte

Berlin is in the same time zone as Monza, so race will start 14:00 local time, pre-race on RTL starts 12:45, dunno about Premiere. Qualifying will start 13:00 IIRC (that's always quali start time, isn't it?)


thank you knuckles. i did mean is there a good bar to watch the f1, rather than is there just a good bar :lol: but thanks for all your efforts :up: . i'll be sure to check it all out.

Are there any channels with english commentray i could get? mind you, being without allen might be nice...

#248 metz

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Posted 04 September 2007 - 00:06

Originally posted by Atreiu
Stupid question:

- Do you guys think the races would become more exciting if pilots could drop their worse results again? For example, if Raikkonen new he could dropp his worse results, do you think he'd risk overtaking or colliding with Hamilton or Massa at Hungaroring or Istambul?

Droping a drivers worst races makes as much sense as droping a drivers best races. ):

#249 Knuckles

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Posted 04 September 2007 - 05:20

Originally posted by le chat noir
Are there any channels with english commentray i could get? mind you, being without allen might be nice...


If only! Let me know if you find one. Germany unfortunately is obsessed with German, all the English-language movies and series on TV are dubbed, making them unwatchable.

The only time I was that lucky was in the first half of the nineties, when the cable company in Vienna, Austria was too cheap to license the German Eurosport feed, and to much dismay of the general public offered "just" John Watson and Ben Edwards. It was so great! (And I was a Hill fan)

By the way, there is an English-language magazine available, the Ex-Berliner, it's pretty nice.

#250 Just

Just
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Posted 06 September 2007 - 01:24

Okay, here's a stupid question. I've heard before that just lifting off the throttle in an F1 car decelerates the car so quickly that it's equivalent to slamming on the brakes in a street car. The question, of course, is why? I would have thought that if F1 cars are so aerodynamically efficient, then lifting off the throttle would cause them to lose speed slower than lifting off the the accelerator in a normal car.