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Parnell-BRM


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#1 GTO

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Posted 31 October 2006 - 20:53

In 1966, Mike Spence was seen at the wheel of a 2.0 BRM engined Parnell sportscar.
He drove it to victory at Goodwood in the Lavant Cup. Then, Spence won the Anerley Trophy at Crystal Palace et finished second at Silverstone in July.

Does anybody know something about this car?
Technical information, photos, its career...
Who built it? Where did it run? By whom? With which result?

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#2 Doug Nye

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Posted 31 October 2006 - 22:21

Designed for Tim by Les Redmond - fitted with a nominally 2-litre BRM V8 engine - won at Goodwood Easter Monday I think driven by Mike Spence. Either it or the similar Willment-BRM reappeared in later years roofed-in - I believe - as the 'Mysteron' or 'Mystron' GT. I saw it race in that guise at Snetterton, in a meeting which I believe also featured a violent accident in which one car spun into the end of the pits, and was then joined there a few moments later by another, both drivers being quite badly hurt. Or is my memory playing me false? :confused:

DCN

#3 RickT

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Posted 01 November 2006 - 09:41

Dear Doug

It was the Willment BRM, not the Parnell, which was later 'roofed' and re-named the Mysteron. It was raced like this quite successfully by Ken Simmons including at least one Snetterton on May14 1968. At that meeting Brian Spicer's E-Type hit the end of the pit wall and was then followed by Tom Mayhew's Elan doing the same, both drivers went to hospital but Autosport reported their injuries as only superficial.

The Willment is quite special to me having been owned and raced by my father Anthony Taylor since 1978. We are hoping to have the car out racing again next year as we have not managed to run it for a couple of seasons now. When my father bought the car it came with the Mysteron gull wing doors and roof.

Cheers
Richard Taylor

#4 Doug Nye

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Posted 01 November 2006 - 21:06

Thanks Rick - daft old fart that I've become. I was peripherally involved in extracting those guys from the end of the pit wall and for a while - in my medical inexperience - it did not look good. They were very heavy impacts. To happier matters - does the Willment still have the BRM engine?

DCN

#5 RickT

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Posted 02 November 2006 - 09:34

Doug

Yes, it does still have the BRM engine, which is currently in the process of being rebuilt - it should have been ready for Goodwood this year but the new valves were not ready in time. Hopefully she should be up and running again in time for next season, hopefully to take in some rounds of the excellent, new format, HSCC Classic Sports Car Championship.

Dad bought the car in a real state in 1978, then had to identify exactly what it was ! This was made all the more difficult by the added roof section. Once he new what he had got he then rebuilt the car and used it in the HSCC Historic Special GT Championship for many years (winning the under 2 litre section in 1980). Since then we have run it in lots of Piper/Knight SuperSports races, Group 4 and twice at Goodwood. It is only run very occasionally now, trying to keep the engine miles down.

Cheers
Richard

#6 Alan Cox

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Posted 03 November 2006 - 23:12

As this thread has veered slightly OT onto the Willment, here is Innes Ireland from the Croft Wills Trophy meeting, 1966, when it won one of the heats.

Posted Image

Photo by Roger Ellis

#7 roger ellis

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Posted 04 November 2006 - 12:34

Moments before this picture was taken an irate Innes had administed a tongue lashing to a hapless Willment mechanic for trying to start the BRM V8 while the 'plug leads were unattached!

#8 Bjorn Kjer

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Posted 04 November 2006 - 14:32

Hi Cox/Ellis ,fine pic, also saw those on the paddock thread, great , even gave me a glimse of a couple of transporters. Bjørn

#9 Mistron

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Posted 05 November 2006 - 10:08

I've got a pic and race report of the 'Mysteron' from Autosport in May '68 as (courtesy of C&SC) there was a suggestion that my car was perhaps in part the ex Wilment car - I bought my car as 'the Mysteron' which should have been Mistron........

just to confuse matters, in the article the ex wilment car was refered to throughout as Mistron!

easy to see where confusion sets in!

I'll see if I can look them out.


http://myweb.tiscali...acecar/pandora/

#10 Gerard Gamand

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Posted 27 February 2007 - 10:45

I have found two pics of the lovely Parnell-BRM V8 :

First is the very late Mike Spence winning the sports cars race at Goodwood Easter Monday in 1966 (#143) and the second one, is the same, winning Christal Palace in 1966 too (#80)

Posted Image

Posted Image

#11 Alan Cox

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Posted 27 February 2007 - 19:09

Pretty rare shots, Gerard, merçi.

It was a most elegant 2-litre sports car. It was a shame that it had such a short career.

#12 Gerard Gamand

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Posted 27 February 2007 - 19:21

I think exactly the same when I find the picture in my archive. What a wonderful sports car, perharps better look than the Lotus 30.
Was a monocoque chassis ? Where is the car today ?

#13 silicanza

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Posted 18 August 2009 - 10:53

Posted Image

Attached a newspaper article at the time of completion of the Parnell BRM for Tim Parnell. Les Redmond in the seat.

#14 silicanza

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Posted 18 August 2009 - 11:27

The Story behind the Parnell BRM.

After Reg Parnell's death and the subsequent mothballing of the almost completed Les redmond designed and built, Climax engined Parnell RP64 F1 car, Reg's son, Tim Parnell instead acquired three Lotus 25’s for 1964. Les Redmond, designer and builder of Moorland cars, Gemini FJ and various other designs, was then commissioned to design and build the Aluminium bodied Sports racing car; the Parnell BRM.

Redmond had worked with Reg at Aston Martin in the competition department when Reg Parnell was the Race Manager.

As has been mentioned, the Parnell BRM with rear mounted 2 litre normally aspirated BRM enjoyed success in 1966, in the hands of Mike Spence. Spence drove it to victory at Goodwood in the Lavant Cup. Then, Spence won the Anerley Trophy at Crystal Palace and finishing second at Silverstone in July. Tony Magg's also drove the car at sometime.

Later reports have suggested the RP64 chassis was modified and became the Parnell BRM Sport Car. Its doubtful one could take a monocoque chassis 4’’ narrower than the Lotus F1 of the day and make it a Sports car. I'll post photos of the chassis of the Parnell RP64 F1 during construction and you decide, if this, a centre seat single seater could be made into the Parnell BRM Sports Car, where the driver sat to the right. If it was, it would have involved building a whole new tub!!!

There are reports and pictures on the Web of a Parnell F2 car that although resembling a Lotus it's a lot narrower?. Is it a possibility the RP64 chassis was used for that car???? Does anybody have any information or chassis photos of the Parnell F2 car?



#15 hatrat

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Posted 18 August 2009 - 11:29

A slightly bigger version of the newspaper article.

Posted Image

#16 hatrat

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Posted 19 August 2009 - 08:12

It says in the article that Les Redmond was the "co-designer" - who was the other co-designer?

#17 silicanza

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Posted 02 September 2009 - 11:05

It says in the article that Les Redmond was the "co-designer" - who was the other co-designer?


For lack of response from anyone else; I would say they are implying Tim Parnell, as the car carried his name? As a courtesy maybe.

#18 Macca

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Posted 04 January 2012 - 11:32

I'm bringing this up from the past because of finding this photo:

http://trackthoughts...143_M010897.jpg

Is this the real car? Presumably only one was built - I don't know the full history after 1966. Have any of our US colleagues seen it or met (with) the owner? I'd be interested to see any pictures showing the chassis or suspension.

Paul M

#19 barrykm

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Posted 04 January 2012 - 12:05

A good looking car, very much like a Lotus 30 in appearance.

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#20 Ted Walker

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Posted 05 January 2012 - 08:39

It does indeed look like it. When was it taken ???

#21 Macca

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Posted 05 January 2012 - 12:17

In 2010 at the Rolex Monterey historic event.

There are a couple of on-track photos here and the driver is listed as Dan Davis.

Paul M

#22 bradbury west

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Posted 05 January 2012 - 15:57

How refreshing to see the V8 Webster Spl in a photograph. We could do with that one and the 2 litre at Goodwood.....................
Roger Lund

#23 David Birchall

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 02:33

Roger, I am not sure how much, if any, contemporary racing the Webster participated in.

#24 Ted Walker

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 06:36

Dan Davis is the editor of Vintage Motorsoprt Magazine I think.

#25 Wouter Melissen

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 06:43

At the Motorsports Reunion in 2010 the car had a four cylinder with BRM stamped on the cam covers. So no more V8, or did it ever race in period with a 'four'?

Edited by Wouter Melissen, 06 January 2012 - 06:43.


#26 raceannouncer2003

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 06:54

Dan Davis is the editor of Vintage Motorsoprt Magazine I think.


Victory Lane.

Vince H.

#27 Alan Cox

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 09:53

At the Motorsports Reunion in 2010 the car had a four cylinder with BRM stamped on the cam covers. So no more V8, or did it ever race in period with a 'four'?

That's a shame. I don't recall it racing with a 4-cyl.
A few more pics here: http://www.flickr.co...arnell monterey

#28 Macca

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 08:46

Apparently Tim Parnell is going to be at the Shelsley Walsh BHC event this weekend, where there will be a BRM celebration for 50 years since NGH's first GP win.

Is anyone going? Does anyone know Tim to talk to? And if so, could they raise these questions:

1) Was the 1.5-L F1 actually finished and tested before being abandoned, and if so are there any pictures?
2) Was it scrapped, or were any parts used in the RP64 sportscar?
3) Did the 3-L F1 chassis that was being built in early 1968 use any parts from the 1.5-L, and was it also designed by Les Redmond?
4) When Lotus 25 chassis R3 was crashed by Mike Spence in Mexico in 1966, how badly damaged was it? Are there any photos? Was it brought back to the UK, and if so were any parts used in any other cars?
5) Did the F2 car of 1967 have any links to the 1963 or 1968 F1 cars? Was it built by the Parnell team or modified from something else?

Very anorakish I know, but it would be nice to know.....

And on the subject of Lotus 25 R3, here is a photo in the paddock at the 1966 International Trophy when fitted with an FPF:
http://mydadsphotos....966/bw_e004_02/

Paul M

#29 raceannouncer2003

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 06:01

Monaco Historique

Posted Image Posted Image

Tim Parnell with ex-Peter Revson Lotus 24-BRM/P1........................Parnell with...(supply your own caption...visiting hours?)

Vince H.



#30 cdrewett

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 06:16

Apparently Tim Parnell is going to be at the Shelsley Walsh BHC event this weekend, where there will be a BRM celebration for 50 years since NGH's first GP win.

Is anyone going? Does anyone know Tim to talk to? And if so, could they raise these questions:

1) Was the 1.5-L F1 actually finished and tested before being abandoned, and if so are there any pictures?
2) Was it scrapped, or were any parts used in the RP64 sportscar?
3) Did the 3-L F1 chassis that was being built in early 1968 use any parts from the 1.5-L, and was it also designed by Les Redmond?
4) When Lotus 25 chassis R3 was crashed by Mike Spence in Mexico in 1966, how badly damaged was it? Are there any photos? Was it brought back to the UK, and if so were any parts used in any other cars?
5) Did the F2 car of 1967 have any links to the 1963 or 1968 F1 cars? Was it built by the Parnell team or modified from something else?

Very anorakish I know, but it would be nice to know.....

And on the subject of Lotus 25 R3, here is a photo in the paddock at the 1966 International Trophy when fitted with an FPF:
http://mydadsphotos....966/bw_e004_02/

Paul M

I'll be there and I'll try to ask him
Chris

#31 Barry Boor

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 09:28

Did they ever let Graham out or is he still there?

#32 Sharman

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 15:20

Dear Doug

It was the Willment BRM, not the Parnell, which was later 'roofed' and re-named the Mysteron. It was raced like this quite successfully by Ken Simmons including at least one Snetterton on May14 1968. At that meeting Brian Spicer's E-Type hit the end of the pit wall and was then followed by Tom Mayhew's Elan doing the same, both drivers went to hospital but Autosport reported their injuries as only superficial.

The Willment is quite special to me having been owned and raced by my father Anthony Taylor since 1978. We are hoping to have the car out racing again next year as we have not managed to run it for a couple of seasons now. When my father bought the car it came with the Mysteron gull wing doors and roof.

Cheers
Richard Taylor


Seek and ye shall find. I have been searching for details on Albert Betts and an E type which he modified. In that thread I asked for Brian spicer and lo and behold, here is the E type.
I don't want tp hi-jack this thread but I have found a considerable more detail which I will now apply to the Albert thread.

#33 Sisyphus

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 19:05

After Reg Parnell's death and the subsequent mothballing of the almost completed Les redmond designed and built, Climax engined Parnell RP64 F1 car, Reg's son, Tim Parnell instead acquired three Lotus 25’s for 1964.


Any story behind why the Parnell F1 was mothballed in favor of the Lotus 25's? The Lotus certainly had a winning history but was getting a bit old by '64 and all 3 chassis (R3, R4, and R7 I believe) had done some considerable amount of miles.

If the Parnell was "almost completed" I wonder why they didn't at least test their work. The BRP Lotus 25 "copies" were not too bad considering the relative capabilities of BRP vs Team Lotus.

#34 raceannouncer2003

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 06:15

Did they ever let Graham out or is he still there?


I think everyone else has gone home except Graham and one other fellow at his table. Graham is still trying to finish his lunch while telling another story. (Just kidding, Graham!)

Vince H.


#35 cdrewett

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 16:42

I'll be there and I'll try to ask him
Chris


Macca
I had a good chat with Tim today, it was over lunch so I didn't take notes, but I think the answers to your questions are;
1. No. When Reg died the sponsors insisted that Tim concentrate on running the team, so the F1 project was abandoned.
2 A few parts, Tim thinks suspension, went into the sports car but the tub was scrapped.
3 No and yes I think.
4 They had 3 Lotus 25s, R3 R4 and R7. I may have this wrong, but R3 went to Oz, R4 was dismantled and parts went to other cars and R7 was written off and scrapped.
5 Sorry, didn't ask.
Chris

#36 mariner

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 16:48

The pic of the Parnell Lotus 25 with a 2.7 litre climax FPF 4 makes me wonder why Team Lotus didn't try that instead of fitting the 2 litre climax V-8 into the 33 for the start of the 1966 season.

I still remember Jim Clark's drives in the 2 litre 33 at Monaco and Zandvoort ( where he might have won if the water system hadn't failed IIRC).

Team Lotus had fitted a 2.7 climax four into the Lotus F2 car for the Tasman series so they had experience of it.

In the Des Hamill Climax book ( great read) the power of both engines was much the same at 245 bhp but I would guess the 2.7 had much better torque, close to most full 3 litre engines then.

Probably Colin Chapman didn't want to spend the money!!



#37 David McKinney

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 17:29

Team Lotus had fitted a 2.7 climax four into the Lotus F2 car for the Tasman series so they had experience of it.

When the upper limit of the formula was 2.5 litres?


#38 mariner

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 22:40

When the upper limit of the formula was 2.5 litres?

Sorry, lack of Nostalgia forum precision there - I meant 2.5 litre version of the same engine.


#39 Peter Morley

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Posted 04 June 2012 - 09:03

When the upper limit of the formula was 2.5 litres?


Not a surprising mistake for someone to make when current (e.g. historic) events for "Tasman cars" feature lots of 2.7 litre entries...

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#40 tonywilson43

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Posted 20 August 2012 - 17:47

Back to the Parnell-BRM sports car, I worked on this car for a few months in 1966. Working for Tim Parnell, as a 23 year old junior machanic to engineer Roy Christmas.

We took the car from a rolling chassis to a racer in time for the Goodwood 1966 Easter Monday meeting, where Mike Spence won first time out. Not an easy victory, Mike was in a battle with Mike Beckwith (Willment-BRM), Tony Dean (Willment Brabham BT8-Climax) and Mac Daghorn (Felday-BRM), and was off the circuit once! I am reading from the results sheet, which includes race positions every lap. The Parnell ran under race number 143, exactly as the recent photos from America.

A win at Crystal Palace, then a second and fuel-pressure retirement at Silverstone, before the project was shelved and I was out on my ear!

I have photos of the car in early stage of build.

Here is a photo of the Parnell-BRM at Tim Parnell's Findern, Derby workshop, Les Redmond standing by the front left. The car to the left is one of Tim's Lotus 25s, and leaning against the wall is the rear body section of the Parnell-BRM.
http://s12.postimage...Les_Redmond.jpg

This photo was taken by Derby Evening Telegraph, its caption names us as Tony Williams (actually me!), engineer Roy Christmas, and Tim Parnell.
http://s9.postimage....1st_picture.jpg
http://s12.postimage...ure_caption.jpg

This is the race report sheet from the Easter Monday Goodwood event.
http://s17.postimage...Race_info_A.jpg
http://s12.postimage...Race_info_B.jpg

Many thanks to Roger Lund for pointing me in the right direction for posting these links.

Tony Wilson

Edited by tonywilson43, 31 August 2012 - 15:46.


#41 bradbury west

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Posted 20 August 2012 - 18:36

Tony, of the various options used here on TNF, I have found this one idiot proof, ie I can make it work.
http://www.postimage.org/
Roger Lund

#42 Macca

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 14:19

http://www.hrscc.co.nz/gemini2.html

More about Les Redmond.


Paul M

#43 bradbury west

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 15:53

An excellent find, Paul, much detail about his designs etc.
TNFer Nigel Russell continues generously to host Peter Emery's Emeryson website on the HSRCC site under Formula Junior.
Roger Lund