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Motorcycle racing; 1949-1968 nostalgia


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#8351 billlawrence

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 01:42

Yes, well done, Fred it is in '64. He was a good consistent performer, aye. Apparently, he later became a Jehovah witness and worked for them in Manchester.


yes you are right Russell .My brother in law was a Jehovahs Witness and I remember him showing me an article that Fread had written in one of their magazine,s about ten years ago . .
Bill Lawrence

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#8352 pmbboy

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 08:33

Hi All,
I think the writing on the fairing on Fred Stevens picture is Bill Jakeman who produced fairings in the 60's, not sure what happened to his company but he did produce s good looking fairing.

Pete


#8353 picblanc

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 11:53

What a great shot! packed with atmosphere! :up:

#8354 GD66

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 13:27

Good question ! Have asked Tom to take a peek at it.

Meanwhile, Merry Christmas to all. :wave:

#8355 Russell Burrows

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 13:43

He spins a good yarn:
http://www.mikenicks...dman-godfather/

#8356 knickerbrook

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 16:23

I clearly remember seeing an article in an old (circa 1962) Motor Cycling weekly that I was given years ago - it was a magazine with yellow cover - about a Francis Beart 7R! The bike was distinctive, not only by Beart's trademark green livery, but that stubby Norton-type seat. I am sure the bike pictured (with Stevens aboard) is the very same! I wonder what became of it?

#8357 Russell Burrows

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 17:57

I clearly remember seeing an article in an old (circa 1962) Motor Cycling weekly that I was given years ago - it was a magazine with yellow cover - about a Francis Beart 7R! The bike was distinctive, not only by Beart's trademark green livery, but that stubby Norton-type seat. I am sure the bike pictured (with Stevens aboard) is the very same! I wonder what became of it?

I clocked a similar looking bike a few years ago at Brands, minus, I think, the stubby seat. From memory it purported to be Peter Darvill's '63 Manx winner. The well knocked about one pictured here in '64 could easily be both the same bike you recall reading about, and the one still floating about a classic meetings. Then again Beart might have prepared a few of them around that time?

#8358 picblanc

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 18:15

Franta Stasny?

#8359 knickerbrook

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 20:30

Steve Spencer?

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#8360 Russell Burrows

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 21:12

Steve Spencer?


Yes, Barry. Too easy?

#8361 knickerbrook

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 21:38

Not really, it had me going for quite a while! The pure road circuit was significant (probably an Irish race?) so I trawled the TT database for likely candidates in the mid-sixties and the penny dropped as soon as I saw Spencer listed.

#8362 larryd

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 21:50

Not really, it had me going for quite a while! The pure road circuit was significant (probably an Irish race?) so I trawled the TT database for likely candidates in the mid-sixties and the penny dropped as soon as I saw Spencer listed.


Not an Irish road race , Barry.

We're still at Salzburg, I think !


#8363 Russell Burrows

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 21:53

Not an Irish road race , Barry.

We're still at Salzburg, I think !


Oh, yes ;)


#8364 GD66

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 22:20

... who is the Aussie with the Manx ? I don't know and, assuming nobody else knows for sure, I wondered if your mate Tom Gill could ID him, Glenn?



Tommy's not 100% sure, but thinks it might be Dennis Fry.


Edit : is that Errol Cowan on #98? Petrol tank's taken a big hit !

Edited by GD66, 24 December 2012 - 22:51.


#8365 larryd

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 11:48

Tommy's not 100% sure, but thinks it might be Dennis Fry.


Edit : is that Errol Cowan on #98? Petrol tank's taken a big hit !


Bit chubby in the face for Dennis, perhaps?

#8366 Russell Burrows

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:45

Tommy's not 100% sure, but thinks it might be Dennis Fry.


Edit : is that Errol Cowan on #98? Petrol tank's taken a big hit !

Errol is correct, Glenn, Saltzburg '67.

Thanks for contacting Tom, and to Tom for having a gander (although I think I'm with Larry on this).

Edited by Russell Burrows, 25 December 2012 - 12:48.


#8367 larryd

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 13:04

Errol is correct, Glenn, Saltzburg '67.

Thanks for contacting Tom, and to Tom for having a gander (although I think I'm with Larry on this).


Early user in European road races of a Jet style helmet -- Trevor Pound ??

#8368 SgtPepperoni

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 16:30

Time for one more?
Posted Image

Great pic of Errol, RB. He stayed with me a couple of times and was great company. Was married to a beautiful girl, but I can't for the life of me remember her name. She always ran around bare foot. Errol told me it was a South African thing :lol:

He was a superb rider. Great style and bloody fast. The pic is especially timely as he passed on almost three years ago, 2nd of December 2009 actually.

Edited by SgtPepperoni, 25 December 2012 - 16:33.


#8369 barrykm

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 06:28

Time for one more?
Posted Image


Nice pic of Errol Cowan - from the days when 'leathers' were just that...not sure what the current suits are made of?

#8370 GD66

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:10

Early user in European road races of a Jet style helmet -- Trevor Pound ??


Trevor was only over there in 1960 and '61, Larry, and as far as I know his jet helmet was red.

Posted Image

Edited by GD66, 26 December 2012 - 09:29.


#8371 larryd

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 16:25

Trevor was only over there in 1960 and '61, Larry, and as far as I know his jet helmet was red.

Posted Image


Fair do's, Glenn - point taken!

My next thought was Malcolm Stanton, but his jet helmet was dark, and it's possibly a year early for him.

Last try -- Ron Robinson ?


#8372 larryd

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 17:40

I was thinking Ron too, Larry - I was, honest. He was around at the right time and there's a photograph of him out there in the following year with a roo of similar design on his lid. Nothing then in the Cox book?

Posted Image


Being pursued by Smiling Jack ?

Circus Life just has a photo of Mal, Russ - that's where I got the "dark helmet" from.

Nothing on Ron, and I've never seen a photo of him - I know from "Heroes" that he was over in '64, among several others!!

You mean you haven't got the C.L. book yet?? ):

I'm told that Keith Bryen has read it twice so far, and I've just started on my second lap - it's a cracking book and I can't recommend it highly enough :clap:


#8373 Russell Burrows

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 17:47

Being pursued by Smiling Jack ?

Circus Life just has a photo of Mal, Russ - that's where I got the "dark helmet" from.

Nothing on Ron, and I've never seen a photo of him - I know from "Heroes" that he was over in '64, among several others!!

You mean you haven't got the C.L. book yet?? ):

I'm told that Keith Bryen has read it twice so far, and I've just started on my second lap - it's a cracking book and I can't recommend it highly enough :clap:


Yes, Ahearn chasing. I don't know what 'Heroes' is, Larry? Yes, haven't got my paws on a copy of the Cox book yet - I will soonish, hopefully.

#8374 knickerbrook

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 18:36

My money's still on Fred!

#8375 SgtPepperoni

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 19:12

Yes, Ahearn chasing. I don't know what 'Heroes' is, Larry? Yes, haven't got my paws on a copy of the Cox book yet - I will soonish, hopefully.

A quick google turned up these two sites, Russ. The first link has some info on the Cox book, Circus Life, while the second features a bit about "Heros", also written by Cox together with Will Hagon.

http://www.google.de.../...EwAg&dur=38

http://www.google.de.../...wAQ&dur=251

#8376 Russell Burrows

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 19:18

A quick google turned up these two sites, Russ. The first link has some info on the Cox book, Circus Life, while the second features a bit about "Heros", also written by Cox together with Will Hagon.

http://www.google.de.../...EwAg&dur=38

http://www.google.de.../...wAQ&dur=251


Thanks, Sarge. :up:

#8377 Paul Rochdale

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 20:03

I don't know but Joe Dunphy is in the background.

#8378 Russell Burrows

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 20:07

I don't know but Joe Dunphy is in the background.

You should be good at Identifying people ;) Yes, Joe in the background of the Steve Spencer shot, Paul.

#8379 larryd

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 20:12

Yes, Ahearn chasing. I don't know what 'Heroes' is, Larry? Yes, haven't got my paws on a copy of the Cox book yet - I will soonish, hopefully.


Cox & Hagon's "Australian Motorcycle Heroes" - another most excellent book, equally recommended.

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#8380 Russell Burrows

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 20:30

Cox & Hagon's "Australian Motorcycle Heroes" - another most excellent book, equally recommended.

:up: Thanks, Larry


#8381 billlawrence

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 01:10

Trevor was only over there in 1960 and '61, Larry, and as far as I know his jet helmet was red.

Posted Image


How about Peter Pawson ? Bill Lawrence

#8382 GD66

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 03:26

Petrer Pawson was (should say is) a Kiwi, Bill, and he came home at the end of 1961 as well.

#8383 germanty

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 10:24

Chaps, one of our little group has planted a seed of doubt in my mind as to the accuracy of my identification of Fred in this shot. I was pretty certain it was him - what do you think?


Looks a bit like Stuart Graham !

#8384 larryd

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 11:41

Looks a bit like Stuart Graham !


Sorry - very much don't think so . . . . . .

#8385 knickerbrook

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 13:25

Say, Bill Lawrence - did you race a 125 Honda by any chance? (Particularly at Aberdare Park in 1978?).

#8386 billlawrence

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 13:32

Say, Bill Lawrence - did you race a 125 Honda by any chance? (Particularly at Aberdare Park in 1978?).


Yes mate did race at Aberdare Park a few times top littel track .
Regards Bill Lawrence

#8387 Russell Burrows

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 14:32

Looks a bit like Stuart Graham !


Hi germanty, only a bit.... Unlike loads of other riders who I can recall seeing in the flesh as it were, I can't remember ever clocking Fred minus his riding gear so I'm relying on memories of photographs from long ago. I bet Dennis knew Fred ?

The appeal to the Clerk of the Course was based on this picture, one of Fred with Lewis Young in which his features don't appear to match with those of the guy in the Salzburg pic. It's clearly a valid point, but I think Fred's longer and more elaborate fifties type hairstyle, coupled with the less than crisp image, are distorting things. I think they're both Fred. What do y'all rekon?
Posted Image

Edited by Russell Burrows, 27 December 2012 - 15:33.


#8388 germanty

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 16:11

Hi germanty, only a bit.... Unlike loads of other riders who I can recall seeing in the flesh as it were, I can't remember ever clocking Fred minus his riding gear so I'm relying on memories of photographs from long ago. I bet Dennis knew Fred ?

The appeal to the Clerk of the Course was based on this picture, one of Fred with Lewis Young in which his features don't appear to match with those of the guy in the Salzburg pic. It's clearly a valid point, but I think Fred's longer and more elaborate fifties type hairstyle, coupled with the less than crisp image, are distorting things. I think they're both Fred. What do y'all rekon?
Posted Image



Russ, Found a fair bit on Fred at http://thekneeslider...r-continuation/
in the bottom section including comments from some of his relatives.

I will ask Dennis to have a good look.

Incidentally on the Island in 1959 or 1960 I remember a black Jaguar MK8/9 Hearse that carried a couple of bikes in it. The guys also slept in the back I think. My failing grey matter seems to recall either Fred, Lewis Young or the Hintons owned it.

#8389 Russell Burrows

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 17:51

Russ, Found a fair bit on Fred at http://thekneeslider...r-continuation/
in the bottom section including comments from some of his relatives.

I will ask Dennis to have a good look.

Incidentally on the Island in 1959 or 1960 I remember a black Jaguar MK8/9 Hearse that carried a couple of bikes in it. The guys also slept in the back I think. My failing grey matter seems to recall either Fred, Lewis Young or the Hintons owned it.

Thanks germanty, might attempt to locate the son, especially since they're photos involved !

Yes, I seem to recall seeing a jag fitted out like that. I think Paddy Driver had one too? I seem also to recall Jim Blanchard putting up a photograph of one on here ?

Edited by Russell Burrows, 28 December 2012 - 08:23.


#8390 larryd

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 22:25

Bo Granath got back to say he's not sure but thinks it may be Jack Saunders.


I may be wrong (again!!) but I think that Jack Saunders's first year in Europe was not until 1965 ??

#8391 Russell Burrows

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 00:04

I may be wrong (again!!) but I think that Jack Saunders's first year in Europe was not until 1965 ??

Not sure on that, Larry.

I think Jack may have died just recently ?

Edited by Russell Burrows, 28 December 2012 - 00:11.


#8392 Rennmax

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 18:08

Another shot of Fred for our advanced physiognomic studies....

Posted Image

#8393 Russell Burrows

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 19:28

Another shot of Fred for our advanced physiognomic studies....


Lovely looking G50; high pipe, Oldani, seemingly sawn off seat, looks very Arter like? Shorey with his Manx. Is it in Germany, Renn?


#8394 Rennmax

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 20:56

Lovely looking G50; high pipe, Oldani, seemingly sawn off seat, looks very Arter like? Shorey with his Manx. Is it in Germany, Renn?


Hi Russ, pretty sure it's at the Sachsenring in '65, where he finished 5 th

#8395 Bernard

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 00:35

Bo Granath got back to say he's not sure but thinks it may be Jack Saunders.

Ron Robinson...well ..the fairing looks like his bike but I dont remember a Bell type helmet...met him and his wife Magda one cold practice morning on the Glencruchtery Road in 196 whatever

#8396 Russell Burrows

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 10:53

Ron Robinson...well ..the fairing looks like his bike but I dont remember a Bell type helmet...met him and his wife Magda one cold practice morning on the Glencruchtery Road in 196 whatever

Hi Bernard, good to see you back here. Do you by chance have any pics from around that time?

#8397 Bernard

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 11:40

Hi Bernard, good to see you back here. Do you by chance have any pics from around that time?

Sorry Russell no I dont...the only pics I have are in my head as all my Motorcycle News,Motor Cycling and Motor Cycle Sports are long gone. Someone on the Car forum mentioned Motor Cycle Sport which I can remember started as a newspaper..was the first one around Manx GP time,I have a recollection of Alan Shep on the front page

#8398 Russell Burrows

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 20:52

Posted Image

#8399 picblanc

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 21:46

Eric Oliver, Silverstone? 1956?

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#8400 Russell Burrows

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 22:03

Eric Oliver, Silverstone? 1956?


I'm not sure myself ,Graham, but that seems about right. Less Nutt in the chair? I don't ever recall seeing one of his bikes with such elaborate streamlining as this one. Good shot though, aye?