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#151 275 GTB-4

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Posted 28 December 2013 - 10:12

Sharman Posted Today, 19:02

GTB

It looks to me as though it is a Minor body over a something or other frame, the driver appears to be sitting over the rear axle, the track all round is exceedingly wide and the front axle line looks well forward, suggesting an engine centralised as much as possible.

Not a Racing Minor, a bitza which has had Minor body parts used to hide its knickers.


I don't agree...have a look back at some of the other posts here...the common theme is racing minors and some like the Morrari were quite radical in their day...if you want an argument (arggh, never mind :lol: )
 
(now put that stick down and step back from the cage! )



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#152 GMACKIE

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Posted 28 December 2013 - 10:19

Crikey Mikey, I thought this was only a Minor Disagreement.



#153 Sharman

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Posted 28 December 2013 - 11:19

GTB

Whilst I respect your opinion (misguided though it is), I need the stick to keep poking the colonials in the ribs whenever they get too uppity.....and I can't find the emoticons but I'm sticking my tongue out.

A Happy New Year to all.



#154 275 GTB-4

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Posted 28 December 2013 - 20:58

Ahhhh the plain-Jane, emoticonless, black and white forum strikes again :rolleyes:
 
 Meilleurs vœux to you too Monsieur Sharmione

(As for you Mackie, oil deal with you when I get a round tuit)



#155 GMACKIE

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Posted 28 December 2013 - 21:23

:p



#156 GMACKIE

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 03:05

I like racing Minors.......it's even better beating them. :)

 

 

3R7F1204_zpsb077d2c6.jpg


Edited by GMACKIE, 29 December 2013 - 22:01.


#157 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 05:48

They look like Holden wheels so possibly Holden suspension and grey powered? ....sure looks like a racing Minor to me :up:

I agree, it is a Sports Sedan, probably Holden powered.
You don't expect anyone in the late 60s to be racing with a A series BMC. Yet alone a sidevalve!
Many had B series, Holden, really anything with more power.
The only thing raced with a A series was a Mini.

#158 Sharman

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 07:34

I agree, it is a Sports Sedan, probably Holden powered.
You don't expect anyone in the late 60s to be racing with a A series BMC. Yet alone a sidevalve!
Many had B series, Holden, really anything with more power.
The only thing raced with a A series was a Mini.

QED It is not a racing Minor in any, as I described it earlier it is a bitza with a pretty dress.



#159 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 10:21

Try again. Posted and it did not happen.
Since many car companies lay claim to a modern 'Touring Car' in many series world wide Lintons pic is a Morris minor with a few suitable mods.
A Volvo Stupid Car will have a V8 and rear drive instead of V6 and front drive. Yet alone 18x11 rims and all the composite panels. Makes that Minor minimally modified,
The NZ Morrari probably was a little more modded

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#160 Sharman

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 11:40

Try again. Posted and it did not happen.
Since many car companies lay claim to a modern 'Touring Car' in many series world wide Lintons pic is a Morris minor with a few suitable mods.
A Volvo Stupid Car will have a V8 and rear drive instead of V6 and front drive. Yet alone 18x11 rims and all the composite panels. Makes that Minor minimally modified,
The NZ Morrari probably was a little more modded

Lee

As has been pointed out the driver of that car is sitting somewhere over the rear axle, my guess is that the position is of necessity as whatever unit drives the beastie is centrally mounted in a space frame. Hardly modified, more in line with special saloons. a pal of mine now sadly deceased had what looked from the outside, like a Capri. internally there was a spaceframe holding a 7 litre V8, what was called Silhouette Racing.



#161 275 GTB-4

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 21:05

Lee
As has been pointed out the driver of that car is sitting somewhere over the rear axle, my guess is that the position is of necessity as whatever unit drives the beastie is centrally mounted in a space frame. Hardly modified, more in line with special saloons. a pal of mine now sadly deceased had what looked from the outside, like a Capri. internally there was a spaceframe holding a 7 litre V8, what was called Silhouette Racing.


This is outrageous...why hasn't there been a Royal Commission into this flagrant disregard for originality in racing :p


Edited by 275 GTB-4, 29 December 2013 - 21:07.


#162 Sharman

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 21:42

This is outrageous...why hasn't there been a Royal Commission into this flagrant disregard for originality in racing :p

I will stoutly defend my views on the right for a Morris Minor to retain its' identity, after all if I was trying to sell a bastardised box of bits as a numbered birdcage Maserati there would dozens of people saying I was out of order.

Sauce for the goose.........



#163 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 21:57

Lee
As has been pointed out the driver of that car is sitting somewhere over the rear axle, my guess is that the position is of necessity as whatever unit drives the beastie is centrally mounted in a space frame. Hardly modified, more in line with special saloons. a pal of mine now sadly deceased had what looked from the outside, like a Capri. internally there was a spaceframe holding a 7 litre V8, what was called Silhouette Racing.

The driver of that car is alongside the centre pillar, look at the angle. Even in 68 the rules precluded moving the driver bac very far. The back of his seat was no further back than the leading edge of the back seat. Again look at modern tourers, back 2 feet and almost on the centre hump.
As for silouhette racing,,, again,, look at modern Tourers. Where NOTHING is original.
And as I said before, a racing Minor in 68 is a contradiction in terms. Underpowered underbraked eco box transport. Though modified with a bigger engine, brakes, wheels etc made them a fairly numeric model on the grids in that period. And remember a Minor 1000 was only discontinued here in 66. As a production racer it was against Minis! yet alone Cortinas. Cars 2 decades newer in design with double the power to weight ratio. Yet alone pushing far less air.

#164 arttidesco

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 02:26

Yes, a Traveller. It was his company car when he worked for the family brush business, ISTR.
Roger Lund

Confirmed as correct in quotation marks from Brian himself half way down this linked page and referred to again more correctly as a Traveler on the top of image 9/9 below the 312PB on this linked page :up:



#165 Sharman

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 08:02

The driver of that car is alongside the centre pillar, look at the angle. Even in 68 the rules precluded moving the driver bac very far. The back of his seat was no further back than the leading edge of the back seat. Again look at modern tourers, back 2 feet and almost on the centre hump.
As for silouhette racing,,, again,, look at modern Tourers. Where NOTHING is original.
And as I said before, a racing Minor in 68 is a contradiction in terms. Underpowered underbraked eco box transport. Though modified with a bigger engine, brakes, wheels etc made them a fairly numeric model on the grids in that period. And remember a Minor 1000 was only discontinued here in 66. As a production racer it was against Minis! yet alone Cortinas. Cars 2 decades newer in design with double the power to weight ratio. Yet alone pushing far less air.

Nothing you say there has any bearing on my contention that something powered by anything but an A series BMC engine is removed from contention as a pure Racing Minor. I have not looked at your profile but I suspect you were not there in the heyday of tintop racing when we saw everything from 100E Fords to 236 Armstrong Siddeley Sapphires being bullied round the circuits. It was club racing at its best and anything that came later was tinged with, if not corrupted by, commercialism. 

And I was looking at the angle, look at the exaggerated track and the filleted infill of the front wings.



#166 D-Type

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 11:34

I see where you are coming from - but where do you draw the line?  I don't know the full story of the Minor: I know it originally came with a side valve engine, followed by A-series OHV engines in sizes from 800cc (I think) to 1100cc.  But it never had a 1275cc engine as standard.  But many race that way in historic racing because someone 'could' have done so in period.  There were various overhead valve conversions for the side valve engine available in period, including one by Alta.  In period some were supercharged.  Do we accept these modified cars?  Essentially they are still Minors.  At the extreme we have period specials like the famous New Zealand Morrari which was, I believe, a grand prix Ferrari chassis, engine and running gear with a body from a Minor.  This raced in period in a class of racing that permitted such cars so it should be eligible for some form of historic racing.  A special saloon with a Holden engine, Minor body and whatever in between should also be eligible in the form raced in period.  But what about a re-creation or replica? 

 

To my way of thinking, they all have their place: a 9-year old would have seen them as "a car like Mum's but hotted up".  And we are talking nostalgia. 

 

Admittedly my view would change if I were racing a standard car or a period car against modern modified specials (however you care to define them)



#167 Speedbox

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 15:02

Now lets stop bickering folks! "Proper" Minors still race regularly, and are absolutely brilliant fun.

 

Our "Bluebell" has 38 seasons behind her, and is all steel and no body mods, 1000cc and all BMC bits. I'll post a few links if I'm allowed, but meantime - when did a Morris Minor last win a race outright? Thanks to the great, late Bill Stone (and thanks to Dave O'Neill for posting his video) search for "Pre-57 Classic Saloon Car Championship race at Mallory Park" on You Tube.

Damn, I've spoilt the ending!

 

 



#168 Sharman

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 15:37

Now lets stop bickering folks! "Proper" Minors still race regularly, and are absolutely brilliant fun.

 

Our "Bluebell" has 38 seasons behind her, and is all steel and no body mods, 1000cc and all BMC bits. I'll post a few links if I'm allowed, but meantime - when did a Morris Minor last win a race outright? Thanks to the great, late Bill Stone (and thanks to Dave O'Neill for posting his video) search for "Pre-57 Classic Saloon Car Championship race at Mallory Park" on You Tube.

Damn, I've spoilt the ending!

I'm not bickering, I'm trying to shine the light of the blessed Sir Alec onto the facts in a fashion which even a bunch of colonials and ex-colonials can empathise with !! I think I last drove a Minor in 1960.



#169 275 GTB-4

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 21:01

I'm not bickering, I'm trying to shine the light of the blessed Sir Alec onto the facts in a fashion which even a bunch of colonials and ex-colonials can empathise with !! I think I last drove a Minor in 1960.


Not bickering? Down hear we call a spade a spade....troll, thread high jacker, excreta agitator, whatever....

 

now, your words prove you to be a lightweight, but are you a southpaw? (that could explain a lot about your lineage! :rolleyes: )

http://adb.anu.edu.a...ames-jimmy-8398



#170 Sharman

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 21:26

Not bickering? Down hear we call a spade a spade....troll, thread high jacker, excreta agitator, whatever....

 

now, your words prove you to be a lightweight, but are you a southpaw? (that could explain a lot about your lineage! :rolleyes: )

http://adb.anu.edu.a...ames-jimmy-8398

Where I come from we call a spade a bloody shovel. I have got a full cousin in Victoria (Traralgon) who, when he last visited us in France where we now live, proved to be a chip off the old family block and knew all the right words, not necessarily in the right order though. They (the family) were farm labourers out of Lincolnshire who took to navvying, helping build railways from Yorkshire to Lancashire.

And I haven't high-jacked the thread, I'm just trying to keep it pure, the high jackers have introduced miscegenation, crossing GM and Ferrari with BMC will never work, the offspring will be sterile.


Edited by Sharman, 30 December 2013 - 21:28.


#171 GMACKIE

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 21:37

Wouldn't "Racing Minors" be a form of child abuse?

 

Sorry......just trying to lighten this up a bit. :blush:



#172 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 22:43

Nothing you say there has any bearing on my contention that something powered by anything but an A series BMC engine is removed from contention as a pure Racing Minor. I have not looked at your profile but I suspect you were not there in the heyday of tintop racing when we saw everything from 100E Fords to 236 Armstrong Siddeley Sapphires being bullied round the circuits. It was club racing at its best and anything that came later was tinged with, if not corrupted by, commercialism. 
And I was looking at the angle, look at the exaggerated track and the filleted infill of the front wings.

Having been around motorsport over 40 years the only Minors I have ever seen raced [occasionally they turned up at Sprints and hillclimbs] have been repowered with something better. The A series engine is a pretty asthmatic thing, even at 1275 or 1310 [not in a minor] they were out of date by the late 60s.That in Minis. Unless drastically modified. As for the sidevalve? did anyone ever race one? if they did it would have been pre 60 and even then totally uncompetitive.
This pic causing all the kerfuffle is 1968, not 1958. Though the Morrari was what? early 60s

#173 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 22:45

Where I come from we call a spade a bloody shovel. I have got a full cousin in Victoria (Traralgon) who, when he last visited us in France where we now live, proved to be a chip off the old family block and knew all the right words, not necessarily in the right order though. They (the family) were farm labourers out of Lincolnshire who took to navvying, helping build railways from Yorkshire to Lancashire.
And I haven't high-jacked the thread, I'm just trying to keep it pure, the high jackers have introduced miscegenation, crossing GM and Ferrari with BMC will never work, the offspring will be sterile.

BMC are dead and buried in the 60s. GM and Ferrari are still alive and producing cars

#174 Catalina Park

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 00:30

There is a RALT link to racing Morris Minors. Ron Tauranac's brother Austin raced a Minor at Bathurst and other places in the 50's.
I'm not sure if it belongs in this thread because the cylinder head wasn't standard. it had a Mazengarb OHV conversion to the side valve engine.

But then again, should Minors with "Austin" A-series engines even be in this thread?

#175 275 GTB-4

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:04

And I haven't high-jacked the thread, I'm just trying to keep it pure, the high jackers have introduced miscegenation, crossing GM and Ferrari with BMC will never work, the offspring will be sterile.


Ohhh dear, give that man someone quinine...he's delirious! (gone troppo to use the vernacular)

If you feel so strongly about Maurice Minors (in this fluff-allowed thread) why not take yourself to the Historic Research area and start your own little thread and let the rest of us philistines enjoy some minor related  reminiscences? :rolleyes:



#176 lyntonh

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:05

09_zpsb108a7ac.jpg

Oran Park 3rd January 1970...side view...the front seat floor rails are really long, that's all !!!



#177 GMACKIE

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:27

There is a RALT link to racing Morris Minors. Ron Tauranac's brother Austin raced a Minor at Bathurst and other places in the 50's.
I'm not sure if it belongs in this thread because the cylinder head wasn't standard. it had a Mazengarb OHV conversion to the side valve engine.

But then again, should Minors with "Austin" A-series engines even be in this thread?

 

There is a RALT link to racing Morris Minors. Ron Tauranac's brother Austin raced a Minor at Bathurst and other places in the 50's.
I'm not sure if it belongs in this thread because the cylinder head wasn't standard. it had a Mazengarb OHV conversion to the side valve engine.

But then again, should Minors with "Austin" A-series engines even be in this thread?

Austin racing a Morris...Riley? [or is that really?]



#178 Catalina Park

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:45

Austin racing a Morris...Riley? [or is that really?]

But at least when Austin raced a Morris it had a Morris engine and not an Austin.

#179 Catalina Park

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:45

Then there was his mate Maurie Miller that also raced a Morrie Minor.

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#180 GMACKIE

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 06:48

Good Lord, Nuff [ield] said. :blush:



#181 DanTra2858

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 19:51

Funny how you guys carry on, after all a MORRIS MINOR is nothing more than a form of cheap transport that allways left you stranded with a broken rear axle, could not get rid of mine as quick as I would of liked, could not find a spare axel, FIAT 1100 now there was a car.

#182 275 GTB-4

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 01:32

"Fix It Again Tony!" :)



#183 Catalina Park

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 01:40

I can understand liking the 1100 part but the FIAT bit has me confused.



#184 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 07:03

I can understand liking the 1100 part but the FIAT bit has me confused.

Great cars Fiats, providing you have a hill to roll them down to get it started. Fiat and electrical are at odds with each other.
Having Tony to fix it is also an advantage of course.
But when they are actually going run rings around the BMC prams.

#185 DanTra2858

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 08:53

I can understand liking the 1100 part but the FIAT bit has me confused.


You are not suggesting that BMC (BLOODY MOTOR CAR) should go in front of 1100 are you, manners please & go to Confession on Saturday to repent.

#186 Catalina Park

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 09:06

I should perhaps hand in my 1100 badge and swap it for a 1368.
 



#187 275 GTB-4

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 09:50

Heee heee runnin out of overbores there Mike :blush:  :confused:



#188 arttidesco

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 18:21

Apologies for this Minor deviation...

 

Image4278sc.jpg

 

I don't recall ever seeing a competition Minor until I came across Trudy Slater's example at Shakespeare County Raceway a couple of years ago.

 

According to the blurb on this youtube clip  the car is a "road race moggy minor cosworth 4x4, mountune spec, 200 block, 7.2.1 comp yb, holset he1 turbo, seimens black injectors, modified skyline intercooler, 100 shot of nos, ran 11 second quaters with t34 on without gas. Running in to be setup by norris motorsport looking for 10's..

 

A tad faster than my Golf I suspect :blush:  



#189 275 GTB-4

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 05:14

Oran Park possibly June 1968...
 
Morrden/Holorris? anglebox and brick...

MinorAngleMini_zpsc97da176.jpg

#190 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 22:08

I saw something different yesterday,,, an A series powered Minor!I know that sound. Being driven by an elderly lady. Even then it had wider rims and decent, probably 175x70x14 tyres.Which appeared to have been on it for a LONG time. You cannot buy a tyre to legally fit the very narrow rims these days.

#191 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 22:09

Oran Park possibly June 1968...
 
Morrden/Holorris? anglebox and brick...

MinorAngleMini_zpsc97da176.jpg

The same car isn't it?

#192 275 GTB-4

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Posted 03 January 2014 - 10:17

The same car isn't it?


Yes...that's why I posted the pic.

#193 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 19 January 2014 - 04:36

Another minor improvement, just a Holden into a Minor. 3.8 V6 Commodore motor. I do have pics of both motor and car. Just have to get them on here.

#194 lyntonh

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 02:19

IMG_0044_zpsa20a0e5c.jpg

 

IMG_0043_zps699c4e64.jpg

As mentioned above by Lee.