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Personal photos of Australian motor racing '50s to '70s


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#5151 Wirra

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Posted 21 May 2011 - 10:56

I have quite a few photos of Graham Hill from the Friday but none of Rindt. My friend, who jumped the fence with me to gain access to the paddock, recalls that Rindt's car wasn't ready for the Friday so Rindt only had the official Saturday to learn the circuit. If so, it makes Sunday's dominance even more impressive.

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#5152 SJ Lambert

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Posted 21 May 2011 - 11:58

Launchpad - is your Avatar shot Jimmy Clark?

#5153 launchpad

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Posted 21 May 2011 - 12:25

Launchpad - is your Avatar shot Jimmy Clark?


Yes. Jim Clark at Newry corner, Longford Tasman (Saturday) 1968.
I took it at the same time as my posts 5021 and 5027.
Regards,
Launchpad

#5154 launchpad

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Posted 21 May 2011 - 12:28

Launchpad - is your Avatar shot Jimmy Clark?


OOps.... The shot is on the Monday Tasman "very wet" race.
I must have been distracted and had it wrong in the previous post.

#5155 SJ Lambert

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Posted 21 May 2011 - 12:57

One of my all time favourite shots feautures Jim coming out of Mountford on the Saturday of that weekend - I don't recall whether it is one of yours - despite the bad weather on feature race day it would have been a humdinger of a meeting to be at!

Edited by SJ Lambert, 22 May 2011 - 14:31.


#5156 David McKinney

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Posted 21 May 2011 - 15:34

My humblest apologies, launchpad

If I'd known you were Rod McKenzie I wouldn't have made my comment

But in my defence, there's so much nicking going on that I'm just waiting for someone to sue the forum and get it closed down

#5157 Ray Bell

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Posted 21 May 2011 - 20:57

Originally posted by Wirra
I have quite a few photos of Graham Hill from the Friday but none of Rindt. My friend, who jumped the fence with me to gain access to the paddock, recalls that Rindt's car wasn't ready for the Friday so Rindt only had the official Saturday to learn the circuit. If so, it makes Sunday's dominance even more impressive.


Yes, it is basically so...

Rindt's car arrived at the circuit just as the final session ended on Friday. The first session had been at 2:00pm and the report says that most were very slow getting onto the circuit. The second session was wet, so everyone was keen to have a go in the third session after the circuit dried. The lap record at this time was 1:29.0 for racing cars, 1:27.3 for Matich in the sports car.

By the end of the final session, Amon managed to get down to 1:27.6 and Courage eclipsed this with a 1:27.1. But it should be noted that this was an era of rapid lap time descents, high wings in force and it was normal to see seconds come off lap times. Warwick Farm was to prove one of those circuits where this was more so than others.

When Rindt's car arrived, it was too late for him to join in and the circuit was immediately cut off at the crossings as the AJC staff as they prepared the horse tracks for training the next morning. I have no doubt that Rindt had been given a lift or even a drive around the circuit in a road car at some time during the day so he knew what the place looked like, and a special favour was granted to him of being able to run the 49T around the Hume Straight, Creek Corner and Esses section, going back and forth for some time.

So on Saturday he wasn't completely devoid of knowledge of the place. But he was completely dominant right from the start. Courage in the bi-wing Brabham got into 26s in the first session and Amon soon followed suit, Rindt was again late onto the circuit and it was well into the session when he got out there. His fifth lap, according to the RCN report, was 1:26.4. Amon got cracking more seriously when it was known Rindt was under 1:26 and the session ended with the two of them sharing fastest time at 1:25.6. Hill and Courage sat on 1:26.1.

For the second session, Rindt was ready and soon got into the 25s again, then surprised everyone with a 1:24.8. But we were really beyond being surprised on this day as they were approaching a five-second drop in times compared to the class record and two and a half seconds under the SR3's time already. The record book was literally in tatters, we were all watching in awe and listening carefully for the announcement of times of the PA.

It wasn't only the visitors who were pounding the record, but the locals too. Leo Geoghegan fitted a high suspension-mounted wing and was on 1:27.0 by the end of the day; Kevin Bartlett, the record holder, had done a 1:28.0 in the first session and put his car away to save its engine.

Still it wasn't over. Courage and Hill got down into the 25s, Derek Bell in the second Ferrari the 26s as he chased a good gear ratio selection for the Farm layout (having already biffed the car on a pile of dirt at the Northern Crossing), Peter Wherrett notes that onlookers were no longer impressed by any times higher than the 1:25.0. He's dead right.

Amon was out to prove that the little Ferrari was just about the ideal car for this circuit, which it probably should have been. But it didn't have the wings the Lotus had, merely a fixed wing over the engine. So when he did several laps at 1:24.5 it was pretty much concluded that was his limit. Of course, when he did that it became necessary for Rindt to come out again and assert the dominance he'd shown earlier.

The laps were run off: 1:24.5, 1:24.2, 1:24.0 and finally 1:23.8. There was no reply to this. It was a day among days, but people tend to forget that because the next day was so memorable too.


#5158 Wirra

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Posted 21 May 2011 - 23:56

Thanks Ray.

I've posted these images before but I thought they might complement Ray's post. They illustrate the wing configurations Ferrari, Lotus and the Courage Brabham ran that weekend.

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#5159 launchpad

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 10:23

[quote name='Wirra' date='May 22 2011, 09:56' post='5034145']
Thanks Ray.

Wirra - these aren't colour, but the shots are colourful in context.
A shot from practice - Jochen Rindt - wings in action
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Similar fantastic car control in the race

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Rod Mackenzie

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#5160 SJ Lambert

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 10:24

Amazing

#5161 Wirra

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 10:52

To quote 'Rampaging' Roy Slaven, "love your work".

IIRC the roll bars were disconnected for the wet race, as the Sunday photo seems to illustrate. Tremendous roll on the front and while the rear bar is still in place the rod connecting it to the right rear upright appears to be missing.

#5162 cooper997

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 10:57

Rod,

These 2 latest Rindt photos have a certain brilliance to them. One being Jochen's car control and equally your abilty to stand that close and capture it. Thanks for sharing.

Those wings depicted by yours & Wirra's latest photos certainly show the engineering guessing game that was going on with them, from team to team.

Stephen

#5163 Ray Bell

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 13:12

That is, without a doubt, the most graphic shot I've ever seen of Rindt in that race...

Keep 'em coming, Rod.

#5164 michael84

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 13:37

Hi

I havent been through all 130 pages but the pages Ive looked at are awesome....

Does anyone have any pics of Ian Geoghegan's Mustangs they could post up.....Thanks

Edited by michael84, 22 May 2011 - 13:41.


#5165 bradbury west

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 14:24

T hat is, without a doubt, the most graphic shot I've ever seen of Rindt in that race...
Keep 'em coming, Rod.


Just wonderful. Many thanks from someone "over here, now" for shots of racing "down there, then"
Roger Lund

#5166 Tim Murray

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 14:39

Hi

I havent been through all 130 pages but the pages Ive looked at are awesome....

Does anyone have any pics of Ian Geoghegan's Mustangs they could post up.....Thanks

These would seem to be the only ones posted in this thread (found using the 'Search Topic' box bottom left):

http://forums.autosp...w...t&p=4455315

http://forums.autosp...w...t&p=3034615

http://forums.autosp...w...t&p=3015780


#5167 SJ Lambert

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 14:45

Wirra - these aren't colour, but the shots are colourful in context.
A shot from practice - Jochen Rindt - wings in action
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Similar fantastic car control in the race

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Rod Mackenzie


I just wanted to see these two shots again on this page!! - golden!!

#5168 Ray Bell

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 21:19

Originally posted by bradbury west
Just wonderful. Many thanks from someone "over here, now" for shots of racing "down there, then".


Yes, Roger, I know how you feel about it too...

That pic is just coming up to the Shell Bridge, or maybe just under it, recall when we walked that section together?

Adding to the drama of the actual pic as it stands is the knowledge that he would be about to change direction from coming out of the right hander as he is and into the last left hander of the Esses.

#5169 ellrosso

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 21:29

Tremendous shots Rod, really special.

#5170 seldo

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Posted 22 May 2011 - 23:17

Thanks Rod - Brilliant stuff!!

#5171 Andrew Fellowes

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 02:20

My thanks too, I drove past the entrance that day, a penniless student and with little desire to get wet so I gave it a miss. Certainly ranks as one of my worst mistakes.

Edited by Andrew Fellowes, 23 May 2011 - 02:21.


#5172 ellrosso

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 21:58

Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImageSome Geoghegan Mustang shots from oldracphotos library.Posted ImageExcuse dodgy layout, first time I've posted for a while. Cheers, ellrosso

#5173 DanTra2858

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 22:03

How many name changes did the corners of Oran Park have, when I first started going there at the end of the main straight you had CC tyers, after the esses was Robin Orando then comming onto the straight was BP, what were the name changes that they went through & why. Funny the Dog Leg has all ways been the same name.

#5174 Dale Harvey

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 22:10

Hi

I havent been through all 130 pages but the pages Ive looked at are awesome....

Does anyone have any pics of Ian Geoghegan's Mustangs they could post up.....Thanks


Go to page 53 post 2112 there are a few Big Pete shots.
Dale.

#5175 Dale Harvey

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 22:15

How many name changes did the corners of Oran Park have, when I first started going there at the end of the main straight you had CC tyers, after the esses was Robin Orando then comming onto the straight was BP, what were the name changes that they went through & why. Funny the Dog Leg has all ways been the same name.


Coming onto the straight was known as Energol when I started going there and the Dogleg was known as the Dufor Dogleg. All the others were as you have listed.
Dale.

#5176 elansprint72

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 22:39

Squeaking as a photographer; this is one of the best threads on the forum. Some astounding images, in the true sense of the word. :up:

#5177 bradbury west

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Posted 24 May 2011 - 00:05

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Just love it. The body language of that car at full chat is quite amazing.
Roger Lund

#5178 Ray Bell

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Posted 24 May 2011 - 01:28

Originally posted by DanTra2858
How many name changes did the corners of Oran Park have, when I first started going there at the end of the main straight you had CC tyres, after the esses was Robin Orlando then coming onto the straight was BP, what were the name changes that they went through and why? Funny the Dog Leg has all ways been the same name.


Just starting from when the circuit was extended... which is the first meeting I went to:

Energol was, as Dale confirms, the original name for BP. Possibly BP changed their preference for this as the Energol name slipped into the background, but see my comments a couple of pars further on.

CC Tyres at the end of the straight became Torana Corner, but I don't know if it ever got a new name after Toranas went into Limbo. Of course, by then there was a longer circuit in use, so it was less important.

The Esses never had any other name that I recall.

Robin Orlando became Suttons, undoubtedly because Suttons reacted to a proposal put to them by Oran Park Raceways Limited and their cash was better than Robin Orlando's.

Dufor's title on the Dogleg was short-lived IIRC, Shell later had the naming rights there.

I recall Toby Bent once saying that Castrol 'put a lot of money into the circuit'... Bob Levett always claimed that it went away after each meeting on the back of the Ford transporter with the green stripes over the top... but nevertheless, the Control Tower there was named for Castrol, was it not? And it could be that the change from Energol to BP was in keeping with Castrol's injection of funds, they would undoubtedly have preferred to not have a competing oil brand there getting repeated mentions over the PA, so BP meant fuels as well.

On the long circuit, the tight left after sweeper at the end of the straight was first called Chesterfield while the Torana name went onto the sweeper when using this circuit. Under the Bridgestone bridge into the tight right called Coca Cola, then Ampol put their name on the tight right that headed up to the bridge.

#5179 ed holly

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Posted 24 May 2011 - 02:34



Some more of John's photos - about 5 left after these ...


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#5180 GMACKIE

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Posted 24 May 2011 - 06:00

Only 5 to go - what a pity, as these have been really great photos, Ed!

First two are Lithgow [40 bends] again. Tommy Edwards, in the [green] early Holden, Then Harry Bargwanna [white FJ], and his twin brother, Alf right behind him.

#5181 DanTra2858

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Posted 24 May 2011 - 22:12

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At which circuit are these cars racing at, if it is Bathurst wow what a difference from today.

#5182 Ray Bell

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Posted 24 May 2011 - 23:20

Longford...

All taken within 300 or so metres of each other, the last one diving down towards the Viaduct, the others into and out of the Viaduct. Actually, if you reverse the photos it would all be in order.

#5183 launchpad

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 00:52

[quote name='ellrosso' date='May 24 2011, 07:58' post='5043069']
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Perhaps you might like to see the Viaduct today as it looked in April when I visited for the Longford Revival Festival.
The new alignmenment of the Illawarra Highway means Longford as a circuit will never reopen. (ps There were two bridges used for the track which have long gone which also makes it impossible.)

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#5184 ellrosso

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 02:43

Thanks Rod, I photographed there in 2003 and looks like they have cleared a lot since then.Posted Image
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Sorry for lack of info on last lot - I was in a bit of a hurry when I posted the pics.

#5185 ellrosso

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 02:46

Thanks for posting help Wirra, obviously you have to hit return twice to get a space between pics. Cheers, Lindsay R

#5186 Team Result

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 06:46

Re Big Pete's Mustang = my alltime fav racecar.

I'm not an expert on the marque, but I believe the pix shown include both his cars. Judging by the competition around him and the circuit, I think all the Longford ones are of the old car. Also, one rear shot shows the early flat tailights. IIRC, he got the new car in '67 (I recall seeing it and Rod Coppins in his old car around that time in the same race at Lakeside) All the shots with sponsors' logos (and of course the ones with flared guards) are post-68 when advertising signs were allowed so must be of the newer car.
Both cars were, of course, immaculately turned out - I particularly loved the gold pin-striping!

#5187 Ray Bell

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 07:52

That would have to be the '67 Longford, then...

One Saturday race had Gardner in the lead ahead of Pete for a while, while the Monday race had Robin Bessant led Pete off the line... hence he's still ahead going down beside the railway line.

Pete and Rod Coppins both raced at the July 1968 Warwick Farm. I have looked and see no reference anywhere prior to this of Pete having his new car and it's not - that I could see - mentioned in this report either.

#5188 seldo

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 08:02

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Sensational photos!
But - is it just me, or does Pete's Mustang seem to have a rather ephemeral being at the tiller..?

#5189 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 08:14

Re Big Pete's Mustang = my alltime fav racecar.

I'm not an expert on the marque, but I believe the pix shown include both his cars. Judging by the competition around him and the circuit, I think all the Longford ones are of the old car. Also, one rear shot shows the early flat tailights. IIRC, he got the new car in '67 (I recall seeing it and Rod Coppins in his old car around that time in the same race at Lakeside) All the shots with sponsors' logos (and of course the ones with flared guards) are post-68 when advertising signs were allowed so must be of the newer car.
Both cars were, of course, immaculately turned out - I particularly loved the gold pin-striping!

The car that appears to have no grille is the 67. The first car is a 65-66 shape with different front treatment etc.And no rollcage. The later car is the one that had a lot more development.
But both those car seem to have huge weight transfer. In some of those shots the frnot is miles in the air, it must have an unstable car to drive.
Those famous Oran Pk shots of it with wheels hanging everywhere and all twisted up shows it was very 'hooked up' but would have been a pig in corners. Great driver and the rest of thge opposition were no better [or worse]

Edited by Lee Nicolle, 25 May 2011 - 08:16.


#5190 Ray Bell

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 08:28

Originally posted by seldo
.....But - is it just me, or does Pete's Mustang seem to have a rather ephemeral being at the tiller?


It's just you, David...

Do you ever get your eyes checked?

#5191 DanTra2858

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 08:36

It's just you, David...

Do you ever get your eyes checked?


Note there is no number on the side of the car but #11 is on the bonnet, could it be someone else driving the Mustang.

The photo also shows the size of the front flares, Sport Sedan size.

#5192 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 08:41

Sensational photos!
But - is it just me, or does Pete's Mustang seem to have a rather ephemeral being at the tiller..?

Agreed.


#5193 launchpad

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 09:09

[quote name='ellrosso' date='May 25 2011, 12:43' post='5045543']
Thanks Rod, I photographed there in 2003 and looks like they have cleared a lot since then

There was severe flooding three weeks before the event and most of the low lying ground had the vegetation washed away.
Rod.

#5194 Ray Bell

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 09:38

Indeed, there were pics of that on the Longford thread...

Though I thought it was more like a week beforehand.

Nevertheless, regarding Lee's question about someone else driving the Mustang, not a chance. And at Longford the most important number placement was to the right of the bonnet as the timekeepers were up high on that side.

#5195 launchpad

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 09:46

The car that appears to have no grille is the 67. The first car is a 65-66 shape with different front treatment etc.And no rollcage. The later car is the one that had a lot more development.
But both those car seem to have huge weight transfer. In some of those shots the frnot is miles in the air, it must have an unstable car to drive.
Those famous Oran Pk shots of it with wheels hanging everywhere and all twisted up shows it was very 'hooked up' but would have been a pig in corners. Great driver and the rest of thge opposition were no better [or worse]


Hi Lee,
My contribution to the Ian Geoghegan Mustang Appreciation Society.
He was GREAT!
Here at the 1969 Tasman Warwick Farm saturday practice.

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#5196 Ellis French

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 09:47

[quote name='Ray Bell' date='May 25 2011, 07:52' post='5045724']
That would have to be the '67 Longford, then...

One Saturday race had Gardner in the lead ahead of Pete for a while, while the Monday race had Robin Bessant led Pete off the line... hence he's still ahead going down beside the railway line.


The lead Mustang going into the viaduct is Robin Pare in the Elliot Mustang.
(and Elliot still had it for 68 Longford as well.)
Bessant was in the ex Norm Millen Lotus Cortina.

#5197 Ray Bell

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 10:01

Phhttt... sorry about that...

Got my Robins mixed up there. Somewhere I also have a photo of the Elliot/Pare Mustang coming off the Long Bridge in '66.

#5198 austmcreg

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 10:37

Longford...

All taken within 300 or so metres of each other, the last one diving down towards the Viaduct, the others into and out of the Viaduct. Actually, if you reverse the photos it would all be in order.


Hello all, This is my first post here after discovering this forum only recently. Not sure how I missed it, but... I have thoroughly enjoyed the last 130 pages (many eveings later), and found many photos and topics of interest to me, especially those related to Longford and that wonderful period in 1958-62 when Cooper Climaxes ruled. Many thanks to all those who posted those wonderful photos, especially the period colour, which is always stunning.

Re Ellrosso's photos of the Geoghan Mustang at Longford 1967. Unfortunately, Pete had no real opposition at this meeting, the first time he had been to Longford since the 1962 ATTC meeting in the Jaguar (he missed the main race but thats another story). Going into the 1967 meeting, the touring car lap record was held by Allan Moffat in Lotus Cortina at 2.55.4, wheras the over 4000cc record was listed by the LMRA as Robin Pare (in the Elliott Mustang) at 3.10.3, both times having been set in 1966. The latter was curious because in 1965 Gawaine Baillie in the Galaxie had done a 3.02.0 in practice and almost certainly went under 3 minutes in the Monday race as his average for the 6 laps was 3.01.5, though none of the published results I have seen give the fastest lap and I dont have the official results from that year.

Anyway, Pete played with his opposition in each of his races before clearing out, with a fastest lap for the weekend at 2.40.2, set on the 4th lap of his first race. This stood as the record forever as there were no faster touring cars at 1968 meeting (not running anyway - the Beechey Nova was in the pits but never came off the truck).

The recent photos showing the disturbingly clean area around the viaduct (it was NEVER this clear in the racing years) show the concrete curb on the small bridge over the rivulet at the viaduct exit right hander. This same curb is hidden by the Mustang in photo shown chasing the Mildren Alfa. The difference in vegetation is almost unbelievable - it looked like a tropical rainforest in the 1960s. In earlier years this was a wooden plank bridge, and keen local photographers who knew the lie of the land (including my father) used to get down in the rivulet and poke their head up over the edge to take photos. If anyone is interested I will find some so-taken.

Rob Saward

#5199 ellrosso

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 10:37

Seldo, even the hi-res of that shot looks weird - its just the reflection on the screen which makes the driver look a bit odd. I can assure you its the big fella at the wheel though. Lee - I don't know how efficient the nose up, wheels hanging everywhere was in racing car dynamics, but to see him in full flight and really going for it like he was at Symmons in '69 (started 3 laps behind after push start from flat battery - finished 4th on the road but disqualified) is a sight I will never forget. He was absolutely masterful and consistent to boot.

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#5200 Ray Bell

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Posted 25 May 2011 - 10:54

Originally posted by austmcreg
Hello all, This is my first post here after discovering this forum only recently. Not sure how I missed it, but... I have thoroughly enjoyed the last 130 pages (many eveings later), and found many photos and topics of interest to me, especially those related to Longford and that wonderful period in 1958-62 when Cooper Climaxes ruled. Many thanks to all those who posted those wonderful photos, especially the period colour, which is always stunning......


Welcome to the forum, Rob, did I not tell you about this years ago?

And knowing who you are, I guess that you've checked RCN for Baillie's lap times too:

.....in 1965 Gawaine Baillie in the Galaxie had done a 3.02.0 in practice and almost certainly went under 3 minutes in the Monday race as his average for the 6 laps was 3.01.5, though none of the published results I have seen give the fastest lap and I dont have the official results from that year.....


...and they aren't there. Not a single time! What about newspapers, like The Examiner on the Monday or he Tuesday afterwards?

.....The recent photos showing the disturbingly clean area around the viaduct (it was NEVER this clear in the racing years) show the concrete curb on the small bridge over the rivulet at the viaduct exit right hander. This same curb is hidden by the Mustang in photo shown chasing the Mildren Alfa. The difference in vegetation is almost unbelievable - it looked like a tropical rainforest in the 1960s.....


I'm sure it was well vegetated prior to the flood as well. My pics of the rear of cars across there taken from the top of the Viaduct show plenty of bush around.

.....In earlier years this was a wooden plank bridge, and keen local photographers who knew the lie of the land (including my father) used to get down in the rivulet and poke their head up over the edge to take photos. If anyone is interested I will find some so-taken.


Do you really think you have to ask?

And then there is the need for you to check the Longford, Reims of the South Pacific thread(s).

Welcome aboard, I hope your book is getting closer!