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Personal photos of Australian motor racing '50s to '70s


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#6101 lyntonh

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Posted 23 November 2011 - 13:18

Two Random shots from Bathurst 1972....above the Elbow.....

First...Jim McKeown in the Alfa
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Phil Ward
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Edited by lyntonh, 12 February 2012 - 00:51.


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#6102 Ray Bell

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Posted 23 November 2011 - 15:11

Ah yes...

You were very much Phil Ward fans, weren't you?

#6103 Paul Newby

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Posted 25 November 2011 - 00:52

Interesting to see a photo of Jim McKeown's Alfa Romeo 2000 GTV at Bathurst ATCC round.

A friend spoke to McKeown recently about the Alfa. Apparently McKeown has spent the last 30 (almost 40!) years trying to forget about this wretched vehicle!

Apparently McKeown approached Alfa Romeo Australia about running the new 2000 GTV (released in Italy in October 71) in the 72 ATCC to replace his Porsche. I understand they provided an "Autodelta built" GTV in LHD (The Australian launch for this model was not until August 72) which I beleive was relatively standard. Not sure whether McKeown was expecting something in the way of a GTAM like his mate Foley, but I suspect he was a bit underwhelmed with the car and promised support from ARA - apparently their belief was; "It's an Alfa Romeo - go out there and win!" I don't think it had many Autodelta "goodies" and info and parts for these cars were pretty thin on the ground back in 72.

At the first ATCC race in Symmons Plains the windscreen shattered in practice - it wasn't even laminated! As they were unable to source another one in a hurry the car was withdrawn. McKeown ran it at Calder, Bathurst and Sandown with its only finish being at Bathurst in 7th.

After Sandown he never raced it again. I wonder what happened to this car? As it was LHD it couldn't be put on the used car lot as a demonstrator. I understand that Peter Brown also had a (yellow) Shell sponsored 2000 GTV that was also LHD, not sure what happened to that one either.

Of course in the Group C era the 2000 GTV had a successful career winning classes numerous times at Bathurst and racing in the ATCC up until 1979. But it was very different in its first year, 1972... :)



#6104 lyntonh

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Posted 25 November 2011 - 01:18

Interesting to see a photo of Jim McKeown's Alfa Romeo 2000 GTV at Bathurst ATCC round.

A friend spoke to McKeown recently about the Alfa. Apparently McKeown has spent the last 30 (almost 40!) years trying to forget about this wretched vehicle!

Apparently McKeown approached Alfa Romeo Australia about running the new 2000 GTV (released in Italy in October 71) in the 72 ATCC to replace his Porsche. I understand they provided an "Autodelta built" GTV in LHD (The Australian launch for this model was not until August 72) which I beleive was relatively standard. Not sure whether McKeown was expecting something in the way of a GTAM like his mate Foley, but I suspect he was a bit underwhelmed with the car and promised support from ARA - apparently their belief was; "It's an Alfa Romeo - go out there and win!" I don't think it had many Autodelta "goodies" and info and parts for these cars were pretty thin on the ground back in 72.

At the first ATCC race in Symmons Plains the windscreen shattered in practice - it wasn't even laminated! As they were unable to source another one in a hurry the car was withdrawn. McKeown ran it at Calder, Bathurst and Sandown with its only finish being at Bathurst in 7th.

After Sandown he never raced it again. I wonder what happened to this car? As it was LHD it couldn't be put on the used car lot as a demonstrator. I understand that Peter Brown also had a (yellow) Shell sponsored 2000 GTV that was also LHD, not sure what happened to that one either.

Of course in the Group C era the 2000 GTV had a successful career winning classes numerous times at Bathurst and racing in the ATCC up until 1979. But it was very different in its first year, 1972... :)


Thanks for that bit of history....I was curious about the car when I scanned the photo....what colour was it....Italian red, maybe?

#6105 ellrosso

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Posted 25 November 2011 - 07:40

Yes it was a deep red. I was at pit cnr at Symmons as the tow car and trailer were driven across the track to the pits - bonnet up and mechanic working on it!
Poor Jim, after his success with the Porsche it must have been very disheartening. To have the windscreen shatter must have been the last straw......
Wasn't quick either.

#6106 Ray Bell

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Posted 25 November 2011 - 20:56

A lot of Autodelta stuff arrived in Australia as either worn out or not up to scratch...

You had to be right on the pace with that stuff. KB could well have some stories.

#6107 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 25 November 2011 - 23:50

It seems that a lot of people large and small have been burnt byoverseas cars that are not what they were supposed to be.In all facets of motorsport too, circuits, drags, speedway and motorcyle racing in general.

#6108 David Shaw

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 00:24

And it goes back a long way. Didn't Doug Whiteford have a lot of trouble with his second Lago-Talbot with it not being what it was meant to be back in the mid 50s?

#6109 David McKinney

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 07:26

Don't recall that one, David

Did you hear it from Lola 5000? He's likely to know

#6110 Lola5000

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 09:31

Don't recall that one, David

Did you hear it from Lola 5000? He's likely to know

Unknown to me.
I shall ask my father,when i see him.
I've got to get him to teach me how to drive my little MG with the Wilson pre-select box and get of him all those 50s race photos including the various Albert Park meetings.

#6111 Lola5000

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 09:34

Does anyone know what wheel width the Porsches ran in the 1970 ATCC?

#6112 ellrosso

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 10:24

9" Minilites wearing 500 x 11.30 x 15 Goodyears at Bathurst 1970 on the Foley Porsche 911 at least. From memory Jim McKeown had the Minilites too so I'd imagine they would be similar to Foleys.

#6113 Lola5000

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 10:40

9" Minilites wearing 500 x 11.30 x 15 Goodyears at Bathurst 1970 on the Foley Porsche 911 at least. From memory Jim McKeown had the Minilites too so I'd imagine they would be similar to Foleys.

Thankyou for that,I thought they were 9s as per the 2.5ST cars.

#6114 ellrosso

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 10:48

Few shots of the McKeown Alfa GTV 2000 from Symmons 1972 ATCC round.

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#6115 Lola5000

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 11:25

Few shots of the McKeown Alfa GTV 2000 from Symmons 1972 ATCC round.

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How under powered would that car have been to the 2.3l Porsche,what was Jim thinking.
Was the idea ,class wins and thus a better chance of outright points ATCC winner?
He told me once he wanted to run a Javlin ex Trans -Am but CAMS would not allow the car.

#6116 275 GTB-4

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 21:52

Unknown to me.
I shall ask my father,when i see him.
I've got to get him to teach me how to drive my little MG with the Wilson pre-select box and get off him all those 50s race photos including the various Albert Park meetings.


Rob...please get on with it - times a wastin! :wave:

#6117 Lola5000

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Posted 26 November 2011 - 22:41

Rob...please get on with it - times a wastin! :wave:

There are issues there but for you guys ok. :kiss:

#6118 David Shaw

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 01:52

Don't recall that one, David

Did you hear it from Lola 5000? He's likely to know


I've just looked it up in the 2nd edition of Blanden's book, where I must have read of it originally. It says that as Whiteford was impressed with his first Lago Talbot, he sought out one of the later and more powerful models, which he purchased from Paul Vallee. It arrived with incorrect engine, Zeniths instead of Solex and no ZF differential. It apparently arrived late '53 or early '54 and debuted at Albert Park in March 1955.

#6119 Lola5000

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 05:43

I've just looked it up in the 2nd edition of Blanden's book, where I must have read of it originally. It says that as Whiteford was impressed with his first Lago Talbot, he sought out one of the later and more powerful models, which he purchased from Paul Vallee. It arrived with incorrect engine, Zeniths instead of Solex and no ZF differential. It apparently arrived late '53 or early '54 and debuted at Albert Park in March 1955.

Wonder if it arrived with a 6 plug head ?

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#6120 eldougo

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 07:02

Check out the Renault16 tow car for the Alfa. :confused:

#6121 Lola5000

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 07:55

Check out the Renault16 tow car for the Alfa. :confused:

Be fun in the wet with the Alfa on the back,little wonder it took Jim 30 years to get over the experience.

#6122 275 GTB-4

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 09:13

Some more of Rod Steven's photos ... note the number below as a reference to the main photo file Peter schell did for me.

56

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Cripes!! when did Amaroo open?? 1920s-30s going by the on-track action and the spectators conveyances!! :)

Edited by 275 GTB-4, 27 November 2011 - 09:14.


#6123 Lola5000

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 10:56

Looks like a veteran/vintage car rally late 60s?

#6124 ed holly

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Posted 27 November 2011 - 22:08

Prior to around 1987 the Regularity Trial component of Historic Motorsport meetings was limited to pre 1955 vehicles. That meant for instance anything up to and including MG-TF could get a run, and of course anything older.

As this photo of "old cars" was from the very first Historic meeting in Australia which was at Amaroo, & which included Motorbikes, those were the rules and what looks like an old car rally was in fact the Regularity Trial.

Around 1987, 9 years later, the rules were relaxed and more "modern" cars such as MGAs were eligible - and that's where I got started - seems like just yesterday !

#6125 Paul Newby

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 00:41

A lot of Autodelta stuff arrived in Australia as either worn out or not up to scratch...

You had to be right on the pace with that stuff. KB could well have some stories.


I understand that Foley’s 1750 GTAM was somewhat or an Autodelta mystery – previous history allegedly unknown…

Autodelta came back into the picture in 1975/76 and I believe even Carl Chiti made a visit here, venturing out to Amaroo Park for testing.

The Foley entered 2000 GTV that won its class at Bathurst 75 in the hand of Beaumont and Leffler was a LHD Autodelta car. I understand it came attached with an Autodelta mechanic, who was discarded with when it turned out the Australian prepared GTVs were quicker than the Autodelta one.

Autodelta were also involved with the Alfetta GTAMs that raced at Bathurst in 76. Someone obviously didn’t read the rule book when these cars turned up with trick Autodelta built 16 valve race engines. They were sent back to Italy and fitted with Spica injected “Nord” engines, like the 25 “road” GTAMs that were delivered here. An unmitigating disaster in every respect…. :rolleyes:




#6126 fnqvmuch

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 01:01

Wonder if it arrived with a 6 plug head ?

there is an undated photo i've copied from i know not where showing a 'type 35A' and a '4CL' flanking a 'Lago Talbot' on an australian wharf ...
it has a rocket launcher and carries the No 26 - is this it, or which is the one that had SUs in my dad's photos?
steven

#6127 petersracing

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 01:40

I understand that Foley’s 1750 GTAM was somewhat or an Autodelta mystery – previous history allegedly unknown…



I'm no alfa expert but is this the car that Bowin did a lot of work on as the P9? If so I got a few Alfa and Bowin/Alfa parts and jigs when I took over the contents of the factory recently.

Drawings of what they did are here http://www.bowincars.../index.php/(P9)

#6128 Paul Newby

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 03:45

I'm no alfa expert but is this the car that Bowin did a lot of work on as the P9? If so I got a few Alfa and Bowin/Alfa parts and jigs when I took over the contents of the factory recently.

Drawings of what they did are here http://www.bowincars.../index.php/(P9)


No, it's not the same car. The "P9" is the original Mildren RHD GTA raced by Bartlett and sold to John French prior to being purchased by Foley and turned into the lightweight GTA. The GTAM ended up with the Tasman V8 shoehorned in it. Both cars were in Chesterfield colours and were raced at the same time, the GTAM in ATCC and the GTA in sports sedans.

The GTA has been returned to original Mildren livery (white) and specifications while the GTAM is being returned to its 1971 specification as originally raced by Foley (with 2.0 engine).



#6129 Cam Arnott

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 06:09

Porsches...Thanks for the photos Lynton :wave:

I can confirm that the ex. Foley etc car is currently being restored in Melbourne.

Also the 1st Hamilton 911 was not an R. It was what was known as a T/R or T Rally which was basically a customer homologation special (Group 3). One of three T/R's made in RHD form.

I believe Hamilton wanted to run an R but the lightweight panels used in the R's meant it would not conform to the rules of the day. The Hamilton car has all steel panels and weighs about 100 or so kg's more!

Cheers

Cam

#6130 Wirra

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 09:25

... The "P9" is the original Mildren RHD GTA raced by Bartlett and sold to John French prior to being purchased by Foley and turned into the lightweight GTA. The GTAM ended up with the Tasman V8 shoehorned in it. ...


Have I got these right?

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#6131 275 GTB-4

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 10:57

Prior to around 1987 the Regularity Trial component of Historic Motorsport meetings was limited to pre 1955 vehicles. That meant for instance anything up to and including MG-TF could get a run, and of course anything older.

As this photo of "old cars" was from the very first Historic meeting in Australia which was at Amaroo, & which included Motorbikes, those were the rules and what looks like an old car rally was in fact the Regularity Trial.

Around 1987, 9 years later, the rules were relaxed and more "modern" cars such as MGAs were eligible - and that's where I got started - seems like just yesterday !


All jokes aside Ed...quite a special meeting then, are there other meetings/venues claiming to be the "birth" of Historic Racing in Australia?

#6132 lyntonh

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 11:01

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Warwick Farm 6th September 1969

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WF 6/9/69
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WF 6th December 1969

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WF 20th November 1971

Edited by lyntonh, 12 February 2012 - 00:36.


#6133 lyntonh

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 11:09

A couple of Open Wheelers....Creek Corner Warwick Farm 6th September 1969

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Edited by lyntonh, 11 February 2012 - 23:01.


#6134 Ian G

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 11:09

Some more great shots Lynton,i have some of the Chesterfield car at that WF meeting i'll try and find.

They did a short review of the Alfa Giocattolo in last Friday's Sydney Telegraph,the small bottle of Bundy rum in each new cars tool kit was a nice touch.
http://www.madwhips....attolo-group-b/

#6135 GMACKIE

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 20:19

All jokes aside Ed...quite a special meeting then, are there other meetings/venues claiming to be the "birth" of Historic Racing in Australia?

Perhaps not ALL historic meetings, but there were certainly historic RACES at W.Farm, in the early '60s.


#6136 Ray Bell

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Posted 28 November 2011 - 23:17

The only claim I've ever heard made about that Amaroo meeting was that it was the first 'All Historic' meeting in Australia...

I don't think anyone has ever disputed that claim. They were too much of gentlemen to do so even if they were inclined.

Greg would remember Kevin Catt winning the race at the Farm on October 14, 1962 in the Lancia, but I'm sure there were other 'vintage' events in Victoria and South Australia before that mixed in with regular meetings.

#6137 Lola5000

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 01:50

The only claim I've ever heard made about that Amaroo meeting was that it was the first 'All Historic' meeting in Australia...

I don't think anyone has ever disputed that claim. They were too much of gentlemen to do so even if they were inclined.

Greg would remember Kevin Catt winning the race at the Farm on October 14, 1962 in the Lancia, but I'm sure there were other 'vintage' events in Victoria and South Australia before that mixed in with regular meetings.

At Sandown,might be the opening of the track,Stan Jones raced the 250F,from memory 1.25s lap,without its bonnet.

#6138 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 02:27

There was defenitly historic racing before historic only meetings.

#6139 Paul Newby

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 02:44

Have I got these right?

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Posted Image


Yes, that is correct. For some reason they converted the GTAM from LHD to RHD when they put the Tasman V8 in it. As far as I know it never raced in the ATCC with the V8 in it.

This car was sold to Frank Cecchele in WA in 1972 who raced it with a Rover V8. I understand he bought the original 4 cylinder engine (used by Foley in a 1750 GTV he ran in the Dulux Rally) and sold it all to Vin Sharp in Melbourne about 7 or 8 years ago. Sharp is currently restoring it to original 1971 ATCC spec.

Foley bought the "Lightweight" (Mildren) GTA from John French in 72, and then had Bowin transform it into a sports sedan. It suffered a major shunt at Oran Park in 73 and then was rebuilt and onsold in 74, eventually ending up (like most special Alfas) in the West. The current owner bought it back to the east coast (NSW) and returned it from Chesterfield livery and lightweight specs back to original Mildren specification and colour. I believe this was quite a difficult restoration as the car had been cut around.

Foley never raced these cars concurrently, but they both looked similar (the Lighweight went from "step-nose" front to the later 1750 front) and non experts often confuse the two cars.



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#6140 GMACKIE

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 06:24

Greg would remember Kevin Catt winning the race at the Farm on October 14, 1962 in the Lancia, but I'm sure there were other 'vintage' events in Victoria and South Australia before that mixed in with regular meetings.

Certainly do, Ray, as I was there. The Lambda was very quick for a vintage car - Kevin had the outright Vintage record at Silverdale hill. He turned the camshaft end-for-end, and fitted two carbies to the original exhaust ports, then used single inlet port for the exhaust......weird, but it worked a treat.

As the car had neither starter, nor crank-handle, Kevin would crawl under the Lambda, grab the flywheel, and give it a tug - and it would start every time. I remember it had a different tyre on each wheel, and they were all rubbish. :eek:


#6141 Ray Bell

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 08:07

Originally posted by Lee Nicolle
There was definitely historic racing before historic only meetings.


That's what everyone's been saying, Lee...

But I wouldn't count this:

Originally posted by Lola5000
At Sandown,might be the opening of the track, Stan Jones raced the 250F, from memory 1.25s lap, without its bonnet.


...as 'Historic' racing. Contemporaries of this car, like the Tornado and the Eclipse Zephry, indeed, there was a Ferrari around too, were still racing in everyday races at that time.

#6142 Lola5000

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 09:23

That's what everyone's been saying, Lee...

But I wouldn't count this:



...as 'Historic' racing. Contemporaries of this car, like the Tornado and the Eclipse Zephry, indeed, there was a Ferrari around too, were still racing in everyday races at that time.

Yes it was an historic race/demo.

#6143 AnnieOz

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:54

I know that in SA there was a class for Vintage ad PVT (Post Vintage thoroughbreds) for many years, possibly 60s - will try to check dates but I remember Dad racing in this class from about 73/74 as well as at the Sandown Hang Ten meetings. I'm sure someone will have the programmes for those events
Cheers
Annie

#6144 Lola5000

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 09:19

I know that in SA there was a class for Vintage ad PVT (Post Vintage thoroughbreds) for many years, possibly 60s - will try to check dates but I remember Dad racing in this class from about 73/74 as well as at the Sandown Hang Ten meetings. I'm sure someone will have the programmes for those events
Cheers
Annie

Hang ten meetings sure did have historic racings,got programs in the garage.

#6145 SJ Lambert

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 10:08

A couple of Open Wheelers....Creek Corner Warwick Farm 6th September 1969
Posted Image


This one has gotta be Len Goodwin in the Mk1 Elfin Mono M6441 (ex Hunnam) running an 1100cc engine??

#6146 Lola5000

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 10:41

This one has gotta be Len Goodwin in the Mk1 Elfin Mono M6441 (ex Hunnam) running an 1100cc engine??

Thats my old car,great little car when i had it powered by a 1475cc (under 1,500cc) Vega -tuned twin-cam.

#6147 SJ Lambert

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 11:40

Thats my old car,great little car when i had it powered by a 1475cc (under 1,500cc) Vega -tuned twin-cam.



Oops, I should have said Chassis no M6443, not 6441. Those early cars were very attractive machines!!!

#6148 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 01 December 2011 - 10:12

I know that in SA there was a class for Vintage ad PVT (Post Vintage thoroughbreds) for many years, possibly 60s - will try to check dates but I remember Dad racing in this class from about 73/74 as well as at the Sandown Hang Ten meetings. I'm sure someone will have the programmes for those events
Cheers
Annie

I can remember Kevin at Austin 7 meetings going back to about 74 when I first became involved in circuit racing. Such a distinct car driven hard.

#6149 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 01 December 2011 - 10:12

I know that in SA there was a class for Vintage ad PVT (Post Vintage thoroughbreds) for many years, possibly 60s - will try to check dates but I remember Dad racing in this class from about 73/74 as well as at the Sandown Hang Ten meetings. I'm sure someone will have the programmes for those events
Cheers
Annie

I can remember Kevin at Austin 7 meetings going back to about 74 when I first became involved in circuit racing. Such a distinct car driven hard.

#6150 Lola5000

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Posted 01 December 2011 - 10:25

Oops, I should have said Chassis no M6443, not 6441. Those early cars were very attractive machines!!!

Fast little car in a straight line,pencil thin.Weakness hp vs the VW 36hp gearbox.