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Personal photos of Australian motor racing '50s to '70s


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#1801 Ray Bell

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Posted 21 February 2008 - 23:13

Originally posted by David M. Kane
55mm lens! He must have bloody close to the edge of the track! Awesome shot!


He was waving flags, he would have been right there...

Gordon, I can't say what superchargers they are, but I think there were at least two manufacturers in Australia... most famously Eldred Norman, whose son Mike still has promotional material and probably still makes them in Noosaville Qld.

Some came from old cars too. Like the P-type MG and so on.

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#1802 ken devine

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Posted 21 February 2008 - 23:24

This is the only shot i got of the Peugeot Elf.Imade a mistake about the wheels Vindid had wire wheels.
Weren't the superchargers Shorrock?





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#1803 plannerpower

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 00:13

Blowers have always intrigued me.

Both blowers look like Roots-type.

That eliminates Norman, Shorrock, Zoller & PowerPlus which (I think) were all vane types.

Marshall & Wade made Roots types in the old days. The Roots-types used in GP cars (Daimler-Benz, Ferrari, Maserati etc) were made in-house.

Roots-type "cabin blowers" from aircraft were available as war surplus in the 50s & 60s; in accord with the great Aussie penchant for scrounging, these were adapted to cars so the devices in the pictures may be cabin blowers.

#1804 Terry Walker

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 01:07

Something like half a dozen of these Peugeot powered specials were built in the early to mid sixties in Western Australia. The grandaddy of them all, the Wally Higgs car, is being rebuilt from rusted remains disinterred from a tip. The Kingbsury car is with a WARM member, and being rebuilt. The fate of the others - such as the Vin Smith car, later raced by Norm Scott, and the Dick Ward car shown here, are unknown at present.

After the Peugeot wave died down, there was a small wave of Elfin Catalina clones, copies or imitations with full independent rear ends and usually Ford engines: the Befa, ZX3, etc.

We are a long way from anywhere and mostly had to build our own racing cars at that time. The first genuine factory built single seater racing car in WA was the Ferrari, which arrived in 1960. Then came the Ausper and the Elfin Catalina, and later Don O'Sullivan turned up with Cooper Climaxes.

#1805 fredeuce

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 03:31

There was a S/C Peugot openwheeler here in SA built by Ian Richards from memory. Goes back to the late 60's as I recall. Quite an effective race car. The addition of the supercharger made it sound quite purposeful.

As for the type of supercharger I can't be sure but there was a fellow in Adelaide by the name of John Wray that built vane type superchargers for various 4 cylinder combinations and I believe some 6's as well in the mid to late 60's. I think it may have had one of these fitted.

Perhaps others can assist here. Where's Kaydee? I suspect he would know something about all of this.

#1806 David McKinney

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 06:57

Originally posted by Terry Walker
The first genuine factory built single seater racing car in WA was the Ferrari, which arrived in 1960

...in the wake of a Cooper-Bristol/Holden and a couple of Altas, not to mention motorcycle-engined Coopers :)

#1807 Terry Walker

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 09:07

Bloody hell! I forgot the Cooper Bristol, and the 500s! I had the C-B in my mind, but before I sat down to type I went off and did something else first, and whoops! a senior moment!

#1808 David McKinney

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 09:23

Happens to the best of us :lol:

#1809 ken devine

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 10:39

Thats ok Terry the Ferrari was the first real one.

#1810 Stan Patterson

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 10:48

Maybe I am missing something here...

This thread was started by Kaydee with brilliant pics of our motor history..of long lost pictures of why we mattered..and of why Lex Davison, Reg Hunt & Stan Jones grabbed our Olympic attention ..of how Australia mattered in the remote motor racing world of those times, about the stature Albert Park enjoyed in the 50's before the Liberal Party destroyed it, about how we drew the world's best here .....etc etc etc

Do we need pics of Renault shopping trolleys, EH taxis, et al wallowing over Bathurst followed by boring discussions of who drove what nanna car ?...particularly when it was all in a corrupt contrived non-Jaguar environment

DOES IT ReALLY MATTER?
.

If only somebody had have stood up and said WHOA.."This is just not right"..we wouldnt be in the mess we are in today...

Stan

#1811 Catalina Park

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 10:53

Originally posted by Stan Patterson
Maybe I am missing something here...

This thread was started by Kaydee with brilliant pics of our motor history..of long lost pictures of why we mattered..and of why Lex Davison, Reg Hunt & Stan Jones grabbed our Olympic attention ..of how Australia mattered in the remote motor racing world of those times, about the stature Albert Park enjoyed in the 50's before the Liberal Party destroyed it, about how we drew the world's best here .....etc etc etc

Do we need pics of Renault shopping trolleys, EH taxis, et al wallowing over Bathurst followed by boring discussions of who drove what nanna car ?...particularly when it was all in a corrupt contrived non-Jaguar environment

DOES IT ReALLY MATTER?
.

If only somebody had have stood up and said WHOA.."This is just not right"..we wouldnt be in the mess we are in today...

Stan

And remember, friday night is half price drinks at the Club.

#1812 275 GTB-4

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 11:01

Originally posted by Catalina Park
And remember, friday night is half price drinks at the Club.


But of course...and here was me looking for a rational explanation for Stans most bizarre utterance yet :rolleyes:

#1813 Stan Patterson

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 11:16

Mr Elfin,

Would you care to address the issues I have raised ?..rather than the shallow Howardesque abuse you prefer? ...I was raised to respect the other chaps point of view...the curse of BRDC and being British

Half price you say?

STEWARD!!

#1814 Catalina Park

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 11:25

Originally posted by Stan Patterson
Mr Elfin,

Would you care to address the issues I have raised ?..rather than the shallow Howardesque abuse you prefer? ...I was raised to respect the other chaps point of view...the curse of BRDC and being British

Half price you say?

STEWARD!!

If you were raised to respect the other chaps point of view why can't you.. Oh never mind it was a silly idea anyway.

Steward, Charge my drinks to the table over there.

#1815 GeoffR

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 11:29

Doesn't motor racing mean anything that has a motor in it and is raced - not just those that don't have mudguards??
That Fiat Abarth is wicked!!

BTW - who is going to Phillip Island to see all the magnificent touring cars that will be there? Oh, and I guess we'll have to put up with those 'racing' cars as well!! ;)

#1816 repcobrabham

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 11:33

i'm assuming you can still smoke in here :smoking: i'll have a sapphire and tonic and a ringside seat, chin-chin!

#1817 Catalina Park

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 11:37

Originally posted by repcobrabham
i'm assuming you can still smoke in here :smoking: i'll have a sapphire and tonic and a ringside seat, chin-chin!

Real men smoke rubber. :smoking:

#1818 Terry Walker

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 11:50

The Fiat Abarth has a turbo Mazda 13B rotary engine, and a fully adjustable front and rear suspension. It raced with huge success here and specially in Asia until 1982 when it hit the fence at Wanneroo Park and was retired (superseded by three consecutive RX7 sports sedans, which kept Dick busy until he himself retired temporarily around 2001.) Two or three years ago Dick Ward blew the dust off it, restored it, and returned it to competition as a sprint and hill climb car. It is too light to race in the sports sedan category, as there is a minimum weight rule for turbo cars above a certain capacity (don't ask..)

#1819 David McKinney

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 12:01

Originally posted by GeoffR
Doesn't motor racing mean anything that has a motor in it and is raced - not just those that don't have mudguards??

There was a time when it didn't - it meant racing by racing-cars ;)
Am I right, Stan?

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#1820 GeoffR

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 12:02

Ahh - Mazda rotaries. They were magic in rally cars, just hold it on the 'beeper' until the next corner. Then people got into such things as BP, PP, Webers, low diffs etc.

#1821 Stan Patterson

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 12:25

Yes David

That abomination did not RACE it OFFENDED.

If that riduculous comic book car, in any way purported to be a form of serious motor racing, then we should have all asked ourrselves where are we heading?...what is motorr racing?

Damn

#1822 Ray Bell

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 13:00

Originally posted by Stan Patterson
.....If that riduculous comic book car, in any way purported to be a form of serious motor racing, then we should have all asked ourrselves where are we heading?...what is motor racing?


I have to agree with Stan's sentiment here...

Even though I get interested, watch and appreciate even, some touring car racing, I regard real motor racing as racing between cars that serve no other interest other than to race.

So, if a car was built as a road car, then it wasn't built to race. If it races, then it's compromised in both its lives. A Racing Car, on the other hand, serves no other purpose.

The extension of that is that racing of production based cars can be linked to selling road cars. Hence it's leaning towards being advertising rather than racing.

Roll out the ME2 and a smart looking BT36 any day!

#1823 Terry Walker

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 13:59

Right back at the beginning, the 1890s, the whole purpose of motor racing was to publicise the factory's production cars. Even Rolls-Royce went motor racing! Nothing much has changed, except that the sport became more broadly based, and subdivided into numerous categories to satisfy equally numerous (usually marketing) requirements, not to mention an infinite variety of purses.

Grand Prix Racing is simply a very expensive, very highly specialised, and heavily publicised branch of motor racing; not all of it. I enjoy it all, from Karts to Speedway to tourers to Formula Ford to ... well, all of it.

#1824 repcobrabham

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 15:01

Originally posted by Catalina Park
Real men smoke rubber. :smoking:


yeah, thanks dad.

racing takes all kinds - wish i was around (or at least a conscious being) for torana v falcon, all-time by any measure - but supercabs is awful in concept and execution. i'm only engaged at bathurst.

#1825 maoricar

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 18:49

Like it or not, a substantial portion of motor racing history can be traced to Ford vs GM rivalry..Henry l and R E Olds both risking life and limb in the very early 1900's, with Winton as the Bogeyman.
I know, I know...ascribing Olds as GM is a stretch...but less of one than others I've seen here.
Most probably they raced for money..purses of $1000-00 or more, in order to further capitilize their 'production car' factories.

Without the money backing, and/or expertise from major manufacturers, whether they be Riley, Fiat, Mercedes, Ford, GM etal...in all likelihood motor racing would have had a somewhat spotty complexion.
There never has been a combination of technical expertise AND funding to produce a bespoke 'racing car' for any appreciable length of time....and I doubt there ever will be
Cooper and Lotus did very well with power plants supplied from an industrial engine manufacturer...for a time
Enzo purchased one of his best power plants from rival Lancia...unsurprisingly..a V-6.

And so, I doubt there EVER was such a thing as a 'pure' racing car.....outside of some wishful thinkers, in comfy arm chairs, nursing their G and T's

#1826 Allen Brown

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 19:11

Don't we already have a thread for this debate over the definition of "motor racing"?

Less gabbing and more photos people!

#1827 maoricar

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 19:56

Fair comment; point taken; apologies offered.............

#1828 2Bob

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 20:32

I do agree about the more photos plea, however, thought I would pass on thoughts after a meeting up with a couple of people yesterday.

Because I live only 200 metres away from the Adelaide GP track (whoops Clipsal...) and I was offered a 'go anywhere' pass for a couple of days I wandered over there Thursday and Friday, mainly to look at the F3s practice - no other real racing cars there! Had a quick chat with Ian Richards (of the Puegeot engined self built Viper mentioned earlier) and Andrew Miedecke of Ralt RT4 fame (and Cosworth Sierra too as well as a few other things I suppose).

Ian, of course, went from the Viper to the Richards Australian F2 cars (and won the championship) and is now running a F3 team (if one car is a team?) with the younger Reindler. Somewhere along the way he also built and (still?) hillclimbs some sort of turboed Daihatsu (or something) 4WD shopping trolley.

Andrew is driver standards official for the V8 utes (now that must be an interesting job!) as well as supporting son George who races in that series - must be some sort of conflict of interest one would think but he seems to have the respect from the rest of the drivers to do it!

Anyway, the point of my rambling on is that if you love motor racing then somehow you keep involved and even utes are better than nothing! I imagine Andrew is involved in the utes because son George is too big (tall) to fit into any sort of real racing car!

#1829 plannerpower

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 21:16

OK; back to photos.

Bathurst, Easter 1963; I will arrange them in groups. Racing cars first then, after an interval for discussion, sports cars and, finally, tourers;


Alex Lazich (Piranha);

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Frank Walters (So-Cal);

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Ken Milburn (Kent Price?) (Lotus 20);

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Jesse Griffiths (Maserati 4CL) - practiced only, did not appear in races as I recall;

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Tony Shelley (Cooper);

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A rather odd assortment but that's all I have of the open-wheelers.

#1830 Ray Bell

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 21:47

Originally posted by plannerpower
OK; back to photos.

Bathurst, Easter 1963; I will arrange them in groups. Racing cars first then, after an interval for discussion, sports cars and, finally, tourers;


.....Ken Milburn (Kent Price?) (Lotus 20);

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Yes, Kent Price...

He raced under an assumed name here because there was prizemoney on offer. If he won any, which he often did, a few measly quid at a time, he would lose his amateur status in the USA.

All of this was revealed when he crashed, I think that was at the '64 meeting at Bathurst. Broken legs, IIRC.

Story is that his wife and Joan Matich used to give gifts to each other occasionally. One gift that 'did the rounds' as a gift only, not to be used, was a can of chocolate coated ants.

#1831 ken devine

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Posted 22 February 2008 - 23:16

After deadheating in final championship race Syd Taylor and Merv Dudley decided to split the prizemoney
and have a runoff to decide the champion,here they prepare for the start of the 3 lap race Syd Taylor in
The TS beat Merv Dudley in the BRM a car length.OH it was 1956




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#1832 Terry Walker

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 00:42

Both the above cars still exist. The BRM (Bill Richards Motors) Morgan No 19 became the Repco Holden Sports car a few years later, is restored in that form, and still appears. The TS Special No 1 is also restored and racing in the able hands of Charlie Mitchell.

#1833 John Ellacott

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 06:08

One of my earliest motor racing photos. Who, What, When Where ?

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#1834 Catalina Park

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 06:24

Where looks like Mt Druitt. :

#1835 Stan Patterson

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 06:37

Magnificent pic of the T53

Surely the most under-rated GP car of all time...pure elegance..and a world title to its name.

Many people say it was the first Brabham..but that is unfair to the Coopers IMHO


In respect of the recent Tony Brooks thread...imagine if the Flying Dentist had sat in one..

But that is not within the ambit of V8 Ute mentality..."hot Damn! yall"


BLOODY HELL

No Half Price Drinks This Eve

Stan

#1836 ken devine

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 08:17

Which flying dentist do you mean Stan ? Syd Taylor was our Flying dentist,we always wanted to see what he
could do with the Anderson Alta.

#1837 viva48

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 09:24

[IMG]http://img179.images...ercorneroz1.jpg[/IMG]
Here's one of Beechy at the Farm 14/2/65, Ledger Corner.

#1838 viva48

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 09:33

[IMG]http://img84.imagesh.../7046/opjw4.jpg[/IMG]
This is Oran Park Div. 2 Tourers, probably mid '64. The old track running across the hilltop to the start line is visible. Note also the lack of spectator mounds at the Dogleg. This might have been the first meeting that Energol Corner was used.......not sure, too long ago, but, the bitumen looks brand new and the Armco seems freshly painted.

#1839 Stan Patterson

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 09:51

Sorry Ken,

I am referring to Charles Anthony Standish Brooks..aka C.A.S Brooks..

Probably 3rd in line behind Fangio amd Moss..and on occasions equal to both.

No offence to your local chap

Stan

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#1840 Catalina Park

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 09:54

Originally posted by viva48
Posted Image
This is Oran Park Div. 2 Tourers, probably mid '64. The old track running across the hilltop to the start line is visible. Note also the lack of spectator mounds at the Dogleg. This might have been the first meeting that Energol Corner was used.......not sure, too long ago, but, the bitumen looks brand new and the Armco seems freshly painted.

Funny thing about that corner, they eventually filled in the little dam and removed all the armco but the tree survived for a long time after the armco went. Eventually it was removed after (I think) one of the Brabham sons hit the tree with a Ford Laser! (it must have been David!) The tree had been hit a few times before that.

#1841 Catalina Park

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 10:00

Originally posted by Stan Patterson
Sorry Ken,

I am referring to Charles Anthony Standish Brooks..aka C.A.S Brooks..

Probably 3rd in line behind Fangio and Moss..and on occasions equal to both.

No offence to your local chap

Stan

Stan, I am glad you cleared that up. When you were talking about the Flying Dentist I thought it must have been the bloke supplying your laughing gas.

I would agree with Tony Brooks as one ot the top shelf. But I think that our Jack would have to be near the top as well.

#1842 Stan Patterson

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 11:04

Nice Turn of Phrase Cat

We all had a chuckle over the billiard table..is the Fellow a member?..never mind

Let there be no mistake... Sir Jack does not need me, or any other old brandy soaked wanker, to sing his praises..he is UNIQUE.. maybe i will save the Peter Thomson/Rod Laver/Jack Brabham .. "what is an Australian Icon" debate?' .... for another time...after the V8 UTE races are over...swooon "OH My Love for Peter"

Maybe we need to address the big picture issues before we can even begin to understand how the V8 Supercab sickness corrupts and demeans us all

Oh by the way. ...the "Utes are on"

GET REAL

#1843 Ray Bell

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 12:12

Originally posted by viva48
Posted Image
This is Oran Park Div. 2 Tourers, probably mid '64. The old track running across the hilltop to the start line is visible. Note also the lack of spectator mounds at the Dogleg. This might have been the first meeting that Energol Corner was used.......not sure, too long ago, but, the bitumen looks brand new and the Armco seems freshly painted.


If it's the first meeting on the extended circuit, then it has to be September 1963...

It could be too, that low dust hanging over the dogleg could very well be real and that area was broken up in that first meeting. Badly broken up, I think a Sprite rolled when it tipped up on the mound that was built up there.

That could also be Barry Thiele in the Major there, and the only meeting at which he had Minis around him like that, as I read the race reports, was that opening one. Though there's no mention of Holdens! All the same, I'm not sure it's a Major, and Simca and Prefect could be options... IMO.

I can tell you this... it's not the May '64 event, as the fence is undamaged. At that meeting Allan Grice took out that fence in the first race of the day.

#1844 Ray Bell

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 12:15

Originally posted by Catalina Park
Where looks like Mt Druitt.


"Looks like" is severely understating the obvious... post 1952, I'd say... with Erskine Park in the background before it learned its name was really St Clair.

No idea with the cars...

#1845 Ray Bell

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 12:30

Picked this up on another forum...

Not my pictures, but my curiosity. What is the Cooper with the high exhaust pipe? Or should I say, whose?

Posted Image

The event is Maldon hillclimb, would have to be 1963.

#1846 John Ellacott

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 21:49

Mt. Druitt picture is from July 1957, the car nearest is Leon Thomas MG

#1847 John Ellacott

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 22:06

Ray, the top right picture looks to me to be the lex Davison Type 62 Cooper, but do not know the other one with the high exhaust.

#1848 Ray Bell

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 22:08

I should have looked at the file name!

John, the biggest thing to me in that pic is how it captures something we can never see again...

Posted Image

The crowds of people sitting in their cars, lining the airstrip and the runs up and down the hill and enjoying a simple and pleasurable day out at the races.

And the unsullied 'Western Suburbs' countryside, that broad expanse in the background that was once green and is now tiled roof all over.

A great pic for atmosphere...

#1849 Ray Bell

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 22:14

Originally posted by John Ellacott
Ray, the top right picture looks to me to be the lex Davison Type 62 Cooper, but do not know the other one with the high exhaust.


That's right, John, that's the only car that it can be... very distinctive...

#1850 ken devine

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 23:10

Yesterday i went to the old Caversham circuit where the Vintage Sports Car Club have the lease of the Raaf
buildings and are renovating them as club rooms.Allan Tomlinson was there and presente them with a large
photo of him winning the 1939 AGP this is the first of many old photos to go on the wall.When i get the pic of the presentation i willpost it.After reading Rays remarks on what happened to Mt Druit reminded me of the
housing development which would destroy all the beautiful bush.Of course while i was there i took a nostalgic
drive around the circuit in my old Barina thinking of when i won my only motor sport event a regularity trial
in 1962 in my Morris 850.