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Formula 5000 - happy days!


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#901 Glenn Moulds

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 23:36

I would love to have that Excel list, but I kind of need it right away. My e.mail address is at the bottom of my post, and one more thing... who was Michael Adams and did he ever front up to compete? As in make practice or a race?


Email sent. I believe Michael Adams was the owner of the Elfin 815 and Mike Trengove drove the car whilst Adams gained his licence. Adams did drive the car in local Racing Car events here in SA - not sure about interstate yet.

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#902 Ray Bell

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:02

Thanks, Glenn...

Now, after a flurry of activity, I have added another four names of drivers who competed at racing circuits in F5000 cars in Australia and New Zealand between 1968 and 1982.

I would be fairly confident I've got all the Australians, but I might have missed a Kiwi or two (if anyone thinks of any, please e.mail me today!), I have 101 on the list apart from the 42 drivers who have either contributed to the book or have stories about them in the book. A total of 143 drivers who got the right sort of kick in the backside, you might say.

#903 ellrosso

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:47

While we are on this, can anyone give details of this car from Sandown 1981. I've also got to update Russell Davidson on the ORP website.

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#904 xj13v12

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:51

The tyres are grooved slicks to historic pattern.

#905 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:57

Thanks for chiming in, Glenn...

Jon Davison is mentioned in the previous Calder report, also in the Winton report (mentioning the Myers livery), both Jon Davison and Russell Davidson are spelled out in mentions in the Oran Park report, he was there at AIR (where he crashed) for the final round. He is not mentioned in the Sandown series-opener report.

So to look at the mention in this Calder report, we see that "Davison and Butcher executed a double spin at Glo-Weave..." It appears towards the end of the report, but it is a bit disjointed, could it have happened while Butcher was lapping Davidson? Certainly, there is no mention of Jon in the early part...

"...John Wright was the first to blast away in the Lola T400. Allison slotted the MR8 Elfin into second from Rob Butcher's T332 Lola, then came Garrie Cooper (Elfin MR9), Bob Minogue (Lola T430), Tim Slako (Elfin MR6), Peter Edwards (Lola T332) and Alan Nitschke in the BEGG (sic) FM5/2."

Unless Davo was in there behind Nitschke somewhere and came through to tangle with Butcher as he tried to pass him, I'd agree with your assessment that he wasn't there. And this photo does look like a first lap or second lap pic, doesn't it? So Davo should be in it. Unless Graham Slater missed out on mentioning him in his listing.

I would love to have that Excel list, but I kind of need it right away. My e.mail address is at the bottom of my post, and one more thing... who was Michael Adams and did he ever front up to compete? As in make practice or a race?

Hi, Mike Adams was I believe Adelaide based. Stan Keen did some prep on the car as well as Elfin.[less than a km away] I saw the car both places. I seem to remember him mentioned in reports about that time. Well down the field. Car was No6, or when I saw it anyway.Had from memory a larger D series transporter. Made the Elfin truck look small.

#906 Bondy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:07

While we are on this, can anyone give details of this car from Sandown 1981. I've also got to update Russell Davidson on the ORP website.

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Thats Barry Singleton in the Gardos OR2 leading Mel McEwin Matich A53/007 and Ian Adams Lola T330 HU1.


#907 ellrosso

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:13

Thanks Bondy.....TNF never fails!

#908 Bondy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:18

Thanks Bondy.....TNF never fails!


Another great shot from my very good customer and top bloke Neil Hammond :)


#909 Bondy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:26

Thanks Bondy.....TNF never fails!


There is a pic of a ELfin MR8 on your site, its captioned Sandown 82, Garrie Cooper. While the pic is small i reckon its Stuart Kostera as he did a few races in the car circa 81. Can you post a clearer pic of it?


#910 ellrosso

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 07:08

Sure, can you give me the index number?

#911 Bondy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 07:15

Sure, can you give me the index number?


I think i got this right, 6928. Thanks :)


#912 ellrosso

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:03

Elfin MR8 from Sandown attached + a few other Neil Hammond pics. Couldn't resist putting the one of Alfie in the M26 on - what a car, right up their with the Elfin MR9 at the top of my F5000 list.

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Graham McRae, Winton 1980
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Bob Minogue, Jon Davison Winton 1982 - one of the last F5000 category outings in Aust.
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Alfredo Costanzo McLaren M26 Chev Sandown 1981

#913 Bondy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:09

Elfin MR8 from Sandown attached + a few other Neil Hammond pics. Couldn't resist putting the one of Alfie in the M26 on - what a car, right up their with the Elfin MR9 at the top of my F5000 list.


Thanks :) It will be 81 and i reckon its Kostera. The McRae shot will be 79 and the Winton Minogue/Davo shot, would'nt that be 81 as i don't think the F5000's returned in 82.


#914 simonlewisbooks

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:17

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Alfredo Costanzo McLaren M26 Chev Sandown 1981



This thread just gets better and better! So many interesting cars we have never previously had the opportunity to see on this side of the globe! :up:

#915 Bondy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:27

This thread just gets better and better! So many interesting cars we have never previously had the opportunity to see on this side of the globe! :up:


Totally agree Simon :) we need a picture of Lugsy's creation as i have never seen a full picture of it..


#916 ellrosso

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:30

Could well be right Bondy, I'm going off Neil's captions which may not have been done at the time of shooting. Bit hard to tell between Garrie and Stuart as they both wore a white helmet.

#917 Bondy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:43

Could well be right Bondy, I'm going off Neil's captions which may not have been done at the time of shooting. Bit hard to tell between Garrie and Stuart as they both wore a white helmet.


I might have to give Neil a call, although our convo's normally last too long ;) I know Stu raced the MR8 in 81 in selected ARCO races..


#918 Duc-Man

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:57

I got a question for you guys.
Hall & Hall have been restoring a Shadow DN6. Does anybody know if they are done or has any other information about the car?

Edited to add this link to a flickr album page with some F5000 photos.

Edited by Duc-Man, 10 May 2012 - 10:12.


#919 ellrosso

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 10:32

I had the shortest call ever with Neil last weekend - only about 10 minutes - usually 1/2 hr minimum! Once we get started......
Few more of Neil's plus a couple of mine from AIR to show the UK TNFr's a bit of its unusual (!) atmosphere....

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#920 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:43

This thread just gets better and better! So many interesting cars we have never previously had the opportunity to see on this side of the globe! :up:

And Thommos Benz in the background in one of its many incarnations. And obviuosly John Bowe was the driver that meeting.

#921 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:48

Elfin MR8 from Sandown attached + a few other Neil Hammond pics. Couldn't resist putting the one of Alfie in the M26 on - what a car, right up their with the Elfin MR9 at the top of my F5000 list.

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Graham McRae, Winton 1980
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Bob Minogue, Jon Davison Winton 1982 - one of the last F5000 category outings in Aust.
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Alfredo Costanzo McLaren M26 Chev Sandown 1981

I think that is 82 at Winton as the cars have airboxes again. I bet little Winton was hard on those poor old Hewlands,,, and the drivers arms.

#922 Ray Bell

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:28

Not at all...

The 1982 Winton race was a Gold Star event for Pacifics won by Alfie.

Both Minogue and Davison had tall airboxes at the 1981 Rose City 10,000 - as pictured in RCN.

The very last F5000 race held in Australia was at AIR on May 2, 1982. There were just three races that year, Calder on February 28 and Oran Park on March 21.

#923 beesa71

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 16:37

Posted Image
105 by jones115, on Flickr

This image has made on old(ish) man very happy. Why; well that's me with the motorcycling gear on leaning into the cockpit. The other chap was a schoolfriend of my older brother who, also from Warrington, we used to do most Oulton meetings with in that period. Great, just great. I had thought I might make it onto an image under the Oulton Scoreboard thread but here will do very nicely thank you.

Paul (aka beesa71 almost everywhere).


#924 ellrosso

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 21:33

Good to clear up the Winton 1981 debate Ray - I've got a bit of caption work to do! So the Calder stuff from 1982 (The Slako leading the pack shot) is all correct.
Do you have any details of the last AIR race in May 1982 Ray?

#925 Bondy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 22:46

Here's the Entry list for the 81 Sandown Gold Star Round :)

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#926 Ray Bell

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 23:11

Originally posted by ellrosso
Good to clear up the Winton 1981 debate Ray - I've got a bit of caption work to do! So the Calder stuff from 1982 (The Slako leading the pack shot) is all correct.
Do you have any details of the last AIR race in May 1982 Ray?


Glenn sent me this yesterday, he's been a big help, I just wish I'd known he had this stuff a few months ago!

2 Bob Minogue
3 Russell Davidson
4 Jon Davison
7 Alan Nitschke
10 Rob Butcher
11 Reg Orr: TBA
15 Terry Hook
17 Mel McEwin
33 Tim Slako
76 John Wright

The Reg Orr car didn't turn up, nor did Terry Hook.

Yes, the colour stuff from Calder is the February 28, 1982 meeting. Other ARCOgraphite dates were (inserted here because they're very hard to find!):

Round 1 - Sandown Park - September 13, 1981
Round 2 - Calder - November 8, 1981
Round 3 - Calder - February 28, 1982
Round 4 - Oran Park (short circuit) - March 21, 1982
Round 5 - Adelaide International Raceway - May 2, 1982

Winton's Rose City 10,000 was for F5000 only and was sponsored by ARCOgraphite, but wasn't a round of the series.

I think it's also very interesting to read Graham Slater's comment in the RCN report on the February Calder round. This was a meeting where the ATCC round was held and there was a 60-lap Formula Pacific title race:

In contrast to their smaller counterparts, the sound of the big F5000 V8s was music to the ears...



#927 Bondy

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 05:13

Could well be right Bondy, I'm going off Neil's captions which may not have been done at the time of shooting. Bit hard to tell between Garrie and Stuart as they both wore a white helmet.


After speaking to Neil, he said he would'nt want to bet a model against me so we are going with Stuart Kostera ;)


#928 Lola5000

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 06:17

Not at all...

The 1982 Winton race was a Gold Star event for Pacifics won by Alfie.

Both Minogue and Davison had tall airboxes at the 1981 Rose City 10,000 - as pictured in RCN.

The very last F5000 race held in Australia was at AIR on May 2, 1982. There were just three races that year, Calder on February 28 and Oran Park on March 21.

Hi Ray,any updates on the book release?

#929 ellrosso

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 09:18

Here are shots from the same angle of Cooper and Kostera - hard to pick! Some more shots from back then - big Max, one of my favourites, KB and Vern S.

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#930 Bondy

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 09:33

Here are shots from the same angle of Cooper and Kostera - hard to pick! Some more shots from back then - big Max, one of my favourites, KB and Vern S.


Garrie was running the MR9 that weekend, we worked it out that the MR8 pic is from September 1981, the ARCO round.


#931 Lola5000

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 10:48

I'm told by a driver whom drove a few of the latter Lola cars,that the Elfin MR8's was right up there as a car,sure looked good.

#932 Ray Bell

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 12:09

There's absolutely no doubt that the MR8 was a good car...

Bruce Allison jumped into it and was instantly challenging Wright, who was the class leader of the day. John Smith got Middleton's car going for a few laps at Oran Park and reckons he was matching Wright's sub-40s lap times... though his official time was 41.1, he says he did the quicker times in the untimed late afternoon session.

Vern Schuppan was instantly competitive when he started to run the MR8, Larry Perkins likewise, Rob Butcher made some comment that I can't recall immediately, but he certainly didn't decry the car, John Bowe was another who found it to his liking.

As for the book, it's off to the printer next week, come rain, hail or shine. Give it eight weeks before bulk copies are in the country and look for a release late June or early July.

And we've paid due respect to the vast number of people who drove these cars in Australia and New Zealand. I finished my count at 143.

#933 Ray Bell

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 12:23

Originally posted by ellrosso
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Stephen Fraser spells his surname like his father did... no 'z'...

Graeme Lawrence doesn't use an 'h'.

Glen Dix is spelled with an 'x'.

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McCormack in the M23 in Unipart colours?

Edited by Ray Bell, 11 May 2012 - 12:25.


#934 Lola5000

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 12:31

The photo of the M26 at the old Sandown pits ,man to the rhs from RH wheel, Jim Hardman?

#935 Ray Bell

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 13:26

I believe you're right there...

We have a pic in our book with Jim working on Davo's Lola too.

#936 Lola5000

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 20:59

I believe you're right there...

We have a pic in our book with Jim working on Davo's Lola too.

LOL,with NO fag in his mouth.
I remember being at Sandown when the M26 did under 1 min,it was quick and looked the goods.
Made the other 5 litre cars look old,which I guess they were by then in race car years.

Edited by Lola5000, 11 May 2012 - 21:02.


#937 Ray Bell

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 21:08

John Wright claims he broke the minute first...

But his time was disallowed.

No matter whether he did or not, there's no doubt he was quick, really quick, in that old Lola by the time he got 18 months down the track in it. And discovered his tension wrench was giving bad readings.

#938 Bondy

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 23:03

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Im confident that is Max Stewart. It's a T400 and Max had a stripe going down the top of the airbox like this car.


#939 Ray Bell

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 23:11

Yes, you're right...

I was thinking that the car only had that when it was in the colours as run in NZ, but another pic further back showed the stripe up the tail when he had the multi-colour scheme.

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#940 Lola5000

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 01:06

John Wright claims he broke the minute first...

But his time was disallowed.

No matter whether he did or not, there's no doubt he was quick, really quick, in that old Lola by the time he got 18 months down the track in it. And discovered his tension wrench was giving bad readings.

is that the T400,that is now in Benalla VIC?

#941 Bondy

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 02:37

is that the T400,that is now in Benalla VIC?


Yep, its the car Mike Glynn runs.


#942 Lola5000

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 03:38

Yep, its the car Mike Glynn runs.

had that car for a long time,I can remember going to NZ about 17 years ago with Bob M and the T430 and Mike was over there also running it

#943 Ray Bell

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 10:48

It's the car Michael Lance owned...

Sad that he never got to race it.

#944 Lola5000

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 12:32

It's the car Michael Lance owned...

Sad that he never got to race it.

I don't know the name,what happened?

#945 Ray Bell

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 13:52

Michael was a top Clubman driver in Sydney...

When he found he was dying with a melanoma, he bought the Lola. His sole wish was to drive a F5000. He had no morphine until he did, he drove five slow laps of Oran Park and they lifted his frail body from the car, then he had morphine. He died two days later.

Michael always wanted to race these monsters.

#946 Allen Brown

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 15:20

Which Lola Ray? That story deserves to be part of the car's history.

#947 gouldo

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 03:59

I'm glad that correct identification as a P6 came up, I was worried about it!

Fred, we live in Australia where P76s roamed free. Yes, a modifed Rover, but via the P76 (1" taller block) route. This car was (naturally enough) always immaculate when Barrie Garner ran it, but is it really the car the Milus Man ran? Wasn't there another car? Black was the common denominator.


Ray,

This car, the Bowin Hay, was owned by Mike Sullivan for a while. Its the same car that Mike had his accident in. In the green livery, it was owned by Garry McFadyen, whose son Neil went on to win the 2004 Australian Gold Star in a 96D Reynard Formula Holden.

It has until recently been owned by Neil Farr. it was for sale prior to Xmas.

#948 Marc Sproule

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 05:56

Some new additions to my 5000 set. Black and white from Long Beach in '75. Had to shoot from the grandstands as I didn't have a photog cred. In fact my general admission ticket wasn't quite real.

Seems a driver who shall remain nameless, whose initials are EFR, took a real ticket to a local color copier outfit and a number of us didn't have to pay to get in.

:rolleyes:

http://www.flickr.co...57626135973193/

#949 Duc-Man

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 10:45

Some new additions to my 5000 set. Black and white from Long Beach in '75. Had to shoot from the grandstands as I didn't have a photog cred. In fact my general admission ticket wasn't quite real.

Seems a driver who shall remain nameless, whose initials are EFR, took a real ticket to a local color copier outfit and a number of us didn't have to pay to get in.

:rolleyes:

http://www.flickr.co...57626135973193/


You got on there a shot of a Shadow DN6 with the radiators right behind the front wheels. I knew they tried different radiator setups but I never saw this before.
Could you post that one in bigger please?

#950 JacnGille

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 14:50

Seems a driver who shall remain nameless, whose initials are EFR, took a real ticket to a local color copier outfit and a number of us didn't have to pay to get in.

Easy to understand from a driver who's helmet livery included lace and raced something with as silly a name as Tui. :cool: