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Lola T70 Mk3 & Mk3B coupés


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#101 biz5300

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 19:43

yes same car.. posting some more in a minute.. :-)

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#102 biz5300

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 19:48

[IMG]http://img76.imagesh.../jey3yt5.th.jpg[/IMG] Posted ImagePosted Image

#103 biz5300

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 19:52

http://[IMG]http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/6315/jey3rk3.th.jpg[/IMG] http://[IMG]http://img76.imageshack.us/img76/6325/jey2mx4.th.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://img165.images.../jey1pv2.th.jpg[/IMG]

#104 5000gt

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 20:00

The photos from a Ferrari meeting in Sweden??

#105 biz5300

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 20:19

I have no idea magnus, where they were taken.. previous owner of my Bizz gave them to me.. N

#106 5000gt

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 20:22

SL76/152 was red then it came to Sweden.It was owned buy a man in Lomma Sweden 1995.He also owned a 750 Monza.

#107 ahe

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 20:26

Hi biz5300, 5000gt and all,

The car was not sold through Bonnier to France.
It is the ex Taylor/Woolfe/Seidler 1967 T70, SL73/102.

The pictures are from Kinnekulle Ring 1976 if I remember
correctly.

Saluti

/ahe

#108 5000gt

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 20:37

Isnt it Mantorp 1976?

#109 adminj

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Posted 30 May 2008 - 06:48

Originally posted by ahe
Hi biz5300, 5000gt and all,

The car was not sold through Bonnier to France.
It is the ex Taylor/Woolfe/Seidler 1967 T70, SL73/102.

The pictures are from Kinnekulle Ring 1976 if I remember
correctly.

Saluti

/ahe



Hello Anders!

Very interesting informations to this nice pics! ;)

Jürgen

#110 r.atlos

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Posted 30 May 2008 - 22:08

The KA - ... registration (for Karlsruhe) confirms that this is SL102, the ex-Woolfe/Seidler car. I guess it must have been around late 1971 or in 1972 that this car had been sold on by Bernd Seidler. In September 1974, a certain K. Lehmann from Bruchsal (and I guess they do have Karlsruhe registrations down there) offered it for sale as "Germany's only T70 Mk.III in street version".

Thus, we can assume that the Stockholm street picture dates from around 1975.

#111 craig jones

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 08:30

I am the current owner of SL73/119. The car was purchased from Ben Huismann of Holland in 1997 and completely rebuilt to correct Mk 3 specification by Clive Robinson of Totnes, Devon. The car is powered by a 302 cu in small block iron block Chevy and still retains an original tub complete with SCCA transfers on the original spyder dash frame from the 1967 CanAm season.

The car has been raced extensively by myself throughout Europe and South Africa and I have also taken part in a number of hillclimbs.
The ultimate victory for the car in my ownership was at the 2000 Monza Coppa Europa meeting when we passed the T70 Mk3B of Nigel Hulme at the end of the pit straight on the last lap and went on to win by a cars length.

Unfortunately I suffered a serious testing accident at Donnington Park in UK in December 2006 when the throttle jammed open close to a concrete wall which was more substantial than the car! This has taken a long time to repair but I can now advise that the car should be ready for testing (not at Donnington this time!) next month.

In 1967 the car was sent to USA and was raced by Peter Revson sonsored by Dana Corporation. The car was originally a spyder and was converted to a coupe when it returned to UK some years later. I have attempted to discover some of the 1968 - 1970 history of the car but without success. Maybe someone out there can help to fill in this missing history.

Craig W Jones

#112 Giraffe

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Posted 02 July 2008 - 20:50

John Starkey's book only indicates what it probably did with Revson behind the wheel in the '67 Can-Am, which you have undoubtably read.Then there is a gap to it's sale by Northdown Racing in 1982.

#113 ANM

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Posted 17 December 2009 - 23:34

Hello all!
I have an enquiry about a Lola T70 Mk. 3 SL73/101. This looked like a very likely place to continue my research.
Anyone know it's history and where it might be today?
I would be grateful for any help or leads on this car which I believe was owned and raced by Jo Bonnier, John Surtees and some others.

As seen in Ecurie Bonnier colors below.

Posted Image


Posted Image

Edited by ANM, 17 December 2009 - 23:36.


#114 petestenning

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Posted 18 December 2009 - 07:05


This is from my thread on 10/10ths




As my other post lists my research request for information on the Lola T70 MK3B i will now add my LolaT70 MK3 Coupe.

SL73/101 67 Racing car show vehicle, this car was used to homologate the T70 into Group 4. Surtees/Hobbs fitted with Aston Martin engine.
SL73/101-Ecurie Bonnier 68/Jim Beach 69 'Now Chevy engined'
SL73/102-Sid Taylor68, 69/ John Woolfe Racing 69
SL73/103-John Mecom
SL73/104-John Mecom
SL73/105-Mike De Udy69/David Prophet 69
SL73/106-John Mecom
SL73/107-John Mecom
SL73/108-John Mecom
SL73/109-John Mecom
SL73/110-Carl Hass/John Mecom
SL73/111-Yongue Rosqvist (Sweden) 67
SL73/112-Epstein/Hawkins
SL73/113-Max Wilson fitted BRM engine
SL73/114-John Mecom
SL73/115-Carroll Shelby
SL73/116-to Japan
SL73/117-James Garner
SL73/118-Schmidlin-Wanger
SL73/119-USA/ Peter Revson?
SL73/120-Carl Hass
SL73/121-Team Surtees 'Aston Engine' 67 Entered by Lola Cars/Jackie Epstein 68 'Chevy engine'
SL73/132-Sports cars unlimited Paul Hawkins/Ulf Norinder 68
SL73/134-Sid Taylor Racing 68/Tech-speed Racing , Chris Craft/Eric Liddell 69
SL73/132

Its not up to date as we know that some cars have morphed into 2 sometimes 3 cars , lol.

I have recieved little in the way of updates toe the MK3 T70'S BUT HAVE had more luck with the MK3B'S.


chassis no team sold to or used by
SL76/134 Tech Speed Racing
SL76/138 Sid Taylor Racing
SL76/139 Penske 'Daytona 69 Winner'
SL76/140 Penske 'Spare Car'
SL76/141 Sportscars Unlimited of Switz.
SL76/142 Paul Hawkins Racing LTD[written off at oulton park 69]
SL76/143 Ecurie Bonnier
SL76/144 Team Elite
SL76/145 Scuderia Filipinetti
SL76/146 John Woolfe Racing
SL76/147 Louis Morand/Alan Minshaw 08
SL76/148 Picko Troberg via Joachim Bonnier/Avalon Racing'Barrie Smith'/ Chris Beighton 08
SL76/149 Grand Bahama Racing Car Co./Wayne Park/Bob Sherrard07 AUS
SL76/150 David Piper Autoracing
SL76/151 Scuderia Filipinetti
SL76/152 Jacques Rey
SL76/153 A& J Motors Chadwell Heath

Some of these cars were possibly written off in accidents, have they been rebuilt?, Paul Hawkins car for example. And if so did they retain their original chassis no.?

If anyone can fill in any further gaps I would be grateful.

The following are the Continuation cars as know by me at present.


HU76/159 David Coplowe.GB
HU76/160 Esmond Smith.GB
HU76/161 Pat?Hobart .USA.
HU76/162 Eduardo Davilla.ESP
HU76/163 Steve Tandy.GB


#115 Alfie

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Posted 18 December 2009 - 09:30

Apologies for going slightly off topic but I have to confess to reading this thread with a tear in the corner of my eye, as it brought back a flood of boy to man formative experiences. And there is a loose association with the thread.

Growing up within earshot of Silverstone we would often here cars testing mid-week and just jump on our bicycles to go and see who it was.

And on this day, perhaps February half term, we found John Surtees in a MkII T70 testing prior to going off to Can-Am and David Hobbs in the F2 BMW engined car. Parked on the outside of the circuit at Abbey we had full access to everything that was going on that day. Would that have been 1967?

If so, it fits with my having already seen Denny Hulme achieve the first 120mph lap around Silverstone in Syd Taylor's Lola the previous year during practice for the Daily Express. A lovely photo of his MkIII confirmed a suspicion that I had when I saw a renovated Syd Taylor car - the original green stripe was a BRG not an emerald green.

Peter - wasn't there a Swede by the name of Ulf Norinder who drove a blue and yellow Mk III? Always smiling as I recall.

Eric Hauser and Skip Scott both came over to England for the Martini Trophy - again IIRC it was 1967 a year of torrential rain even by Martini Trophy standards. I remember Hauser because he drove wearing a hooped rugby shirt -white and mauve? And Skip Scott had such a cool name!!

Lola were to play a big part later on, in 1972, when I was asked to go to Le Mans with a Lola customer - Jo Bonnier. Although that year was remembered for all the wrong reasons, I have never lost my love for sports cars and Le Mans in particular, and eventually led to my working in Motor Sport up till now.

Time to dry the eyes and get back to work!

Edited by Alfie, 18 December 2009 - 09:35.


#116 Tomas Karlsson

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Posted 18 December 2009 - 10:25

Jo Bonnier got his first T70 (101) from Surtees and sold it to David Prophet.

"Sportscars Unlimited" were the Norinder cars.

Rosqvist's name was Yngve. He was the first Swedish T70 owner. (His first wife were quite fast BTW. Her name was Evy.)

Picko Troberg had two cars! Both were crashed. Now figure that out....

#117 RA Historian

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Posted 18 December 2009 - 14:06

Hello all!
I have an enquiry about a Lola T70 Mk. 3 SL73/101. This looked like a very likely place to continue my research.
Anyone know it's history and where it might be today?
I would be grateful for any help or leads on this car which I believe was owned and raced by Jo Bonnier, John Surtees and some others.

As seen in Ecurie Bonnier colors below.

Posted Image


Posted Image

I notice that the bodywork is different on these two cars. The first photo shows it with T-73 front bodywork, while the second photo has it with T-76 bodywork. Same car with different bodywork, or two different cars with same livery?
Tom

#118 RA Historian

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Posted 18 December 2009 - 14:14

The trouble with tracing Lola T-70s in the States is that in the 65-67 years the importer was John Mecom. As a result, Mecom's name is listed multiple times as the first owner. While he did, of course, keep a couple cars to race with his team, the rest were all pass throughs to the actual purchaser.

I have not seen any of Starkey's updates to his earlier Lola T-70 books so I cannot comment as to the accuracy of his tracings. The first book was, shall we say, very basic in the chassis listings and as such not much help at all. For example, far too many T-70s had their history start and stop with Mecom, which was no help at all. I hope that his later works have more accurate chassis lists.

I find Martin Krejci's listing of Lola T-70s very helpful in tracing ownership, but of course, and I am sure he will admit it, that list is not fool proof. Over the years there has been so much chicanery practiced with chassis plates, etc., that the truth about many of these cars has been lost forever.

Over here I am constantly amazed at how many T-70s are around in Penske/Sunoco colors. All, of course, THE Mark Donohue car. I am sure that Roger is surprised at how many T-70s he apparently owned....

Tom

#119 Giraffe

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Posted 18 December 2009 - 22:19

I have not seen any of Starkey's updates to his earlier Lola T-70 books so I cannot comment as to the accuracy of his tracings.

Over the years there has been so much chicanery practiced with chassis plates, etc., that the truth about many of these cars has been lost forever.


I had the pleasure of meeting Lola Heritage Coordinator Glyn Jones at the F5000 drivers reception at the Oulton Park Gold Cup this year, and he and the young lady accompanying him from Lola almost hissed when I mentioned John Starkey's name.......

Glyn also told me that Lola issued Jo Bonnier with a series of T70 chassis plates that he kept in the draw of his desk, and shuffled and issued as required!!!

There has been much discussion on the Sid Taylor thread and elsewhere here regarding the legitimacy of various Lola T70s.

Edited by Giraffe, 18 December 2009 - 22:20.


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#120 petestenning

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Posted 19 December 2009 - 07:50

I had the pleasure of meeting Lola Heritage Coordinator Glyn Jones at the F5000 drivers reception at the Oulton Park Gold Cup this year, and he and the young lady accompanying him from Lola almost hissed when I mentioned John Starkey's name.......

Glyn also told me that Lola issued Jo Bonnier with a series of T70 chassis plates that he kept in the draw of his desk, and shuffled and issued as required!!!

There has been much discussion on the Sid Taylor thread and elsewhere here regarding the legitimacy of various Lola T70s.


That being true about the chassis plates no wonder we dont know which car is genuine or not , must make Glyn s job harder.
I have not met Glyn but hes has allways been very good comunicating with me when i have supplied Photos of Lola cars .

I suppose cars from this era were to easily mixed and matched from write offs and rebuilt on another chassis etc that with bent chassis and engines being seperated and ending up as the same car twice , lol



Pete

Edited by petestenning, 19 December 2009 - 07:50.


#121 Tomas Karlsson

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Posted 19 December 2009 - 15:41

Picko Troberg insists that the existing 148 is a fake, since he have kept the remains of his car from the Nürburgring crash. But he haven't explained what number the replacement car had. The car that was crasched by Ronnie Peterson and later sold to Barrie Smith. My suspicion is that they had the same number. Or is there anyone who has another explination?

#122 Giraffe

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Posted 19 December 2009 - 17:52

This is the info available on Barrie Smith's website:

http://www.frenchpix...lat70stats.html

Edited by Giraffe, 19 December 2009 - 17:52.


#123 Falcadore

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Posted 20 December 2009 - 04:20

I'll have to dig around for it but have some photos of the Australian T70. Lives in the same part of the world as me, so I see it from time to time at race meetings.

The owner, Rob Sherrard, is one of Richard Branson's execs with Virgin, Virgin Blue airline I think. Former Australian Touring Car Championship racer Wayne Park looks after it through his workshops in Milton. Sherrard built up a stunning collection quickly after his arrival in Australia. The T70 was his first big banger sports car, a GT40 followed, then a 956, since sold, then a 962, and most recent a Sauber C9. There is also a RS200 Escort, a Bizzarini, and one of the Garry Rogers Motorsport built 427C Monaros built for the Bathurst 24 Hour. The 962 I think is now in Europe for historic Group C racing.

Nice guy to chat to, is keen on making sure his collection is used for its intended purpose.

#124 petestenning

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Posted 20 December 2009 - 07:56

I'll have to dig around for it but have some photos of the Australian T70. Lives in the same part of the world as me, so I see it from time to time at race meetings.

The owner, Rob Sherrard, is one of Richard Branson's execs with Virgin, Virgin Blue airline I think. Former Australian Touring Car Championship racer Wayne Park looks after it through his workshops in Milton. Sherrard built up a stunning collection quickly after his arrival in Australia. The T70 was his first big banger sports car, a GT40 followed, then a 956, since sold, then a 962, and most recent a Sauber C9. There is also a RS200 Escort, a Bizzarini, and one of the Garry Rogers Motorsport built 427C Monaros built for the Bathurst 24 Hour. The 962 I think is now in Europe for historic Group C racing.

Nice guy to chat to, is keen on making sure his collection is used for its intended purpose.



Thank you for that Falcadore,

I saw the Sherrard/Park car at Brands Hatch a couple of years ago on a very wet day and was highly impressed with Waynes driving skill round the GP circuit in very wet conditions. I have allways been a lover of the T70'S since i was 16 and first saw them.
In my eyes the prettiest car ever made the MK3B, very nice aerodynamic wise for its time , just a bit suspect on reliability for some reasons head gaskets in perticular.


The sheer sound and spectacle of 6/7 on a grid in 1969 was a sight to behold , and with such prominent drivers as Brian Redman,Jo Bonnier,David Piper, Chris Craft,Paul Hawkins [sadly missed a few months later],Frank Gardner,Richard Attwood,Trevor Taylor.


#125 Giraffe

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Posted 20 December 2009 - 09:03

The sheer sound and spectacle of 6/7 on a grid in 1969 was a sight to behold , and with such prominent drivers as Brian Redman,Jo Bonnier,David Piper, Chris Craft,Paul Hawkins [sadly missed a few months later],Frank Gardner,Richard Attwood,Trevor Taylor.


Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-05-16

Paul Hawkins' Lola in the paddock at Oulton Park on the morning of 26th May, 1969.

Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-05-17

Trevor Taylor entering the pits as winner of the TT, shortly after Paul's accident.

Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-01-06

David Piper's T70 at the same meeting.

Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-06-26

More recently, Nick Linney's ex-Sid Taylor T70 MKIIIB (SL76/138) that Simon Hadfield assures me is one of the few truly original T70's still around, pictured earlier this year at Donington Park by myself, almost 40 years to the day since I captured it lurking behind Piper's car in the previous pic!

Edited by Giraffe, 20 December 2009 - 09:35.


#126 Giraffe

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Posted 20 December 2009 - 10:35

Hello all!
I have an enquiry about a Lola T70 Mk. 3 SL73/101. This looked like a very likely place to continue my research.
Anyone know it's history and where it might be today?
I would be grateful for any help or leads on this car which I believe was owned and raced by Jo Bonnier, John Surtees and some others.

As seen in Ecurie Bonnier colors below.

Posted Image


Posted Image


Martin Stretton had this car on display at the last Silverstone Classic, but I can't vouch for it's authenticity.

Posted Image
By giraffe138, shot with EX-M2 at 2009-12-20

Posted Image
By giraffe138

Posted Image
By giraffe138, shot with EX-M2 at 2009-12-20

Edited by Giraffe, 20 December 2009 - 10:42.


#127 Simon Hadfield

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Posted 20 December 2009 - 11:06

The car Martin Stretton had on display belongs to Michael Hinderer (spelling?) and is 73/115, bought from Frank Sytner who got it from Fantasy Junction in California and it was originally a Carroll Shelby owned spyder that was sold on (I think) for use in the 67 CanAm series. The car came to Frank with lots of bills, clippings etc that went back to the guy who put the roof on. Apart from the fact it is now a coupe not a spyder it was a very nice straight old bus. I would point out that obfuscation over the histories of these cars is usually more caused by the money involved rather than the difficulty in tracing the actual history!

#128 Nordic

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Posted 20 December 2009 - 15:37

The T70 was one of my favorite cars ever since Nigle Hulme raced his, he lived a in nearby village to me so I was always drawn to towards his cars as a lad.


This one was at the Goodwood for the recent test days, not sure if its the real thing, but it was very clean, maybe too much so?
http://rupert8766.fo.../p60850767.html

http://rupert8766.fo.../p60850766.html

Shaun Lynns smart looking example from the 08 LM classic
http://rupert8766.fo.../p51958507.html

Edited by Nordic, 20 December 2009 - 15:44.


#129 scags

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Posted 20 December 2009 - 22:51

how hard was it to convert a spyder into a coupe?

#130 Giraffe

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Posted 21 December 2009 - 11:10

Shaun Lynn's car at Donington last May....
Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-21
Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-21
Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-21

Chris Beighton & Jon Finnemore's car (understood to be ex-Troberg/Barrie Smith).....
Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-21
& also in 2008 at Silverstone......
Posted Image
By giraffe138, shot with EX-M2 at 2009-12-21
Posted Image
By giraffe138, shot with EX-M2 at 2009-12-21

Leo Voyazides car at Donington (ex-Wilson Fittipaldi).....
Posted Image
By giraffe138, shot with EX-M2 at 2009-12-21
Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-21

Nick Linney's car at Silverstone, 2008
Posted Image
By giraffe138, shot with EX-M2 at 2009-12-21
Posted Image
By giraffe138, shot with EX-M2 at 2009-12-21



A continuation car on the Lola stand at Stoneleigh 2008.....
Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-21

& at Donington in 2008 run by Steve Tandy.....
Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-21

Esmond & Andrew Smith's continuation car at Donington last year....

Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-21

Edited by Giraffe, 21 December 2009 - 11:30.


#131 Gregor Marshall

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Posted 22 December 2009 - 11:17

Chris Beighton & Jon Finnemore's car (understood to be ex-Troberg/Barrie Smith).....
Posted Image
By giraffe138, shot with EX-M2 at 2009-12-21


From some recently found files (whilst snowed in) and hopefully of some interest!!

This was one of the last T70s and was sold by Jo Bonnier to Picko Troberg. It was crashed very badly at the 1000kms at the 'Ring by Bjorn Rothstein and was re-built by Lola in August '69 and sold to Barrie Smith who raced it at Buenos Aries in Jan '69 (co-driver Ed Swart) and then raced again at the Kylami 9 hour in the November (co-driver Jackie Pretorious).

It was then converted to a road car in 1971 (which is probably why there is a reg number!!) and then bought from Mike Weatherill in 1974 by Richard Bond and converted back to a racer and was raced various times in '75 & '76.

It was then bought by Geoffrey Marsh in November '76 and raced extensively in '77, '78 and '79 before being rested for '80. In '81 it was raced three times by my late father, two wins (one at the Dubai GP) and one retirement. Unfortunately I'm not sure of it's life from '82 (Ray Mallock raced it as Geoffrey was building up a second T70) until Chris Beighton/GTC purchased it in '05 but David Piper owned it in the '80s.

There is some debate about the chassis number of this car though and has claim to two different chassis numbers due to the accindent at the 'Ring:-

http://www.ssij.nu/ringen.htm
(scroll down the page a liitle bit for the pics)

#132 Tomas Karlsson

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Posted 22 December 2009 - 12:07

From some recently found files (whilst snowed in) and hopefully of some interest!!

This was one of the last T70s and was sold by Jo Bonnier to Picko Troberg. It was crashed very badly at the 1000kms at the 'Ring by Bjorn Rothstein and was re-built by Lola in August '69 and sold to Barrie Smith who raced it at Buenos Aries in Jan '69 (co-driver Ed Swart) and then raced again at the Kylami 9 hour in the November (co-driver Jackie Pretorious).

It was then converted to a road car in 1971 (which is probably why there is a reg number!!) and then bought from Mike Weatherill in 1974 by Richard Bond and converted back to a racer and was raced various times in '75 & '76.

It was then bought by Geoffrey Marsh in November '76 and raced extensively in '77, '78 and '79 before being rested for '80. In '81 it was raced three times by my late father, two wins (one at the Dubai GP) and one retirement. Unfortunately I'm not sure of it's life from '82 (Ray Mallock raced it as Geoffrey was building up a second T70) until Chris Beighton/GTC purchased it in '05 but David Piper owned it in the '80s.

There is some debate about the chassis number of this car though and has claim to two different chassis numbers due to the accindent at the 'Ring:-

http://www.ssij.nu/ringen.htm
(scroll down the page a liitle bit for the pics)

As I wrote earlier: Picko Troberg kept the parts from the wrecked Nürburgring car and ordered a new. That new car was raced by Picko at Anderstorp in June and was then by Ronnie Peterson at Magny-Cours in July, where he won, and at Österreichring July 27th where he crashed the car. It was this second car that was repaired and sold to Barrie Smith. This second car doesn't seem to have a number, so my guess is that it got the same... in 1969.
As can be seen on the Nürburgring pictures, that car hasn't much left to repair.

Edited by Tomas Karlsson, 22 December 2009 - 16:10.


#133 Mark 13

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Posted 22 December 2009 - 15:49

The car Martin Stretton had on display belongs to Michael Hinderer (spelling?) and is 73/115, bought from Frank Sytner who got it from Fantasy Junction in California and it was originally a Carroll Shelby owned spyder that was sold on (I think) for use in the 67 CanAm series. The car came to Frank with lots of bills, clippings etc that went back to the guy who put the roof on. Apart from the fact it is now a coupe not a spyder it was a very nice straight old bus. I would point out that obfuscation over the histories of these cars is usually more caused by the money involved rather than the difficulty in tracing the actual history!


Perhaps we should invite all current owners to tell us their own cars history.
I expect some will be put off for the reasons you mention Simon. I am personally disappointed by the sketchy detail of the various chassis records published and (politics aside) suprised that Lola heritage are not able to produce a more comprehensive listing.
Perhaps it has not been done because most people are not sad anoraks like myself and are therefore not actually interested!


#134 barrykin

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Posted 22 December 2009 - 18:12

Here is a story on the 1969 24 Hours of Daytona, which was won by the Roger Penske-entered Lola T70 Mk IIIB driven by Mark Donohue and Chuck Parsons. The story contains many great pictures of the T70s...

http://www.sportscar...a-race-profile/

Posted Image


#135 BritishV8

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Posted 22 December 2009 - 19:06

Tom wrote:

Over here I am constantly amazed at how many T-70s are around in Penske/Sunoco colors. All, of course, THE Mark Donohue car. I am sure that Roger is surprised at how many T-70s he apparently owned.


Mark 13 wrote:

Perhaps we should invite all current owners to tell us their own cars history.


I can only comment on the history of one particular ex-Penske T70. The current owner of SL.73/126 is Bill Thumel. Bill drives his T70 in SVRA events - I've seen it at Road America, Watkins Glen, and V.I.R. - and last winter Bill graciously invited me to photograph the car at his Virginia Beach shop ("Abacus Racing"). I published photos of construction and restoration details here:
Bill Thumel's Lola T70 Mk3 Race Car, in 59 Large Photos

samples:
Posted Image

Posted Image

Personally, I don't enjoy researching, documenting, or even reading about provenance. Thankfully, fellow T70-owner Paul Wilson had already written a magazine article about all the previous owners of Bill Thumel's T70, and it can be read in the January 2009 issue of Classic Motorsports magazine. I understand there's another T70 owner somewhere who claims to own SL.73/126, but can't similarly document who owned his car through all the intervening years since Penske.

#136 MCS

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Posted 22 December 2009 - 19:15

Here is a story on the 1969 24 Hours of Daytona, which was won by the Roger Penske-entered Lola T70 Mk IIIB driven by Mark Donohue and Chuck Parsons. The story contains many great pictures of the T70s...

http://www.sportscar...a-race-profile/


Interesting stuff. If you click-through to http://www.flickr.co...os/smuckatelli/ there are some lovely shots from Daytona, Sebring and such like.


#137 Giraffe

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Posted 23 December 2009 - 15:54

Here is the Marc Devis / Gary Pearson T70kIII 5.7 litre Coupe at this year's Silverstone Classic........

Posted Image
By giraffe138

......and here's a T70 I photographed 40 years ago at the TT at Oulton Park.......

Posted Image
By giraffe138 at 2009-12-23

The TechSpeed entered car of Jackie Oliver next to Mac Daghorn's GT40. This is the T70 in which Chris Craft won the Martini Trophy.


#138 Gerald Swan

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Posted 23 December 2009 - 19:30

Perhaps we should invite all current owners to tell us their own cars history.
I expect some will be put off for the reasons you mention Simon. I am personally disappointed by the sketchy detail of the various chassis records published and (politics aside) suprised that Lola heritage are not able to produce a more comprehensive listing.
Perhaps it has not been done because most people are not sad anoraks like myself and are therefore not actually interested!



Um..... the reason Lola Heritage doesn't provide a more comprehensive listing is because I only list the cars that have been formally registered with me :). This applies to all the entries in the register except in a few cases where I have gone with the details from another authoritative source (:wave: OldRacingCar.com). This at least gives me the opportunity to speak with the owner and try and clarify any possible questions. The T70 history is enough of a convoluted mess without me adding to it by quoting "facts" I can't substantiate.

I have found that most owners (of all Lola types) are very happy to disscuss their car's history and are generally open to any new details that I can uncover even if it means that they find out their car isn't quite what they thought it was. Part of the idea of the Register is to put a car's history in the public domain so that people can comment on or correct details.

Regarding the tale of SL76/148, I have spoken to Barrie Smith about this and the evidence points to it being pretty much as Tomas Karlsson says below. Lola repaired the car after the original Nürburgring shunt and it was then returned a second time after Peterson's accident. According to Barrie there was some disagreement between Lola and Troberg on payment following the first accident so that when Barrie went to Lola to buy a T70 he was offered a new car with the engine and gearbox (both rebuilt) from the Troberg car and all the undamaged parts from the wreck as spares. It would seem likely that Troberg had retained the original chassis plate and that since the new car was initially being built as a replacement for SL76/148 (and it required a chassis plate) and effectively SL76/148 no longer existed Lola decided to use the same chassiss number again.

I have to emphasise that this is, at best, informed guesswork so shouldn't be taken as gospel. Lola's Glyn Jones has heard a similar tale so it would seem likely but I am only going to worry about it when the second SL76/148 is registered :drunk:.

I should mention the original damaged chassis which is still retained by Pico Troberg is being restored.

Gerald.

Lola Heritage

#139 petestenning

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Posted 23 December 2009 - 21:42

Many thanks Gerald for your reply, It does seem to bare out what has been said about the Smith car in previous posts.

From my own point of view seeing these cars race again whether they be genuine original cars or continuation cars and if you like second rebuilds from parts of one cars as seems to be the case often makes no difference to me . yo the owners and the cars, real value it of course does make a difference.

It is so good that the memory of these fabulas cars still can be seen on track is alone worth it, the prettiest of the Lola' s built.



Pete

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#140 RA Historian

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Posted 24 December 2009 - 00:52

the prettiest of the Lola' s built.

So, as we segue to the 'blood pressure' thread...
Tom


#141 Tomas Karlsson

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 14:25

Um..... the reason Lola Heritage doesn't provide a more comprehensive listing is because I only list the cars that have been formally registered with me :). This applies to all the entries in the register except in a few cases where I have gone with the details from another authoritative source (:wave: OldRacingCar.com). This at least gives me the opportunity to speak with the owner and try and clarify any possible questions. The T70 history is enough of a convoluted mess without me adding to it by quoting "facts" I can't substantiate.

I have found that most owners (of all Lola types) are very happy to disscuss their car's history and are generally open to any new details that I can uncover even if it means that they find out their car isn't quite what they thought it was. Part of the idea of the Register is to put a car's history in the public domain so that people can comment on or correct details.

Regarding the tale of SL76/148, I have spoken to Barrie Smith about this and the evidence points to it being pretty much as Tomas Karlsson says below. Lola repaired the car after the original Nürburgring shunt and it was then returned a second time after Peterson's accident. According to Barrie there was some disagreement between Lola and Troberg on payment following the first accident so that when Barrie went to Lola to buy a T70 he was offered a new car with the engine and gearbox (both rebuilt) from the Troberg car and all the undamaged parts from the wreck as spares. It would seem likely that Troberg had retained the original chassis plate and that since the new car was initially being built as a replacement for SL76/148 (and it required a chassis plate) and effectively SL76/148 no longer existed Lola decided to use the same chassiss number again.

I have to emphasise that this is, at best, informed guesswork so shouldn't be taken as gospel. Lola's Glyn Jones has heard a similar tale so it would seem likely but I am only going to worry about it when the second SL76/148 is registered :drunk:.

I should mention the original damaged chassis which is still retained by Pico Troberg is being restored.

Gerald.

Lola Heritage


I don't think the first 148 was repaired. Troberg told me that he ordered a new car from Bonnier and raced it for the first time at Anderstorp. If you look at the pictures from the Nürburgring shunt, it seems rather unlikely, that anyone would try to rapair it. At least during the 1969 season...
Look at the picture of the wreck and you'll understand:
http://www.ssij.nu/ringen.htm

The second car was not at all that seriously damaged. It was a pretty dramatic accident, but the chassis seems to have stood up well (it doesn't seem to have rolled or folded). Look at the pictures on this site:
http://www.motorsportarchiv.at/
Look at Zeltweg 1969 GT There are a lot of pictures from both sportscar races at Österreichring that year. And of the Peterson car in a ditch.

I believe that Troberg kept more than a chassisplate from the first car, but at the time it would seem ridiculous to even try to repair it. Nowadays you don't need much of to build a new one. But I do think that both cars are genuine.

#142 Giraffe

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 21:10

I refer once more to "Barrie Smith's Racing Times" website, and his take on it:

http://www.frenchpix.../lolastory.html

#143 Tomas Karlsson

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 14:44

Well, if that is correct, there have been three chassis number 148! It could well be true...
The only thing I don't believe in, is that the first PR-Lola, the one that raced at SPA, ever was rebuilt in the sixties. But now it is...

#144 Tomas Karlsson

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 19:24

The Swedish Illustrerad Motorsport wrote after the Österreichring accident: "... a broken damper seems to have been the reason for Ronnie's accident. It will be an economic blow for Picko Troberg, who now will have to pay 15.000 kronor to get the car rolling again. After that it will be sold, because Picko has lost interest."

In a report from the Nordic Challenge Cup at Anderstorp Sep 14th a Swedish magazine noted that Barrie Smith had bought "Picko's Lola".

According to Smith's homepage Peterson "rolled three times" and the car was a write-off. The pictures from Austria says something else...

#145 Giraffe

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 22:06

I copy here my post from the Sid Taylor thread regarding SL76/138, the Sid Taylor MKIIIB. Now this is one of the most traceable MKIIIBs, but it's history is circuitous to say the least.....

"Thanks Alan. A little further delving by way John Starkey's book reveals that SL76/138 was re-chassised in 1986 with a new tub from the works. The old tub was sold to Mike Ostroumoff & John Hunt who built up another car in 1987 which was raced in South Africa and then sold on in 1989.
Now somewhat complicating the issue, SL76/138 with the new tub was crashed comprehensively on 19th March 1988 by Mike Wheatley at the East London Circuit in South Africa, and the wreck and spares were sold to...... you guessed it!.... Mike Ostroumoff & John Hunt, who rebuilt the car on a new chassis..........

On that basis, there appear to be two Lola T70 MK3B SL76/138's about, both having had the original Sid Taylor tub at one time, but neither having it presently!!! The Lola T70 saga generally is at best, a complex issue!!!"

Every car can potentially have every component replaced at some point in it's life, tub included, but to me it's the spirit of the car, and to my mind SL76/138 retains that with Nick Linney.



#146 Giraffe

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 10:51

Here at the Silverstone Classic is yet another T70 MKIIIB that is regularily seen on the circuits, the green car of John Minshaw being overtaken by Nick Linney.

Posted Image
By giraffe138

I don't know the history of this particular chassis; I suppose I should have asked! :blush:

Here it is!!!

http://minshaw-racing.com/?cat=25

Edited by Giraffe, 29 December 2009 - 15:38.


#147 Giraffe

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 11:45

And yet another example....

Posted Image
By giraffe138

The Oliver & Grahame Bryant version chases down a Chevron B16.

There were actually 9 MKIIIBs, a MKIII & 4 MKII Spyders out in the Denny Hulme Trophy Race, so there are alot of T70s about.

#148 RA Historian

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 17:01

There were actually 9 MKIIIBs, a MKIII & 4 MKII Spyders out in the Denny Hulme Trophy Race, so there are alot of T70s about.

Which, I would imagine, comes as a bit of a surprise to Eric Broadley, et al, who must not recall building all of them...
Tom

#149 Giraffe

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 18:35

Which, I would imagine, comes as a bit of a surprise to Eric Broadley, et al, who must not recall building all of them...
Tom

I would go so far as to say that no truly authentic T70 MkIIIB exists Tom, but some are definately more authentic than others.............. :wave:



#150 RA Historian

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 22:11

I would go so far as to say that no truly authentic T70 MkIIIB exists Tom, but some are definately more authentic than others.............. :wave:

I fully suspect that you are right! Same with most Can Am McLarens and other Can Am Lolas.
Tom