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The book thread: In memory of Pete Fenelon


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#2451 f1lass

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 08:24

Ditto what Jack said

Carole

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#2452 bradbury west

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 14:07

I had the time to have a long look through the Darley Jim Clark Book last night, quite superb.

But, do not think that it is just a book about JC. It covers a vast number of the other drivers and personnel in that period with some quite superb photographs of the regular protagonists and also some who perhaps do not feature quite so regularly, with a good mixture of race shots and informal car/paddock stuff..
Highly recommended, but then I am a sucker for photo-books.. and for that period.

Roger Lund.

PS some good transporter shots, Bjorn..................

#2453 petefenelon

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 17:05

Picked up the Cahier autobiography on Saturday and am currently about halfway through vol. 1 (blame a stunning hangover on Sunday for lack of progress). The pictures are magnificent and the words are pretty damn good too - once you accept that although the pictures are history the words are autobiography. A great read, magnificent to look at, and full of people and stories. Well worth the money.

Also in the to-read pile is Bill Milliken's autobiography Equations of Motion - looks like this has loads about engineering, flying, the early days of post-War road racing in the States, and yet more engineering. A big book by a serious engineer and sportsman, definitely one for the hardcore gearhead who isn't scared of graphs and tables, but also seems very accessible to the casual reader.

Was a little disappointed by the selection in the museum shop at Brooklands this morning - 90% aviation and they didn't even have a copy of 'Bod's epic history there :( - still, good museum and definitely worth half a day of your time; the rather brash Mercedes temple next door, despite using part of the Railway Straight for people playing with little hatchbacks, has a few interesting pieces of kit in there, and a very good b/w photo exhibition about Mercedes racing in the 30s.

#2454 HDonaldCapps

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 19:28

Having had more than a few occasions to meet and talk with Bill Milliken, I can attest that he can make the completely opaque crystal clear to even someone such as me. Be advised that Bill still drives at one speed -- VERY VERY FAST, as I found out when he gave me a lift back to my car once upon a recent time. The book is nothing compared to getting it live and in person. Mr. Milliken is quite something, a fascinating person to listen to -- I learned more about certain aspects of aviation from him than I ever did during my flying days.

I finished the Cahier volumes this weekend and can still only marvel at the photographs. Cahier tells an interesting story and one that certainly shed some light on things I had wondered about concerning BC. Lord knows where it will finally end up since I am literally running out of room in my office at the moment and I can't do anything until other renovations get finished before I can do anything with my cubbyhole and the library at large.

#2455 bradbury west

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 19:29

[QUOTE]Originally posted by petefenelon
The pictures are magnificent and the words are pretty damn good too - once you accept that although the pictures are history the words are [b]autobiography. A great read, magnificent to look at, and full of people and stories. Well worth the money.

Also in the to-read pile is Bill Milliken's autobiography Equations of Motion - looks like this has loads about engineering, flying, the early days of post-War road racing in the States, and yet more engineering. A big book by a serious engineer and sportsman, definitely one for the hardcore gearhead who isn't scared of graphs and tables, but also seems very accessible to the casual reader.

QUOTE]

With you all the way on the Cahier, Pete. A top volume, or volumes.

I am surprised the Milliken book has not come up before, as it has been very well reviewed, albeit with its own special subjects.
I look forward to seeing a copy

RL

#2456 Vitesse2

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 22:46

A picture book which seems to have slipped under everyone's radar is "The Golden Age of Motor Racing" by Tim Hill (he of "Formula 1 - the unseen archives", which raided the Daily Mail picture library), published by Marks & Spencer (yes - really!) in 2005.

In a larger format than his previous book, this is a compilation of images from the LAT archive up to 1965 and is quite a high quality production on good paper, with good reproduction. Inevitably there are a few caption errors and transpositions, but the print quality is very good and not many of the pictures are the expected familiar ones.

I first spotted a copy of this on German eBay a few months ago and got one (again via eBay) a couple of weeks back.

It's not a Schlegelmilch, but well worth looking out for: perhaps significantly, there are no copies on ABEbooks, indicating that the print run might have been quite small.

(I saw what appears to be a German-language edition on German eBay too - same cover picture.)

#2457 petefenelon

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 23:45

Originally posted by HDonaldCapps
Having had more than a few occasions to meet and talk with Bill Milliken, I can attest that he can make the completely opaque crystal clear to even someone such as me. Be advised that Bill still drives at one speed -- VERY VERY FAST, as I found out when he gave me a lift back to my car once upon a recent time. The book is nothing compared to getting it live and in person. Mr. Milliken is quite something, a fascinating person to listen to -- I learned more about certain aspects of aviation from him than I ever did during my flying days.


Back in the days when I read engineering books for fun I ploughed my way through Race Car Vehicle Dynamics. It is phenomenally lucid, and large chunks of it still stick with me even though I am not and never will be a Mech Eng. type. A stunning book.



I finished the Cahier volumes this weekend and can still only marvel at the photographs. Cahier tells an interesting story and one that certainly shed some light on things I had wondered about concerning BC. Lord knows where it will finally end up since I am literally running out of room in my office at the moment and I can't do anything until other renovations get finished before I can do anything with my cubbyhole and the library at large.


I was reading Vol. 1 on the train up from London tonight and was getting a lot of people peering over my shoulder. It is truly gorgeous, and casts a lot of different light on some of the racing politics of the 50s and 60s. It's always good to hear people from outside the Anglophone racing tradition telling their stories; there are different sets of heroes and villains and a very different perspective. Did Jabby Crombac ever finish an autobiography? Has Johnny Rives ever had a go? (I've got Rives/Moity/Flocon's very large French-language history of F1, which is a book that really should be translated into English if only for its different perspective on the French drivers of the 60s and 70s).

#2458 Barry Boor

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 10:29

The book Vitesse mentions has been on sale at Woolworth's in Bangor for about sixpence ha'penny!

I agree, for the price it's not at all a bad tome.

#2459 Bjorn Kjer

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 10:45

:clap: Please Barry , buy me one copy and send it ! Please!

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#2460 petefenelon

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 11:44

I had a look at "Unraced: F1's Lost Cars" this weekend and I'm afraid I think it's missed the point a bit, concentrating too much on 'low hanging fruit' that's been well-documented in the mainstream press. There's some insight in the case of Dome, DAMS and Honda, and a few nuggest in Premier 1 GP, but the rest of it you could piece together from the news columns of the mags. Not much text. Nicely illustrated though.

I'm probably far from being the target audience for this as my interest really isn't in F1 of the last decade or so; even though I think this was a good idea let down by lack of depth!

I'd much rather see a book that took off from where the epic Atlas thread on GP entries that never made it started -- perhaps trying to analyse and categorise the failures and look at them against the context of racing at the time they failed to appear. A longer, denser and more human book would have appealed to me a lot more!

#2461 Barry Boor

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 12:08

I don't know if it is still there, Bjørn, but I will certainly look next time I am in town.

The book does come up on Ebay fairly regularly.

#2462 Bjorn Kjer

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 14:01

;) Barry thanks, now I can sit back and hope! :smoking:

I did answer your question or comment on the transporter thread!

#2463 bradbury west

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 17:46

Originally posted by HDonaldCapps
The book is nothing compared to getting it live and in person. Mr. Milliken is quite something, a fascinating person to listen to -- I learned more about certain aspects of aviation from him than I ever did during my flying days.

.


I recall well his performance in the camber car at Goodwood 3 or 4 years ago, storming up the hill in the streaning rain, returning with sodden overalls, and at 89 years of age..... I noted the irony of the sight of him in the Paddock, wet through holding his holdall, which bore the make logo "No Fear". I sent him a photo of that and received a delightful reply. Brilliant man.

BTW Mick Walsh did a fine piece on him in C&SC not long after. Milliken was a fine driver in his time, 4WD MUIller IIRC, and was a founding father of Watkins Glen with a bend named after him, again, IIRC. I look forward to sight of the book.

Roger Lund.

#2464 Pils1989

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 17:51

Yes, the left bend just before the right one getting you on the village straight. Named in his honour as he went off big style in that bend.
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#2465 D-Type

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 21:25

Originally posted by Barry Boor
I don't know if it is still there, Bjørn, but I will certainly look next time I am in town.

The book does come up on Ebay fairly regularly.

There are two books with similar titles and content: Motor Racing the Golden Age by John Tennant, ISBN: 1844032035, which I think is the book Barry is talking about and there is The Golden Age of Motor Racing by Tim Hill, ISBN 1844613798 which is the Marks and Spencer one that Vitesse 2 is referring to. I have had a browse through the first one in the shops and it looks a good selection and fair value at tthe discounted price. I have the second one and the number of glaring errors is far fewer than Tim Hill had in Formula 1 The Unseen Archives .

#2466 jarama

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 22:10

I've John Tennant's "Motor Racing The Golden Age" and fully agree with D-Type: a selection of fine b/w pictures @ a good price. Highly recommanded!


Carles.

#2467 Barry Boor

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Posted 08 May 2007 - 22:54

Ooops! I just read Vitesse's post again - I'm afraid I picked up on the wrong title.

It was the Unseen Archives that I saw in Woolworth's and the one that I have. Not the other book.

Sorry! :blush:

#2468 D-Type

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Posted 09 May 2007 - 07:58

Don't get me wrong. Unseen Archives is still worth getting if the price is right. The caption errors can be mildly irritating, but no more than that. The book is for enjoyment and does not make any claim to be history.

#2469 philippe charuest

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Posted 10 May 2007 - 16:46

Originally posted by jarama
I've John Tennant's "Motor Racing The Golden Age" and fully agree with D-Type: a selection of fine b/w pictures @ a good price. Highly recommanded!


Carles.

me too, its a very amazing and very unusual choice of pictures, that book is really one of kind

#2470 FLB

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Posted 11 May 2007 - 15:11

Originally posted by philippe charuest
me too, its a very amazing and very unusual choice of pictures, that book is really one of kind

I want a print of that shot of Donald Campbell with Mr. Wopppit! :love:

#2471 Rob29

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Posted 11 May 2007 - 15:50

Originally posted by jarama
I've John Tennant's "Motor Racing The Golden Age" and fully agree with D-Type: a selection of fine b/w pictures @ a good price. Highly recommanded!


Carles.

Somehow I seem to be in possesion of 2 copies of this book.If anyone is interested one is spare. :)

#2472 VWV

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Posted 12 May 2007 - 13:47

Regarding Bill Milliken's autobiography Equations of Motion, at the IMRRC website you can now download a 53 minute, 6.3 mb MP3 file of Bill Milliken talking at the IMRRC about his experiences and his book.

Web section link http://www.racingarchives.org Go to the Center Conversations tab

Direct link

I like the idea of the IMRRC having downloadable files of the monthly talks they have there, as I can't attend each one in person. I was there in March for the talk on the Mark Donohue Indy Eagle.
I promise to post pictures I took of the car as soon as I finish my move to a new home.

#2473 bradbury west

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Posted 12 May 2007 - 18:01

I believe Mr Milliken is back at Goodwood next month with the Camber Car at the Festival. be sure to see him and the car. Photos available from last time if anyone e mails me, and I will reduce the file size

Roger Lund.

#2474 sterling49

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Posted 13 May 2007 - 11:34

Just had an e-mail alert from Amazon regarding the forthcoming release of "The Ford Cosworth DFV, The Inside Story" priced at £16.50, anyone know anything about this book? Written by Andrew Noakes, opinions would be gratefully received before I click the dreaded mouse!!!!

Sterling

#2475 KJJ

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 15:41

Having recently picked up a copy of Bette Hill's book I was wondering if any other wives, girlfriends or family members had put pen to paper.....if not a book perhaps a magazine article?

#2476 petefenelon

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 16:19

Originally posted by KJJ
Having recently picked up a copy of Bette Hill's book I was wondering if any other wives, girlfriends or family members had put pen to paper.....if not a book perhaps a magazine article?


Virginia Williams, A Different Kind of Life. Really concentrates mostly on life with Frank after the accident but does show how driven a man he was in the very early days of 'Wanker Williams'.

#2477 Allan Lupton

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 16:19

Originally posted by KJJ
Having recently picked up a copy of Bette Hill's book I was wondering if any other wives, girlfriends or family members had put pen to paper.....if not a book perhaps a magazine article?

Didn't Alice Caracciola?

#2478 KJJ

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 16:49

Thanks for these replies.

I completely forgot about Elly Beinhorn's Rosemeyer book even though I've got a copy of the Chris Nixon update :blush:

Any more known about the Alice Caracciola book?

#2479 ensign14

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 16:50

Originally posted by KJJ
Having recently picked up a copy of Bette Hill's book I was wondering if any other wives, girlfriends or family members had put pen to paper.....if not a book perhaps a magazine article?

Adriane Galisteu on Senna. One of the better books on Senna, in fact, although that just reveals how much shite has been written about him.

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#2480 bradbury west

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Posted 14 May 2007 - 19:48

And Bira's wife wrote about B Bira.

Roger Lund.

#2481 RA Historian

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 00:15

Originally posted by ensign14

Adriane Galisteu on Senna. One of the better books on Senna, in fact, although that just reveals how much shite has been written about him.

Shite?

#2482 petefenelon

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Posted 15 May 2007 - 01:25

Originally posted by RA Historian
Shite?


See under Rubython, T.

#2483 HDonaldCapps

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Posted 16 May 2007 - 22:47

An item of perhaps some interest to a few: Jean-Pierre Melville's "L'Armee des Ombres/Arny of Shadows" has been released on DVD by Criterion here in America.

#2484 Bjorn Kjer

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 17:08

Can that really be ? Can you name 1 book wich has F1 result (world championship) up till around 2000 + , wich apart from pos,driver,car,time, etc. tells the name of the :confused: TEAM ?

#2485 HDonaldCapps

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 17:49

Originally posted by Bjørn Kjer
Can that really be ? Can you name 1 book wich has F1 result (world championship) up till around 2000 + , wich apart from pos,driver,car,time, etc. tells the name of the :confused: TEAM ?


Sorry, I seem to have missed something here, but, yes, there were such books before the Internet came along and redefined everything.

#2486 Rob Ryder

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 18:12

Originally posted by Bjørn Kjer
Can that really be ? Can you name 1 book wich has F1 result (world championship) up till around 2000 + , wich apart from pos,driver,car,time, etc. tells the name of the :confused: TEAM ?

Grand Prix Data Book by David Hayhoe and David Holland (Duke) seems to do a reasonable job if it is only statisics that interest you. The only one I have is the 1997 edition but there is now a new version covering to 2005.

Personally I find that books covering a single year are more interesting ans give much more detail, Autocourse for example.

Rob

#2487 FLB

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Posted 19 May 2007 - 01:15

Originally posted by KJJ
Having recently picked up a copy of Bette Hill's book I was wondering if any other wives, girlfriends or family members had put pen to paper.....if not a book perhaps a magazine article?

Joan Villeneuve is putting something together about her family.

Lynda Johncock wrote an article about her husband Gordon in the 1982 Indianapolis 500 annual published by Carl Hungness.

#2488 D-Type

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Posted 19 May 2007 - 12:09

Originally posted by Bjørn Kjer
Can that really be ? Can you name 1 book wich has F1 result (world championship) up till around 2000 + , wich apart from pos,driver,car,time, etc. tells the name of the :confused: TEAM ?

Steve Small's Grand Prix Who's Who lists the entrant for all drivers. That's not quite the same thing as the Moss-owned Maserati is listed as entered by "Equipe Moss", "A E Moss", "Stirling Moss ltd" and "Officine Alfieri Maserati" although run by the same team. The entries in the Maserati name reflect the works support he was given, but could also be because some organisers would only accept entries from manufacturers.

BTW Does anybody know if a new edition is in the pipeline? One is overdue.

#2489 philippe charuest

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Posted 19 May 2007 - 17:26

and what about the big " formula one encyclopedia" of Menard, roebuck,Cahier and so

#2490 Bjorn Kjer

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Posted 19 May 2007 - 17:56

:wave: Thanks D-type , you are pretty close with the Small books , I am getting older because I have a 94 version. OK I shall have to go by drivers , but better than nothing. Getting older is no problem for me , but not being able to explain clearly what I looked for make me feel worse !
Anyway , thanks all for tying!

#2491 petefenelon

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Posted 19 May 2007 - 18:06

Originally posted by philippe charuest
and what about the big " formula one encyclopedia" of Menard, roebuck,Cahier and so


A fun book but not one to take seriously as a reference. Though the lap charts seem to be OK.

#2492 Dennis David

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 13:35

My nephew said there was a huge box (Cahier) that came for me in the mail. Once again I have motorsport's version of the New York Review of Books to thank. :up:

#2493 Dennis Hockenbury

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 19:10

I also just received the Cahier book(s), along with "Life at Team Lotus" by Peter Darley.

The Cahier volumes are highly enjoyable. So much so, the Darley book will have to wait for a bit.

#2494 HDonaldCapps

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Posted 23 May 2007 - 19:50

I have managed to find and read "Gold Thunder" by Rex White -- the book being a victim of our (still) on-going renovations since I returned. Another one of those books hard to define, as autobiographies -- and biographies in general -- usually are.

Having said that, I did like the book, perhaps in great part because of knowing the era and the tracks fairly well, as well as having seen him race many times. It does an excellent job of laying out that certain level of craziness that made these folks continue to race when they often had problems paying for their next meal. It is a stark reminder as to just how much racing, especially in the NASCAR ranks, has changed.

I was always a bit mystified by White's somewhat abrupt disappearance from the racing scene. In 1965 he was still doing well in the highly-competitive Sportsman Division, which was chock full of talent those days, especially in the Carolinas and Eastern Georgia (Augusta and Savannah in particular). The book helped explain that to me, ending that minor mystery.

As ever, the stories are good, but they also provide insight into just how driven and competitive these men were. When I was re-introduced to stock car racing when we returned after our years in Europe, I was initially a bit puzzled by it, but after falling in with several like Rex White, I found that the similarities were far more numerous than the differences when comparing the racing I had experienced over the past seven plus years with what I was now in the middle. I found that I loved both types of racing and still think how lucky I was to get plunked down where we did.

On page 190, White writes, "Racing was and still is a demonstration of showmanship. Race fans expect and are willing to pay for a really good show." I think that this is something that is often trivialized, ignored, downplayed or even scorned when it comes to discussions concerning this point. Or, perhaps, it is considered "bad form" to actually think of racing as "show" and worse to actually enjoy it on those terms.

But, I digress....as usual.

Well, I always had high regard for White and his gold Chevrolet with the red number "four" on it was certainly a crowd favorite. I regret that I never realized that White lived in Fayetteville, Georgia, since I was stationed at US Forces Command at Fort McPherson at one point and we lived in what we used to call the "Jonesboro-Lovejoy-Hampton Metroplex" -- our house being within a VERY short distance from the track. We used to pass through Fayetteville on our way to Peachtree City to attend church or visit friends all the time.

Not for everyone, but certainly worth the time to take the effort and get a sense as to why, although while NASCAR is largely scorned and loathed here, it has such a hold on some of us.

Gold Thunder: Autobiography of a NASCAR Champion
Rex White with Anne B. Jones
Jefferson, NC: McFarlane, 2005
ISBN 0-7864-1975-X

#2495 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 25 May 2007 - 02:43

I just received my copy of Ferrari Gauld Mine and while it looks like an interesting read the quality of photo reproduction is quite disappointing, especially in a book of this price.

Jack

#2496 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 26 May 2007 - 20:46

There's a very nice (if somewhat superficial) review of The Grand Prix Saboteurs in today's Financial Times.

Jack

#2497 David McKinney

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Posted 26 May 2007 - 21:36

Also reviewed in today's Daily Telegraph
http://www.telegraph...5/26/mfgp26.xml

#2498 FLB

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Posted 26 May 2007 - 22:40

The Grand Prix Saboteurs was also plugged by Bob Varsha during SpeedTV's Monaco practice on Thursday.

#2499 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 26 May 2007 - 22:52

Originally posted by David McKinney
Also reviewed in today's Daily Telegraph
http://www.telegraph...5/26/mfgp26.xml


Thanks, David. That is a more thorough review.

Jack

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#2500 RA Historian

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Posted 28 May 2007 - 02:19

I am about three quarters of the way through Bernard Cahier's book. While the anecdotes and the photos are very entertaining, two things about it are a bit troubling.

The first is that it is apparent that Cahier relied on his memory rather than research for a lot of the racing items. There are just way too many errors as to time, place, and events. Two such examples: Bernard writes that Rindt's Monaco win in 1970 was his first; he states that for the 1966 season Richie Ginther was let go by Ferrari. There are many more of like ilk. Not to be overly critical, but it is my supposition that he composed the text on memory, as mentioned above.

Secondly, and this is certainly no fault of M. Cahier, is the continuing level of sadness that permeates the book as every year (n.b.: I have read through 1970 thus far) brings heart rending mentions of many, many friends lost to racing accidents. The roll call of the departed just leaves me with a melancholy sense of sadness and loss. I have to feel sympathy for Bernard, as it must be difficult indeed to have to say goodbye to so many friends, so often. I know that on this forum we are supposed to be relishing the "old days", and indeed many posts on this forum from some members keep up a drumbeat of criticism of racing today. But....how good were the "good old days" when the risk was great that any given race would cost the life of yet another driver? I do not know about you, but it certainly makes me appreciate carbon fiber, roll hoops, nomex, the HANS device, and so many life saving devices that we take for granted today.

But enough of that. The photos in the Cahier book are great. Some fantastic race shots, and many paddock shots and photos of drivers at ease off the track that give a very human element to be enjoyed. Enjoy the pictures, ignore the errors, mourn those whom we have lost, and enjoy vicariously the life of Bernard Cahier, who had the good fortune to have been able to do for a living what the rest of us could only remotely wish for.
Tom