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Richie Ginther: what happened?


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#301 Jerry Entin

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 19:10

ginther625trcBBDVonNeumannFerPSNov57A_zp

Richie Ginther unloading John Von Neumann's Ferrarit at Palm Springs airport in 1957


photo Kurt Zimmerman collection.


Edited by Jerry Entin, 15 December 2014 - 06:34.


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#302 Jerry Entin

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Posted 10 November 2008 - 21:17

gintherEnzoFerrariandRitchieGintheratIta

Richie Ginther and his Boss Enzo Ferrarithis is from 1960

 

Richie Ginther was inducted into the Motorsports Hall of Fame of America this past August. The Hall of Fame is located in Novi, Michigan. Here is what they said about Richie at the induction:

Richie Ginther started his driving career in 1951 and competed in Mexican Road Races, LeMans and in Formula 1. He was a factory driver for Ferrari and BRM. In 1965, he took Honda to the winner’s circle for the first time in F1 at the Mexican Grand Prix.
He retired from driving in 1967 and passed away in 1989.

photo Kurt Zimmerman collection.


Edited by Jerry Entin, 18 December 2014 - 00:55.


#303 Jerry Entin

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Posted 24 November 2008 - 00:47

Posted Image
March Air Force base races July 1954
Phil Hill is inside his Ferrari 375MM and Richie Ginther working on the front end.


photo Mark Savory collection.

#304 PortlandRaceFan

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Posted 24 November 2008 - 03:01

Originally posted by Jerry Entin
Posted Image
This is Richie Ginther at Riverside in 1966 for a private Honda test.
Ronnie Bucknum was also at this test. It was the new V-12 Honda 3 liter Formula One car.

photo lent site Davey Jordan - scanned for site Norma Jordan


I was at that test. Ronnie Bucknum was a neighbor and friend and I rode out in his new GT350. Ginther and Bucknum took me to lunch but made it a race to lunch by Ginther taking one freeway and Ronnie taking another. When thee freeways joined it was a near dead heat. And I still remember looking out the back as we four wheel drifted at the offramp.

One other thing I remembered from the test was the fact that they changed every plug after every on track session. Only decades later did I figure out that plugs provided the best data on engine performance. Data acquisition has come a long way.

That pic was memorable to me. Thanks.

#305 Jerry Entin

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 00:34

Posted Image
Richie Ginther in Porsche leading John Von Neumann
This is at turn 2 at the Santa Barbara Airport, also known as Goleta.

photo Bill Tibbetts collection - copyright 2008 Bill Tibbitts.

#306 Jerry Entin

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Posted 15 December 2008 - 09:38

Posted Image
Richie Ginther in Porsche at Santa Barbara.
This is from May of 1957.

photo Bill Tibbitts - copyright 2008 Bill Tibbitts

See more of Bill Tibbitts great pictures at Tams Old Race car site:
http://www.tamsoldra...00Homepage.html

#307 Jerry Entin

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 00:24

Posted Image
Richie Ginther at Sebring in 1961



photo Dave Nicholas - www.barcboys.com

#308 Miracle Man

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Posted 16 December 2008 - 02:02

Those Honda motors were so damn loud they could not tell if all 12 were firing, so the Japanese mechanics would take a small squirt bottle and spray each one of the headers to see if the water boiled. Only after they were sure would they put the cover on and send the car out.

We watched this with total fascination at Watkins Glen.

Here is Ginther helping Pheel Heel at the Watkins Glen F Libre race in 1958.



Posted Image


And arriving with Hill in their Chevy. Race was won by Joe Bonnier in a 250F

Posted Image

photos from barcboys.com

#309 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 17 December 2008 - 00:08

Originally posted by Jerry Entin
Posted Image
Richie Ginther at Sebring in 1961



photo Dave Nicholas - www.barcboys.com


Ferrari 246SP, shared with von Trips. DNF. What a beautiful car.

Jack

#310 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 17 December 2008 - 00:11

Originally posted by Miracle Man
Those Honda motors were so damn loud they could not tell if all 12 were firing, so the Japanese mechanics would take a small squirt bottle and spray each one of the headers to see if the water boiled. Only after they were sure would they put the cover on and send the car out.

We watched this with total fascination at Watkins Glen.

Here is Ginther helping Pheel Heel at the Watkins Glen F Libre race in 1958.


And arriving with Hill in their Chevy. Race was won by Joe Bonnier in a 250F



photos from barcboys.com


Great pictures. Thanks.

Jack

#311 Jerry Entin

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Posted 23 December 2008 - 02:23

richieandGraham_zps1a082bd7.jpg

Richie Ginther and Graham Hill and Tony Rudd


photo: Kurt Zimmerman collection.


Edited by Jerry Entin, 16 December 2014 - 12:41.


#312 kzimmerm

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 19:39

For some reason, Richie seemed reluctant to tell his staff about his accomplishments in racing. None. Most of us knew he was very good at what he did, but only Harold (Richie's Chief Mechanic and Partner) really knew just how deep and varied Richie's background really was. In the 1970's, there were no books available on Richie Ginther, no internet, even few magazine articles. Even today I think we only know a small amount about him.

#313 Jerry Entin

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 19:33

Posted Image
Richie Ginther at Sebring in 1960.


photo Dave Nicholas - www.barcboys.com

#314 markpde

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 21:10

Doug Nye posted this photo (without comment) in the 'Porsche 917 with snorkels' thread - 1969 917PA, not Seppi - I suspect it's Richie Ginther?

Posted Image
Copyright: The GP Library

Richie was intensely involved with the development of the 917PA, altering and adapting the chassis settings to even out the tyre temperatures (Helmut Flegl, the Porsche engineer who worked on the 917PA with Richie, confessed that up until then Porsche had never even looked at tyre temperatures!), fitting trim tabs and spoilers to create downforce (the original bodywork was drawn by Tony Lapine, Porsche's chief stylist, and lacked downforce, although it actually proved to be more stable than the coupe and pointed the way to the revisions to the 917 at Zeltweg in October 1969 (there were two 917PAs - one stayed in Europe)), cutting slots in the tops of the front wings to reduce the air pressure in the wheel arches, and eventually completely reprofiling the nose - all done intuitively through experience 'in the field'. The photo is taken at a relatively early stage, with just the trim tabs, wheel arch slots and rear spoilers - either Bridgehampton or Michigan - by Laguna Seca the 917 had the chisel nose.

#315 Seppi_0_917PA

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Posted 08 March 2009 - 15:19

Originally posted by Seppi_0_917PA 14 Feb 2008
From Jeanne Beeching's "The Last Season" about the 1969 Can Am - Friday practice at Laguna Seca:

"Siffert and Motschenbacher had raced in Japan two days earlier and would not arrive in Monterey until the morrow—so Porsche team manager, Richie Ginther, shook down the Porsche 917PA—and as he took the Porsche out of the pits for the first time, he was cheered and waved at the whole length."

She also wrote that Thursday before the Riverside Can Am: "Siffert's Porsche 917PA had been fitted with a redesigned nose section and Richie Ginther drove the practice session to sort out the handling".

Has anyone ever seen a picture of Richie driving the 1969 917PA?

Thank you markpde for placing that photo here and for the details of Richie's involvement with the 917PA! :up: I think the photo is Laguna Seca, that looks like the Laguna Seca pit lane and the car is identical to this photo: http://www.vintagemo...T-LAGUNA/Detail

#316 markpde

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 00:38

Originally posted by Seppi_0_917PA

Thank you markpde for placing that photo here and for the details of Richie's involvement with the 917PA! :up: I think the photo is Laguna Seca, that looks like the Laguna Seca pit lane and the car is identical to this photo: http://www.vintagemo...T-LAGUNA/Detail

Cheers! Thanks also for the quotes from Jeanne Beeching's book - it sounds well written. You have Doug Nye to thank for the photo, though - as I was saying, he posted it on the other thread, without comment. Just noticed it wasn't Seppi behind the wheel.

Re. the location, I tried to figure it out from Peter Morgan's excellent book, 'Porsche 917 - The winning formula', which I should have credited for the info, but it suggests the chisel nose was fitted by Laguna Seca, and evidently it wasn't. I was going to ask if anyone recognized the pit lane but wasn't sure if there was enough of it to recognize, but you know the territory, and the photo you linked to is conclusive.

Edit - I've only just realised where you're coming from - I hadn't even seen your previous post! Fate!!! :D

Edited by markpde, 03 May 2009 - 18:27.


#317 raceannouncer2003

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Posted 04 May 2009 - 19:07

Posted Image
Richie Ginther in yellow Porsche


From Art Conner, current owner of the Platypus:

"...that's Miles (Gupton) in the Platypus. I'm pretty sure that's Hans (Adam) leaning on the roll bar and I'm bettin that Ann (Adam) can ID the other gentleman, and the track..."

Vince H.


#318 ZOOOM

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Posted 04 May 2009 - 19:13

The guy in the distance sure looks like Smokey Yunnik!

ZOOOM

#319 Buford

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Posted 04 May 2009 - 19:21

The guy in the distance sure looks like Smokey Yunnik!

ZOOOM


Yeah almost sure it is.

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#320 anthony says

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Posted 06 May 2009 - 00:32

The following quotations from the report of the 1962 French GP at Rouen in Motor Racing Year seem to sum up Richie Ginther reasonably well:

"Though 'Toto' Roche had been called in to provide one of his comic starts, he was late getting the cars away. There was drama on the line, as Richie Ginther found he was unable to get his BRM to fire after successfully putting in his three warming-up laps. When the field had streaked by, he leapt out, pushed the BRM to the pits, where a loose starter lead was refixed, and he got away about 3 miles behind the pack. Setting off on a lonely drive, he must have given little for his prospects. But this was to be an incident-packed race, and the Californian eventually dove into third place."

and later

"Third place went to Ginther, but not before a last-minute drama, for with about three laps to go the BRM's throttle cable broke off at the pedal. The quick-thinking Californian pulled back the outer cable, wound the inside round his hand, and finished the race controlling the revs in this way. A magnificent achievement, revealing much of this driver's determination never to give up."

I've no idea whether this report and incident are well known - apologies if they are, but I hope it is of some interest.

#321 thunder427

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Posted 06 May 2009 - 03:30

Jerry,in your post/Photo of Richie.is that Mickey Thompson in the light colourd Jacket ??????????..........regards427

Edited by thunder427, 06 May 2009 - 03:31.


#322 Twin Window

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 20:48

Posted on behalf of Peter Darley;

Posted Image

Posted Image

#323 Jerry Entin

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Posted 07 May 2009 - 23:10

Vince:
You are right. I didn't look at the photo that well when I posted it.

You are right as usual, thank you for the correction.

Peter: Great photos. Thanks for posting them Stuart.

Edited by Jerry Entin, 07 May 2009 - 23:11.


#324 Jerry Entin

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Posted 12 July 2009 - 23:22

Posted Image

Richie Ginther Team run 914 Porsche

photo Kurt Zimerman collection

#325 klemcoll

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Posted 13 July 2009 - 00:54

I remember an unforgettable lunch back in 1981 at Pierre Bardinon's estate when Pierre was hosting a French Ferrari club celebration of the 20th anniversary of Phil Hill's championship year. Richie, Phil and John von Neumann were siting together at the table with a friend of mine from Belgium who had put together a commemorative album of photos for Phil from 1961. The conversation was one of those once-in-a-lifetime sessions as Phil and Richie with von Neumann kibitzing talked about the personalities from their past who appeared in each image.

At one point, as we were all very well lubricated with Pierre's wine offerings, Richie told a story of his later BRM days when he had had a huge crash at Aintree, I think coming out of Melling Crossing in practice for the "200" in 1964. Richie made it clear that he had been very lucky to survive at all and that those who came to visit him in hospital were kind of embarrassed to find him alive. What a wonderful human being he was.

#326 Jerry Entin

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Posted 30 March 2010 - 15:26

gintherfamily_zps8d1f8e43.jpg

 

Dr. Bret Ginther and his wife Catherine and daughters Anna and Clarice

This was at the 2010 Legends of Riverside event. The Ginther family came to honor their father and grandfather Richie.


Edited by Jerry Entin, 14 December 2014 - 18:29.


#327 Jones Foyer

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Posted 30 March 2010 - 15:32

Posted Image
Dr. Bret Ginther and his wife Catherine and daughters Anna and Clarice

This was at the 2010 Legends of Riverside event. The Ginther family came to honor their father and grandfather Richie.


Cool. The family resemblance is there in Bret.

#328 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 30 March 2010 - 15:44

Great picture. Thanks. It's nice to know that Richie is being remembered.

I'll say again that I hope someone is working on a thorough biography while there are still a few primary sources around.

Jack.

#329 P0wderf1nger

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Posted 01 April 2010 - 08:53

I'll say again that I hope someone is working on a thorough biography while there are still a few primary sources around.

Jack.

Jack

Don't you see it? You're the man for the job. You're good with words, you know what it takes to research and write a biography, you're enthusiastic about Richie, and you're the right side of the Atlantic.

Go on, do it!

Paul

#330 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 01 April 2010 - 23:57

Jack

Don't you see it? You're the man for the job. You're good with words, you know what it takes to research and write a biography, you're enthusiastic about Richie, and you're the right side of the Atlantic.

Go on, do it!

Paul


Well, that's quite flattering :blush: , Paul, but I'm afraid I have neither the talent, nor the resources, nor sufficient time remaining for such an undertaking. We'll have to hope that DCN or someone else of his stature will see the merits in writing such a book.

Jack.

Edited by Jack-the-Lad, 02 April 2010 - 00:00.


#331 SKL

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Posted 02 April 2010 - 01:14

Micheal Argetsinger is done with the Donohue books... maybe he could do another... the Donohue book is priceless for all us Mark fans... as the owner of an original 914 (my first car which I still have) I remember well Ginther's work on the 914.

#332 drbooba1

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 03:20

[quote name='Jerry Entin' date='Jul 13 2009, 00:22' post='3743363']
Posted Image

Richie Ginther Team run 914 Porsche

photo Kurt Zimerman collection

I believe that is Elliot Forbes-Robinson, identified by the flowers his wife painted on his helmet she still did that a few years ago when he drove for Rob Dyson

regards



#333 Jerry Entin

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Posted 30 August 2010 - 12:08

richiestruck_zps634283b1.jpeg

 

Richie Ginther's Ford Ranchero
This car had a 429 Cobra Jet engine. It was called a 1971 Ford Torino Ranchero.
They called the hood scoop Ram Air and it was called a GT Model.

photo sent site Martin Blote
photo: Blote Family collection


Edited by Jerry Entin, 15 December 2014 - 14:19.


#334 coyote46

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Posted 30 August 2010 - 22:20

I just discovered these videos on youtube I beleive that richie's son brett posted them himself, They are old commercials Richie did for shell oil.
You can find them here Shell commercials
Enjoy!

Edited by coyote46, 30 August 2010 - 22:21.


#335 jj2728

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Posted 26 December 2010 - 18:36

Posted Image

#336 Ray Bell

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Posted 26 December 2010 - 21:24

That's one very good pic, jj...

Indy 1967?

#337 jj2728

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Posted 26 December 2010 - 21:28

That's one very good pic, jj...
Indy 1967?


Thanks Ray, yes my dad was there during the practice sessions.

#338 RA Historian

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 01:16

Has to be one of the very last times Richie sat in a race car with serious intent...
Tom

#339 Ray Bell

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 03:37

That's the Toyota 2000GT, which was mentioned on the first page of this thread, of course...

They became too valuable to keep, or if you wanted to keep one, too valuable to drive. A real shame.

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#340 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 04:40

Posted Image
Richie Ginther's Ford Ranchero
This car had a 429 Cobra Jet engine. It was called a 1971 Ford Torino Ranchero.
They called the hood scoop Ram Air and it was called a GT Model.

photo sent site Martin Blote
photo: Blote Family collection

I had one of those a few years back. Ranchero GT 351C 4v, FMX. Aircond power steering. Nice to drive but the rhd conversion screwed a few things up. One with a 429 c/j would have been a very rare beast.


#341 JKH

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 17:23

Posted Image

#342 chfrank

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 17:02

My family now owns the 914-4 E production car prepared for EFR at the Ginther racing shops. The car was raced in SCCA E-production racing into the 90's. We have restored the car and are looking for more images of the car and race results for riverside, willow springs, laguna seca, for 1972 Cal Club races and SFR races. Also images and results for 914 racer and second owner Pete J Sones, who raced in the Atlanta area in 1973-1978 with this car.

Thanks,
Chris

#343 Hse289

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 11:09

My friend Jim Sitz wanted to comment on this thread.

"Richie was actually invited to BRM reunion and suffered a heart attack after being lifted from the car for demo,,died few days later, sad.
Not in good health when invited,,only did few laps i think,..exhausted."



#344 Jerry Entin

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Posted 19 January 2014 - 00:57

pcc4.jpg

Here is a telegram sent to Richie by his friend Phil Hill after he drove a car with Disk brakes for the first time

 

Telegram from :Ron Kellogg collection


Edited by Jerry Entin, 19 January 2014 - 00:59.


#345 Paul Parker

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Posted 19 January 2014 - 18:45

Under rated and too often in a supporting role he was self evidently much better than his later GP race results would suggest, he deserved better than playing back up to others.

 

The other thing is this, people like Richie Ginther are irreplaceable, there are no latter day equivalents, alas things change, often not for the better.



#346 Gytis

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Posted 03 December 2014 - 14:21

goodyearad375x500ec0.jpg
Richie Ginther only ran Goodyear tires on all his Porsche's at his Culver City shop. Ginther Racing.
richiegoodyearbadge467xqj2.jpg
Richie Ginther with his Goodyear badge.
photos posted for Dave Nicholas

 

Sorry I'm new here and I understand this thread is pretty old, but how I can see photos that were here once ?



#347 Vitesse2

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Posted 03 December 2014 - 15:00

Sorry I'm new here and I understand this thread is pretty old, but how I can see photos that were here once ?

Jerry is still an active member, so I'd suggest you send him a personal message. Click on his user name on one of his posts and you'll see a link which says 'Send me a message'.



#348 EmilioC

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Posted 11 December 2014 - 20:13

The attached picture of a 914-6 belongs to a car brought to Mexico early 1973. Former owner states that Richie Ginther modified the car (per windscreen), and was bought from someone in Chicago who raced SCCA in 1972. Any  tips on finding records, images, or history? Thanks

 

 


Edited by EmilioC, 11 December 2014 - 20:14.


#349 B Squared

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Posted 11 December 2014 - 21:11

I'm not sure why this post was edited recently after fourteen years, but it still contains incorrect speculation about Richie's death. Doug gave us the facts back in 2002:
 

If I remember correctly, just recently Richie Jenkins had posted (it seems to have since been deleted) a request from a Ginther family member or friend that asked that some of the erroneous and hurtful (to them) information be redacted.



#350 Richard Jenkins

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Posted 11 December 2014 - 21:42

Cleo von Neumann did ask me for it to be deleted - I have asked Ray and Richard for the post to be deleted, but we've decided to keep it as it is as it shows that it is erronous.

 

She was more upset about Keir's assertion he had diabetes and that he became a freakish recluse. Richard kindly has deleted the vast amount of rubbish written about Richie so that this thread is more of celebration of what he was and not filled with rubbish about what he wasn't.

 

As for a book, Cleo would be happy to see it happen, but she's not sure there's the interest. I thought there would be but I haven't had any luck yet. I've asked DCN but not had a reply yet.