177 replies to this topic

[thunder427]

I keep sidetracking other forum sites, harking back to the"Good ol'e days of NZ motor sport which was very much 'run what yu brung'...the 'Allcomers saloon cars',and and Dear I say a bunch of so called 'Hot Rodded' sport cars ,it surely was a 'Golden Age' of 'do it yourself motor sport,there was a lot of 'backyard' talent in the 'Land Of The Long White Cloud',,,(Bruce Mclaren comes to mind !!) A FEW EXAMPLES TO GET THE SITE STARTED.. Tecmec/Healey Corvette/Zephyr Corvette/Anglia Corvette/Monza Corvette/silvesters''38 Chev coupe/Giff Taits '38 Chev Coupe/lets not forget the Lycoming Special with an aircraft engine that Jim Clarke actually drove when his Lotus Formula One car broke durring practise for the 'Wigram Grand Prix one year...so what happened to the Arthur Kennard Healey Corvette ?????????????????????

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by thunder427
so what happened to the Arthur Kennard Healey Corvette ?????????????????????

It raced on in the South Island for years - in 1966 (I think it was), when sportscar racing was going through one of its bad patches, Graham Smith was able to gain some good placings in championship rounds. Don't know what happened to it after that though.
Re the Lycoming, I think you're getting two events mixed up. Bruce McLaren drove it in the 1960 Lady Wigram Trophy after his works Cooper-Climax broke in practice. Jim Clark tried it out at Teretonga a few years later - just for the fun of it

[thunder427]

re. Lycoming Special,I stand corrected,!! its that 60's memory fog !!but its good to provoke/share some great flash back' moments with other 'blasts from ones past'...I remember the Healey Corvette in 'black and touquese blue,seem to remember it living in Timaru..am I close, perhaps in its later years

[David McKinney]

Yep, Timaru's good
From Kennard it went to Ed and/or Sid Candy (neither of whom was very fast)

[David McKinney]

I’ve been trying to remember the earliest NZ cars with so-called Corvette engines. I think Kennard’s Healey, which appeared late in 1957, was the first, but I’d be surprised if its engine was a genuine Corvette. On the other hand the Stanton-Corvette, which first raced at Wigram in 1960, might have been, as I think the Stantons had pretty good connections with the Californian hot-rod crowd.
The first so-called Corvette-powered saloon also appeared in 1960, namely George Dixon’s ’38 Chevrolet coupé, but that used a 1956 Bel Air engine bored out to 4400cc.
The next year Johnny Riley and Red Dawson had ‘Corvette’ engines in their pre-war coupés, Chev and Ford respectively, and over the next few years there were a number of other Auckland-based coupés - the Fords of Garth Souness and Glenn Jones in 1963, for example, then the following year Dawson’s famous Willys and Rod Coppins’s Chev. Tait’s South Island Chev had also appeared in 1963.
It was only in 1965 that people got around to dropping V8s into more modern cars, and we had the Coppins Zephyr-Corvette and the Morrari, as well as Colin Lumsden’s ’57 (?) DeSoto. Silvester’s Chevs and Doyle’s Anglia came along later again, not to mention John Miller’s frightening Renault Dauphine.
In single-seater racing meanwhile, the Stanton-Corvette had been joined in 1961 by the Tec-Mec, whose engine was allegedly (but I believe incorrectly) described as being ex-Scarab. This was the engine Coppins later ran in his Chevrolet, then in the Zephyr. The 1962 season brought us the Monza-Corvette in sportscar events, and also the converted Tec-Mec, followed in 1964 by another converted single-seater, the Stanton.
What have I forgotten?

[Bruce302]

Re the Coppins Corvette/Zephyr, I understand it went something like this.

The 1960 Camoradi Corvette, was wrecked in August 1960 in
sweden. The engine and gearbox were removed and stuffed into the team's Ford
station wagon and returned to Modena. The "remnant" car was abandoned to
the investigating officer, perhaps as tacit agreement to NOT arrest Bob
Wallace, the driver, for some sort of violation.
Wallace then assisted in putting the engine into a Maserati 250F, for
shipment "down under" to raise in a "run what you brung" series. The car
ran without particular success, because it was over-powered and repeatedly
crashed. It was finally purchased by folks who wanted to put it into GP
trim again, and the motor ended up with Coppins.

So the Coppins engine was definitely a Corvette, and a very significant one,
and not ex Scarab, but ex the Maserati 250F (The Tec Mec ?) courtesty Bob Wallace.

This is according to the current owner of the wrecked, but now rebuilt Camoradi '60 Corvette.

Bruce.

[David McKinney]

Yes, that's more likely
(..and I did say the Zephyr-Corvette engine came from the Tec-Mec)

[Ray Bell]

Being a born cynic, I once asked Ray Wamsley about the 'Corvette' engine in the Tipo B Alfa, installed after a succession of engines (Alvis 4.3s, GMC) had adorned the engine bay vacated in 1939...

He assured me it was definitely a Corvette engine. I'm not sure if I asked Lou Abrahams the same question. I would think the last rendition of the Maybach was definitely Corvette, however.

To label an engine as a 'Corvette' would have, in those days, been a popular pastime. The other Australian car that stands out is the Carter Corvette, but that's one I would expect was just labelled as having been a Corvette engine.

I would seriously doubt that the Ballot was Corvette powered... just labelled so.

[ellrosso]

Speaking of the Carter Corvette, I'm trying to track down a shot of it with Murray driving for his daughter. If anyone has anything please contact me on info@oldracephotos.com
We have a number of shots of the car on the website but not with Murray driving it.
Cheers,Lindsay Ross

[thunder427]

David and Bruce off the front row of the grid,'brilliant'this was the discussion I wanted to provoke...being 15 years old in 1960 and a dad involved in motorsport (in chch/NZ)with 'Route 66' on TV,staring a '62 Vette /Buzz and Todd,buying Hot Rod mags once a month (you had to save up in those days) anything with the word 'Corvette stired the interest( own 3 corvettes these days ofcourse)...so 'keep the cards and letters' comming...great stuff !!!

[Ray Bell]

You sure you wouldn't prefer a 4.3 Alvis?

I'm not sure, elrosso, but it's possible that John Ellacott has a pic of Murray Carter in the Carter Corvette... if he has you are certainly in luck!

[thunder427]

there is an 'Urban' myth regarding Rod Coppins Zephyr,Jim Clarke and the Wigram race meeting ,early 60's goes something like this:Jim clarke was electronically timed down the back straight at Wigram (reputed at the time to be the longest straight in the Southern Hemisphere/considering it was a runway of a fully 'commissioned' Royal New Zealand Air Force base,used two days a year(friday/saturdy) for the Tasman Series,with the Trophy being the 'Lady' Wigram trophy/cup) ,so the myth goes,at '136MPH in his Lotus Formula One Race car (British Racing Green comes to mind)so, durring Friday practice for the Allcomers Saloon Cars , Rod ,with the exhaust sticking straight out through the 'bonnet'of the MK2 Zephyr (like a 'Ferggie' tractor) was timed ,as the myth continues at a 'sparkling' 146MPH,upon returning to the 'pits its reported that after some consideration of the vehicle Rod was driving, Jim Clark walked over to Rod, shock hands and subgested "your a braver man than I am Gungudin"

[Bruce302]

(..and I did say the Zephyr-Corvette engine came from the Tec-Mec)

Indeed you did David, I thought the background of the engine was quite interesting. My early morning dyslexia.

If I remember rightly, the Corvette name held a lot more respect than a mere Chevrolet. But these were the day when the Corvette was usually more powerful than other Chev products.
There were many engines that attained the greater status by merely attaching the "Corvette" rocker covers.
Heck, if it said it on the rocker covers, it must be true.

If I can use some base language, the Drag racers had a lot of Corvette powered cars, from 100E Anglias upwards (is there any other way from 100E ?) I know that even today the Corvette name carries the same kudos, check out modern engine swaps using the LS series.

Thunder427, You'll know many of the cars from those old Hot Rod magazines.

Bruce.

[Bob Riebe]

Remember thanks to Duntov, the Corvette boys are the one who kept high performance going at Chevrolet.

The Holley 3310 "Corvette" of the 4150 series was the carb that really put Holley on the map, especially after it simply became the 4150 series 780 cfm model, without the Corvette connection, but the Corvette boys gave Holley the publicity, not Chevrolet even though Corvette was merely a Chevrolet with a person running the program who knew what he wanted and did what it took to get it.

[thunder427]

I think in all things Ford,Mr Chevrolet,Hi-performance, Zora Argus Duntov and I think maybe his brother..??developed the very famous Arden (Hemi style) heads for the 'flathead Ford of the 40's but it took Chevrolet to recorganise the 'Geniuse' of the man

[Bruce302]

I'm pretty sure it was Zora himself who was responsible for the Ardun heads (AR kus-DUN tov) and I seem to think he was somehow involved with the Frontenac OHV conversions on the Ford Model T engines.

Bob, quite right about the Holley connection, and it really was the Arkus-Duntov lead Corvette that was the leader of the Chevrolet performance push.
The Duntov cam as it was known was also a very popular upgrade.

Back to the racers, Am I right in remembering that it was the ex Coppins '38 Chev coupe that went onto be Ron Sylvesters car ?

What we need is some good old fashioned pics of the 'Vette powered racers.
I'll dig some out tomorrow.

Bruce.

[hiteknz]

Originally posted by David McKinney
I’ve been trying to remember the earliest NZ cars with so-called Corvette engines. I think Kennard’s Healey, which appeared late in 1957, was the first, but I’d be surprised if its engine was a genuine Corvette. On the other hand the Stanton-Corvette, which first raced at Wigram in 1960, might have been, as I think the Stantons had pretty good connections with the Californian hot-rod crowd.
The first so-called Corvette-powered saloon also appeared in 1960, namely George Dixon’s ’38 Chevrolet coupé, but that used a 1956 Bel Air engine bored out to 4400cc.
The next year Johnny Riley and Red Dawson had ‘Corvette’ engines in their pre-war coupés, Chev and Ford respectively, and over the next few years there were a number of other Auckland-based coupés - the Fords of Garth Souness and Glenn Jones in 1963, for example, then the following year Dawson’s famous Willys and Rod Coppins’s Chev. Tait’s South Island Chev had also appeared in 1963.
It was only in 1965 that people got around to dropping V8s into more modern cars, and we had the Coppins Zephyr-Corvette and the Morrari, as well as Colin Lumsden’s ’57 (?) DeSoto. Silvester’s Chevs and Doyle’s Anglia came along later again, not to mention John Miller’s frightening Renault Dauphine.
In single-seater racing meanwhile, the Stanton-Corvette had been joined in 1961 by the Tec-Mec, whose engine was allegedly (but I believe incorrectly) described as being ex-Scarab. This was the engine Coppins later ran in his Chevrolet, then in the Zephyr. The 1962 season brought us the Monza-Corvette in sportscar events, and also the converted Tec-Mec, followed in 1964 by another converted single-seater, the Stanton.
What have I forgotten?

Dave,pretty well what I remember ,Kennard won the sports car race at the 1958 Ardmore GP meeting ,George Dixon first with the Corvette engine in a coupe ,followed by the rest you have ,its hard to know how many were genuine Corvette engines at that time ,I remember one local guy that had a Corvette engine in a Hydroplane and another in a 1958 Chev 2 door car ,well he had one set of Corvette rocker covers anyway,a couple of other Chev engineed cars ,Corvette or otherwise were Kevin McGreal with another B4 coupe ,that Dave Simpson managed to collide with at the Matamata Street Race,Lyndsay Nielson came up to Pukekohe with a Chev engineed Mk3 Zepyr for the last Pukekohe GP allcomers race ,but it was a non-starter ,also I think the HWM sports car had a "Corvette engine in latter years

[David McKinney]

Wasn't McGreal's B4 an ex-Souness car?
My list only went up to 1965 - for no good reason. Neilson's Zephyr and the HWM conversion were after that

Bruce 302:
Yes, the Coppins Chev coupé went to Ron Silvester, but I think he only did about half a season in it before destroyig it at Ruapuna. The mechanicals went into the replacement which he raced for many years.

[hiteknz]

Dave,
No I think from memory Ray Olenius had the ex Souness B4 at that same time ,likewise the ex John Riley coupe went to George Bunce ,talking of George Dixon ,I think that the 6cyl Chev engine he had in the coupe before the Corvette went into the Chev coupe that Jack Nazer had ,getting of topic here ,maybe I had better start a new topic on the other coupes etc of that era ,any takers

[Bruce302]

Rod ,with the exhaust sticking straight out through the 'bonnet'of the MK2 Zephyr (like a 'Ferggie' tractor) was timed ,as the myth continues at a 'sparkling' 146MPH

146 mph in a Mk2 Zephyr takes balls.

maybe I had better start a new topic on the other coupes etc of that era ,any takers

I'd love to hear more about the allcomers.

Bruce.

[Peter Leversedge]

Re "Healey Corvette" I remember the late Arthur Kennard telling me that went he ordered the engine for his Healey he was told that if he like to wait for a few months they could supply a new engine which was larger than that the engine he was ordering and it would be 283 CI!!!!!

[David McKinney]

But did he wait for it?

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by hiteknz
Dave,
No I think from memory Ray Olenius had the ex Souness B4 at that same time ,likewise the ex John Riley coupe went to George Bunce ,talking of George Dixon ,I think that the 6cyl Chev engine he had in the coupe before the Corvette went into the Chev coupe that Jack Nazer had ,getting of topic here ,maybe I had better start a new topic on the other coupes etc of that era ,any takers

I'm a bit reluctant to keep this going when there are probably only two people interested, but...
When I was writing about McGreal's B4 I had a nagging feeling his car wasn't the ex-Souness. Presumably one or other of these went to Buster Bell?
George Dixon ran a Chev six after the V8 - that would be a more likely candidate for Nazer?
Another point, I always thought - but never knew - that Riley's 1961 Chev (bright red) was the Dixon (light blue) car from 1960. Do you know?

[David Shaw]

I am very interested David, it's just that I have nothing to offer being in nappies in the wrong country at this time. I am intrigued by all these circuit racing hot-rods in New Zealand that I knew nothing of.

[Ray Bell]

I don't know, David...

You could always dig up something about the 1932 Ford V8 roadster that ran at the opening Warwick Farm meeting... and other places.

[David Shaw]

With a flathead or a transplanted engine?

[Ray Bell]

I have no idea...

You might be able to tell when you look up the engine capacity in a programme. I doubt that it was a Chev, however.

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by David McKinney
I'm a bit reluctant to keep this going when there are probably only two people interested, but...

This remark referred to the specifics, not to the thread as a whole ;)

[Peter Leversedge]

Re the "Healey Corvette", yes David Arthur did get a 283 CI engine and someone asked of the fate of the car, well I understand it was wrecked beyond repair in a road crash but I stand to be corrected

[Peter Leversedge]

I am finding the thread interesting as my racing covered 1962 t0 2000 mainly in the South Island of NZ in cars mainly powered by V8 engines. Early on with Flathead Fords and later Chev V8s [ I don't think I have ever owned a set of Corvette rocker covers though ]

[thunder427]

the Corvette engine,"Mystical Status"..(I still have two sets of rocker covers!!)..I posted this 'ramble' on the Ken Wharton site re. the Monza/Corvette but I belive it belongs in this Forum,durring the 50/60's there was some sort a 'Import Tax' rort in New Zealand (consider at this time import duty on so called "Luxury Tax" was 'VERY' step )especially regarding the importation of engines,BUT...if it was for a boat (read: marine use!!) it came into the country at a 'VERY' low, (if not tax free) import duty,what made this concept interestingwas that a Government Offical/Inspector would have to'inspect' the installation of the 'said' imported engine actually fitted ('AND RUNNING!)into a boat,once this proceedure has taken place and all t's have been crossed,and as with any government dept.I's been dotted you were elligable for 'your' tax rebate.....that achieved,out came the 'CORVETTE" engine..WAM...straight into the race car,(there was a wonderful story at the time regarding Giff Tait and this "proceedure ,prior to his apperance at Wigram with his Chev'CORVETTE" Coupe,which he managed to roll coming onto the front straight,read:very very SPECTACULAR!!) you might say,"did these things really happen ??!!"I won't ask you to trust me ,but I will subjest that Motor Sport in those days was made up of some real characters,not so much about money,more about 'having a go'/competing,that was what got Respect!!

[hiteknz]

Originally posted by Peter Leversedge
I am finding the thread interesting as my racing covered 1962 t0 2000 mainly in the South Island of NZ in cars mainly powered by V8 engines. Early on with Flathead Fords and later Chev V8s [ I don't think I have ever owned a set of Corvette rocker covers though ]

There is photo of the type of covers I remember on the Ferrari Corvette photo in the personal photos of Australian Motor Racing topic,apparently there were a couple of variations in that era Optional engines in 1956 had 9 fin alloy valve covers, 1957 had 7 or 9 fin alloy valve covers, and the 1958 had 7 fin alloy covers on optional engines.

[thunder427]

I was at Renwick,an original'round the house' event,held just outside Blenhem (top of the south island/nz) the year that John Miler's Renault Dauphine powered by a 'CORVETTE',engine, installed finished the night before the race ,'black' paint job, couple of practise laps ,the a couple laps into the race...'bam/kapow'!!.into a lamp post,on the main straight (I think!!!)..come on more imfo of those CORVETTE/NZ days and ways...

[hiteknz]

[hen I was writing about McGreal's B4 I had a nagging feeling his car wasn't the ex-Souness. Presumably one or other of these went to Buster Bell?
The ex Souness ,Olenius car ,went to a local family ,the Harrison boys from Bombay ,never raced again,spent its life being thrashed around the roads



George Dixon ran a Chev six after the V8 - that would be a more likely candidate for Nazer?
Another point, I always thought - but never knew - that Riley's 1961 Chev (bright red) was the Dixon (light blue) car from 1960. Do you know? [/B][/QUOTE]
I have been a close friend of George Dixon since late 1959,I spoke with him on the phone today ,he has recently moved house and is busy but I am hoping in the next week to catch up with him and get the answers on the above ,also he has some photos which I hope I can post on here,Dave do you have any other questions for him

[thunder427]

In the mid 60's a fellow co-worker who had been on a 'ski' weekend confronted me about an 'alien'craft that had passed his car as he travelled back to christchurch along the Erwell State Forest (aprox 100 miles of concrete) highway in what could be described as Sunday traffic,a line of aprox 8-10 cars,my co-worker is 'captaining' a reasonable new 'Volvo' of the time...4speed.. (the picture is building!) being rather pleased with his choice of wheels and its 'locked away' performance, decides that an overtaking opportunity is at hand,applys the 'indicator',looks in the rearview mirror for the all clear ,only to spot an Anglia,(I should subjest at this point,he knew an Anglia, as that was his previous car to the Volvo) he went on to explain that the front wheels seemed to be sticking out of the front guards at a funny angle,so! commited to the overtaking manovour, down a couple of 'coggs'..on the 'gas'..passed three cars,pulls third gear,foot still hard down on the'go fast' pedal,glances in rearview ???? Anglia is still right there with him,ponders the thought "didn't go that fast when I owned one,as he engauges 'top' gear, he 'quickly' notes the speddo is reading 70 miles an hour (and still accelerating ) 5 or 6 more cars..."its still there !!" he complained..gets past car number 10, indicates pulling Left,merges,just as the Anglia pulls along side with a 'thunder' of exhaust note (read; VERY LOUD !!) engaging 'top gear' as he passes the said Volvo and 'blasts' in to the night... 'Wow'... was my remark , what colour was this Anglia ?? ,"a dark Green" comes the immediate reply," and it was full of wheels",I immediately have a mental Flash ..put two and six together and came up with...Oh !! don't worry I assure him that was Niel Doyle in his CORVETTE powered Anglia, I guess he must have been competing at the 'hillclimb' up where you were skiing, and was on his way home to Ashburton where he lives,, my co-worker thought for a moment,"good !!.. I was wondering wether I should have kept the Anglia" !!!...those where the days you could drive your race car to the event...on public roads..fun fun fun till they took our 'liberties away !!

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by hiteknz
I have been a close friend of George Dixon since late 1959,I spoke with him on the phone today ,he has recently moved house and is busy but I am hoping in the next week to catch up with him and get the answers on the above ,also he has some photos which I hope I can post on here,Dave do you have any other questions for him

I'll contact you off-forum

[hiteknz]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by thunder427
'thunder' of exhaust note (read; VERY LOUD !!)

It might sound crazy in these days of harsh rules and legislation,but in those early 1960's most of the coupes etc got driven on the road to and from events with the crudest of silencing ,or none ,you would be hung today for it

[Martin Roessler]

Hi,found a few pics of the Stanton Corvette from this year at Phillip Island...













cheers Marty

[David McKinney]

The Stanton started off as a front-engined single-seater (not pictured)
As it says on the tin, the rear-engined version was converted to sportscar spec in 1964
It ran with two different noses that I can recall - but the one on it now must be post-period
Oh, and Russell Greer raced it on the beach sans bodywork when he first owned it

[thunder427]

the Stanton,s didn't have the 'budget' for a Hewland rear gear/drive box so the improvised a"chain' driven rear,basically a CORVETTE style rear end,half shafts etc.(in principal !!) which can be seen clearly in those 'fantastic' photo's by Martin Roessler ,details/spec's being on thier 'Imfo' board

[Ray Bell]

Yeah, I've got some pictures of that rear end here, courtesy of Paul Hamilton...

'Corvette style'? Yes, but that was styled after the E-type or Lotus 18 anyway. And as for the 'world's first car using American V8 power'... what about the CERV I, and wasn't the Tucker rear engined?

[Peter Leversedge]

The front engined version of the "Stanton Corvette" was called "The White Elephant" by Charlie Stanton in later years.The first version of the sports/racer used the rear engine single seat frame widened at the cockpit to take two seats and after Maurice wrecked it at Waimate they built a new frame which was a sports car type frame

[David McKinney]

I never realised the post-Waimate sportscar had a new frame, Peter
Though it's perfectly understandable
My guess would be that some at least of the old bodywork was retained, but did it get its pointy nose at the same time? Actually, thinking more, I'm sure it still had the bulbous look when Geoff Mardon first drove it.

[Peter Leversedge]

Was the Tucker engine not a flat 6 air cooled aircraft engine???
Could we say the Stanton Corvette [ rear engine single seat version ] was the worlds first "Formula A" car???
The reason Stantons changed the car into a sports racer was that they [MANZ] made the Gold Star Series and Tasman Series up to 2.5 L engines which "outlawed" the car yet a few years later they went to Formula A!!!

[Ray Bell]

Indeed you're right... it was a six...

Unlike the Tatra.

[thunder427]

peter; it's ironic that NZ quite possibly has the largest concentration of 'Formula 5000' cars in the world...Small Block Chev/Corvette engine... the concept may have all started in a small factory by a railway yard in the back blocks of christchurch,( think Begg/England !!??) or is that like saying 'Russell Crowe' is a New Zealander !!!

[fredeuce]

Here is a pic of the Stanton Corvette published in Feb 68 ed. of RCN competing against the 4th Elfin 400 built by Gary Cooper.

Can any of the Kiwi folk add any information about this Elfin ?

I understand it to be slightly longer than the others. Also is it correct that it had a 396 Chev big block engine?

[xbgs351]

Originally posted by thunder427
the Stanton,s didn't have the 'budget' for a Hewland rear gear/drive box so the improvised a"chain' driven rear,basically a CORVETTE style rear end,half shafts etc.(in principal !!) which can be seen clearly in those 'fantastic' photo's by Martin Roessler ,details/spec's being on thier 'Imfo' board

It struck me as a Jag style rear end.

[thunder427]

xbgs351; trust you are young enough to bend down and look up a Corvette's 'skirt' and and you will see a rear end that looks very much like a 'Jag',now if you are in the USA and you looked up a Jags 'skirt' you may think it looks like a Corvette stlye rearend, Question; "which came first, the chicken or the egg !!??

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by thunder427
.....Question: "which came first, the chicken or the egg?"

This was covered in the post at the top of the page...