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Moto GP and general bike racing Winter Season thread


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#1 Atreiu

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Posted 08 November 2007 - 11:44

First of all, it's only winter up there were most of you live, I'm heading towards nice sunny summer days at Rio de Janeiro. :)
Second, I guess we can use this as our bike thread for now. The championships are over and this year class 'graduates' are:
- Moto GP: Casey Stoner;
- 250cc: Jorge Lorenzo;
- 125cc: Gabor Talmacsi;
- WSBK: James Toseland;
- AMA: Ben Spies;
- BSB: Ryuichi Kiyonari.

So, as winter and summer approach there is still a lot to discuss and review, not to mention the obvious testing results.

One interesting information I caught was at crash.net:

"The feel of the new bike is quite different both in terms of the engine characteristics and the riding position. From the outside it looks bigger - and it is a bit bigger but it's still OK for me," revealed Pedrosa. "I didn't focus on lap times today because the most important thing is getting familiar with the new bike and learning where we're going to develop it. Anyway the lap times are not so bad for the first test. We also tested tyres for Michelin today, mainly with the old bike because we have a lot of reference data for that bike."


So, I guess HRC decided it would be better to have Hayden race a bike he could actually fit in. How tall is he anyway? What about Mini P?

I also read that Honda's new pneumatic engine needs some working and improving. How long does it take to get it like they want? Months? Weeks?

Another question I really want answered is how will Rossi do with Bridgestone!


Over to you now!
I wish the 2008 season started next week!

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#2 Atreiu

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Posted 08 November 2007 - 16:12

Too bad Repsol doesn't race in black only, looks way better.
http://www.autosport.../1194532522.jpg

#3 Ody Mandrell

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Posted 08 November 2007 - 16:28

Hayden is saying the seat-to-bar distance feels the same, but that the bike feels more planted and less apt to wheelie and dive on the brakes. The engine going out was not a good sign -- Hayden had too many mechanical DNFs in '07. More here.

#4 giddyup409

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Posted 08 November 2007 - 16:34

thank you atreiu for this new topic and the 2008 preseason introduction :up:

i'm curious to see how yamaha's bike develops. i think they are at a loss atm. last year they seemed to have had much better head start.

#5 Nova

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Posted 08 November 2007 - 21:16

Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer
Appears there is a bit of doubt regarding Shumey´s lap time on the Ducati. Seems a bit odd that Memola, Schwantz and Gardner were slower. Does anyone know anything?



Gardner? Any links to what he thought about the ride?

#6 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 08 November 2007 - 21:38

Originally posted by Nova



Gardner? Any links to what he thought about the ride?


Nova, haven´t read any actual reports, just the times of the jurnos who got to ride the 800s. Here are some times. I think they only had a few laps on the bikes, but nevertheless, one would have thought, compared to the time accredited MS, they should have done a bit better.

Randy Mamola, 1:38.714
Kenny Noyes, 1:39.604
Wayne Gardner, 1:42.811
Alex Criville, 1:43.245
Steve Atlas, 1:43.378
Michael Neeves, 1:48.138
Didier de Radrigues, 1:48.526
Steve Parrish, 1:48.899
Roland Brown, 1:49.598
Alex Gobert, 1:51.008
Dario Marchetti, 1:51.546
Allan Cathcart, 1:53.686

#7 smithy

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 00:49

It might be in the other thread but someone questioned the validity of Schumacher's time vs Gardner et al. Methinks it's more because MS is still fit and dialled in. If the rest of them are anything like Gardner nowadays they suffer from Zapp Brannigan Syndrome...

"The spirit is willing, but the flesh is spongy and bruised."

#8 raisinberry777

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 01:56

My big question is, will Randy being unleashed on the Honda be good for him?

I mean, the Kawasaki hasn't been a top bike, but he's now on a good bike (not saying the Kawasaki was bad, and it certainly improved under his time with the team) I reckon he can get 2 or 3 podiums during this season.

Lorenzo is the other name to watch I guess, can he explode onto the scene the same way Pedrosa did?

#9 Dudley

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 02:44

I am astonished that either michelin or bridgestone are good with the Fiat deal.

#10 woftam

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 03:29

Originally posted by raisinberry777
My big question is, will Randy being unleashed on the Honda be good for him?

I mean, the Kawasaki hasn't been a top bike, but he's now on a good bike (not saying the Kawasaki was bad, and it certainly improved under his time with the team) I reckon he can get 2 or 3 podiums during this season.

Lorenzo is the other name to watch I guess, can he explode onto the scene the same way Pedrosa did?


To be honest I don't think Randy has taken a step up. I think his bike for 2008 wont be as competitive as his 2007 Kawasaki was. When he signed for LCR when he could more than likely have stayed at Kawasaki I was gobsmacked. Perhaps there is more to it and he doesn't get along with Hopper.



I am astonished that either michelin or bridgestone are good with the Fiat deal.



Lets face it if either had a choice they wouldn't be good with it.
Judging by Bridgestones press release a few weeks back they didn't have any choice.

#11 MaxScelerate

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 04:21

I never followed motorcycle racing... I do wonder, however, if after countless seasons in AMA and after his last (bad) accident, Miguel Duhamel will finally retire.. He's, what, 3 times the age of the youngest riders? :drunk:

#12 ehagar

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 05:08

Originally posted by MaxScelerate
I never followed motorcycle racing... I do wonder, however, if after countless seasons in AMA and after his last (bad) accident, Miguel Duhamel will finally retire.. He's, what, 3 times the age of the youngest riders? :drunk:


He will probably be like his old man and never really officially retire.

#13 Cindy

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 08:30

Not really happy on how they treated Michelin. Michelin did give them several good years, dominant years! They have a bad year, and now they are crying for a single tire rule.

Ferrari didn't try to ditch Bridgestone when they were having issues in F1. Am I wrong to assume that Honda & Yamaha should have had more loyalty to Michelin in MotoGP?

#14 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 08:57

No, because I dont think it was Michelin that made them win. When a Yamaha on Michelin beats a Honda on Michelin to a world championship, how is that Michelin's credit? Yes they allowed both teams to be in front of Bridgestone bikes, but ultimately the championship was decided by the team. If Yamaha were the only win capable team on Michelins that'd be one thing, but your Ferrari analogy is closer to Ducati where they're the only top team/top riders on that make of tire. Suzuki and Kawaski have been solidly B-teams.

#15 Atreiu

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 09:38

I pretty sure Bridgestone will be even happier if they win with Stoner again next year.

#16 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 10:41

Originally posted by Cindy
Not really happy on how they treated Michelin. Michelin did give them several good years, dominant years! They have a bad year, and now they are crying for a single tire rule.

Ferrari didn't try to ditch Bridgestone when they were having issues in F1. Am I wrong to assume that Honda & Yamaha should have had more loyalty to Michelin in MotoGP?


Cindy, I´m not sure racing is about loyalty. However, I do think Rossi may well regret his move to B/S (remember, his teammate Lorenso will still be on Michelins, so it was Rossi´s decision, not Yamaha´s) as it could have been a bit premature. It´s very unlikely that Michelin won´t bounce back, especially after what they must regard as a slap in the face by Valentino. They have been producing top flight tyres in M/C racing for over 30 years, so they aren´t about to forget how it´s done. One bad year (by their standards) must be expected now and again, but they will be back, of that I have no doubt. In fact, maybe they are already back. Afterall, the last GP this year was won on their product, not Bridgestones.

#17 Gilles4Ever

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 10:55

Originally posted by Atreiu
I pretty sure Bridgestone will be even happier if they win with Stoner again next year.


nah, they would be happier if they win with Rossi because then it proves it really is the tyres.

#18 woftam

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 11:09

Originally posted by Gilles4Ever


nah, they would be happier if they win with Rossi because then it proves it really is the tyres.


Anyone who thinks Vale lost the championship by tyres alone is kidding themselves and I suspect Michelin are on an even footing with Bridgestone at the moment anyway. Phillip Island they weren't but Malaysia they were even and Valencia as well. Motegi looked like being a Michelin track too except for the weather. Michelin need to get a better wet weather tyre though. The tyre war seemed very track dependant to me so instead of suffering on a weekend Bridgestone are better he will suffer when Michelin are next season.
Don't get me wrong I think over the course of the season Bridgestone won out easily, but I'm not so sure that was the case near the end of the season nor might it be at the start of next season.
One things for sure he isn't going to look too clever if Dani or Nicky dominate on Michelins next season and if Casey dominates again then he wont have tyres to complain about.

Risky move from Valentino - big time.

#19 Andy35

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 13:15

It probably was the Yamaha being at 90% and the tyres being at 90% and Rossi riding at 120% to make up and making a ot of errors so his mistakes popped him down to 90% also. He still managed to come 3rd of course, higher than people on better tyres and faster bikes....

Philip Island interested in F1. I'd love to see the car racers go into turn 1, now that would sort the men from the boys. The'd probably put a chicane in though ... :

Regards

Andy

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#20 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 13:38

They'd destroy the place. After Friday practice the girls would complain the wind affects them under braking for turn 1 and overnight they'd errect a giant fence blocking the circuit off from the sea.

#21 Andy35

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 14:08

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld
They'd destroy the place. After Friday practice the girls would complain the wind affects them under braking for turn 1 and overnight they'd errect a giant fence blocking the circuit off from the sea.


You'd still get seagulls getting sucked into the sidepods though, unless they put chicken wire over them.

Regards

Andy

#22 Alaweni

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 14:29

Well, I just got my tickets confirmed for the new MotoGP race in Indy next year. Here is the view from my seats:

http://www.redbullin...truction/flash/

Section E-Penthouse (although I'm 5 rows up from where the picture was taken.

#23 giddyup409

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 14:44

i'll have the same view from the same section (E-penthouse) :wave:

hope we did well.

#24 Alaweni

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 15:02

Yeah, I'm really excited to finally see these guys in action. The picture surprised me with how long that first curve is...the track map doesn't do it justice.

#25 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 15:47

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld
They'd destroy the place. After Friday practice the girls would complain the wind affects them under braking for turn 1 and overnight they'd errect a giant fence blocking the circuit off from the sea.


Oh dear Lord, please don´t let F1 anywhere near PI. It would be the end of the best M/C track on the calender. Can you imagine them paving all those beautiful grass areas? God forbid.
Bet they´d take turn 1 on the stop though :up:

#26 Atreiu

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 15:58

That's a great view, if you ask me.
I can't wait for it either!

#27 F1Champion

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 18:36

I just about to post yesterday how long it would take before Rossi ended up at Ducati in an all-Italian setup and today he made some comments about it.

#28 God_Speed

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Posted 09 November 2007 - 23:19

Originally posted by smithy
It might be in the other thread but someone questioned the validity of Schumacher's time vs Gardner et al. Methinks it's more because MS is still fit and dialled in. If the rest of them are anything like Gardner nowadays they suffer from Zapp Brannigan Syndrome...

"The spirit is willing, but the flesh is spongy and bruised."


That's an amazing bit of intertextuality :lol: :clap:

#29 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 12:01

Testing in Sepang. First day times.

1. De Puniet
2. Vermulen
3. Edwards
4. Dovi
5. Capirossi
6. West
7. Hayden
8. Hopper
9. Lorenzo
10. Toseland

Toseland had a light fall in his first session, but resumed testing again shortly afterwards.
Good effort by De Puniet considering he´s now on Honda and Michelins. Only ten testing plus two Japanese Yamaha test riders who weren´t on the timing sheets.

#30 ViMaMo

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 12:20

Rossi pressurising Yamaha. He is talking bollocks. I think he has had too much leeway. He better realize if Yam drops him, and if Casey doesnt want him at Duke; he has nowhere to go.

#31 Gilles4Ever

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 12:25

Sad but True.

Rossi is the biggest name in MotoGP he can almost go where he wants - as long as his demands aren't totally overboard they will all jump at signing him.

#32 HYMS

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 12:28

Posted Image
Loren-Show at Sepang's Winter Testing Session

#33 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 13:08

Originally posted by Gilles4Ever
Sad but True.

Rossi is the biggest name in MotoGP he can almost go where he wants - as long as his demands aren't totally overboard they will all jump at signing him.


I wouldn´t put money on that. He´s yesterdays news. Times have changed and so have perceptions, and Rossi´s pull isn´t what it used to be. He would be well advised to get his head down, stop talking, and start working bloody hard to try and get back to where he was. I think the pack that have been hunting him down have finally caught up.
Personally, I think he has had his day.

#34 Gilles4Ever

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 13:18

Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer


I wouldn´t put money on that. He´s yesterdays news. Times have changed and so have perceptions, and Rossi´s pull isn´t what it used to be. He would be well advised to get his head down, stop talking, and start working bloody hard to try and get back to where he was. I think the pack that have been hunting him down have finally caught up.
Personally, I think he has had his day.


He got Bridgestone tyres for one bike in the team - I think he still has clout.

#35 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 13:24

Originally posted by Gilles4Ever


He got Bridgestone tyres for one bike in the team - I think he still has clout.


I think the Bridgestone affair only reinforces my point. He asked Bridgestone for support in 2008, was refused, went and complained to Dorna, and Dorna told BS that unless they supplied Vale with tyres they would introduce a one tyre rule and give the deal to Michelin. They then agreed, against their will.
Blackmail, it would appear, doesn´t only happen in F1 :lol:

#36 Bumper

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 13:26

Personally I'm really looking forward to what Lorenzo can do next year. He won't have the easiest of times being effectively in a one-man team, on different tyres as his 'team mate'.

By the way great pic Hyms :up: Are you at the track all three days?

#37 Atreiu

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 13:31

Originally posted by HYMS
Posted Image
Loren-Show at Sepang's Winter Testing Session


That white livery makes it look as if they come from the future, or outerspace.
:)

#38 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 13:35

Originally posted by Bumper


By the way great pic Hyms :up:


Yes Hyms, spectacular shot. Do you happen to know what the emblem is on the front of the fairing?

#39 Bumper

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 13:57

Just browsing, from Crash.net, Lorenzo on the switch from 250s to MotoGP:

“It's hard for me to use all the power at the moment and I need to learn to be slower and smoother in the corners and to open the throttle a bit earlier. I'm struggling a bit to find the fast lap times but this is normal because there is still so much about the bike that I don't understand. Tomorrow we have some new things to try, including a new fork, and I will just keep on working steadily.”

Testing was cut short today because of the rainfall.

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#40 HYMS

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 15:01

Originally posted by Bumper
By the way great pic Hyms :up: Are you at the track all three days?


yep...i'll be there for rest of the testing session.

Luchio Cecchinello approached me when he saw me 'snapping' De Puniet around the track and request a couple of images for Honda LCR daily press release for the rest of the testing session at Sepang.

my lucky day i guess...... :drunk:

#41 HYMS

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 15:11

Originally posted by ex Rhodie racer


Yes Hyms, spectacular shot. Do you happen to know what the emblem is on the front of the fairing?


Posted Image

I let the 'expert' to explain it for us :lol:

#42 HYMS

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 15:13

Originally posted by Atreiu


That white livery makes it look as if they come from the future, or outerspace.
:)


my girlfren told me the livery look like 'CLONE TROOPER' from Star Wars. :p

maybe she's right :)

Posted Image

#43 Alaweni

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 15:57

I know I'm not the 'Expert', but I just read Lorenzo's explanation of the symbol in the Nov/Dec issue of Road Racer X (the best magazine!). It means Outside, which is his nickname for passing Pedrosa and Stoner in Brazil 2003 (125's) on the outside of the last corner. Someone made a graphic for it with the letters in Outside forming a circle, then it was converted to the symbol you see today.

#44 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 16:24

Originally posted by Alaweni
I know I'm not the 'Expert', but I just read Lorenzo's explanation of the symbol in the Nov/Dec issue of Road Racer X (the best magazine!). It means Outside, which is his nickname for passing Pedrosa and Stoner in Brazil 2003 (125's) on the outside of the last corner. Someone made a graphic for it with the letters in Outside forming a circle, then it was converted to the symbol you see today.


Interesting. Thanks for that Alaweni :up: :wave:

#45 Ody Mandrell

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 16:28

Originally posted by Alaweni
It means Outside, which is his nickname for passing Pedrosa and Stoner in Brazil 2003 (125's) on the outside of the last corner.

Schwantz made an outside pass on the last lap at Donington'91 to beat Rainey, but it's hard to imagine him being so lame as to adopt "Outside" as his nickname to memorialize the moment.

#46 Red ITC

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 16:43

Surely it's the loop for Loopy! I'm looking forward to next season's madness from him...

#47 ex Rhodie racer

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 16:59

Originally posted by Ody Mandrell

Schwantz made an outside pass on the last lap at Donington'91 to beat Rainey, but it's hard to imagine him being so lame as to adopt "Outside" as his nickname to memorialize the moment.


Just a bit of harmless fun I should imagine Ody. George seems like a nice lad. At least he tries to liven the show up. Seems that´s what the majority of the punters want these days.

#48 Ody Mandrell

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 17:04

Sure, ex-Rhodie, and I can see the draw of trying to start a rivalry with Pedrosa, with whom Lorenzo's camp seems to be trying to start something. The risk is that the bigger he talks, the more foolish he'll look when the results don't come.

#49 Atreiu

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 21:07

I'd rather have them talk too much than noting at all.

Anyone got the pass on youtube?



PS: if Stoner feels annoyed by the sticker, he can just stamp a huge MOTO GP CHAMPION on his bike. hehehe

#50 Ody Mandrell

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Posted 15 November 2007 - 21:42

Originally posted by Atreiu
I'd rather have them talk too much than noting at all.

Yeah, but you don't want to become Colin "Fast on Monday" Edwards by always promising and not delivering.

PS: if Stoner feels annoyed by the sticker, he can just stamp a huge MOTO GP CHAMPION on his bike. hehehe

Hayden seemed to need to spell it out for everyone:

Posted Image

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