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F1 fanaticism reaching new (soccer-like) heights


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#651 bond

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 23:54

Originally posted by Nitropower


:down:


You didn't like it?
Too bad...


Eu alerts for growing racism in spain

http://www.elperiodi...dseccio_PK=1021

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#652 Lontano

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 23:58

Originally posted by bond


I had one problem, but I spent a lot of time in spain in work to know that. Also i have spanish friends in spain that have the same conclusion has me.
Accept the fact that the vast majority IS racist.


vast majority? do i have to believe what i see everyday or your word?

#653 LuckyStrike1

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Posted 04 February 2008 - 23:58

Originally posted by Buttoneer




He hasn't said that. As far as I can see he hasn't said anything at all. But he will have to make a statement of some sort soon because he is bound to be asked the question by a journo first chance they get.


So - he answers the question. What is the problem?

#654 Ashe

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:01

Just a couple of things:

1) I'm not the biggest fan of the FIA, but it's excellent to see them take act quickly and sternly over this. I hope that they'll back it up with suitable sanctions if it continues.

2) Although I don't think Alonso (or any Spaniard involved in F1) is obligated to make a statement, I hope he does publically condemn it. I'm not his biggest fan by any stretch, but if he had (or has?) made a statement soon after the events it would only help his reputation.

#655 TennisUK

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:01

Originally posted by Suntrek


Please point them out.


Well, there are certainly two who appear to defend the indefensible in this forum, at lengths far beyond rational. I'd rather you formed your own conclusions, rather than leave myself open to some ridiculous abuse at the hand of said racists.

The actions of those small minority of spectators in Barcelona is repugnant. And the behavior a few others in this forum is equally so, for choosing some insanely obfuscated "reasoning" for said behavior.

#656 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:02

Originally posted by Buttoneer
He hasn't said that. As far as I can see he hasn't said anything at all. But he will have to make a statement of some sort soon because he is bound to be asked the question by a journo first chance they get.

Since when have I made things up? You are essentially saying I am lying! I'd like an apology please. Or at least, a properly resourced reply.

Jonathon Noble's article was a Q&A with Alonso. Q&A with Ferdinand Alonso The questions asked were:

Q. What are the feelings for the new season?

Q. What do you think about the technical regulation changes this year? David Coulthard said recently that it could be dangerous?

Q. After the strange season you had at McLaren, do you think it would have been better to stay at Renault rather than go there in the first place?

Q. After the form of Renault last season, are you worried that they may not be able to give you a car that is capable of fighting for the world championship?

Q. Everything learns something about themselves, through good and bad times. You said last year was difficult for you, but what did you learn?

FA: Well, I think we all improve every year - and the drivers even more. You are one year more experienced and you are a better driver when you start the next season. For me it was a difficult season but for sure in the difficulties you learn even more and are even quicker. It is something that this year for sure I will be better.

Q. Why did it get so personal with Lewis Hamilton last year?

FA: I don't think I have any problem with Lewis. Sometimes I read some things, but I am sure they are exaggerated in Spain. Every time he has an interview he has two or three questions about me, and every time I have an interview I have two or three questions about him. And anything you say will be exaggerated the next day.

So at the end of the day I am really convinced it is better not to say anything, because we cannot make a big thing of something that is not really a big thing. I don't have problems with anyone. I don't regret anything from 2007. I had some difficulties, but I am here in 2008 ready to fight again and happy. There is no big problem. It seems that everybody wants to put something there.


Q. Is the chapter with McLaren-Mercedes closed for you?

Q. You have driven the 2007 car and the 2008 car. Can you give us your impressions of how they compare?

Q. The front end is quite new. How does it feel?

Q. Does the new front end suit the Bridgestone tyres better?

Q. After racing with Lewis all year, how talented do you think he is?

FA: Again, the questions are about Lewis and I don't want to say anything more than what I had said all year. He is a very talented driver, and rookie of the year, surprise of the year, and everything everybody said last year nothing changed. The first year in F1, fighting for the championship.

Q. How much do you think you can contribute in closing the gap, because there's a view that you were half a second faster than Giancarlo [Fisichella] and last year they were about a second off the pace of Ferrari, so half of their deficit was on the driver side...

Q. We will have two new street races this year – will they give Renault a better chance to compete at the front?

Q. You made very fast starts when you drove for Renault – do you think that will still be the case with launch control now banned?

Q. Last year you said you expected McLaren to pay more regard to the fact that you came there as a double world champion. How do you feel about the situation at Renault?



Please read what he said, it seems quite clear he has decided the simplest way to avoid stirring up controversy is just not to talk about Hamilton. I think he's right too - its what I'd do. If once considers how much the media change things, after all that has gone on, I do not blame him for taking this stance.

He doesn't organise tracks - its up to the authorities to run their businesses properly.size

#657 bond

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:05

Originally posted by Lontano


vast majority? do i have to believe what i see everyday or your word?


Assuming you're a big boy, believe in what your mind tells you to believe...

#658 Fatgadget

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:06

Originally posted by Durant
If Alonso does speak out, you mob will just say it wasnt genuine and that he was forced to do it.


Yep. The proverbial horns of a dilemma. Damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.

#659 Mauseri

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:06

Originally posted by Chui
Surely, you're joking... :rolleyes:

You got the point though? If I draw a caricature of Lewis Hamilton, I'm a racist. If I draw a caricature of Michael Schumacher, I'm only a hater. Is it possible to hate Hamilton without being a racist? Or do you label them all racists?

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#660 Lontano

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:09

Originally posted by bond


Assuming you're a big boy, believe in what your mind tells you to believe...


which means i either agree with you or am a mistaken child?

#661 Suntrek

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:10

Originally posted by le chat noir


bully for you. but your post suggested these spanish racists had been watching itv. so i asked whether they actually did and what alonso hating was in the british media. it was a question, why not answer it?

don't you miss watching f1 live?


I do watch F1 live. With Swedish commentary. The commentators are rather neutral. They don't feel the need to put Alonso down every minute, and maybe they are a bit biased towards Kimi, as he comes from a neighbour country, but nothing serious. I can live with that.

So, care to give me a good reason why the Spanish fans shouldn't have felt the same Alonso animosity as I have? As both Sweden and Spain are "non-British" countries, so to speak? :wave:

But, as I've stated before - this is no excuse for anyone hurling racist insults at Hamilton, but to put the blame on Alonso and the Spanish press alone is a bit rich.

#662 miguevaio

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:10

Originally posted by bond


I had one problem, but I spent a lot of time in spain in work to know that. Also i have spanish friends in spain that have the same conclusion has me.
Accept the fact that the vast majority IS racist.


do you care to define "vast majority"? 10, 20, 40.000.000? what facts do you have to keep your word? the same ones of the article of Autosport? a guy who looked bad at you one day in one village? come on

Lynch would be proud of all of you guys.....keep the bash and the demagogy on....starting for Simon Baskett and Autosport :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Curiously, all the weekends, Ryanair and EasyJet go full of Bristish people to Spain just to get drunk....maybe being drunk is easier to manage racism? (* read down)

(* here) That would be the kind of comment with bad taste and no sense that would show hate and anger against a country's people. I would be getting few examples and generalizing to a whole country. This is the same kind of thing many of you are doing, including, sadly, journalists.......

#663 bond

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:13

Originally posted by Lontano


which means i either agree with you or am a mistaken child?


If you say so...

#664 Fatgadget

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:14

Originally posted by micra_k10

You got the point though? If I draw a caricature of Lewis Hamilton, I'm a racist. If I draw a caricature of Michael Schumacher, I'm only a hater. Is it possible to hate Hamilton without being a racist? Or do you label them all racists?


It all depends in the context in which its done. For a example,someone can say 'negro' in one sentence and no reaction...someone else can say the exact same word in another sentence and all hell would break loose. Go figure.

#665 Mauseri

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:18

Originally posted by Fatgadget
It all depends in the context in which its done. For a example,someone can say 'negro' in one sentence and no reaction...someone else can say the exact same word in another sentence and all hell would break loose. Go figure.

Yeah. I think he gets called in racist way in spain because they hate him. But they dont hate him because they are racist. At least I'd like to think so. Whatever, majority hate him, but only minority abuses.

#666 Lontano

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:19

Originally posted by bond


If you say so...


i'm not sure what went on right here: i disagree with you then you hide under some indulgence? :confused:

#667 bond

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:20

Originally posted by miguevaio


do you care to define "vast majority"? 10, 20, 40.000.000? what facts do you have to keep your word? the same ones of the article of Autosport? a guy who looked bad at you one day in one village? come on

Lynch would be proud of all of you guys.....keep the bash and the demagogy on....starting for Simon Baskett and Autosport :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Curiously, all the weekends, Ryanair and EasyJet go full of Bristish people to Spain just to get drunk....maybe being drunk is easier to manage racism? (* read down)

(* here) That would be the kind of comment with bad taste and no sense that would show hate and anger against a country's people. I would be getting few examples and generalizing to a whole country. This is the same kind of thing many of you are doing, including, sadly, journalists.......


I tell you what i see from my own experience and from people i meet in spain.
So, it's just my opinion, take it as it is.

#668 bond

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:21

Originally posted by Lontano


i'm not sure what went on right here: i disagree with you then you hide under some indulgence? :confused:


Read my post againg.
I didn't told you were a child if you disagree with me...

#669 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:24

Autosport article, part of which is:


Estaban Ibarra, spokesman for Spain's Movement against Intolerance, said these manifestations of racism were a reflection of worrying trends in Spanish society and the lack of institutional action.

"Racism and xenophobia are present in Spain just as they are in the rest of Europe, but our observations show that they have grown in Spain in recent years as evidenced by the proliferation of racist Internet sites and the activity of ultra groups," Ibarra told Reuters.

"It is not just racism, it is xenophobia too directed against people from Eastern Europe or North Africa for example and people of different religions such as Muslims.

"In sport it started in football but it has spread to other arenas. We've observed that a patriotic excitement in motor sport, for example, can lead to a lack of respect to competitors from other cultures or countries."

He follows with the need for more teeth in institutional action, and maybe the need for a special prosecutor.

Australia was once a very racist place. But hopefully we have changed somewhat, although there is still much intolerance and racial issues in the country. But not in sport, we have at least cleaned that area up and if it happens we seem to act quickly against it.

#670 Lontano

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:24

Originally posted by bond


Read my post againg.
I didn't told you were a child if you disagree with me...


yes, i see you have gone from "Accept the fact that the vast majority IS racist" to "So, it's just my opinion, take it as it is", you just stated an opinion as a fact...

#671 bond

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:26

Originally posted by Lontano


yes, i see you have gone from "Accept the fact that the vast majority IS racist" to "So, it's just my opinion, take it as it is", you just stated an opinion as a fact...


Yes, to me it's just my opinion that's a fact.
Simple for you now?

#672 Suntrek

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:26

Originally posted by TennisUK


Well, there are certainly two who appear to defend the indefensible in this forum, at lengths far beyond rational. I'd rather you formed your own conclusions, rather than leave myself open to some ridiculous abuse at the hand of said racists.

The actions of those small minority of spectators in Barcelona is repugnant. And the behavior a few others in this forum is equally so, for choosing some insanely obfuscated "reasoning" for said behavior.


That is - you don't want to stand up for what you post. Fine.

I DO hope however that you also think the much more common behaviour - in this very thread - of pointing out ALL Spaniards as racists by some "insanely obfuscated "reasoning"" is equally repugnant.

#673 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:29

I just read, from the Autosport site, that the track officials did remove the racial chanters from the track:

Part of the autosport article which quotes the Spanish racing authority:

"The Federation wants to show its absolute repulsion at these incomprehensible events, as well as showing its support to the McLaren team and especially to their driver Lewis Hamilton.

"Car racing is a sport where events that divert from cordiality between fans and drivers and teams will not be allowed.

"These kind of madmen who confuse sporting rivalry with violence must know that the Federation will have no tolerance with them.

"The RFEA wants to make clear that the protagonists of this event were a very small group that doesn't represent the thousands of people who enjoy this sport in a fun and cordial way.

"The RFEA also wants to highlight the speed at which the Circuit officials removed the offensive banners and the trouble markers from the stands.



#674 lukywill

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:32

it´s quite a speedy gonzales. :lol: all for mighty bernie, the obscure.

#675 Davebo

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:32

Originally posted by Nitropower


No it's more comfortable not to think and pray the ITV prayer. Maybe hating Spain and helping hate to Spain is not racism? :) What about the "Letter to cousin Pedro" in Planet F1? Is that racist? :) :) Hola hombre!!! No es buenoooo! Mexico lindo!


You're talking nationalism. Nationalism is not the same as racism. Call him a butt ugly Brit all you want. Please. It's far better than the racist insults happening recently.

#676 le chat noir

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:35

Originally posted by Suntrek


I do watch F1 live. With Swedish commentary. The commentators are rather neutral. They don't feel the need to put Alonso down every minute, and maybe they are a bit biased towards Kimi, as he comes from a neighbour country, but nothing serious. I can live with that.

So, care to give me a good reason why the Spanish fans shouldn't have felt the same Alonso animosity as I have? As both Sweden and Spain are "non-British" countries, so to speak? :wave:

But, as I've stated before - this is no excuse for anyone hurling racist insults at Hamilton, but to put the blame on Alonso and the Spanish press alone is a bit rich.


as it is to put it on itv.

i can understand you seeking out a preferable commentary after the race, but i couldn't understand a desire to follow one you don't like, which is what you seemed to suggest the spanish racists were doing. nor would i expect many of them to read the british press - or take it to heart.

those that hold animosity here, on either side, seem to me rather simple minded, missing the complexities of what went on. racists tend to be simple minded too, so its not a surprise the two should come together this year. its a bit like the animosity against ms and the anti-german jibes in 94 and on. people don't understand what they're watching, don't like what they see, some bitch about it, others let known their xist leanings.

and MP, if Alonso were to say something, he would not be talking or discussing Hamilton, he would be urging spanish fans not to be racist. different thing entirely. if the threat of the f1 race being dropped is there, surely alonso would want to do his best to please the major majority of non-racist spanish fans by doing this simple thing to stop the racists and keep the gp secure.

#677 TennisUK

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:44

Originally posted by Suntrek

That is - you don't want to stand up for what you post. Fine.


I don't recall ever having made any such statement, and find it hard to believe any such conclusion can have been reached from my statement (Unless perhaps one was predisposed to find one). As I posted, I simply don't want to be a figure of abuse for puerile racists. It's tedious and solves nothing. I'm not going to get dragged into childish finger pointing - it's clear to most on this thread (judging by the general ebb and flow) who I am describing. I'm sure you're big enough to see whom I'm referring to.

Originally posted by Suntrek

I DO hope however that you also think the much more common behaviour - in this very thread - of pointing out ALL Spaniards as racists by some "insanely obfuscated "reasoning"" is equally repugnant.


By pointing out the individual responsibility for those involved I had hoped this idea had been implicit. Clearly I should have made made it more clear for some. No, I don't think all spanish people are racist - by any means - and nothing I have said implied this.

However, I do feel all racists are idiots. This includes those who try and hide behind some veneer of rationalism to justify it.

#678 big x

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:44

Originally posted by Nitropower

It's amazing what a few assholes' actions can cause in the British media. Because it's nothing more than that: a few assholes. But now they turn it into a national problem and we are all racist.


Where have the British media said all Spanish are racist ? ? Please provide a link.

Since before the season started I've read countless racist comments on the Spanish language forums but virtually none on the English language ones. That doesn't mean all Spanish people are racist but clearly the problem is rather bigger than just a few "assholes" as you claim.

adam

#679 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:52

Originally posted by TennisUK
However, I do feel all racists are idiots. This includes those who try and hide behind some veneer of rationalism to justify it.

I think ignorant is a better description, although there are many exceptions to mere ignorance.

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#680 TennisUK

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 00:54

Originally posted by Melbourne Park
I think ignorant is a better description, although there are many exceptions to mere ignorance.

Meh, in this instance prefer "idiot"

#681 VresiBerba

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:00

Originally posted by FonzCam
OK enough of this monkey business!

Coulthard said about Montoya "It's like going to the zoo and trying to communicate with a chimpanzee. We speak a different language and have different racing etiquette. There's no point."

That's not racism, it's just an insult (and not a very nice one at that).

Now...

Calling someone a monkey is a term of affection or a mild (jovial) insult (cheeky monkey, little monkey, monkey business) in relationship to their playful/mischievous nature suggesting they are acting like a monkey.

Making monkey noises at and throwing bananas at a black person is done to suggest that because they have black skin they are somehow sub-human and should go back to the 'the jungle where they came from'.

Just for completeness monkey can also mean to play with or tamper with an object (monkey about with) or someone who has been duped/tricked (made a monkey out of him).

Thanks for the English lesson and all, but sorry, I don't buy it.

First of all, and this is according to Montoya himself, Coulthard has not spoken to Montoya in all six years he had raced there, so how Coulthard could have known that talking to Montoya would be like trying to comunicate with a chimpanzee at a zoo, is beyond me. And secondly, I wouldn't put it passed Couldhard that there was an ulterior motive behind the chimp comment, Coulthard has been vocal about Montoya before, many many times, behaving like the ****ing idiot he is.

#682 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:06

Originally posted by VresiBerba

First of all, and this is according to Montoya himself, Coulthard has not spoken to Montoya in all six years he had raced there, so how Coulthard could have known that talking to Montoya would be like trying to comunicate with a chimpanzee at a zoo, is beyond me. And secondly, I wouldn't put it passed Couldhard that there was an ulterior motive behind the chimp comment, Coulthard has been vocal about Montoya before, many many times, behaving like the ****ing idiot he is.

Coultard apologized though:


Coulthard felt that his comments had overstepped the mark, however, and duly went to visit Montoya on Sunday morning at Silverstone to say sorry. Montoya said that he accepted the apology and made it clear that he had not deliberately tried to slow Coulthard in qualifying.

"He came and apologised this morning. It was nice," said Montoya. "You know we had a chat with the stewards and everything, and he told me, 'I backed off because I thought you were going to get in my way and I didn't trust you.'

"I said 'you haven't talked to me in the six years I have been here so it is hard to say why you are not going to trust me when I have never done anything to you'. I said you were never close to me.

"I was coming into the pits and he was starting his lap and he was never close enough for me to pick up the pace. I went off the track then stayed right to come into the pits and when he started his lap he was probably two seconds behind so he said he had to back off to make sure I didn't screw his lap, but I didn't plan to."

Montoya denied that any of the friction between the pair was caused by Montoya being in contention for a drive at Red Bull Racing next year.



#683 bond

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:06

If anyone had any doubts...


ENAR - European Network Against Racism

http://www.enar-eu.o.../Spain_2006.pdf

Conclusion:

Having assessed all the areas and reported cases, this report concludes that racism and xenophobia are continuing to rise in Spain while, at the same time, prejudices and discriminatory stereotypes are settling deeper into Spanish society. These prejudices have affected the Roma people for a very long time and foreigners since a relatively shorter period of time, as their presence has become significant. New groups of victims are springing up, such as the Spanish children of foreigners who arrived to this country, years ago. This is nothing new if we look at how the phenomenon has evolved in other European countries. But Spanish authorities do not seem to be interested in learning from our neighbours’ experience.

These racist acts and prejudices coming from a part of society are growing more numerous everyday and are aggravated by the special circumstances of our territory, in its condition as the Southern border of Europe. This reality has turned our authorities into one of the main promoters of the policy on the externalisation and subcontracting of border controls in neighbouring countries, through which migrants must transit, carried out without democratic rigour. This has led to, and will lead to in the near future, very serious violations of the human rights of transiting migrants. The latter are the responsibility of these European countries, which lack imagination in searching for a solution to what they consider a problem.

In the face of this rising discrimination, not only on the borders but in everyday situations, and frequent cases of direct or more subtle racism in education, housing, the access to the health and other public services, the Spanish authorities' policy is often to keep quiet and look the other way. Although racism has risen, as this report and many others drafted by other experts and organisations show, every authority seems to want to forget everything about the anti-discrimination mandates to which it is bound, by European directives, Directive 2000/43 in particular. We are still lacking a body specialised in the fight against racism on a local, state, or regional level.

The small progresses made in this field of which we are aware lead us to think that the body that will be created will not be effective or will lack resources, because no one wants to face this situation of racism and everyone sees it as a political struggle, not a social one. Some municipalities have drafted interesting projects and made legal progresses in the fight against racism in sport, because of its media effect, but we understand that the most important thing is missing, that is, a clear determination, free of partisan struggles, to face the fight against discrimination with rigour.

In instigating this determination, the ENAR network, in its condition as a Spanish anti-racist platform, and the rest of civil society united in the defence of equal conditions for everyone, have an important role to play and experiences to pass on to the institutions. Making this contribution has not always been possible because of the authorities' apathy towards this subject and the lack of unity of the associations. We hope that in future reports this unity will have been reinforced and that the reality we will describe will be fairer and better for all people.

#684 VresiBerba

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:11

Originally posted by Hacklerf
England has no great problem with racism in football, Spanish football does.

Don't worry, England has its own problems with football.

http://www.thesun.co...rticle37267.ece

#685 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:18

Originally posted by VresiBerba
Don't worry, England has its own problems with football.

http://www.thesun.co...rticle37267.ece


That seems to me to be more of a German problem ... although I do understand that English football fans travelling are more than terrible.

#686 Lontano

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:29

Originally posted by bond
If anyone had any doubts...

...


oh my god, i've been a racist all this time and i didn't know it!

#687 bond

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:33

Originally posted by Lontano


oh my god, i've been a racist all this time and i didn't know it!


Poor thing ...lol

#688 VresiBerba

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 01:52

Originally posted by Melbourne Park
That seems to me to be more of a German problem ...

:eek: So this whole thread can be summed up as; a Lewis problem?

#689 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 02:11

Originally posted by VresiBerba
:eek: So this whole thread can be summed up as; a Lewis problem?

:lol:

Strange thing with that German story was how a Nazi salute would put one in Gaol. Not in England though - but then they never had a Nazi government. Although there were some who wanted one, the leader of that group being Max Mosley's father.

We bought a history book for my son last week, on the German Nazis, and it had a DVD. The DVD was American, and had details on various Nazi leaders, and also discussed leaders in a couple of countries. They showed a Nazi meeting in the USA, and also Mr Mosley who they described in England and they showed him leading a meeting in England.

John Cleese doing the "Don't mention the Germans" was true cringe and hilarious stuff, all at the same time. My wife can barely tolerate them they make her feel far too uncomfortable. I guess to some peoples they would be offensive.

#690 Chui

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 03:14

I believe that there is residual (and sometimes nurtured) racisms in all cultures and societies and it's indemic in all races.

It's the worst insult to me - not because I'm Black - but because of how I was raised and the philosophy of life I follow. It's Collectivism at it's worst. How so? Because it condemns all of that particular race with NO regard to the Individual.

Being an "African-American" probably makes me more sensitive of others' racial uniqueness and, more importantly, more likely to have a negative reaction to any pperceived racism towards ANY racial group.

What makes Spain look bad in this instance is that the jackarses are so vociferous and brazen. We all know it isn't every Spaniard. It's never "all of anyone". Xenophobia is on the rise all over the world and it will get worse in the short term with all of the immigration from developing nations into developed Western nations.

Sad.

#691 f1seb

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 03:52

Racism as it seems to me is very much alive and kicking in Europe. I spoke about this with my Italian friend and he agrees with me. Also went to the Polish websites who at the same time are covering this scandal and the replies by the users are not what I would call shocking but rather expected by me. Pretty much every single one of them doesn't show any sentimentalism towards Lewis at all, here is what the vocal Polish F1 fans have to say about this:

The FIA or rather the English are the ones to blame for people not liking Hamilton. Now they have a problem with a few fans from Spain, who are right in saying that Alonso lost a sure title due to the favoritism of the Englishman.

Poor shoe polished covered boy. Awww what aren't patting his head, bad Spanish people.

They should just stop trying to make such a big deal about this. Lewis this, Lewis that, what is he, some kind of prophet? St. Lewis should deal with this himself.

He should be happy that he is being recognized. This is a true sign that he is now famous!!!

I could type more but you guys seem to get the point. Yeah there are Polish people on those sites that seem to have half a brain but they are outnumbered by a very good margin.

So yeah racism in Europe is alive and well... :down:

#692 IannDC

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 05:39

Originally posted by Melbourne Park
Please read what he said, it seems quite clear he has decided the simplest way to avoid stirring up controversy is just not to talk about Hamilton. I think he's right too - its what I'd do. If once considers how much the media change things, after all that has gone on, I do not blame him for taking this stance.
size


Good point.

After every morsel out of him last year was taken apart and blown out of proportion, his distrust of the media must have grown tremendously. He's probably in a situation of "damn if you do, damn if you don't".

I have do doubts that even if Alonso makes a statement condemning the events at Barcelona, someone, somewhere -- and then followed by an army -- will find something there to tear him down to pieces.

#693 Andy35

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 06:24

Enlgish monkey responds to Spanish taunts...


http://www.theage.co...gibralter,0.jpg

Regards

Andy

#694 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 06:32

Originally posted by AndyW35
Enlgish monkey responds to Spanish taunts...


http://www.theage.co...gibralter,0.jpg

Regards

Andy

:lol: :lol:

#695 bl-f1

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 06:46

Originally posted by VresiBerba
:eek: So this whole thread can be summed up as; a Lewis problem?


Definitely not. But Lewis has continued to feed the press in recent days with derogatory remarks against Fernando Alonso, to which Fernando has not replied. Lewis Hamilton is not to blame for the idiotic behaviour of a few ignorant individuals, but he is definitely to blame for feeding the fire. Just as action needs to be taken so these incidents are not repeated, someone should tell young Lewis to keep his bile towards Fernando Alonso to himself, drive that beauty of Mclaren as fast as he can, and apply himself to delivering what every one expects him to reach.

#696 Rubens Hakkamacher

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 06:49

Originally posted by Juan Kerr
Still don't follow, they represent the dark side of human nature, the uncontrolled animalistic side. the idea is we try to respect each other's differences otherwise we can go on all day taking the piss out of each other and gain nothing. Perhaps your american influences is stronger than other influences ?


I don't follow you. You are saying respect other's differences; as if describing these racists as "rednecks" is disrespectful - to who???

What "American influences" are you talking about??

#697 Melbourne Park

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 08:40

Originally posted by bl-f1


Definitely not. But Lewis has continued to feed the press in recent days with derogatory remarks against Fernando Alonso ...

I think those are just press sensationalism. LH says ten times as much pro Alonso stuff, wishes him well, praises him, but the press grabs something out of context and they run with that.

Which is why Alonso will not talk about Hamilton, because he is always misquoted, which is what Alonso has specifically said.

Don't blame the racing drivers - go look at the media sales that benefit from sensationalist reporting.

#698 tidytracks

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 09:35

Just been reading the overnight comments, and I must admit to a genuine level of surprise in people saying Alonso does not need to come out and distance himself from this abuse, or to call for this kind of taunting to stop.

I am reminded of English football in 2003, in the run up to the European Championships when England captain David Beckham made a public appeal to England fans to be well-behaved during their Euro 2004 qualifiers.

While the England fans have improved a lot in recent years, back in 2003 they had hurled racist abuse at the Turkish fans and UEFA launched a massive investigation, threatening to throw England out of Euro 2004 if their fans did not behave themselves.

Beckham's appeal for calm did the trick, but so too did UEFA's threat to throw the team out of the championship.

One hopes in this case that the FIA's threat to take the Spanish GPs away from Spain does the trick, but a well worded statement from Alonso would certainly help to calm this insane situation down.

#699 pikamoku

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 09:41

Originally posted by Melbourne Park
I think those are just press sensationalism. LH says ten times as much pro Alonso stuff, wishes him well, praises him, but the press grabs something out of context and they run with that.

Which is why Alonso will not talk about Hamilton, because he is always misquoted, which is what Alonso has specifically said.

Don't blame the racing drivers - go look at the media sales that benefit from sensationalist reporting.


sorry mate, that could be true if you only read team's press releases.

They just tolerate each other.

BTW, i agree that media are helping this (and RACIST ROW too) to benefit themselves.

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#700 K-One

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 09:50

Originally posted by Melbourne Park
I think those are just press sensationalism. LH says ten times as much pro Alonso stuff, wishes him well, praises him, but the press grabs something out of context and they run with that.

Which is why Alonso will not talk about Hamilton, because he is always misquoted, which is what Alonso has specifically said.

Don't blame the racing drivers - go look at the media sales that benefit from sensationalist reporting.


True, journalists will spin comments as an attack to the other. There has been also derogatory comments from FA, but I guess they don't matter