Jump to content


Photo

F1 fanaticism reaching new (soccer-like) heights


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
727 replies to this topic

#51 Durant

Durant
  • Member

  • 694 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 08:33

Originally posted by airwise

Those throwing bananas and making monkey chants should be arrested and locked up. It's as simple as that.


Along with the drivers who call the others Monkeys?

Advertisement

#52 airwise

airwise
  • Member

  • 2,001 posts
  • Joined: March 05

Posted 03 February 2008 - 08:43

Monkey in English is a jovial slang term - I would not expect you to understand that. The throwing of bananas and the making of ape noises at a coloured person in Spain is a very different proposition so don't play silly buggers. Just look at the behavior of the football fans towards black players. I don't think any of them have recently been quoted as calling their team mates "monkies".

#53 Durant

Durant
  • Member

  • 694 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 08:56

Originally posted by airwise
Monkey in English is a jovial slang term - I would not expect you to understand that. The throwing of bananas and the making of ape noises at a coloured person in Spain is a very different proposition so don't play silly buggers. Just look at the behavior of the football fans towards black players. I don't think any of them have recently been quoted as calling their team mates "monkies".


I dont understand it because its not true. Calling someone a monkey is an insult its not a jovial slang term. If you have doubts go upto someone on the street and call them a monkey. I can only imagine what you would have said if Alonso had called his fellow drivers monkeys. Let me guess..'A heinous disgusting slur and lack of respect. The sooner he retires the better'.

Throwing bananas and making monkey noise is just another expression of calling someone a monkey, so according to your own logic its just a bunch of people being jovial. :up:

#54 airwise

airwise
  • Member

  • 2,001 posts
  • Joined: March 05

Posted 03 February 2008 - 09:04

Arrow,

come back when you are English :wave:

#55 Durant

Durant
  • Member

  • 694 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 09:08

Originally posted by airwise
Arrow,

come back when you are English :wave:


So its ok to call someone a Monkey as long as your english? But no one else can call you one?

#56 airwise

airwise
  • Member

  • 2,001 posts
  • Joined: March 05

Posted 03 February 2008 - 09:15

It's OK to discuss the subtleties of the English language when you are English yes.

#57 miguevaio

miguevaio
  • Member

  • 214 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:04

Originally posted by Jacquesback
I'm sure it's not representative of all you spanish people. :lol:

typical spanish people


:lol: as I am sure than this one is not representative of the British....

http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

P.S.: I won't put a title to the link in contradiction with my sentence....;)

#58 Cindy

Cindy
  • Member

  • 614 posts
  • Joined: February 99

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:19

The reason why the Spanish are being highlighted here is because of their recent history of racism in Spanish sports, in particular football.

Throwing bananas, making monkey sounds, and racist insults directed toward black players/driver is different than normal "bad" fan activity I think.

Do UK football fans yell racist (in group unison no less) at black footballers, even their own players? Then I don't think it's the same.


#59 miguevaio

miguevaio
  • Member

  • 214 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:21

Originally posted by airwise


But when we see racist behavior that is clearly illegal according to EU law, coming from a disturbing number of people from a country with a nationalist past , someone somewhere has to stamp it out in my opinion. At least bring it to the authorities attention. Those throwing bananas and making monkey chants should be arrested and locked up. It's as simple as that.


do you care to put some argument in this please? I am very curious to know .... and I am sure that you have good facts, not just bias, to say something as that......

and by the way, could you name one country that in some point of its history hasn't been rabid nationalistic? just one, please :rolleyes:

Advertisement

#60 Cindy

Cindy
  • Member

  • 614 posts
  • Joined: February 99

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:26

Honestly, are you trying to excuse Spanish fans for racism? It's blatant and by a large portion of the fans.

I've been to football match last year in Spain, and I never seen anything in my life like that. The racism towards black players, even their own was disgusting.

Their is no excuse for that activity today, no way.

#61 miguevaio

miguevaio
  • Member

  • 214 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:31

Originally posted by Cindy
The reason why the Spanish are being highlighted here is because of their recent history of racism in Spanish sports, in particular football.

Throwing bananas, making monkey sounds, and racist insults directed toward black players/driver is different than normal "bad" fan activity I think.

Do UK football fans yell racist (in group unison no less) at black footballers, even their own players? Then I don't think it's the same.


It is the same or not depending what you want to read or to hear. Everywhere there are stupid people, everywhere there are normal people. To choose the stupid ones of one country and to compare with th enormal people of the other country is a dangerous game, and a worrying one.... :rolleyes:

You find what you want to search for......just few examples


http://uk.eurosport....acist-fans.html

http://scotland.theo...ist-chants.html

http://www.theredcar...9_oct_swpl.html

http://www.skysports...2391246,00.html

http://www.le.ac.uk/...pl01summary.pdf

http://www.homeoffic...pdf?view=Binary


And I could do it in Italy, in Germany, etc......would I be proving anything? I think not

:wave:

#62 miguevaio

miguevaio
  • Member

  • 214 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:39

Originally posted by Cindy
Honestly, are you trying to excuse Spanish fans for racism? It's blatant and by a large portion of the fans.

I've been to football match last year in Spain, and I never seen anything in my life like that. The racism towards black players, even their own was disgusting.

Their is no excuse for that activity today, no way.


Of course not, not at all. I agree, there is not excuse for racism.

But there is bias when you see and point an example and from that example you generalize for a whole country, we could do examples as the one you have done for any country you want....and? we would make a point or something? have you lived enough in Spain to actually know if people are racists or not? ....please let's leave common places..... :wave:

#63 Cindy

Cindy
  • Member

  • 614 posts
  • Joined: February 99

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:40

Have you even been to a recent UK game, and have several hundred fans making monkey noises when a black player touched the ball?

Having a few idiots here and there can happen anywhere, that is true. But the sheer number of fans I've seen in Spain doesn't compare.

I'm not trying to say Spanish are more racist in general over any other country, but there seems to be a level of freedom allowed in games that I think is a bit high.

#64 miguevaio

miguevaio
  • Member

  • 214 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:44

Originally posted by Cindy
Have you even been to a recent UK game, and have several hundred fans making monkey noises when a black player touched the ball?

Having a few idiots here and there can happen anywhere, that is true. But the sheer number of fans I've seen in Spain doesn't compare.


how many matches have you seen?

that your theory is as biased as if I would think that because there a lot of drunks among British fans when they go abroad, all the people of there (UK) are the same. I don't, I know that they are just a little nasty group that unluckily exist everywhere......but, do you?

#65 Cindy

Cindy
  • Member

  • 614 posts
  • Joined: February 99

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:51

Again, you are pointing out small isolated groups of trouble makers that can appear anywhere. Like I mentioned, I'm talking about large groups of fans (hundreds) in unison yelling out racist insults at black players, even their own.

A group of drunk hooligans in one thing, several hundred unified fans making monkey sounds is another.

#66 J

J
  • Member

  • 675 posts
  • Joined: December 99

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:52

According to Ilta-Sanomat the Marca reports that Hamilton was being tainted in racist terms any time he was near spanish fans during Barcelona tests.

http://www.iltasanom....asp?id=1483706

-J

#67 former champ

former champ
  • Member

  • 2,537 posts
  • Joined: February 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:55

That is just ****ing ridiculous and such an overreaction by these arseholes. :down:

#68 miguevaio

miguevaio
  • Member

  • 214 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 10:56

Originally posted by Cindy
Again, you are pointing out small isolated groups of trouble makers that can appear anywhere. Like I mentioned, I'm talking about large groups of fans (hundreds) in unison yelling out racist insults at black players, even their own.

A group of drunk hooligans in one thing, several hundred unified fans making monkey sounds is another.


and you are minimizing a group and maximizing the other....for me, without real numbers, are the same. Drunk holligans are not few as you pretend, and I don't know in UK but they are very famous when abroad.....so....not so few

Anyway, my point is that not spanish people are racist, not british are racist and drunks...just few of both are that. Let's not try to make a issue where there is not

#69 Cindy

Cindy
  • Member

  • 614 posts
  • Joined: February 99

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:04

Let’s agree to disagree, since we will not convince each other.

I enjoyed my months stay in Spain; it is a wonderful country with nice people. I am Polish with Filipino husband and children. We personally did not see any racism against me or my husband and children during our stay. So again, I'm not saying Spanish are racist people.

But I was very surprised at what we saw during a football game, I have never seen it to that level anywhere else in the World.

#70 miguevaio

miguevaio
  • Member

  • 214 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:08

Originally posted by Cindy
Let’s agree to disagree, since we will not convince each other.

I enjoyed my months stay in Spain; it is a wonderful country with nice people. I am Polish with Filipino husband and children. We personally did not see any racism against me or my husband and children during our stay. So again, I'm not saying Spanish are racist people.

But I was very surprised at what we saw during a football game, I have never seen it to that level anywhere else in the World.


OK, agreed! :)

I was living in 2006 for few months in Warsaw and I say the same, I have very nice memories of Poland and Polish people

About football, I don't like it anymore, it shows the worst of any country. I am living in Italy now, and it is just ashaming what it is happening here....and also here, Italy and Italians are beautiful people, and not racist ones....so, believe me, getting a football match as an valid example is plain dangerous ;)

#71 Cindy

Cindy
  • Member

  • 614 posts
  • Joined: February 99

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:16

True, but my husband is a fan ;)

Lets stick with F1.

#72 Lifew12

Lifew12
  • Member

  • 4,551 posts
  • Joined: May 06

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:32

Originally posted by miguevaio


how many matches have you seen?


I worked at Newcastle United FC for a number of years; i've seen hundreds of matches. Cindy is quite right.
Those shouting racist abuse were not generally drunken hooligans, but otherwise responsible husbands, father, brothers and sons, often with their children in tow.

Believe me, until you've hear 52000 people sing 'Peter Reid's got a f***ing Monkey's head....' and felt the sheer tension and vitriol, you can't quite get a handle on it.

We've been here before with the 'hooligan element' in F1 - think 'Mansell-Mania'.

#73 SeanValen

SeanValen
  • Member

  • 16,933 posts
  • Joined: February 01

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:36

Some people will never further themselfs in this life, it's sad, so I'm not surprised, ir's just extra disappointing us f1 fans have a good record of behaviour at events, I love Spain, ashame those idiots have to spoil it.

"But if everything in life was positive, how boring would it be? Michael Schumacher Japan 2006.


:smoking: :smoking: :up:We must remain positive and keep things in perspective of our positive potential energy in the light of world differences.



#74 djellison

djellison
  • Member

  • 1,725 posts
  • Joined: September 04

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:36

Originally posted by RSNS


You are overreacting. Blame tabloids, not your country.


So it's the Tabloids screaming obscenities and throwing things on the track is it? I don't blame the red-top newspapers for the British football hooliganism that used to occur a lot in Europe. Now, we're a lot better, not perfect, but a lot better. I know some British fans scared to go to Italy, Turkey or Spain because they fear for their own safety. But at no point were the tabloids 'to blame' - it was the moronic disgraceful 'fans' to blame and NO ONE else. THEY took it upon themselves to start fights, insult their opposing fans, gang up, cause violence. The papers had nothing to do with it.

There is a clear, obvious different between saying "stop being such a monkey" to a colleague (which is basically as strong as 'prat' or 'muppet' or 'idiot' - a totally non racially motivated phrase) - and the fundamentally racist behavior of these 'fans' at testing. It's analogous to say, 'anyone want a fag' (a cigraette) or 'you're such a fag' (homophobic reference)

They should be identified from the photographs, banned from ANY sporting venue - and the grandstands reopened for proper Spanish F1 fans - which I am sure the vast majority would condem this recent behaviour.

But somehow, someone points out this racist behaviour (now very well documented) and people come out from the woodwork and seemingly defend it. :down:


Doug

#75 Durant

Durant
  • Member

  • 694 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:39

Originally posted by djellison

There is a clear, obvious different between saying "stop being such a monkey" to a colleague (which is basically as strong as 'prat' or 'muppet' or 'idiot' - a totally non racially motivated phrase) - and the fundamentally racist behavior of these 'fans' at testing. It's analogous to say, 'anyone want a fag' (a cigraette) or 'you're such a fag' (homophobic reference)

But somehow, someone points out this racist behaviour (now very well documented) and people come out from the woodwork and seemingly defend it. :down:


Much like the people defending Hamilton for calling the rest of the grid monkeys. He didnt say 'stop being a monkey' he directly labelled them monkeys. A direct insult. Just imagine if Alonso had called Hamilton a monkey.

#76 Lifew12

Lifew12
  • Member

  • 4,551 posts
  • Joined: May 06

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:39

Originally posted by Durant


Much like the people defending Hamilton from calling the rest of the grid monkeys. He didnt say 'stop being a monkey' he directly labelled them monkeys. A direct insult. Just imagine if Alonso had called Hamilton a monkey.


I do think it has been explained to you that it is hardly considered an insult in the UK.

#77 Durant

Durant
  • Member

  • 694 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:43

Originally posted by Lifew12


I do think it has been explained to you that it is hardly considered an insult in the UK.


Even if that was true, He wasnt in the Uk and he wasnt addressing Uk citizens, so he insulted a whole bunch of drivers. If its not an insult what does it mean in the UK? A compliment?

#78 Lifew12

Lifew12
  • Member

  • 4,551 posts
  • Joined: May 06

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:44

Originally posted by Durant


Even if that was true, He wasnt in the Uk and he wasnt addressing Uk citizens, so he insulted a whole bunch of drivers. If its not an insult what does it mean in the UK? A compliment?


I think you endeavour to miss the point.

It has been explained to you.

#79 Durant

Durant
  • Member

  • 694 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:51

Originally posted by Lifew12


I think you endeavour to miss the point.


I think you endeavour to excuse any sin Hamilton commits. Business as usual around here. Ive never seen a driver with so many biased and fanatical supporters. The Finns are pretty bad but there are not that many. With Hamilton its global.

Advertisement

#80 Chiara

Chiara
  • Member

  • 1,847 posts
  • Joined: December 06

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:53

Originally posted by Durant


Even if that was true, He wasnt in the Uk and he wasnt addressing Uk citizens, so he insulted a whole bunch of drivers. If its not an insult what does it mean in the UK? A compliment?


It depends on the context in which it is used. But you can call someone a monkey here without it being an insult. It can be used in the sense of describing someone as being mischievous or naughty. For example when my cat is being particularly naughty as she is want to do on occasion I often say "stop being a little monkey".

#81 Durant

Durant
  • Member

  • 694 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:55

Originally posted by Chiara


It depends on the context in which it is used. But you can call someone a monkey here without it being an insult. It can be used in the sense of describing someone as being mischievous or naughty. For example when my cat is being particularly naughty as she is want to do on occasion I often say "stop being a little monkey".


Hamilton was not addressing a cat and his context was very different.

#82 Lifew12

Lifew12
  • Member

  • 4,551 posts
  • Joined: May 06

Posted 03 February 2008 - 11:56

Originally posted by Durant


I think you endeavour to excuse any sin Hamilton commits.



Any? You judge my attitude on the basis of me pointing out that one thing he said isn't anywhere as bad as you want to believe? I could point to far more dodgy comments made by Hamilton, and by other drivers, but that's not what we're discussing here, is it?

Business as usual around here. Ive never seen a driver with so many biased and fanatical supporters.



You clearly have not been watching F1 for more than a year, then.

The Finns are pretty bad but there are not that many. With Hamilton its global.


It was global with Michael, too, or were you unaware that he has a massive supporters base in, as everywhere, the UK?

Your refusal to understand that a simple off-hand comment was not the great insult you want it to have been is simply daft.

#83 Cheap Wine Alesi

Cheap Wine Alesi
  • Member

  • 2,723 posts
  • Joined: December 04

Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:09

Originally posted by Chiara

For example when my cat is being particularly naughty as she is want to do on occasion I often say "stop being a little monkey".

But if your cat is black, does it amount to racial abusing?

#84 hobbes

hobbes
  • Member

  • 889 posts
  • Joined: December 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:11

Originally posted by Jacquesback
I'm sure it's not representative of all you spanish people. :lol:

typical spanish people


all mediterrenean countries are similar to that;) Lazio fans burned down buildings when their team had a black player or something. In Greece probably you would be shocked by the amount of insults and swear words you would hear in a football match. In the UK you watch football matches and all the people are sitting down, or standing which is pretty admirable. In my country where all the stands have huge fences surrounding them, there are people hanging from the fence and maybe only the VIPs are sitting. During the match fans from different teams might insult each other really badly , but when its all over, most of them act as if nothing happened.

Originally posted by ensign14
It comes from an ancient Greek word meaning madness..."mania" came first as the adjective derives from the noun.


Not sure bout the ancient greek meaning but mania in modern greek is something like obsession, but there are certain derivatives of that word such which are related to madness.

I dont think there is a problem in F1. In general the more fans a sport will have, the bigger the proportion of idiots will be. Most of it is not even pure hatred and it really shouldnt be taken seriously. You are giving credit to them by bothering.

#85 K-One

K-One
  • Member

  • 5,898 posts
  • Joined: June 00

Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:13

Originally posted by Durant
Business as usual around here. Ive never seen a driver with so many biased and fanatical supporters.


Better check out this Alonso and his "fans" or maybe just a look into mirror will do the job.

This is quite worrying indeed, to my knowledge F1 hasn't seen anything like this before. I wouldn't like to spend 3 days watching idiots like these during GP weekend and pay for it :down:

#86 F1Fanatic.co.uk

F1Fanatic.co.uk
  • Member

  • 1,725 posts
  • Joined: May 05

Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:19

Apologies if this has already been posted: Hamilton subjected to racial abuse by Spanish fans

#87 hobbes

hobbes
  • Member

  • 889 posts
  • Joined: December 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:24

Nobody is saying that racism or fanatisism are good things. There are narrow minded people in this world and in certain cultures people get more passionate over things. Maybe something should be done, but people shouldnt make a whole story out of it because its just like encouraging them.

#88 Slowinfastout

Slowinfastout
  • Member

  • 9,681 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:30

If this ever gets out of hand (its bloody testing, isnt it?), we should kindly ask Hamilton and Alonso to switch helmets for one race only... so we can watch all the idiots have an heart attack?

#89 djellison

djellison
  • Member

  • 1,725 posts
  • Joined: September 04

Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:53

You can argue the semantics - but it's a fact that monkey can be used both in a racial intentionally offensive way and an innocent non racial context.

But that point is essentially moot when we have reports of "puto negro" and "negro de mierda" being used -direct racism from some Spanish F1 fans. People like that should be ejected from the circuit, and banned from any sporting venue. An utter disgrace. I dont for one second suggest that all Spaniards are racist. They are not. My mum lives in Salobrena, I've spent quite a while over there, they're a friendly bunch of people.

But racism is racism, and it must be stamped out, those guilty of it punished. I would not seek to condemn the whole of Spain or Spanish F1 fans for this - but they MUST take STRONG action to eliminate it immediately. If they don't take immediate and strong action, then they become at least partially responsible for it.

And yet, still, in this place, people try and justify this action. Instead of saying "Yes - this is wrong - they must be punished" - the response is "Well other people are racist". That's pathetic.

Doug

#90 K-One

K-One
  • Member

  • 5,898 posts
  • Joined: June 00

Posted 03 February 2008 - 12:57

Originally posted by djellison

And yet, still, in this place, people try and justify this action. Instead of saying "Yes - this is wrong - they must be punished" - the response is "Well other people are racist". That's pathetic.

Doug


:up: Spot on. There's no way to justify that kind of behaviour

#91 J

J
  • Member

  • 675 posts
  • Joined: December 99

Posted 03 February 2008 - 13:23

Originally posted by djellison

But racism is racism, and it must be stamped out, those guilty of it punished. I would not seek to condemn the whole of Spain or Spanish F1 fans for this - but they MUST take STRONG action to eliminate it immediately. If they don't take immediate and strong action, then they become at least partially responsible for it.

And yet, still, in this place, people try and justify this action. Instead of saying "Yes - this is wrong - they must be punished" - the response is "Well other people are racist". That's pathetic.

Doug


Could not agree more with you.

-J

#92 ensign14

ensign14
  • Member

  • 35,885 posts
  • Joined: December 01

Posted 03 February 2008 - 13:42

Originally posted by djellison

But racism is racism, and it must be stamped out, those guilty of it punished. I would not seek to condemn the whole of Spain or Spanish F1 fans for this - but they MUST take STRONG action to eliminate it immediately. If they don't take immediate and strong action, then they become at least partially responsible for it.

Good luck on F1 doing anything about that. When Chanoch Nissany would be barred from driving in a Grand Prix because of his nationality...

#93 VresiBerba

VresiBerba
  • Member

  • 8,951 posts
  • Joined: April 02

Posted 03 February 2008 - 13:45

Originally posted by Lifew12
I do think it has been explained to you that it is hardly considered an insult in the UK.

Makes me wonder why Coulthard had to appologise for calling Montoya a monkey :rolleyes:

#94 Ferrim

Ferrim
  • Member

  • 817 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 13:47

Originally posted by Tifoso05


I wish I was but... it's the harsh reality.

Things have been quite extreme since Alonso started winning. The media, sometimes helped by Alonso and never stopped by him, atacked Michael Schumacher and Ferrari: cheaters, you're old, cheaters x2, cheaters x 20000. That was the game.

Now Alonso has been defeated by his team mate, and by Kimi Räikkönen. So the new bunch of "F1 Experts" who started watching F1 since.... .... 2003? That's too much, Maybe 2005 after Alonso won a race. So those experts and the media started moaning and go against every one else. During 2007, the ball was passed to McLaren rather than Ferrari. They started gently talking about the wonderful team and ended in non-sense stupidity.

The media influences too much these "F1 Experts" who think that F1 is like football where they throw pig heads to the field, bottles of water, lighters... And that's how things will go if no one does anything agains it.

My solution: Make them pay for going there.


:up: :up: :up:

I was starting to think I was the only one among the spanish posters who had this view of what's going on.

What really annoys me about these "Alonso supporters" is that these people didn't care about F1 some years ago. When I was cheering Pedro for a f***ing 6th in Melbourne, or Marc for the same 6th in the Nurburgring. When I was so excited because Pedro started 5th in the grid at Hockenheim (nowadays, if Alonso starts 5th it's a disaster).

These people (at least, most of them) were nowhere on August 24th, 2003, the most intense race of my life. I spent the 70 laps of the Hungarian fearing for Alonso's engine and cried at the end when he won the race. I also shouted when he successfully defended his place against Schumacher at Imola and at Istambul. By then I had a mounting dislike of his attitude. But it was last year when it finally exploded, because before I wanted to believe that Renault really were wrong with him at times. But last year it was all the same at McLaren, and then I couldn't give him a break anymore.

Still, I don't have anything against him, because he has brought a lot of popularity to the sport and that is always good. I also believe he has some kind of psychological disorder (not to say it's something serious, because everyone has something like that). But I can't stand this stupid attitude from these hooligans.

People say: "it happens also at other places and happened before". Okay. But I'm Spanish, I live in Spain and therefore I tend to care of what happens here. If the rest of the world goes the wrong way it doesn't matter.

By the way, last year I went a couple of times to Jerez testing, and it happened by chance that these days Alonso wasn't there. Now I know I'll never go to a testing day on which either Alonso or Hamilton are over there. Thanks to all "Alonso supporters" (I mean the ones who do these things, of course).

#95 Wouter

Wouter
  • Member

  • 5,778 posts
  • Joined: August 01

Posted 03 February 2008 - 14:03

Ferrim, a big :up: for your response.

#96 big x

big x
  • Member

  • 446 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 14:34

Originally posted by Durant


Much like the people defending Hamilton for calling the rest of the grid monkeys. He didnt say 'stop being a monkey' he directly labelled them monkeys. A direct insult. Just imagine if Alonso had called Hamilton a monkey.


No, the connotation of the word is different, the later could imply more than its literal meaning.

adam

#97 MichaelPM

MichaelPM
  • Member

  • 2,583 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 14:36

http://www.pitpass.c...es_art_id=33858

Something has to be done within any community to make people understand something like this is not acceptable.

#98 Burai

Burai
  • Member

  • 990 posts
  • Joined: February 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 15:04

The only answer to the problem if it gets out of hand are severe FIA sanctions. From banning individual supporters from FIA-sanctioned events worldwide, fines for the circuit owners, removing Spain from the calendar and at the most extreme banning Spanish participants from F1 events.

That's what they do in football. Any sign of racial trouble or violence and EUFA start handing out fines and bans. It doesn't matter whether it's the majority or minority, you cannot sit by and let this sort of thing happen.

The price of admission does not give supporters carte blanche to throw items at the participants, nor does it give them the right to racially abuse them. That picture of the supporters in blackface is absolutely sickening.

And anyone who can't see the difference between

a) Hamilton calling backmarkers "monkeys" for acting stupid
b) Fans calling Hamilton a "monkey" for being black

really, really needs to a take a long hard look at themselves.

#99 PdlR

PdlR
  • New Member

  • 13 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 03 February 2008 - 15:07

Originally posted by Kenaltgr


Oh dear what short memories you have. Damon Hill had to have guarded police at the 1994 Hockenheim GP after receiving death threats from Schumacher fanatics on the Friday of the weekend. Look it up, it makes anything compared to Alonso's fans seems like childs play.


Agreed. My dislike for Alonso grows higher because of this kind of things, but let's not sing the old "this-has-never-happended-before" song, because the old times, as it always shows, weren't better. Alain Prost had to be escorted by the brazilian police during his duels with Senna at Interlagos, just to mention another older case.

Advertisement

#100 Two_Jags

Two_Jags
  • Member

  • 66 posts
  • Joined: March 03

Posted 03 February 2008 - 15:10

MichaelPM http://www.pitpass.c...es_art_id=33858



That's just despicable - how long were they allowed to get away with that? If they did that in a British football ground they'd be kicked out straight away & banned for a long time.

I have a vague memory of an incident at Monza during the 80s - didn't a 'fan' throw something at one of the cars (Alain Prost?) during qualifying? I seem to remember Bernie saying that if anything else was thrown onto the track there would never be another F1 race in Italy. Can't find anything about it on the 'net so I hope I haven't imagined it!