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What will you think of HAmilton if mclaren still fails to make hia winning champion?


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#51 volumenzero

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 23:36

Originally posted by Claudius



Alonso told The Sunday People: “The less said about him [LH] the better especially when he is someone who has achieved nothing at all.”
http://sports.setant...slams-Hamilton/

;)





Please verify your sources, because that was a personal interview in Spanish between Alonso and a Spanish reporter, not The Sun.

Post the original please.

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#52 Josta

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 00:08

Originally posted by Claudius

I'm sure Alonso was a disgrace to Mercedes, being beaten by a rookie...


Beaten by how many points exactly?

Remember, "we are not racing Kimi, we are racing Fernando".

How many drivers in the history of the sport had their owner openly stating that they were against their own driver?

Given this, if Ron didn't love Lewis so much, Mcaren and Fernando would be champions. Instead, they won nothing.

#53 volumenzero

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 00:27

Originally posted by Josta


Beaten by how many points exactly?

Remember, "we are not racing Kimi, we are racing Fernando".

How many drivers in the history of the sport had their owner openly stating that they were against their own driver?

Given this, if Ron didn't love Lewis so much, Mcaren and Fernando would be champions. Instead, they won nothing.



Looking at the standings Lewis beat Alonso. It was with equal points and one second place more. Lewis did this in his first F1 season, a great achievement, because Alonso is a 2 times WDC.

But in my opinion Lewis had everything on his side, and Alonso the opposite. Lewis did everything perfect, if we exclude the two last races. Alonso underperformed. In a normal season, with the same car, in a different team, Alonso could have trashed Lewis easily.

my opinion that is.

#54 airwise

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 08:27

Originally posted by volumenzero



my opinion that is.


And a highly amusing one if I may say so.

#55 Durant

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 09:21

Originally posted by Claudius



The problem is Alonso.

He, as a 2Wdc veteran should have won in 07.
He lost it.

McLaren had to rely on a rookie, from the 3d race of the season, who came very close to winning.
I'm sure Alonso was a disgrace to Mercedes, being beaten by a rookie...


The only disgrace is your post.

#56 CWeil

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 09:58

Originally posted by Apocalypse
but if he can't destroy Kovalainen (who in general public's minds is just an average driver)... that will seriously lower his status.


...what general public is this?!

#57 volumenzero

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 13:28

Originally posted by CWeil


...what general public is this?!



Kova had a not so good car last year. He made a good job with it.

#58 CWeil

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 16:31

He had a number of great drives last year. A rough start for sure, but the car wasn't very good, which never helps the rookie cause. A couple races in and he was off running, and by the end of the year he was great!

I just somehow don't think he's seen as an "average driver by the general public". I personally think he's the outright quickest of the 'new generation'.

#59 Claudius

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 16:33

Originally posted by volumenzero





Please verify your sources, because that was a personal interview in Spanish between Alonso and a Spanish reporter, not The Sun.

Post the original please.


That's the only source I've got and it seems like a direct quote.

If you're not happy with that, you can post "the original" (whatever that may mean)

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#60 Claudius

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 16:48

Originally posted by Josta


Beaten by how many points exactly?

Remember, "we are not racing Kimi, we are racing Fernando".

How many drivers in the history of the sport had their owner openly stating that they were against their own driver?



Here we go again, poor Alonso was so mistreated in McLaren that he couldn't beat Lewis with equal machinery

WDC table states Lewis is second and Alonso third by virtue of his classifications. They have 4 wins both, but Lewis has 6 Poles compared to Alonsos 2. In his rookie year, he outqualifies the champion in equal machinery.

If Alonso was so good you guys are claiming, he would have been comfortably ahead, due to his invaluable experience, which is very important in F1. But in comes Lewis, without driving on many tracks, and leads the WDC from the third race all the way to the last. Beating everyone, including Alonso, many times.
While Alonso, the double WDC, started throwing his toys around when the rookie became too quick to handle.

BTW, that comment from Ron was from the penultimate race of the season, when he'd have enough of Alonsos petulance and arrogance. The guy who ratted his team out (and possible blackmail) had it coming...


Originally posted by Josta

Given this, if Ron didn't love Lewis so much, Mcaren and Fernando would be champions. Instead, they won nothing.


And had Ron let his drivers race in Monace instead of handicapping Lewis with 5 laps of fuel, who knows, they would be champions. Instead, they won nothing coz Ron handed the victory to Alonso.

#61 Durant

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Posted 06 February 2008 - 23:42

Originally posted by Claudius

If Alonso was so good you guys are claiming, he would have been comfortably ahead, due to his invaluable experience, which is very important in F1. But in comes Lewis, without driving on many tracks, and leads the WDC from the third race all the way to the last. Beating everyone, including Alonso, many times.
While Alonso, the double WDC, started throwing his toys around when the rookie became too quick to handle.


Experience is overrated these days when you had driver aids, and 4 hours to learn the tracks and a WC to setup the car. You are right that he led the WC until the final race with help from the stewards protecting him at every possible moment, but he still lost the WC. The worst capitulation in the history of the sport.

Originally posted by Claudius

And had Ron let his drivers race in Monace instead of handicapping Lewis with 5 laps of fuel, who knows, they would be champions. Instead, they won nothing coz Ron handed the victory to Alonso.

Another Hamilton fan who cant accept defeat.

#62 SlateGray

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 00:00

Originally posted by Claudius


And had Ron let his drivers race in Monace instead of handicapping Lewis with 5 laps of fuel, who knows, they would be champions. Instead, they won nothing coz Ron handed the victory to Alonso.


The big picture!

Fernando Alonso 2X WDC (besting Schumacher in the process)

Lewis Hamilton 0X WDC (chocking big time in the process)

Alonso worked very hard for his championships; besting Schumacher in 06 took an almost faultless performance from Alonso

OTOH Hamilton could not manage to pick the WDC off of a silver platter.

We already know Alonso is one of the greatest champions the sport has ever seen

OTOH someday Hamilton may win a race, without the best car in the field, from a position other than pole.

PS Alonso was the better/faster driver in Monaco 07; nothing more there so let it rest already.

#63 Chui

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 01:16

Originally posted by SlateGray


The big picture!

Fernando Alonso 2X WDC (besting Schumacher in the process)

Lewis Hamilton 0X WDC (chocking big time in the process)

Alonso worked very hard for his championships; besting Schumacher in 06 took an almost faultless performance from Alonso

OTOH Hamilton could not manage to pick the WDC off of a silver platter.

We already know Alonso is one of the greatest champions the sport has ever seen

OTOH someday Hamilton may win a race, without the best car in the field, from a position other than pole.

PS Alonso was the better/faster driver in Monaco 07; nothing more there so let it rest already.

U forgot one thing.... he defeated the reigning two time WDC while choking big time. If you wish to tell a tale tell ALL of the tale.

#64 SlateGray

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 01:39

Originally posted by Chui

U forgot one thing.... he defeated the reigning two time WDC while choking big time. If you wish to tell a tale tell ALL of the tale.


Totally agree Hamilton was first among the losers in 07!

#65 Chui

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 02:44

The entirety of F1 was a "loser" with all of the political shenanigans this season. About the only high point was the new drivers if you ask me. And, much to the dismay of many, LH led the way. Alonso's driving looked pin sharp the last 1/3 of the season as well as Massa and Kimi on occasion.

The worst "loser" to me was the "blind allegiance" Alonso fans who did not (and apparently still aren't) helping his PR campaign. Idiots. They were closely followed by Alonso's attitude & infantile behavior. The "pro-LH-no-matter-whats" also seemed never to tire of uneventful stories about the new phenom. Of course, many were reactionaries to the Blind Allegiance who may have been reactionaries to the HUGE following the rookie phenom picked up early in the season.

No need to mention the Ferrari-FIA BS. I guess McLaren lost the most. I hope they dominate this season to stick it to the Ghouish illegits who run Scuderia Ferrari and FIA.

The entirety of it was immature. Let's hope things will improve...

That's my 2 cents.

#66 Durant

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 03:51

Originally posted by Chui

The worst "loser" to me was the "blind allegiance" Alonso fans who did not (and apparently still aren't) helping his PR campaign. Idiots. They were closely followed by Alonso's attitude & infantile behavior. The "pro-LH-no-matter-whats" also seemed never to tire of uneventful stories about the new phenom. Of course, many were reactionaries to the Blind Allegiance who may have been reactionaries to the HUGE following the rookie phenom picked up early in the season.

That's my 2 cents.


I noticed you didnt at all mention Hamiltons behaviour in your list of losers. I guess thats because your part of the 'pro LH no matter what' group. :up:

#67 CWeil

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 04:20

Threads like this, and posts like this, ruin this board.

#68 Chui

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 04:36

Originally posted by Durant


I noticed you didnt at all mention Hamiltons behaviour in your list of losers. I guess thats because your part of the 'pro LH no matter what' group. :up:

Well, for a rookie to challenge a reigning champion I give him a :up: for challenging both FA and RD to give him the opportunity to lose. When they did he won a few. I EXPECT the newcomers to be like hungry lions - just like FA was when he started. Did LH get it right all of the time? No one expected him to. We did expect more mature behavior from the champion. This does not diminish his driving skills, but shows that he still does have areas for improvement. He'll be the better for it and should do well with Regie-Renault.

#69 Durant

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 04:41

Originally posted by Chui

Well, for a rookie to challenge a reigning champion I give him a :up: for challenging both FA and RD to give him the opportunity to lose. When they did he won a few. I EXPECT the newcomers to be like hungry lions - just like FA was when he started.


Ah ok so its actually ok for Hamilton to whinge in post race press conferences after losing and to imply team sabotage, and to ignore team policy when it suits him and to start fights with his team mate, and kick off two FIA investigations, because he was a new comer and a 'hungry lion', but if anyone else like Alonso dares to respond they are losers and 'infantile'.
:lol:

#70 Chiara

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 06:35

Originally posted by CWeil
Threads like this, and posts like this, ruin this board.


Agreed. Whatever happened to having respect for your rivals? I have the utmost respect for all the F1 drivers, it's certainly not as easy as it looks, and for the teams who behind the scenes all work remarkably hard year in year out in a very tough ultra-competitive sport.

I think some people fail to realise that you can be a loyal dedicated supporter of a driver/team without the need to constantly denigrate the opposition. In fact doing so just looks a bit childish and petty IMHO.

Both Alonso and Hamilton did a pretty stirling job last season in spite of some very difficult and often tempestuous circumstances. I for one will be interested to see how they get on in their respective teams and situations this year.

#71 airwise

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 08:07

Originally posted by Chiara


Agreed. Whatever happened to having respect for your rivals?
Both Alonso and Hamilton did a pretty stirling job last season in spite of some very difficult and often tempestuous circumstances. I for one will be interested to see how they get on in their respective teams and situations this year.


I agree. Sadly in the 21st century, it seems de rigeur to analyse and accentuate the negatives rather than celebrate the positives. I blame 24 hour news channels in all honesty but I cannot see a way back. I think people's behavior has changed - and that includes the drivers.

#72 Apocalypse

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Posted 07 February 2008 - 12:05

Originally posted by volumenzero



Kova had a not so good car last year. He made a good job with it.


The hardcore F1 followers know what kind of difference a good equipment makes... and they also know that Heikki drove a good, solid season last year with an absolutely dreadful car. Even Flavio admits that...

When I said "general public" I refer to average F1 followers. For them, someone like Heikki Kovalainen is just another driver, while in their mind Hammy plays in the same league with Kimi and Alonso.

I'm not saying that Heikki isn't a good driver, he certainly is. I just meant that people outside places like this don't see him as top contender... and if he suddenly starts beating the Golden Boy, it will make an impact to Hamilton's reputation.