Jump to content


Photo

McLaren's won't take the last pit garage... and BMW (merged)


  • Please log in to reply
88 replies to this topic

#1 IannDC

IannDC
  • Member

  • 166 posts
  • Joined: August 07

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:17

I've been given some information from a very reliable source that McLaren have been allocated the fourth pit garage, and that BMW have requested not to be next to Ferrari. If this is the case, the first four garages for 2008 would be Ferrari, Renault, BMW and McLaren.

Anyone can collaborate what I've been told?

Advertisement

#2 Group B

Group B
  • Member

  • 13,971 posts
  • Joined: March 02

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:30

I always assumed they were allocated by finishing order. Surely you can't allow random requests :confused:

#3 IannDC

IannDC
  • Member

  • 166 posts
  • Joined: August 07

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:33

That is exactly my thoughts, but I've seen the garage plans from another source, that is why I am curious.

#4 undersquare

undersquare
  • Member

  • 18,929 posts
  • Joined: November 07

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:33

Originally posted by IannDC
I've been given some information from a very reliable source that McLaren have been allocated the fourth pit garage, and that BMW have requested not to be next to Ferrari. If this is the case, the first four garages for 2008 would be Ferrari, Renault, BMW and McLaren.

Anyone can collaborate what I've been told?


Gerry said yesterday he'd seen the McLaren garage between Williams and RB, ie 5th.

No idea about BMW, but as a bit of gossip quite interesting! Why don't they want to be next to Ferrari?

#5 undersquare

undersquare
  • Member

  • 18,929 posts
  • Joined: November 07

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:36

Originally posted by Group B
I always assumed they were allocated by finishing order. Surely you can't allow random requests :confused:


I believe this is not an FIA/championship issue, just an FoM agreement between the teams, the points are a basis for the agreement but open to renegotiation.

#6 IannDC

IannDC
  • Member

  • 166 posts
  • Joined: August 07

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:37

Intersting undersquare, when I saw the plans last week, they were placed in the fourth garage. I am curious about the BMW thing also, what could be the reason?

#7 Clatter

Clatter
  • Member

  • 27,315 posts
  • Joined: February 00

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:40

Mac not being in the last garage has been known for a while now.
http://forums.autosp...&threadid=99491

#8 Clatter

Clatter
  • Member

  • 27,315 posts
  • Joined: February 00

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:43

Originally posted by Group B
I always assumed they were allocated by finishing order. Surely you can't allow random requests :confused:


Think they can actually choose which garage they use, with the WCC having first choice.

#9 undersquare

undersquare
  • Member

  • 18,929 posts
  • Joined: November 07

Posted 03 March 2008 - 20:52

Originally posted by IannDC
Intersting undersquare, when I saw the plans last week, they were placed in the fourth garage. I am curious about the BMW thing also, what could be the reason?


Well it would be wholly incorrect of me to suggest they're worried about Ferrari spying on them...ooops! Starting to sound like Max now :rotfl:

#10 IannDC

IannDC
  • Member

  • 166 posts
  • Joined: August 07

Posted 03 March 2008 - 21:04

Probably the past Sauber-Ferrari relationship has made them a little uncomfortable.

#11 se7en_24

se7en_24
  • Member

  • 14,214 posts
  • Joined: March 01

Posted 03 March 2008 - 21:04

In other news, Guy Fawkes has been arrested for trying to blow up Parliament.

#12 jokuvaan

jokuvaan
  • Member

  • 4,060 posts
  • Joined: February 05

Posted 03 March 2008 - 21:06

I would not be suprised if there's post already from last year with begin: "according to TS...." at least what comes to Mclaren not taking last garage place.

#13 Rubens Hakkamacher

Rubens Hakkamacher
  • Member

  • 1,567 posts
  • Joined: March 04

Posted 05 March 2008 - 15:07

Originally posted by IannDC
Intersting undersquare, when I saw the plans last week, they were placed in the fourth garage. I am curious about the BMW thing also, what could be the reason?


Maybe the psychology of not wanting your prime driver seeing the top-tier being successful on a daily basis. I could imagine drivers, mid way through a season when things are not "optimal" in the team, might grouse in a way that is related to Ferrari/McLaren, by using first-person anecdotal things seen by being virtually next door.

"Yeah, but Mario I heard one of the Ferrari guys saying Aldo does it this way" - that kind of thing, perhaps.

It may also help with 2nd and third session qualifying strategy.

#14 gerry nassar

gerry nassar
  • RC Forum Host

  • 10,880 posts
  • Joined: November 98

Posted 05 March 2008 - 22:01

Originally posted by IannDC
I've been given some information from a very reliable source that McLaren have been allocated the fourth pit garage, and that BMW have requested not to be next to Ferrari. If this is the case, the first four garages for 2008 would be Ferrari, Renault, BMW and McLaren.

Anyone can collaborate what I've been told?


BMW was next to Ferrari when i went by on Sunday....

Posted Image


I'll probably pass by today/tonight and have another look.

#15 Mat

Mat
  • Member

  • 7,674 posts
  • Joined: January 99

Posted 06 March 2008 - 07:40

They were still in that same spot yesterday.

#16 Mika Mika

Mika Mika
  • Member

  • 6,738 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 06 March 2008 - 08:00

Originally posted by Mat
They were still in that same spot yesterday.


I wander how much info you can get by being next door :-)

#17 Melbourne Park

Melbourne Park
  • Member

  • 19,136 posts
  • Joined: October 00

Posted 06 March 2008 - 11:54

Originally posted by Mika Mika


I wander how much info you can get by being next door :-)

those signs are maybe quite old, and they just bang them up? The managers of all that will not arrive until the gear does I imagine.

#18 tifosi

tifosi
  • Member

  • 13,281 posts
  • Joined: June 99

Posted 06 March 2008 - 11:59

Originally posted by Group B
I always assumed they were allocated by finishing order. Surely you can't allow random requests :confused:


I think you get to pick by finishing order.

#19 kar

kar
  • Member

  • 10,307 posts
  • Joined: January 06

Posted 06 March 2008 - 12:02

Sounds like a load of horseshit to me. BMW could well challenge McLaren this year and having a pit garage further up the lane gives them a small advantage over that team, if not least in qualifying then certainly if they are racing for position during a grand prix.

Advertisement

#20 IannDC

IannDC
  • Member

  • 166 posts
  • Joined: August 07

Posted 06 March 2008 - 20:23

Thanks, Gerry.

Let us know anything, if you manage to come by some info. I saw some plans for the Sepang race. well things could change.

#21 le chat noir

le chat noir
  • Member

  • 4,278 posts
  • Joined: June 05

Posted 30 March 2008 - 17:16

how come they've been demoted to the last garage at bahrain then? and will this continue?

see autosport frontpage

#22 riffola

riffola
  • Member

  • 940 posts
  • Joined: March 02

Posted 30 March 2008 - 19:06

Wasn't the issue that their massive mobile home needed room which wasn't available at the back of the pitlane in Australia and Malayasia. Since Bahrain has loads of room, that's not a problem.

I am sure we'll see McLaren back in the middle of pitlane for the European races.

#23 MichaelPM

MichaelPM
  • Member

  • 2,587 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 30 March 2008 - 19:32

"We understand that it is in line with the rules and regulations of the sport for McLaren, which scored no points in the 2007 constructors' championship, to take the final set of garages," said Sakhir circuit boss Shaikh Salman bin Isa Al Khalifa.


That sounds to me like it is purely to do with rules being enforced, I have not seen any mention of it being done because they will have the room to operate from the final garage and that will dictate where their garage will be for the rest of the year rather then the rules.

#24 Group B

Group B
  • Member

  • 13,971 posts
  • Joined: March 02

Posted 30 March 2008 - 19:42

If I may play devil's advocate, if you're allocated a certain garage by the rules should you not be forced/required to bring vehicles that will fit?

#25 Gilles4Ever

Gilles4Ever
  • RC Forum Admin

  • 20,166 posts
  • Joined: June 04

Posted 30 March 2008 - 19:43

Originally posted by riffola
Wasn't the issue that their massive mobile home needed room which wasn't available at the back of the pitlane in Australia and Malayasia. Since Bahrain has loads of room, that's not a problem.

I am sure we'll see McLaren back in the middle of pitlane for the European races.


Also mini paragon doesn't travel to races outside europe, so even in Oz there was no reason for them to be anywhere except the end of the pitlane.

#26 cas422

cas422
  • Member

  • 66 posts
  • Joined: December 99

Posted 30 March 2008 - 22:35

Can someone explain why it matters which garage a team has? Is there an advantage to being near one or the other end of pit road or is it purely a status thing?

#27 stevvy1986

stevvy1986
  • Member

  • 3,168 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 30 March 2008 - 22:47

Originally posted by tifosi


I think you get to pick by finishing order.


nope,i'm pretty sure the rules say your garages are based on where you finished the previous season,nothing else

#28 JForce

JForce
  • Member

  • 13,840 posts
  • Joined: March 01

Posted 30 March 2008 - 23:02

AFAIK it isn't a "rule" as such, more a gentlemen's agreement amongst the teams?

#29 scheivlak

scheivlak
  • Member

  • 11,483 posts
  • Joined: August 01

Posted 30 March 2008 - 23:16

Originally posted by cas422
Can someone explain why it matters which garage a team has? Is there an advantage to being near one or the other end of pit road or is it purely a status thing?

There's usually more space at the top end, it's easier to get in front of the others in Q3 if necessary, and it's more rewarding to have a chance to occasionally "spy" on what Ferrari or BMW are doing than on Force India or Super Aguri.

#30 giacomo

giacomo
  • Member

  • 6,977 posts
  • Joined: December 05

Posted 30 March 2008 - 23:36

Originally posted by JForce
AFAIK it isn't a "rule" as such, more a gentlemen's agreement amongst the teams?

A gentlemen's agreement in modern F1? The textbook example of an antinomy.

#31 Melbourne Park

Melbourne Park
  • Member

  • 19,136 posts
  • Joined: October 00

Posted 31 March 2008 - 00:25

Originally posted by JForce
AFAIK it isn't a "rule" as such, more a gentlemen's agreement amongst the teams?


It would be interesting to know if there is such a rule.

I presume that the FIA ultimately makes the decision. And when a team protests about locations, then maybe the FIA steps in and makes the decision.

Once again, the public is not informed. did the FIA make this decision of its own accord? Did one or more teams protest? Did the FIA discuss grid positions and penalty issues?

#32 big x

big x
  • Member

  • 446 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 31 March 2008 - 02:28

Er....

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/66228

How come they have been moved again ?

#33 ashnathan

ashnathan
  • Member

  • 5,018 posts
  • Joined: March 07

Posted 31 March 2008 - 05:41

why are people still asking why they have been moved when it is clearly stated in the articles? sheesh.

#34 archstanton

archstanton
  • Member

  • 425 posts
  • Joined: February 08

Posted 31 March 2008 - 10:38

Originally posted by kids like ash
why are people still asking why they have been moved when it is clearly stated in the articles? sheesh.


eh ... no it is not clearly stated.

so why don't you help us out, if you already know, describe why in the box below; why they were originally assigned a middle garage, and grandstand tickets sold on that basis, and then why this has now been changed to and end garage.

the track owners wouldn't have decided on a whim to put mclaren in the middle - they were told where mclaren would be, and now they have been told to change where mclaren would be, why?

go on, show me the paragraph in the article that clearly explains this

that is what we are trying to talk about in these threads, you don't seem to have quite caught on to that.

#35 AFCA

AFCA
  • Member

  • 6,661 posts
  • Joined: February 06

Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:09

Amus says that the FIA and FOM were irritated about Dennis collecting the trophy on the podium in Melbourne. They expected Dennis to retire and his jubilation would have been a provocation. Now here's the answer to it, McLaren being relegated to the end of the pitlane.

#36 StefanV

StefanV
  • Member

  • 1,214 posts
  • Joined: February 08

Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:18

Originally posted by AFCA
Amus says that the FIA and FOM were irritated about Dennis collecting the trophy on the podium in Melbourne. They expected Dennis to retire and his jubilation would have been a provocation. Now here's the answer to it, McLaren being relegated to the end of the pitlane.

Wow :eek:

#37 VoidNT

VoidNT
  • Member

  • 1,561 posts
  • Joined: April 04

Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:21

Originally posted by AFCA
Amus says that the FIA and FOM were irritated about Dennis collecting the trophy on the podium in Melbourne. They expected Dennis to retire and his jubilation would have been a provocation. Now here's the answer to it, McLaren being relegated to the end of the pitlane.


God :eek: :eek: :eek: Something big is going on behind the scenes, indeed

#38 Actuary

Actuary
  • Member

  • 281 posts
  • Joined: March 08

Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:38

Max and his anti-McLaren, anti RD, pro Ferrari bias showing again. Max really needs to go.

#39 AFCA

AFCA
  • Member

  • 6,661 posts
  • Joined: February 06

Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:49

Yeah sure blame Max for all of what Coughlan and McLaren have done last year. The team - with important partner Mercedes - was lucky FOM was willing to co-operate with them in the first place giving them the 5th pitbox instead of the last, which they should actually be having.

Advertisement

#40 Buttoneer

Buttoneer
  • RC Forum Admin

  • 16,684 posts
  • Joined: May 04

Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:55

Originally posted by Actuary
Max and his anti-McLaren, anti RD, pro Ferrari bias showing again. Max really needs to go.

Maybe, but this is at least in accordance with the rules while giving them 5th place was not. If anything, this is the most unbiased decision that's been made in recent months.

#41 Mika Mika

Mika Mika
  • Member

  • 6,738 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 31 March 2008 - 12:04

Originally posted by AFCA
Yeah sure blame Max for all of what Coughlan and McLaren have done last year. The team - with important partner Mercedes - was lucky FOM was willing to co-operate with them in the first place giving them the 5th pitbox instead of the last, which they should actually be having.


I think Mclaren should have been last all along I dont undertand why they were put 5th in the first 2 races. However I dont think anyone can blame max for this he cant be the whipping boy all the time. :rotfl: :rotfl:

#42 AFCA

AFCA
  • Member

  • 6,661 posts
  • Joined: February 06

Posted 31 March 2008 - 12:12

Because of the importance of McLaren partner Mercedes the team was granted pitbox numero 5, all of the sponsor-guests not having to walk to the end of the pitlane (which really doesn't seem all that much drama to me). Anyway, this is particularly important at the European races when the teams come up with their motorhomes, which might mean the team will have to bring a smaller one to the GP's.

In any case, McLaren must suit themselves to the punishment, not the other way around.

#43 Actuary

Actuary
  • Member

  • 281 posts
  • Joined: March 08

Posted 31 March 2008 - 12:14

Aren't McLaren only getting 3 garages compared to other teams 4? That's more of a disadvantage than the position.

#44 Tuxy

Tuxy
  • Member

  • 953 posts
  • Joined: March 03

Posted 31 March 2008 - 12:43

Originally posted by Actuary
Max and his anti-McLaren, anti RD, pro Ferrari bias showing again. Max really needs to go.


:rotfl: :rotfl:

Wow, are you off your meds?

They were caught red-handed (so to speak), they are cheaters, and they got away with murder last season. How are you so blind?

#45 StefanV

StefanV
  • Member

  • 1,214 posts
  • Joined: February 08

Posted 31 March 2008 - 12:50

Originally posted by Tuxy


:rotfl: :rotfl:

Wow, are you off your meds?

They were caught red-handed (so to speak), they are cheaters, and they got away with murder last season. How are you so blind?

It does not change the fact that they were given the fifth garage. It might have been a "gift", but taking it away and put them at the slow end is nevertheless a punishment. If it is because of the reason AFCA stated it is a case of blatant abuse of power by FIA and FOM. FOM, by the way, should not really have any say in this, should they?

#46 Mika Mika

Mika Mika
  • Member

  • 6,738 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 31 March 2008 - 12:55

You have worried me than Max now did enjoy spanking Mclaren a little too much :lol: :lol:
allegedly

#47 vsubravet

vsubravet
  • Member

  • 2,121 posts
  • Joined: September 03

Posted 31 March 2008 - 17:01

Originally posted by Mika Mika
You have worried me than Max now did enjoy spanking Mclaren a little too much :lol: :lol:
allegedly


:lol: :lol: :lol: MM & spanking, huh? Obviously he loves it - too bad RD didn't recognise the fetish earlier.

#48 undersquare

undersquare
  • Member

  • 18,929 posts
  • Joined: November 07

Posted 31 March 2008 - 17:12

Originally posted by Tuxy


:rotfl: :rotfl:

Wow, are you off your meds?

They were caught red-handed (so to speak), they are cheaters, and they got away with murder last season. How are you so blind?


Max and Ferrari made it seem worse than it was.

#49 Gilles4Ever

Gilles4Ever
  • RC Forum Admin

  • 20,166 posts
  • Joined: June 04

Posted 31 March 2008 - 17:13

Originally posted by AFCA
Amus says that the FIA and FOM were irritated about Dennis collecting the trophy on the podium in Melbourne. They expected Dennis to retire and his jubilation would have been a provocation. Now here's the answer to it, McLaren being relegated to the end of the pitlane.


Has this been collaborated anywhere else? It seems a bit odd to have expected anyone other than Ron to have collected the trophy as he was the most senior McLaren person there. And if they were indeed punishing him why not do it at a track where having the last pitbox would actually make a difference.

#50 Tuxy

Tuxy
  • Member

  • 953 posts
  • Joined: March 03

Posted 31 March 2008 - 17:24

Originally posted by undersquare


Max and Ferrari made it seem worse than it was.


Well there's an objective response if I ever saw one. :rolleyes: