Non-F1 National Grands Prix

Originally posted by Ray Bell
More than haven't I would suggest...

France, for instance, ran a GP for Sports Cars because their cars were being trounced by the Germans. Germany ran their for F2, IIRC... Spain, Portugal, these places you would think never have gone away from F1 have either had non-F1 races before they got F1 events or have diverged for some reason along the way.

Japan had several different formulae for theirs before 1976... and then there were all the European GPs that were part of the WDC in 1952/53 which were run for F2.

Originally posted by Falcadore
When was the German GP for F2 cars, was that in hte pre-51 era when the powers that were, had yet to over look the WW2 (but were quite happy to include Italy?)

Originally posted by Falcadore



And what did happen to the Portuguese GP between the days of Oporto and Pedrables, and Estoril?

Originally posted by Falcadore
When was the German GP for F2 cars, was that in hte pre-51 era when the powers that were, had yet to over look the WW2 (but were quite happy to include Italy?)

Originally posted by Falcadore
Macau is however a principality not a country, we may as well include the Miami Grand Prix or the Gold Coast Grand Prix or...

Originally posted by jarama



Falcadore,

only to make things clear: Pedralbes wasn't a Portuguese circuit, but in Barcelona. Surely between Oporto and Estoril you're refering to Monsanto, isn't it?


Carles.

Originally posted by Rob29
Am Israel GP for F2 was attempted im 1970 but only got as far as practice.
Irish GP for sports cars. Also Venezuela & El Salvador
Indonesia had single seaters. Also Rhodesia to Sth African F1 rules.

Originally posted by Rob29
Am Israel GP for F2 was attempted im 1970 but only got as far as practice.
Irish GP for sports cars. Also Venezuela & El Salvador
Indonesia had single seaters. Also Rhodesia to Sth African F1 rules.

Originally posted by Falcadore


Why only practice for the IGP?

Originally posted by Falcadore


V8Supercar team owner Mark Larkham won the Indonesian Grand Prix at Sentul in his Formula Australia/Holden/Brabham/4000 Reynard in the early 90s.

Originally posted by ray b
indy 500
while not F-1 they gave WDC points up to the late 50's

Originally posted by petefenelon
But it was never a Grand Prix!

Originally posted by billthekat
So might disagree with that since one does find coverage of the "Grand Prix of Indianapolis" in the 1938 Official Bulletins of the AAA Contest Board. However, that is also perhaps irrelevant to most here since it is not within the framework that has been established for such things as a "grand prix."

As an aside, I have always been fascinated by how Alec Ulmann did things and how the 1959 Sebring event was the "II USGP," while the 1959 Riverside event was also the "USGP" -- with the notation (Sports Cars) -- and perhaps the actual "II USGP."

.....and the USGP was run in 1984 & 1985 as part of the CART series at the Meadowlands.

Recently came across mention of a Phillippines Grand Prix. Really?

2 or 3 years ago, about a dozen 'Formula Ford type' school cars were expoted there from a company in the UK.

So there must be a track there. That's all it takes..

Edited by Falcadore, 14 September 2012 - 07:46.

which non F1 national Grands Prix are still existing today? New Zealand Grand Prix (Formula Toyota)
and?

Just Macau. By FIA edict. Sadly.

Be a great leg-up particularly in emerging motorsport nations to have a Grand Prix at some category below F1 I would have thought.

So does this mean that BCE bought the rights to call races a Grand Prix? That effectively means he bought the French language. Or is it solely an FIA thing, and that BCE/CVC had nowt to do with the decision? I had no idea that this had happened - it's like saying you can't call a marathon that very thing unless you have permission from the mayor of Marathon.

There are lots of non-F1 Grand Prix races. The Indycar schedule is full of them. They just don't have a nation attached to the name.

There are lots of non-F1 Grand Prix races. The Indycar schedule is full of them. They just don't have a nation attached to the name.

Edited by Falcadore, 17 September 2012 - 09:24.

So does this mean that BCE bought the rights to call races a Grand Prix? That effectively means he bought the French language. Or is it solely an FIA thing, and that BCE/CVC had nowt to do with the decision? I had no idea that this had happened - it's like saying you can't call a marathon that very thing unless you have permission from the mayor of Marathon.

Edited by Falcadore, 17 September 2012 - 09:21.

Edited by BRG, 17 September 2012 - 11:11.

So if we call it the Gran Premio de Argentina or the Grosser Preiss von Österreich, that will be alright?

The Estonian Grand Prix was held in 1934, 1935 and 1936 for stripped-down touring cars and occasional odd racing car on a 6.7 kilometre circuit on the north-eastern outskirts of Tallinn.

Thought I'd revive this.

A lot of non-F1 national Grands Prix can be found in a category on Wikipedia, although, as I've discovered, it's very incomplete: https://en.wikipedia...nal_Grands_Prix

Others you won't find on Wikipedia:

- Uruguayan Grand Prix: A Libre race held as part of the Temporada series, I believe. There was a single race in 1952 held at Piriápolis, won by Fangio.

- Polish Grand Prix: As mentioned above, an FJunior race from 1963, first ever round of the International Cup of Peace and Friendship.

- Finnish Grand Prix: A race with that title was held a few times at Elaintarha over the years, and at least four further editions were held from 1966-69 (winners: Jack Brabham, Jim Clark, Ronnie Peterson and Ulf Svensson); the first two were held at Keimola, the latter two at Ahvenisto.

- Colombian Grand Prix: F2 race held in Bogotá in 1971, won by Jo Siffert.

- Venezuelan Grand Prix: The 1950s sportscar races are probably quite well-known, but there was also an F2 race with this title held at the San Carlos circuit in 1973, won by Andrea de Adamich.

- Brunei Grand Prix: Formula 2 race held in the capital in 1979. A Singapore newspaper makes reference to a 1978 edition, as well as different classes for motorcycles, touring cars and single seaters.

- Czechoslovakian Grand Prix: Wikipedia does have an article on this, but it's very inaccurate. It says that the 1949 edition of the race was the last, but it actually continued into the early 1950s, and later in the 1960s as well.

- Hungarian Grand Prix: If formula2.net is to be believed, 1936 wasn't the only time Hungary hosted its own Grand Prix before the Hungaroring was built. In the early-mid sixties, there were races held under the Magyar Nagydíj title at Ferihegy Airport.

- Costa Rican Grand Prix: An F3 race from 1991 held at San José, won by Giovanni Aloi.

- San Marino Grand Prix: The F1 Grand Prix at Imola is well-known, but in 1978-79 there were F3 races held under this title at Misano, won by Teo Fabi and Michele Alboreto.

The following are for entities that are either dependencies, or were under colonial rule at the time their races were run:

- Puerto Rico Grand Prix: Formula Junior race held at Caguas in 1962, won by Tim Mayer.

- Mozambique Grand Prix: Non-championship race on the South African F1 schedule in the 1960s.

- Angolan Grand Prix: Sportscar race from the 1960s.

- Algerian Grand Prix: I don't know if this even counts. Some sources list it as the Algerian Grand Prix, others as the Algiers Grand Prix. In any case it's a pre-war event from the colonial era.

- Tunisian Grand Prix: Same issue as with Algeria, same timeframe. Some call it the Tunisian Grand Prix, others the Tunis Grand Prix.

Edited by AByrne27, 16 September 2016 - 21:28.

In contemporaneous French sources the two North African races were referred to as the GP d'Alger (Algiers) and the GP de Tunis.

The German press (especially) were prone to changing race names in the 1920s and 1930s - you sometimes find German magazines calling the RAC Tourist Trophy the Grosser Preis von Grossbritannien, the Indianapolis 500 the Grosser Preis der Vereinigen Staaten and the Masaryk GP the Grosser Preis von Tschechoslowakei. This last appears to have fooled Wikipedia (why am I not surprised? )