I know most of you can't see the BBC F1 videos due to rights restrictions. Yesterday they put up an 18 minute video interview with Jake Humphrey interviewing Max Mosley. I've compiled a transcript for it - it's not perfect, but it is quite accurate.
Jake Humphrey: Well Max, Formula One is famous for posturing and politicalling, some people love that about the sport, but for the first time it seems like there is a serious threat to the future of Formula One, how have we ended up in this position?
Max Mosley: Well the fundamental problem is that the teams want to take over the whole financial side from Bernie and also the regulatory side from us - they would like to run the whole of Formula One, and quite obviously we don't agree. Money is Bernie's problem but as far as the regulations are concerned, we have been running the championship for 60 years and we intend to go on running it. If they want to start their own series, they can, but it won't be the Formula One World Championship.
JH: The teams say that they have done all they can, they feel that they have bent over backwards to try and help the FIA, to try to make the whole thing work. They have no appetite for compromise anymore - they say the ball is now in the FIA's court. What happens next, because as far as they are concerned, what happens next comes from you?
MM: Well, that's a complete distortion of what happened. The real quarrel of what happened is how much is spent. We're saying it's got to be reduced. It has got to come down to a figure that everyone knows. Now that is based on work which was done between January 2008 and June 2008 - a whole system was agreed with them and the only people who disagreed with that was Ferrari. The only argument then was going to be about the figure. They are now pretending that it is now dictatorial, something I dreamt up, it was all agreed with them. And it's a completely determined set of rules agreed by the Chief Financial officer of each team. It's actually all nonsense.
JH: Can you understand the confusion with the fans? Teams have told us they are willing to make cuts, the realise Formula 1 is too expension. The FIA think F1 is too expensive - where is the problem here? It's like both of you want the same thing but you can't achieve it.
MM: The difficult is that they say that they want to reduce costs and "we will do so in a way that suits us" and we [the FIA] are saying "by how much", and they say "well we don't really know" - they don't say anything specific. It is very vague and then they then say that they don't want to move anything until the 31st December, 2010, so it's almost two years away. We're saying it is much more urgent than that, it's really a question of not focusing on what needs to be done which is a clear reduction according to clear rules. The trouble is, when we are doing something like this, it is very easy to confuse the issue, but the basic issue: [teams] cannot go on spending like this. We must be clear about how much we can spend. We can't say a vague figure because then the teams don't know how much they can spend. The other side of it is that they want to achieve cost reduction by restricting the technology on the cars rather like we already have on the engines. We're saying "this can't go on" - you cannot simply freeze the chassis to stop progress on it. If you allow unlimited expenditure then they will spend a fortune on the chassis, so "limit the expenditure" then a clever engineer within that expenditure can do whatever he likes on the chassis. Now, that's a much more logical approach. Now that's all being lost in this suggestion, we're somehow dictating everything to them. Finally, we have made concession after concession to try and accomodate them and they keep saying no. Even though we have a meeting with them, for example on 11th June, we agreed everything with Red Bull, Ross Brawn, Ferrari and even Toyota, and when they got back to the office the others, called the "loonies" tore it all up. So, you spend a whole say agreeing something, but then you don't agree something even though the teams are there. The following Monday there was supposed to be an agreement about finance. Our people sat down with their people and they said "we can't discuss the FIA's rules". And so you're getting to this complete "Alice in Wonderland" situation - they simply won't talk about any progress, and then they pretend its us. For an outside it's "you say this, they say that", but the facts are very simple, we laid everything out, we had the correspondance, they have no answer to this so they simply "parrot fashion", the FIA are dictating, I am dictating, and trying to tell us to do, its not that at all, we are trying to get the thing in order along the lines of the things already agreed before.
JH: You mentioned dictating a few times in that sentence, governance is what the teams are referring to this as, when they say "governance", does this mean that they want Max Mosley to step down as FIA president?
MM: Maybe that's what they'd like, but it's not up to them, it's up to the FIA. They talk a lot about governance, what they really mean there is: the way the rules are made and the stability of the rules - now that always used to be governed by the Concorde Agreement. We've been talking about a new Concorde Agreement, for two/three years, the last one ran out at the end of 2007. We've said to them in recent days: "Don't lets go on with the discussion gone on for two years about a new agreement, let's simply take the governance provision from the 1998 agreement, which lasted for ten years and everyone was happy with, lets put them in place and then governance is taken care of. They, having been put in place, we can then lesiurely discuss a new Concorde Agreement." No, we don't agree with that - that's completely untrue - they operated under those governance rules for 10 years and nobody complained.
JH: You're job as president of the FIA is to do what is best for Formula 1, if you steeping down as president of the FIA meant that FOTA would sign up [for 2010], that Formula One would be the championship as it still is, would you be prepared to do that?
MM: Well, it's not even a question of that, it's a question of whether they'll sign up to rules which will work. Whether I'm there or not makes no difference at all. If you remeber these rules which they are quarrelling with went through the World Council on a 24 to 2 majority. And these are national sporting authorities. Also, we have to think of motorsport as a whole, anything that would help motorsport as a whole I would do including leaving, but that's not the issue. The issue is they [the teams] want to take over Formula 1 from the FIA and from Bernie. All I am is an obstacle to that, and so is Bernie. If they got rid of me, they'd then want to get rid of Bernie, and then get rid of anyone who wouldn't give them what they'd want.
JH: But if the teams made it clear that they'd race if it meant "No Max Mosley", would you be prepared to step down?
MM: If they were prepard to continue according to the rules, which is what they won't agree to certainly, because...
JH: So you'd sacrifice yourself to save Formula 1?
MM: Well I [*laughs*] wouldn't put it that way. The thing is anyone would do that if they are interested in something - they would always put the interest in front of themselves, but its a completely academic question because the argument isn't about me, it's about the rules.
JH: It seems stunningly complicated to work out what has and hasn't been discussed, but as the FIA you have Williams and Force India, and a couple of new teams as well. FOTA have got the biggest teams, stars and names, from what we've heard discussions are already going on with circuits and broadcasters. It feels like FOTA are in a incredibly strong position.
MM: This is an absolute illusion. It's a bit like saying in 2010 I'm going to be the Heavyweight Champion of the World - well I can say that, but its only really when I get in the ring when it becomes real - beforehand it is nonsense. None of this actually comes to a head until we get to Melbourne 2010, so all this posturing can go on, which you've said is very much Formula 1, and they will continue doing this in the hope of getting what they want which is getting their degree of control over the sport on one side and the money on the other. But the reality of it is that when it comes to it, the teams will not go and race in a Golden Steering series, they will want to race in Formula 1 World Championship and so will the drivers' want to win the same championship as Fangio and so on. It's a little bit like the Olympic Games and the Friendship Games - its the brand and the history of Formula 1, so when we get to Melbourne 2010 I would have a very large wager that almost all the existing teams will be there. I think we'll probably lose one or two manufactures, but again, nothing to do with the rules, these companies are losing fortunes and taking taxpayers money are not in a position to carry on pumping millions of pounds into Formula 1.
JH: So you think Formula 1 is the brand, it is the history, it is the chance to emulate the greats as opposed to having fantastic teams, the greatest drivers and engineers?
MM: No, you've misunderstood me. Those best teams, drivers and engineers will be in the Formula 1 World Championship come Melbourne 2010, there's no where else for them to be. Those people don't want to race in a Golden Steering Wheel series, they want to be in the World Championship, and this can go on for quite a long time, but eventually they will all come, as they have to, into the World Championship. Then things will continue as normal.
JH: Is it dangering to think though that those brains in the paddock could set up their own series if they are not happy with the FIA F1 Championship which has the history and glamour. But they believe it [a new series] will be a stronger and greater championship.
MM: Well, they could set up their own series, but if you really think it'll be a greater and stronger championship then I don't think you're right. They know perfectly well that in the end they will be there in Formula 1. What they want is a Formula 1 World Championship - but belonging to them. It's a bit of tug of war but in the end, because it is ours and the commercial rights are Bernie's, we will win the tug of war and they will then come and race in the World Championship as normal. Because the actual issues that divide us are negligable - there isn't anything there because we've offered them all the stability and governance revisions from the old Concorde Agreement. We offered everything they wanted in the Technical Regulations 2010, there actually isn't anything to quarrell about except they want Formula 1 for themselves and sooner or later they'll find out that they can't have it at which point the whole discussion will finish.
JH: You think this is an issue of greed?
MM: No, it's not greed, it's more about power. There are one or two individuals, one particular individual, who fancies himself as the Bernie, now whether he could actually do the job or not, I don't know.
JH: Tell us who that it.
MM: I think Flavio Briatore sees himself as the Bernie and he's fully entitled to that view, but I think Bernie would feel "if he wants my business, then come and buy it", you can't just take it. Then as far as the governing body is concerned, I don't know whether anyone actually wants to make the rules because we never agree on the rules, and when we do agree on the rules we disagree on what they mean. The famous double diffuser was drawn up by the teams then we had to settle all the right and wrong interpretations of the rule they drawn up. This is what it's all about, certain people would like certain positions, you can understand that, but there are correct ways to get it, equally my job - if someone wants my position, they are free to stand for an election. It's a democracy - it's like if I want Gordon Brown's job, I can put up if I want to be elected, but I'm entitled to that event.
JH: Does Flavio Briatore slip into the "loonies" group?
MM: I should think he's associated with them.
JH: Who's the leader of the "loonies"?
MM: The leader of the "loonie"... I'm not sure they've got one. It's in the nature of a loonie to not really have a leader - they all stick together as one.
JH: You genuinely think if the FIA weren't there to look after the "loonies" that they couldn't have the ability to run their own series then they wouldn't have the ability to do it?
MM: I think it would be virtually impossible because generally speaking they find it very difficult to agree on anything. They really do, again the double diffuser, they couldn't agree on that, the KERS system, they couldn't agree about that. It's very difficult, if you're all competitors to agree. It's a bit like trying to run a football match without a referee, if it's real friendly you can do it, once it gets serious then you can't do it.
JH: So, to summarise, you believe that the FOTA teams don't have the ability to run their own championship - they want to race in Formula 1, but they want the power to decide what Formula 1 would be.
MM: That's not quite the right summary, I think, first off they'd have the utmost of [something (sorry can't hear the exact word!)] - but that wouldn't become apparant until the series actually started, secondly what they want is to take over Formula 1 as it is - both the financial and sporting side and try and run it for themselves. Of course you can fantacise about that, but actually doing it is very different.
JH: So FOTA have made their position clear, the FIA have just done the same thing. Just explain to us what the next step is going to be.
MM: The next step we're taking, because trying to take something that isn't yours is not really in accordance of the law, so next week we will be issuing legal proceedings against Ferrari and FOTA.
JH: Of course Ferrari believe that you have no legal proceedings against them because you have broken the contract with them. They believe they have no legal obligation to be in your series, you believe differently.
MM: Yeah, as they say, you'd have to explain that to the judge.
JH: Which they'd be prepared to do I guess?
MM: I hope so, but the thing is we've got very good legal advice which is strong and clear, so we're very confident.
JH: The situation this leaves us in though, this is now June, we've got some teams coming into Formula 1 who aren't 100% sure of the regulations they can't even begin working on their cars, the existing teams cannot work on their cars because they don't know what the regulations are going to be, eight of those ten teams are telling us that they are going to leave, and you're still confident, despite legal proceedings that have been issued against Ferrari, that you're going to have a series ready to run in Melbourne in March 2010 that almost seems impossible Max.
MM: You probably haven't noticed, but we did publish regulations of 29th April. Those regulations are all there and people should be building cars to those regulations - its simple the regulations have been there for more than a month. You may not have noticed but they are there. Now, if we ever want to change those regulations, then we do so, if everyone who has entered, agrees. That's absolutely fundamental in motorsport, so we could change them but only if the people that enter agree like Force India and several other teams. It's just that simple, so anyone building a car would be building one now. If someone came along and wanted to change the defect of that car, he'd sound very sorry "I'm building my car, I don't agree". That's fundamental to motorsport, its been a basic rule in motorsport that once you publish the regulations and accept an entry, then you can't change anything, that's been there since before the Second World War.
JH: Legal proceedings, discussions behind closed doors, Formula 1 fans really don't want to know any more about this - what they want to know is whether there will be a series next year. What will happen next - what do you think will happen?
MM: What I think will happen now is that this discussion will continue for a while, and then at some point we will find when it starts to get important to know what's actually happening, which won't be for some time, we will then find that some of the FOTA teams will come into the championship. Other teams will already be there, and how long that'll take is very difficult to predict because different people take different positions and so on. Nobody wants this, and had the press completely ignored it, it would have gone on quietly for some months and nothing would have happened and things would be back to normal in time for the 2010 season. It's just that between alll of us, we made it seem an issue when it probably isn't.
JH: So the teams and thw FIA can get back together and one day start racing again.
MM: The director of Ferrari came into my office the other day and said "Don't be so unkind about Luca" because we'll all be back together again next Spring and so it makes bad relations. So I took out a lot of rather unkind things that I might have said, and he's right - we've been through these things before we'll go through them again. You cannot have a lot of competititve peak, a lot at stake, a tremondous amount going in, thousands of people involved, without having big conflicts, it's just that because the Formula 1 World Championship is so media intensive it tends to build up into something it isn't. Really, this is just a few human beings sorting out their differences and it usually happens in every walk of life but usually a bit quieter.
JH: Do you think we'll get there in the end?
MM: No question.
Edited by D.M.N., 20 June 2009 - 17:26.
. I tried downloading the clip myself but it didnt work out
