Javascript Disabled Detected

You currently have javascript disabled. Several functions may not work. Please re-enable javascript to access full functionality.

Former F1 drivers and failed F1 teams

Started by HistoryFan , Jul 13 2010 20:16

Please log in to reply

47 replies to this topic

#1 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 13 July 2010 - 20:16

The thread of the GP team by Gilles Villeneuve remembers me on more projects of former Ex F1 driver to create a own F1 team, but that failed:

- James Hunt; want to buy Ligiers and race them on his own. But I don't know backgrounds, who else would be involved in that project
- Jochen Rindt; want to creat a F1 team with Bernie Ecclestone. It already ran in F2.
- Lamberto Leoni and the First project which became the basic of the Life chassis in 1990
- Eddie Irvine wanted to buy some F1 teams some years ago, but talks with Midland and Minardi failed, although he has a well-backing from Russian Routsam Tariko
- Jean Alesi also wanted to etablish a own F1 team for 2007, with help of Direxiv. It failed because Prodrive won the election for an entry in 2010.

Of course there will be much more.
I will post some later and hope you can also complete this list, especially with such not so well-known projects like the Villeneuve projects.

#2 arttidesco

Member

6,709 posts
Joined: April 10

Posted 13 July 2010 - 20:19

James Hunt wanted to buy Ligiers ? What with bird seed ?

#3 ensign14

Member

62,006 posts
Joined: December 01

Posted 13 July 2010 - 20:48

Adrian Campos, whose career as a team-owner was probably more successful than his career as a driver...

#4 arttidesco

Member

6,709 posts
Joined: April 10

Posted 13 July 2010 - 20:55

Chris Amon had two goes at running his own team recording 4 x DNQ 1 x DNS and 1 x Retd does that count as a failure or is making it into one race counted as a success ?

#5 plutoman

Member

115 posts
Joined: June 10

Posted 13 July 2010 - 21:03

James Hunt; want to buy Ligiers and race them on his own. But I don't know backgrounds, who else would be involved in that project

Hunt was linked with Ligier to replace Depailler after his hang-gliding accident in 1979, but I don't remember anything about setting up his own team.

#6 paulhooft

Member

873 posts
Joined: January 01

Posted 13 July 2010 - 21:42

Jos Verstappen wanted....? :rotfl:

Edited by paulhooft, 13 July 2010 - 21:44.

#7 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 14 July 2010 - 13:57

Adrian Campos, whose career as a team-owner was probably more successful than his career as a driver...

He tried to etablish a F1 team very often:
- He was involved in the Bravo project in 1993
- He was linked to buy Minardi in 1999
- He was linked to buy other teams later
- The Campos project for 2010...

#8 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 14 July 2010 - 14:11

Chris Amon had two goes at running his own team recording 4 x DNQ 1 x DNS and 1 x Retd does that count as a failure or is making it into one race counted as a success ?

Yes, in the intention of the thread, it is a success...

#9 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 14 July 2010 - 16:20

Some questions about F1 project from René Arnoux

1. DAMS stands for Driot Arnoux Motor Sport. But René Arnoux is not often mentioned. Why not? Is he still involved in the team? If not, why not and since when not? For what is DAMS now standing?

2. I heard stories that René Arnoux wanted to enter a private F1 team with Ligier chassis. He drove for Ligier from 1987 until 1989 - in 1988 DAMS was found. So the time would be optimal. Was Jean-Paul Driot involved in such thinkings? There were talkings about making that entry with a friend.

3. What did Jean Paul Driot before 1988. Were was he how involved in motorsport?

4. How came the contacts to René Arnoux.

5. In 1995 DAMS built an F1 car. But was René Arnoux involved in the project?

6. Were there no F1 plans before 1995?

#10 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 16 July 2010 - 13:17

Scheckter was involved at the Villeneuve project. But were there also own efforts to etablish a F1 team?

And so to speak about Villeneuve: There are stories that Jacques Villeneuve applies for a 13th F1 team...

#11 tyrrellp346wheels

Member

582 posts
Joined: November 09

Posted 16 July 2010 - 19:55

according to the unraced f1 cars book rene arnoux was not involved with dams when the teams f1 project began, the a in dams then ment associates

#12 arttidesco

Member

6,709 posts
Joined: April 10

Posted 16 July 2010 - 23:17

Did anything come of the rumour that ex F1 drivers TIm Schenken and Howden GAnely were building a TIGA Cosworth F1 kit car in the late 70's ?

#13 ghinzani

Member

2,027 posts
Joined: October 01

Posted 17 July 2010 - 03:12

Did anything come of the rumour that ex F1 drivers TIm Schenken and Howden GAnely were building a TIGA Cosworth F1 kit car in the late 70's ?

I believe its partially built still sat in Ganleys workshop - I recall a mid 80s Motor Sport article where he said he would finish it off someday.

#14 Marc Sproule

Member

984 posts
Joined: April 10

Posted 17 July 2010 - 04:14

I make no claims to vast F1 historical knowledge, but it sure seems to me that Emmo's Copersucar, then Fittipaldi effort ranked pretty low on the success-o-meter, at least with him at the wheel.

Someone with better knowledge could fill in the Rosberg side of the equation.

http://www.flickr.co...57623186790747/

http://www.flickr.co...57623186790747/

http://www.flickr.co...57623186790747/

http://www.flickr.co...57623186790747/

http://www.flickr.co...57623186790747/

#15 FigJam

Member

2,034 posts
Joined: January 10

Posted 17 July 2010 - 05:01

Scheckter was involved at the Villeneuve project. But were there also own efforts to etablish a F1 team?

And so to speak about Villeneuve: There are stories that Jacques Villeneuve applies for a 13th F1 team...

The whole 'Team Villeneuve' that Gilles was serious about setting up, wasn't it undone at the time due to some dodgy backers/investors or something of the like?

Interesting though now that Jacques is serious about setting up his own team. 1 of 3 applications left for the FIA to choose between. Possible Ferrari connection also.

#16 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 17 July 2010 - 13:22

according to the unraced f1 cars book rene arnoux was not involved with dams when the teams f1 project began, the a in dams then ment associates

Thank you. It would be interesting to know, when he left the team.
DAMS doesn't yet answers some questions about that. Most times, they do....

#17 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 17 July 2010 - 13:32

Interesting though now that Jacques is serious about setting up his own team. 1 of 3 applications left for the FIA to choose between. Possible Ferrari connection also.

I didn't think there were only 3 applications left. Cypher is in, Villeneuve Racing and Stefan confirmed, that they are still in the race. And also Epsilon Euskadi sounded like they were still running their application after I contacted them only few days ago. And to Ferrari: Perhaps yes, after Durango (who will run the Villeneuve team) is Italian, too.
By the way: Were there more teams which run teams under other names? So Manor is running the Virgin Team since 2010 and Durango want to run Villeneuve Racing. You can find that in many other series (especially A1GP, Superleague Formula of course), but in F1 history?

And to the topic: Phil Hill and Dan Gurney also want to etablish their American F1 team. They talked of buying the Arrows team in 2002.

#18 arttidesco

Member

6,709 posts
Joined: April 10

Posted 18 July 2010 - 00:35

And to the topic: Phil Hill and Dan Gurney also want to etablish their American F1 team. They talked of buying the Arrows team in 2002.

Dan Gurney ran Anglo American Racers in the 1960's winning the 1967 Belgian GP in his AAR Eagle.

Not heard Dan or Phil were interested in Arrows before today do you have a source of this information ?

#19 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 18 July 2010 - 07:52

One Source:

"For a brief moment, Gurney’s name even popped up in the F1 newspaper columns again. In 2002, he grabbed the headlines by launching the idea of an All-American F1 team, co-led by the man responsible for his initial discovery – Phil Hill. First thoughts in the outside world surrounded taking over Arrows from Tom Walkinshaw, before it became apparent that Gurney was intending it to be a greenfield project financed by businessmen Bob Balachowski and Russ Olsen. (...)"

From
http://forix.autospo.../8w/gurney.html

#20 arttidesco

Member

6,709 posts
Joined: April 10

Posted 18 July 2010 - 16:09

One Source:

"For a brief moment, Gurney’s name even popped up in the F1 newspaper columns again. In 2002, he grabbed the headlines by launching the idea of an All-American F1 team, co-led by the man responsible for his initial discovery – Phil Hill. First thoughts in the outside world surrounded taking over Arrows from Tom Walkinshaw, before it became apparent that Gurney was intending it to be a greenfield project financed by businessmen Bob Balachowski and Russ Olsen. (...)"

From
http://forix.autospo.../8w/gurney.html

Thanks interesting story curious circumstances and indeed another still born project, rather reminds me of the somewhat more laboured USF1 plot.

#21 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 18 July 2010 - 16:22

And not long away: Cypher.

#22 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 20 July 2010 - 12:15

By the way: Were there more teams which run teams under other names? So Manor is running the Virgin Team since 2010 and Durango want to run Villeneuve Racing. You can find that in many other series (especially A1GP, Superleague Formula of course), but in F1 history?

GP Racing ran the Piquet GP2-team in 2007, in 2006 it was run by Hitech.

#23 Michael Ferner

Member

7,203 posts
Joined: November 09

Posted 20 July 2010 - 18:31

Lotus ran the JPS team 1972-78, BRP ran Yeoman-Credit in 1960 and UDT-Laystall in '61/62, Reg Parnell (or was it Tim?) the Bowmaker team in '62, and Tyrrell Matra International in '68/69.

Edited by Michael Ferner, 20 July 2010 - 18:32.

#24 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 21 July 2010 - 08:06

Thank you.

#25 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 22 July 2010 - 12:45

Scuderia Ferrari ran the Alfa Romeo worksteam in the 30s in Grand Prix.
So did Scuderia Subalpina for Maserati.

#26 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 23 July 2010 - 08:17

And HRT is run by the German Kolles team.

#27 RedArrow

Member

30 posts
Joined: May 10

Posted 23 July 2010 - 21:02

And to the topic: Phil Hill and Dan Gurney also want to etablish their American F1 team. They talked of buying the Arrows team in 2002.

I remember that story, but I think it was about starting a new team altogether and not buying out Arrows. Also, it was an idea that Gurney had on his own (Phil Hill later said he wasn't involved), and it never got beyond the planning stage. It was an idea that was raised and then binned in just a matter of months.

Edited by RedArrow, 23 July 2010 - 22:42.

#28 Gert

Member

209 posts
Joined: October 01

Posted 24 July 2010 - 14:24

What did Jean Paul Driot before 1988. Were was he how involved in motorsport?

I think he was involved with GDBA in F3000 in 1987 & 1988.

IIRC:
G = Gilles Gaignault ?
D = JP Driot

no idea what B & A stood for ...

Edited by Gert, 24 July 2010 - 14:24.

#29 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 24 July 2010 - 15:02

I think he was involved with GDBA in F3000 in 1987 & 1988.

IIRC:
G = Gilles Gaignault ?
D = JP Driot

no idea what B & A stood for ...

Thank you. I will try to find out more about that.

#30 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 26 July 2010 - 20:31

In the end of the 2000 season there were rumours about Martin Brundle interesting in starting his own F1 team. He was linked with buying into the Minardi team. Were there more attempts to etablish a team by himself?

Also Nigel Mansell want to etablish his own F1 team. He owned a F3000 (Magdwick International) and then tried to buy Brabham with his friend Greg Norman (golfer). He also wanted to buy Lotus at the end of 1994, rumours were telling. And there were links to buy in McLaren. More attempts? Perhaps we will see a Mansell F1 team in future, after he now is shareholder in a Le Mans team.

And there were plans about a F1 team by Keke Rosberg: "Finnish consortium led by Keke Rosberg had plans to buy Tyrrell in the late 1980's. The team was to be called Kansallis Banking Racing, but the deal fell through as the primary sponsor (a Finnish bank) decided against it." (By Fletcher)

Any more infos about that or another teams planed by former F1 drivers?

#31 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 27 July 2010 - 10:03

I think he was involved with GDBA in F3000 in 1987 & 1988.

IIRC:
G = Gilles Gaignault ?
D = JP Driot

no idea what B & A stood for ...

The A is standing for Arnoux, the B for Blanchet.

#32 F3Wrench

Member

98 posts
Joined: November 08

Posted 29 July 2010 - 08:15

Not sure how "failed" you want to include, but the RAM Racing Team (1976 to 1985) run by John MacDonald and Mick Ralph is worthy (?) of mention.

I understand that some illustrious names were included amongst the vast array of drivers, including Jochen Mass, Guy Edwards, Derek Daly, Jean-Louis Schlesser, and Jacques Villeneuve Senior. Most of the time they failed to qualify, but Daly did achieve a 7th in the 1981 British Grand Prix apparently.

Most of this is derived from Wikipedia, so open to discussion perhaps. One of the lesser known drivers was my old F3 driver Andy Sutcliffe, who insists he would have been a real contender if the wheel hadn't come off at Woodcote when dicing with Jarier :rolleyes:

. And John and Mick (the RAM principals) were personal friends and the lads who ran the small spray shop in Hampstead called Compact Conversions back in the late '60s. Ah, dayzzzz....

#33 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 21 August 2010 - 13:18

- Jochen Rindt; want to creat a F1 team with Bernie Ecclestone. It already ran in F2.

In the Yesterday forum some wrote about Rindt also want to create a F1 team with Robin Herd with own chassis.

#34 COUGAR508

Member

1,184 posts
Joined: February 07

Posted 21 August 2010 - 14:40

In the Yesterday forum some wrote about Rindt also want to create a F1 team with Robin Herd with own chassis.

Yes, I read about that in a book some time ago, but I can't remember which book it was! Would that project have started for the 1971 season?

#35 frp

Member

353 posts
Joined: September 04

Posted 21 August 2010 - 15:16

The A is standing for Arnoux, the B for Blanchet.

My memory of the time was that GDBA was formed at the start of 1987 by Bernard Giroix, Jean-Paul Driot, Mike Blanchet and Rene Arnoux. Giroix, father of driver Fabien, was another victim of the powerboat crash that killed Didier Pironi. Consequently, the team was reformed for 1988, also without Mike Blanchet, as Driot Arnoux Motor Sport.

I hope my memory's accurate

Andy

#36 frp

Member

353 posts
Joined: September 04

Posted 21 August 2010 - 15:29

In the Yesterday forum some wrote about Rindt also want to create a F1 team with Robin Herd with own chassis.

When the operation that became March was being put together in 1969, there were discussions with Rindt about his being the driver. Jochen was apparently not filled with confidence, the famous quote that's been attributed to him: "I suppose you will build the car in Graham's shack!", referring to the workshop that Graham Coaker was renting. Heard after filtering through Rindt's clipped Austrian accent, this led to the moniker 'Grimshek Engineering' being bandied around with reference to the embryonic March outfit. The other one, of course, was Much Advertised Racing Car Hoax.

They didn't do that bad, considering.

Andy

#37 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 22 August 2010 - 07:43

My memory of the time was that GDBA was formed at the start of 1987 by Bernard Giroix, Jean-Paul Driot, Mike Blanchet and Rene Arnoux. Giroix, father of driver Fabien, was another victim of the powerboat crash that killed Didier Pironi. Consequently, the team was reformed for 1988, also without Mike Blanchet, as Driot Arnoux Motor Sport.

I hope my memory's accurate ;)

Andy

So GBDA was renamed DAMS...
Sounds logical!
Thank you!

#38 Tim Murray

Moderator

24,607 posts
Joined: May 02

Posted 22 August 2010 - 09:04

My memory of the time was that GDBA was formed at the start of 1987 by Bernard Giroix, Jean-Paul Driot, Mike Blanchet and Rene Arnoux. Giroix, father of driver Fabien, was another victim of the powerboat crash that killed Didier Pironi. Consequently, the team was reformed for 1988, also without Mike Blanchet, as Driot Arnoux Motor Sport.

I hope my memory's accurate ;)

Andy

I always understood that the 'G' in GBDA was Gilles Gaignault. :confused:

#39 ReWind

Member

3,410 posts
Joined: October 03

Posted 22 August 2010 - 11:13

Bernard Giroix, father of driver Fabien

I hope my memory's accurate ;)

Alas, it is not. The guy you are thinking of was not called Giroix but Giroux. And he was born in 1950 which would have made it even more difficult to father 1960-born Fabien Giroix.

To whom it may concern: The team was not called GBDA but GDBA.

... ends his plea for more accuracy...

#40 Tim Murray

Moderator

24,607 posts
Joined: May 02

Posted 22 August 2010 - 18:18

In the thread F2/F3000/GP2 team take overs Simon Arron has confirmed that the 'G' in GDBA was Gilles Gaignault:

Simon, any chance you could confirm the identities behind the initials GDBA? I always thought that the 'G' stood for Gilles Gaignault, not Bernard Giroix.

Correct. It was Gilles Gaignault. Last saw him at Le Mans, in 2009.

#41 frp

Member

353 posts
Joined: September 04

Posted 22 August 2010 - 20:01

To whom it may concern: The team was not called GBDA but GDBA.

Well, at least I got that bit right and, trust me, that was a close-run thing. As for the Gaignault/Giroux/Giroix débacle, apologies - I'd clearly forgotten how bad my memory was!

Andy

#42 dnhrudi

Member

68 posts
Joined: April 07

Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:43

Seem to remember Alberto Colombo trying to put a team together for the 1980 season. think he built a tub, and rather worryingly purchased a Kauhsen! For the life of me don't recall the name of the project though

#43 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 27 August 2010 - 15:42

Don't know anything about that.

#44 dnhrudi

Member

68 posts
Joined: April 07

Posted 30 August 2010 - 02:48

Did a little more research re Colombo's team. It was called Riviera, The car was designed by Georgio Valentini and a tub delivered to the team built up by Thompson in November 79, They also bought some equitment from Willi Kauhsen including one of the WK chassis, then they hit money troubles. Sold their Cosworths on to Enzo Osella apparently for his fledgeling F1 effort

Edited by dnhrudi, 30 August 2010 - 02:49.

#45 HistoryFan

Member

7,854 posts
Joined: November 07

Posted 30 August 2010 - 09:37

Thank you very much for that informations!

#46 dnhrudi

Member

68 posts
Joined: April 07

Posted 31 August 2010 - 03:57

And after wandering around the net for a while I found this. The car actually looks like the revamped Kauhsen in Merzario A2/4 guise, so have to assume Colombo purchased from Arturo and not from Willi Kauhsen. Can find no pictures of the Pukka Riviera tub or drawings of the car
Posted Image