Horace Gould

Originally posted by David McKinney
Um - that was a joke,

Originally posted by David McKinney
...based on the belief that Horace's only claim to greatness was his great size

Originally posted by Don Capps
I liked 'Orrice GooUld ....

Originally posted by David McKinney
The best-remembered thing about Gould's 1954 NZ visit is that he thought he'd won the Grand Prix. It was only after weeks of checking official and private lap-charts that the results were confirmed.

There is a story that Horace was deeply impressed by the beneficial effects of nitro-methane when added to 500cc F3 car fuel systems. He then heard that Leslie Hawthorn had been similarly impressed and that Bristol - the engine manufacturing company - had just twigged that young Mike Hawthorn's wonderful Cooper-Bristol performances in 1952 had been achieved by enhancing his driving talents with carefully 'laced' fuel. So Big Orrice tried adding a little 'jungle juice' to the fuel of his Cooper-Bristol in 1953, and it went better. Then - reasoning that if a cup-full improved performance a little then a can-full should improve it a lot - he poured all he could find into the tank, and set off round Goodwood. The perhaps predictable result was an almighty blow-up at peak revs down the Lavant Straight - piston-crown first presumably...

"Goo - bugger I - perhaps we overdone it...?"

DCN

O/T - that's a VERY good impression of a Bristol (or Brissle) accent, Don, as I'm sure Darren and others from around here can confirm! Can you remember 'Orrice adding the letter L to the ends of words that ended with an A? That's another Bristol habit - they take holidays in Americal, Australial and Fuerteventural and will often talk about something being a "good ideal" (good idea) while I heard someone recently talking about her children having "sickness and diarrhoeal"!

iirc 'Horace Gould' was actually born Horace Twigg - any idea why the name change?

One of TNF member owns the little Cooper MG that was in Goodwood in 2008 and 2009 and was previously owned by Mr Gould!

http://users.telenet...rs/CooperMG.htm

There is a picture of him in the car at the bottom of the page.
Any other pictures of his Cooper Bristol?

I looked up the link and note the Cooper-MG was raced by Ian Davidson in 1954. Did it not then pass to Brian Naylor as I remember Briian with the car at the 1955 Tourist Trophy race at Dundrod. Or am I wrong ??

Edited by David McKinney, 27 October 2009 - 18:43.

Naylor apparently raced a Cooper-MG in 1954. Was it the same car?

Vince H.

I can recall the late (and very likeable) Bruce Halford speaking very well of him. I rather had the impression (Doug Nye will know better than I - that almost scans!) that Halford, Gould & Bueb were, for a while, the Three Musketeers. But perhaps Ivor took it a little bit more seriously...

Re. 250Fs - I can't recall precisely, but didn't Gould, Halford and Bira all drive the same car? I can only imagine that Bira had it first, but my library is temporarily lost to me...

Edited by Allan Lupton, 27 October 2009 - 21:13.

I looked up the link and note the Cooper-MG was raced by Ian Davidson in 1954. Did it not then pass to Brian Naylor as I remember Briian with the car at the 1955 Tourist Trophy race at Dundrod. Or am I wrong ??

Bira had 2504 from new in 1954, then swapped it with 2509, whilst retaining his own number. This was then raced (but not owned) by Gould in 1955 and owned and raced by Halford from 1956
In other words, the car Gould and Halford raced wasn't the one Bira had had from new

And yes, Gould later campaigned 2514

I'm not disputing a word you say, Graham

What none of us (probably Gould and Halford included) knew until relatively recently was that the 2504 which passed from Bira to Gould and then Halford wasn't the 2504 Bira had bought new. After Flockhart crashed Bira's 2504 in the 1954 British GP, Bira took over the Owen car (2509), repainted it, renumbered it 2504 and carried on his merry way

BRM repaired the Bira/Flockhart wreck, repainted it, renumbered it 2509 and etc etc

In 1956 Horace's 250.F was red. There are colour pictures on the web which prove this.

However, there is a picture of the car in 1957 wherein it looks much darker and has painted upon it a strangely-shaped light nose section.

Can anybody confirm what two colours were on the Maserati at that time, please?

Dunno, but I've just seen the sad news that Martin Gould died in November 2009; just after this thread had started to lie dormant.  I assume it was due to cancer as the family asked for donations to British Cancer Research.

In 1956 Horace's 250.F was red. There are colour pictures on the web which prove this.

 

However, there is a picture of the car in 1957 wherein it looks much darker and has painted upon it a strangely-shaped light nose section.

 

Can anybody confirm what two colours were on the Maserati at that time, please?

I found a colour picture of the 1957 German GP starting grid.

You can see the Horace Gould car on the far right of the picture. It could indeed be a veeeery dark green with a white or cream coloured nose.

https://i1.wp.com/fa...ef0111ded_o.jpg

There's a pic by Phil Hill in Inside Track.  Had it not been for the British colour being green I would have put it down as black; I wonder if Horace had a can of paint from BRM?  Albeit they were not there...

The nosecone is white, in a sort of wave design that looks like -v- at the front. 

Meanwhile, Brian Naylor's car appears to have had a lot more red than what one would have expected, judging by what we can see on the far right side of the photo.

My personal picture of Horace Gould in the 1957 German GP if it helps your research.

Edited by germanty, 11 August 2018 - 10:58.

A magic photo to bring this old thread back to life.

Somewhat late to the party, this May 54 (Australian) WHEELS magazine piece may be of interest to some given the early thread discussion relating to the NZ GP..

The whole results process clearly a very confusing and controversial issue. Officially listed in the 1954 programme as 'THE NZ MOTOR CUP' my programme's original owner wrote '2' next to the #1 Wharton BRM, '3 'next to #5 Gould Cooper Bristol, '1 ' next to #7 Jones Maybach and '4' smack bang between #19 Roycroft Alfa anf #20 Molina MM Holden.

Stephen

When I first read about the dispute over 1954 NZ GP I asked my father whether he remembered it. He never went to Ardmore but did lap scoring at Ohakea for a while. He told me with a chuckle that lap scoring was rather hit and miss. Whenever there was an incident lap scorers would turn to have a look and then hastily fit in whoever they thought should have completed a lap in the interim. I suspect Ardmore worked in a similar manner.