128 replies to this topic

[kar]

I think Kimi, as the current WDC, should be ashamed of himself. Of all the drivers on the grid, he is the one who should be setting the example.

I can see the dripping sarcasm, but I don't actually disagree here.

[Mika Mika]

I think it's up to them, like any union. However if they get hurt because they didn't stand for one of the GPDA safety issues then they can't complain can they?

[undersquare]

Originally posted by hajolyn


IMO the tyre barrier prevented further injury instead of causing it, as it meant that the deceleration was more gradual and therefore the G-loading was much lower than if the car had just hit the first row of tires and stopped there. That would have been far worse.

As for the GPDA, it was formed because some drivers thought that F1 was too dangerous, but now maybe some of the drivers think that it isn't any more, that it is safe-enough. Just because Trulli thinks that it isn't doesn't mean others have to join.

The barrier should slow the car without contacting the driver's head. At 5 tyres and 3.5 metres it was deep enough to give low g, but it's obviously not safe to have the car puncture the barrier and have the driver's head hit directly on the belt/tyres. The design should let the car indent the barrier, not puncture it. They don't get any more depth after all, there's a retaining wall behind.
As it was, Heikki probably got a blow on the front of the head from hitting the barrier, then a blow on the back of the head from the headrest, so depending on the exact timing the brain could have been out of phase with the skull and at much greater risk than 29g implies.

There obviously are risks with motor racing, and drivers have a contribution to make even though they are young and bold and more concerned with winning. We admire them and care about them so I wish they would all participate, but I'm not saying they "have to" or sitting in judgement on them, or using it to bash Hammy like the thread starter. It's just a wish ;) .

[Buttoneer]

Originally posted by kar


I can see the dripping sarcasm, but I don't actually disagree here.

I did lay it on thick...

[kar]

Originally posted by Buttoneer
I did lay it on thick...

The point was certainly taken though, no matter the means :-)

[SirSaltire]

I am all for freedom of choice but the fact of the matter is that the drivers that don't contibute still get all the benefits from the GPDA safety work. Some folk have compared it to being part of a trade union but its not the same. If you do not join or pay your dues to a trade union then you never reap any benefits from it. If some drivers say they do not have the time and/or don't give a toss, fair enough but they should still have to pay their share.

[big x]

Originally posted by dawg_7529
Who cares if he joins. Hell be sacked and out of F1 soon enough anyway.

I tell you what, why don't you go back to your roll-ups in your Amsterdam coffee house and stop trolling here.

[Buttoneer]

Originally posted by SirSaltire
I am all for freedom of choice but the fact of the matter is that the drivers that don't contibute still get all the benefits from the GPDA safety work. Some folk have compared it to being part of a trade union but its not the same. If you do not join or pay your dues to a trade union then you never reap any benefits from it. If some drivers say they do not have the time and/or don't give a toss, fair enough but they should still have to pay their share.

If a trade union negotiates a pay increase for workers at a certain grade, all members will get that increase regardless of their membership status.

[Hippo]

Originally posted by SirSaltire
Some folk have compared it to being part of a trade union but its not the same

Yes it is. GPDA cares about the drivers. Obviously they don't do the money talks because there is no need to do it. But their scope is all about various other drivers affairs.

And may i tell you something? Not everyone likes unions. I for example never was in a union and i never will be. I just dont like the idea of some idealists or even worse show offs representing me. I have my own voice and i'll use it if i feel a need for it. I dont know about Räikkönen or Hamilton, but i can imagine them just being unwilling to join a union. It's really just their decission.

Cheers

[bogi]

Hamilton donates $30k to GPDA

Lewis Hamilton has reportedly agreed to contribute $30,000 to the Grand Prix Drivers' Association, despite still not wanting to become a GPDA member.

The development comes GPDA stalwart Jarno Trulli slammed the few active racers - including Adrian Sutil and the two Ferrari drivers - who are refusing to get behind the safety-oriented body.

The Italian revealed that the fees for GPDA membership are $1000 upfront and 200 dollars per point scored.

"If the top guys are uninterested, there's a lack of money for the GPDA to survive and it's always the unlucky ones, the ones who get paid less, who have to sustain the costs," Trulli was quoted as saying.


"What I don't understand is if you might not want to be part of the GPDA then you can do what you want but at least pay the money since you go on the track too," he added.

The Daily Record reports that Hamilton, the 23-year-old McLaren driver who has scored 20 points so far this season, did indeed agree to 'dip into his salary and fork out his share'.

Source: GMM
© CAPSIS International

http://en.f1-live.co...510112426.shtml


C'mon bashers, full charge!

[kar]

Originally posted by bogi
Hamilton donates $30k to GPDA





Source: GMM
© CAPSIS International

http://en.f1-live.co...510112426.shtml


C'mon bashers, full charge!

He's 'cool' like that, good for him .

Personally I think Kimi should do the same.

[kar]

Hmm so the above is bunk, and it seems from the get go my suspicion about money being an issue seems to be at least a little bit on the mark

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/67318

I'm unsure how to read Webber's comments and whether or not Kimi contributes financially to the GPDA while not being an active participant.

[mach4]

Hamilton:

"I don't understand why I need to. I pay for my racing licence, which goes towards the FIA safety regulations. So I don't understand why I need to be paying more."

:

[Norm]

Originally posted by Chiara


As a general rule I really don't like falling out with anyone, but perhaps you should be a bit more considerate when making comments about Italian racing teams and the Mafia in future.

I think this is called the Kiss of Death.

[SirSaltire]

Originally posted by Buttoneer
If a trade union negotiates a pay increase for workers at a certain grade, all members will get that increase regardless of their membership status.

Ok fair enough but that doesn't seem fair does it?
I have to agree with JT on this. I just cant understand why some f1 drivers do not contribute finance to the GPDA even if they do not want to commit any time to it. If they get benefit from it they should pay for it - its as simple as that. If they don't then in my eyes they are freeloaders

[David M. Kane]

I'm sure I'll get hammered by the Liberals here for this, but why should the better drivers have to pay more for each point earned? That's kinda rubs me the wrong way. I don't believe in success penalties.

[pRy]

"And some guys in the past were not interested but they paid their way because they knew every single lap they did, whether testing or racing, there were GPDA people saving them." - Not sure what it is about that quote but it seems wrong to me. Almost sounds like a guilt trip. But then for some reason Webber just hits a nerve with me in general.

[archstanton]

Originally posted by SirSaltire
Ok fair enough but that doesn't seem fair does it?
I have to agree with JT on this. I just cant understand why some f1 drivers do not contribute finance to the GPDA even if they do not want to commit any time to it. If they get benefit from it they should pay for it - its as simple as that. If they don't then in my eyes they are freeloaders

seems to me you're making some pretty big assumptions there ... who exactly says the drivers benefit from the gpda? plenty of other people can make far more legitimate claims to any successes.
it seems clear that enough drivers don't agree with your assertion, and don't think this is the case, as seen from their actions (or inaction) in this matter, voting with their feet.

freeloaders eh? that would be an organisation helping itself to the financial resources of others, resources which they have no legitimate claim to, for no demonstrable benefit. there's no such thing as a free lunch, something the gpda whiners should quickly realise ... if they want people to pay to join their silly wee union, they should get busy demonstrating actual compelling reasons why people would like to join, not sniping at other drivers through the newspapers.

it's called liberty and free choice, i'll back lewis and kimi to the hilt on this one, they've clocked these gpda chancers for what they are, ineffectual and pointless.

[kar]

Originally posted by David M. Kane
I'm sure I'll get hammered by the Liberals here for this, but why should the better drivers have to pay more for each point earned? That's kinda rubs me the wrong way. I don't believe in success penalties.

The drivers in the fastest cars tend to be the highest paid, I mean Lewis and Kimi are double digit millions per year (apparently), what's 30K to them?

[Buttoneer]

Exactly. They get success pay, after all...

[Josta]

Originally posted by kar


The drivers in the fastest cars tend to be the highest paid, I mean Lewis and Kimi are double digit millions per year (apparently), what's 30K to them?

The impression I get from Lewis is that he probably insists on his (non millionaire, normal) old chums paying for their own drinks when he goes out for a beer with them. "Look John, I know that we have been mates since primary school, that you have a family to support and you lost your job last year, but I don't see why I should have to pay for your beer just because you're a ****ing pauper."

[PassWind]

Originally posted by Clatter


That's what I'm wondering about.

Got to say that if I was LH I'd snub them out of sheer bloddy mindedness. If the GPDA want these drivers to join then they should approach them in person, not via the press, and if they don't want to join, then suck it up and respect their decision.

You think they asked Lewis through the Press, your planets a alternate reality to this one, just have a think about what you said and how it would logically go down, this is not big brother.

What is reported is follow up to a story, that Lewis has declined, the rest is of course opinion as to Lewis's decision and considering he has time to fly around like soap on a rope or is that a dope on a rope, pfft whatever Young Lewis needs to leave the alternate reality that Dennis created for him the Dark side of the Force is strong in this one.

[VresiBerba]

Originally posted by David M. Kane
I'm sure I'll get hammered by the Liberals here for this, but why should the better drivers have to pay more for each point earned? That's kinda rubs me the wrong way. I don't believe in success penalties.

That's probably because, 1, the money needed is to ensure what ever GPDA does, 2, the guy scoring the most points usually also earns the most money, it would therefore seem a bit ridiculous that Yuji Ide should pay the same amount of money that Shumi does, wouldn't it.

[PassWind]

Originally posted by kar


The thread was originally about Lewis, but I must say I feel exactly the same way about Kimi (my favourite driver these days).

As two of the highest profile drivers I find it quite disappointing they both are not more actively involved in the safety side of things.

Particularly since they have both been very recent beneficiaries of work in that area undertaken by the GPDA (Monza run off and barriers, Testing medical crews and marshalling).

With now 20 ego's in a room could you imagine Kimi even getting in a word?

I think it right that all drivers join its a FIA charter automobile safety and the sporting part aside this gig does make them a substantial career they should all give something back through the GPDA.

[kar]

I just found Lewis' comments (and I accept that I'm predisposed to look on his comments more negatively than any other driver anyway) of late very insincere and highly selfish.

Kimi is as guilty (in my opinion, and I qualify that I am unsure if he does contribute to the GPDA) of getting the benefit of the GPDAs work without any input. But he doesn't go around making comments 'I pay my licence, why should I pay union fees'. Particularly when Lewis had that god almighty shunt last year in testing, a shunt that as much anything gave the GPDA impetus to pay for testing safety changes out of their OWN pocket.

The benefits Lewis reaped, and now suggests he should not at all feel compelled to contribute to, is very off putting.

I can't imagine _anyone_ but his most ardent fans could excuse the atrocious PR he's putting out this year. The ridiculous vodafone stunt was embarrassing for his image. This GPDA business, I think, speaks about him personally and that is far more damaging. It points to someone who is very self-interested, cheap, and ultimately happy to reap the benefits of others work.

If Kimi were to make similar comments as Lewis, I would apply the above to him too. I am very interested as to whether or not he contributes. From Webber's comments the other day, it is possible he does, while not actually attending any meetings. That in itself, I find disappointing though.

But Lewis with his comments goes far beyond that

[Buttoneer]

Originally posted by kar
Kimi is as guilty (in my opinion, and I qualify that I am unsure if he does contribute to the GPDA) of getting the benefit of the GPDAs work without any input. But he doesn't go around making comments 'I pay my licence, why should I pay union fees'. Particularly when Lewis had that god almighty shunt last year in testing, a shunt that as much anything gave the GPDA impetus to pay for testing safety changes out of their OWN pocket.

Can you show me an interview where the reporters have asked Kimi, Sutil or Davidson about their membership?

I think we've seen Lewis deal with three lots of questions over this now, two this weekend. How about the others?

Just so we can see how classily they dealt with the questions.

[rearwheelskid00]

Lewis Hamilton
Be the reason money or insecurities that his advantage could be extorted, his view of the GPDA when interviewed by Martin Brundle seemed appreciative for improving the safety at Gilles Villeneuve circuit.

[jesee]

Originally posted by kar
I just found Lewis' comments (and I accept that I'm predisposed to look on his comments more negatively than any other driver anyway) of late very insincere and highly selfish.

Kimi is as guilty (in my opinion, and I qualify that I am unsure if he does contribute to the GPDA) of getting the benefit of the GPDAs work without any input. But he doesn't go around making comments 'I pay my licence, why should I pay union fees'. Particularly when Lewis had that god almighty shunt last year in testing, a shunt that as much anything gave the GPDA impetus to pay for testing safety changes out of their OWN pocket.

The benefits Lewis reaped, and now suggests he should not at all feel compelled to contribute to, is very off putting.

I can't imagine _anyone_ but his most ardent fans could excuse the atrocious PR he's putting out this year. The ridiculous vodafone stunt was embarrassing for his image. This GPDA business, I think, speaks about him personally and that is far more damaging. It points to someone who is very self-interested, cheap, and ultimately happy to reap the benefits of others work.

If Kimi were to make similar comments as Lewis, I would apply the above to him too. I am very interested as to whether or not he contributes. From Webber's comments the other day, it is possible he does, while not actually attending any meetings. That in itself, I find disappointing though.

But Lewis with his comments goes far beyond that

Yada yada yada yada....................Yawn!

[jimm]

Another LH bashing thread...how original