42 replies to this topic

[Georg_Kuyumji]

I think an F1 Magazine (long time back) had the telemetry links comparing Schumacher and Barrichello going through the same corners. From what I recall, the traces had Michael downshifting later, having more throttle throughout the turn, and gaining a few tenths coming out.

Does anybody have any scanned archives/graphs of it ?

[spyduh]

Wasn't the comparison Schumacher Vs Johnny Herbert?

[fukkinen]

May I seize the opportunity to ask if someone has the Autosport comparison among MS Benetton vs. Hill Williams driving styles, back in 1995, published in Autosport Magazine?

Thanks in advance.

[Tigershark]

A comparison between the telemetry of Barrichello and Schumacher at Silverstone (Coprse, Maggots and Becketts), Montreal (Hairpin) and Suzuka (Turn One) was published in the Dutch F1 Racing of September 2003. They have likely been printed in the English magazine a month or two earlier.

I will try to scan them tomorrow afternoon if nobody has provided you with a scan of the (English) graphs by then.

[saudoso]

This might do it:

Google cache on another forum

[Tigershark]

Those are indeed the graphs printed in the 2003 F1 Racing magazine. Nice find saudoso.

[Zoe]

You can clearly see how Ferrari compromised Barrichello's performance there oops....

Seriously, this is very interesting! What I don't understand is why Barrichello didn't use left foot braking; heck, I use it sometimes in my road car?!? He's losing up 0,3 secs in a single corner, thats massive!

Zoe

[Meanie]

Tigershark, could you post the Montreal Hairping page on a higher resolution?
If you manage to get it to the same size as those others scans... that would be grand.

Thanks a lot.

[ViMaMo]

what about races where barric beat schumi? points to ponder

[Gecko]

You can notice in those graphs that Rubens tends to lose most on entry but often gain some of that back on exit. The tracks where Rubens used to beat or at least be comparable to Michael are those that featured lots of stop and go corners (Monza or A-1 Ring), where exit is much more important than entry. Sometimes of course the natural variation in both driver performance and success at finding that perfect setup is what makes the difference from one weekend to the next.

[umapathypon]

Originally posted by saudoso
This might do it:

Google cache on another forum

Thanks saudoso.Interesting.

btw,the non-cached version is still available - http://teamslow.aitc...ight=schumacher

[Tigershark]

Originally posted by Meanie
Tigershark, could you post the Montreal Hairping page on a higher resolution?
If you manage to get it to the same size as those others scans... that would be grand.

Thanks a lot.

I'll be sure to give it a try later today.

[Peter Perfect]

Very cool.

Interestingly I know that Button used to trail the throttle through corners quite a lot when he partnered Fisi to enable him to balance the car. He changed his style when he realised that Fisi was always able to go an extra lap on the same fuel load because Fisi didn't trail the throttle. I'd imagine Button still trails the throttle but not as much as he used to.

Does Rubens still right-foot brake?

[MikeTekRacing]

i have a pdf with this at home, i will upload it tonight and post it here

[Josta]

Originally posted by umapathypon
Thanks saudoso.Interesting.

btw,the non-cached version is still available - http://teamslow.aitc...ight=schumacher

I tried going to this url and was informed that I have been banned by the site administrator. I have never even heard of the forum before, yet I managed to get myself banned.

[Zoe]

Your reputation seems to be quite widespread ;)

Zoe

[Tigershark]

Here is the Canada scan: http://img245.imagev...al_122_56lo.jpg

I might translate the comments later on, but as I'm in a bit of a hurry I think the graphs will be able to speak for themselves for the time being. If all else fails the lower resolution English scan is quite readable as well.

[Jerome]

Originally posted by Josta


I tried going to this url and was informed that I have been banned by the site administrator. I have never even heard of the forum before, yet I managed to get myself banned.

Could be your ip adress was used (highjacked) by a user who needs an uk based adress for watching programs from his own country.

[Juan Kerr]

who cares anyway when the set up parameters give total different handling behaviour.

[Josta]

Originally posted by Jerome



Could be your ip adress was used (highjacked) by a user who needs an uk based adress for watching programs from his own country.

I don't have a uk based ip address, and I am at work. So it is probably the case that one of the 5000 other employees of the bank has been to the forum and been naughty.

[Georg_Kuyumji]

Thanks Thanks Thanks guys!

[giacomo]

Originally posted by Zoe
You can clearly see how Ferrari compromised Barrichello's performance there oops....

Of course Todt ordered poor ole Ruby to slow down to enable Ferrari to publish telemetry sheets that make Schuey look good.

[giacomo]

Originally posted by Zoe
Seriously, this is very interesting! What I don't understand is why Barrichello didn't use left foot braking; heck, I use it sometimes in my road car?!?

Just out of interest - left foot braking in your road car? For what purpose?

[saudoso]

Originally posted by Josta


I tried going to this url and was informed that I have been banned by the site administrator. I have never even heard of the forum before, yet I managed to get myself banned.

Same here, that's why I posted the cache.

[Zoe]

Originally posted by giacomo
Just out of interest - left foot braking in your road car? For what purpose?

Because it's fun? And you don't have to switch between accelerator and brake pedal with the right foot, simply get off the throttle, hit the brakes, hot the throttle again. Just like in go-karts.

Zoe

[eoin]

Originally posted by Zoe

Because it's fun? And you don't have to switch between accelerator and brake pedal with the right foot, simply get off the throttle, hit the brakes, hot the throttle again. Just like in go-karts.

Zoe

After a weekend of racing i stepped in my car and nearly crashed at the first turn doing this! Coming up to a 90 degree turn and went to brake but used my left instead of my right, left legged naturally, forgetting that i might need to use the clutch to get out of 5 gear! Legs/hands flying all over the place...

[Georg_Kuyumji]

Some inspirations for left foot braking:

Montoya in NASCAR foot cam:



or:



You can practise this technique good in Racing Simulations if you have the equipment

[giacomo]

Originally posted by Zoe

Because it's fun? And you don't have to switch between accelerator and brake pedal with the right foot, simply get off the throttle, hit the brakes, hot the throttle again. Just like in go-karts.

Ok. Thanks.

[Hacklerf]

Originally posted by Georg_Kuyumji
Some inspirations for left foot braking:

Montoya in NASCAR foot cam:



or:



You can practise this technique good in Racing Simulations if you have the equipment

I left foot break sometimes in my road car when im bored

[mclarensmps]

Originally posted by Hacklerf


I left foot break sometimes in my road car when im bored

Same here, I do it because I love the sound of blipping the throttle during heel and toe .

[MikeTekRacing]

http://rapidshare.co...Rubens.pdf.html
i don't know if the other links work, i uploaded the article here
enjoy

[Alaweni]

Originally posted by giacomo
Just out of interest - left foot braking in your road car? For what purpose?

I do it in stop and go traffic. I find it easier to just move my toes instead of my right leg pedal to pedal.

[mimin]

Originally posted by Josta


I tried going to this url and was informed that I have been banned by the site administrator. I have never even heard of the forum before, yet I managed to get myself banned.

I was surprised as well

[BMW_F1]

who ever posted this link, thanks. Are there any other charts like these on the web for other drivers?

[Georg_Kuyumji]

Originally posted by MikeTekRacing
http://rapidshare.co...Rubens.pdf.html
i don't know if the other links work, i uploaded the article here
enjoy

Is that a cat or a dog?

[StefanV]

Originally posted by Zoe
You can clearly see how Ferrari compromised Barrichello's performance there oops....

Seriously, this is very interesting! What I don't understand is why Barrichello didn't use left foot braking; heck, I use it sometimes in my road car?!? He's losing up 0,3 secs in a single corner, thats massive!

Zoe

He switched to left foot braking some years ago. Maybe it was 2003, after seeing this telemetry?

[jb_128]

Most of the text is bollocks but the graphs are interesting. Looks like (one of) MS' secret is dynamically adjusting brake balance by using the throttle during heavy braking, a technique I've heard alien sim racing drivers use, but never seen in real life.

The brake trace in the Suzuka graph looks strange though, I wonder if the 3% brake he uses before lifting off and while accelerating at the exit are real inputs or just insignificant noise?

[pingu666]

Originally posted by StefanV

He switched to left foot braking some years ago. Maybe it was 2003, after seeing this telemetry?

there was a interview years ago on the autosport website i think, and they asked him what foot he uses in ermgancy... and he said both

i think he might use a mix of left and right now...

[Risil]

I think we're all missing the point here. The real burning question as to Schumacher and Barrichello's driving styles, is

'How is their second phase turn-in??'

;)

[big x]

http://molinier.thom...rivingstyle.wmv

[mclarensmps]

Originally posted by Risil
I think we're all missing the point here. The real burning question as to Schumacher and Barrichello's driving styles, is

'How is their second phase turn-in??'

;)

I fell off my chair

[Bob Nomates 2nd]

he is still racing and schumacher isn't

[mursuka80]

Originally posted by Risil
I think we're all missing the point here. The real burning question as to Schumacher and Barrichello's driving styles, is

'How is their second phase turn-in??'

;)

Peter windsor is good for one thing:Comedy