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BRM Can-Am cars


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#51 Doug Nye

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Posted 14 August 2008 - 17:53

Michael Wheatley recalls seeing "the burned-out rear end of the P167" in David Hepworth's place in the early 1980s, and Hepworth saying he intended to build a fresh monocoque to the original drawings to recreate the car. The inference here is that the original tub was effectively destroyed in the surface-freight fire onboard ship. Perhaps this rear end still survives with the Hepworth family?

Michael's own P154 was acquired from Tony Hazlewood, for whom it had been driven by Mike Wilds. It was fitted with a 5-litre engine to match the regulations set by the hugely popular John Foulston for his big-banger race series, seemingly to ensure that he always had the biggest banger in the fleet. Mike's car was re-tubbed by Kerry Adams/Allan McCall when its original monocoque proved to be flexing, some of its glued seams having parted. The reassembled car was then set-up in effective P167 trim and proved itself "sensationally good". The failed original tub was left - it would appear - with Kerry...

DCN

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#52 mfd

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 11:13

Originally posted by Doug Nye
Michael Wheatley recalls seeing "the burned-out rear end of the P167" in David Hepworth's place in the early 1980s...Perhaps this rear end still survives with the Hepworth family?

Michael's own P154 was acquired from Tony Hazlewood...The failed original tub was left - it would appear - with Kerry...DCN


All in all, I'm now confused, not difficult :lol: but to summarise. A car for sale claiming to be unique, may not be. Nor the inference that it was the Wheatley car, which it was assumed came from Hepworth may not be either.
Assuming the Silverstone photo of the Hepworth car in May 73, which looks like a P167, had been on the fire damaged ship in November 72, it must have escaped relatively unscathed to be on track six months later. Perhaps the other car could have been more significantly damaged & this one was still around in the 80's?

#53 Mark 13

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Posted 22 August 2008 - 16:48

Thanks for the debate in response to my original post.

We still do not have a conclusion, but ultimately the identity and whereabouts will probably remain a mystery. In the 80's the Donington/MN GT Championship provided great variety and several of the bigger class cars were based on sportscars. I think Mick Hill was one who based his car on a T70, which has since been restored and the Jeff Wilson M1 with a GA engine was also a cleverly adapted car. There must have been some Gp 7 based hybrids at that time and there were certainly a few 2 litre Gp 6 cars used.

#54 Hepster

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 19:03

The car for sale is the Kalisch car and has been rebuilt after a considerable accident, it is also the car that Mike Wheatly, Mike Wilds and George Eaton drove. It is NOT however the sole remaining 154 as we still own the remaining 154 the 154/167 and 2 167's ( 4 out of the 5 cars built) that my father bought along with all drawings, paterns, moulds,Engines and spares, when BRM dropped the project.We have informed the agent selling the car of this but it still remains advertised as such, the latest black and white photograph actually shows an original 167.
The 1973 photo of Dad at Silverstone is definatly a genuine 167.
Over the years this car has been modified Mike Wheatly updated the car which was in genuine 154 spec to 154/167 spec with the assistance of my father and some parts supplied by ourselves. Mike did also have a tub "rebuilt" and on last speaking to him in the 90's still had the original panels.
The car then passed to Ulf Bowman in Sweeden who also sourced spares from ourselves, in recent years the current owner has made many modifications from any BRM specification original spec can be verified with the drawings we have.
The myth that one car was lost to the sea is untrue and has been doing the rounds prior to my father passing away, it was however damaged on board a ship travelling to Brazil, and after much negotiation and subsequent costs the car was repatriated from the salvage company.
One of the 167 was also damaged and still remains so after a transporter fire on the M1 in around 1973.
It is our intention to start restoration of the cars along with the other cars from my fathers motorsport life which if someone had the time would make a great book.
It is appreciated that interest is shown in these great cars and My father who was one of motorsports characters in its golden years.
Any one wanting further information drop a line or any other interesting David Hepworth stories. :rotfl:

#55 mfd

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 21:10

Originally posted by Hepster
The car for sale is the Kalisch car and has been rebuilt after a considerable accident, it is also the car that Mike Wheatly, Mike Wilds and George Eaton drove. It is NOT however the sole remaining 154 as we still own the remaining 154 the 154/167 and 2 167's ( 4 out of the 5 cars built) that my father bought along with all drawings, paterns, moulds,Engines and spares, when BRM dropped the project.


Nice to hear the reality is far from the original claim, although the one for sale could claim to be the only one in running order, this is not quite like saying "the only surviving Can-Am BRM"

I'm sure all fans of BRM will be delighted to read of your intention to restore them :up: Thanks

#56 Mark 13

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Posted 29 August 2009 - 21:19

Nice to hear the reality is far from the original claim, although the one for sale could claim to be the only one in running order, this is not quite like saying "the only surviving Can-Am BRM"

I'm sure all fans of BRM will be delighted to read of your intention to restore them :up: Thanks


It looks like this thread has been brought up to date after the unfortunate accident at Brands Hatch further damaged the ex-Kalisch car.
This months MotorSport contains a nice letter correcting the magazines innacurate report and referencing this forum as the source of the full and true story about the Can-Am BRM's.

#57 Johnny Lugnuts

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 19:15

Here's a shot of my Vanquish MG 1:32 slot car, complete with working differential!

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Johnny

#58 retriever

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 21:01

I attended the Martini 200 at Silverstone when Howden Ganley steered the BRM P154 massively through the original Woodcote corner. The entry was over 20 cars but half were only also rans. Impressive all the same. Cannot say the same about the grandstands though - scaffold poles and numbing canvas seats!

What year was that?

#59 simonlewisbooks

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Posted 01 October 2009 - 21:22

I attended the Martini 200 at Silverstone when Howden Ganley steered the BRM P154 massively through the original Woodcote corner. The entry was over 20 cars but half were only also rans. Impressive all the same. Cannot say the same about the grandstands though - scaffold poles and numbing canvas seats!

What year was that?

I once had a chat with Howden who was looking at a photo of this event which I had on my stand at Donington. I asked him what he thought of the car in general
"Great fun" he said "especially in the rain...." and I do believe he was being serious.....

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#60 faminz

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Posted 24 December 2009 - 07:21

G'day from NZ...

I just saw this forum and thread while googling about the P.167 and Id like to ask for help.
I have acquired a Polistil 1/26 scale (I think) diecast of what is marked as a P.154 1971.

To me it looks more like a P.167 ... hmmmm , anyway I want to restore it to accurate colours.

Can anyone help with a link to a colour photo of the car and/or where I can get decals for it?

The car has cheap stickers on the front fenders saying Can am 72and a red sticker along the sill under the doors...

I can post a photo if that will help.


#61 Duc-Man

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Posted 24 December 2009 - 11:13

I have the 1/43 scale model by Polistil.

I think the most proper paint job would be the Castrol version:
Posted Image

Or the Alcan version:
Posted Image

Those were run like that back in the early 70ies. With the sponsor stickers on the sides of the car: at least in the Can-Am they changed partially from race to race.
Best thing to do would be: if you find a good shot of the car from the side, build it like that.


#62 faminz

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Posted 24 December 2009 - 20:10

thanks duc-man... as Howden Ganley drove the alcan one (and him a fellow New Zealander) I guess that would be best.

I also think the Castrol one doesnt look quite the same as the polistil model. The wing seems to lack the fences and the wing mirrors are different.

I also have a B&W side view of the alcan one which Ive dumped on my website for the link.

http://www.huttcity....NZ/Default.aspx


The Polistil model looks like this:
http://2.bp.blogspot...uloCoruja_1.jpg

Edited by faminz, 24 December 2009 - 20:15.


#63 Mark 13

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Posted 14 November 2011 - 22:51

It looks like this thread has been brought up to date after the unfortunate accident at Brands Hatch further damaged the ex-Kalisch car.
This months MotorSport contains a nice letter correcting the magazines innacurate report and referencing this forum as the source of the full and true story about the Can-Am BRM's.


Did the car get rebuilt after its Brands Hatch incident? The Supersport Cup seems to have retrenched due to the recession and the Masters Series alternatives. Has the John Grant McLaren been rebuilt. That car also had 2 heavy accidents, although the last incident was quite alarming.

#64 Thundersports

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Posted 15 November 2011 - 00:04

I'm sure the chassis numbers were intact.......

#65 Giraffe

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Posted 27 February 2012 - 15:31

Has the John Grant McLaren been rebuilt. That car also had 2 heavy accidents, although the last incident was quite alarming.


I had lunch with John yesterday, and he told me that the McLaren is almost finished, although I can't see his wife letting him race it (or much else for that matter :well: ) John also has the Shadow DN9 that Helen Malkie used to race & which he tells me had been modified to 'B' spec but which he has now returned to original. We later compared our limps in the carpark! :cool:

#66 Mark 13

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 16:26

Noticed in Autosport that the Hepworth team are looking to restore the BRM Can-Am cars.

Hopefully they will be unleashed again in their period livery. Does anyone know how many cars they have. I seem to remember 1 being the P154, another being a hybrid and the 3rd being the ultimate P167.

#67 Duc-Man

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 17:26

Noticed in Autosport that the Hepworth team are looking to restore the BRM Can-Am cars.

Hopefully they will be unleashed again in their period livery. Does anyone know how many cars they have. I seem to remember 1 being the P154, another being a hybrid and the 3rd being the ultimate P167.


It's been answered here before.
Look at post #54.

#68 19ryanh93

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 10:23

We have 4 out of 5 which i believe my dad confirmed previously the final car is the Kalisch car.

One of the cars is undergoing restoration at the moment and I will post photos from time to time, if you want any more info have a look at www.hepworthinternational.com where we will keep an album up to date.

#69 Tim Murray

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 11:15

Welcome Ryan - good to see that you're maintaining the family racing tradition:

http://www.ryanhepwo....uk/family.html

#70 Duc-Man

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Posted 05 July 2013 - 08:30

Since the whole discussion re-surfaced after more than a year I have a couple of questions about the Kalisch and the car:
a) why did Kalisch stop racing it?
b) does anybody know who bought it or where it went to?
c) any chances to see the car back on track?
d) any chances to see any of the BRM can-am cars back on track?

996517_632633970083258_1302984493_n.jpg?
Ulf Bowman

944477_632633943416594_1849044427_n.jpg?
Jost Kalisch
Sorry for the poor quality :cry:


Edited by Duc-Man, 29 June 2015 - 14:48.


#71 19ryanh93

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Posted 28 March 2014 - 11:53

So, I have only just really got back onto this thread but to answer some of your questions:

 

The Hepworth owned cars are currently going through restoration, there is one P154 and a 167 currently undergoing restoration in our workshop, we have posted numerous photos to our facebook page which you all are more than welcome to have a look at:

 

https://www.facebook...107473629292507



#72 Mark 13

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Posted 25 June 2015 - 22:17

Hepworth International present at the Goodwood FOS with the fully restored P167.
A fantastic sight and I had a great conversation with the original mechanic who looked after the car in period and has returned from exile in Canada to assist with the build.

#73 kartman24

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 12:39

Great news, been looking forward to seeing the car again. Last time I saw it was at the Martini International at Silverstone in the early 70`s. Any pictures?............Martin



#74 Duc-Man

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 14:45

Great news, been looking forward to seeing the car again. Last time I saw it was at the Martini International at Silverstone in the early 70`s. Any pictures?............Martin

Stephen Hepworth/Hepworth International posted some photos of the rebuild and the finished car on facebook.

 

1907500_981278788578649_5296520177609570

 

11665488_980144328692095_197868186982909

 

11209700_477631552399767_523704204287422



#75 sabrejet

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Posted 29 June 2015 - 20:05

A few from Donington Supersports 2nd September 1990 (wish I'd stored my negatives better!):

 

decb11ea47a5f958e12e5582e74a332d_4bf.jpg

 

d4606363f1bd41b546188eb3d011b2e0_3f0.jpg

 

d5aa16d26610aa755d261d1dcca6f35a_3ac.jpg



#76 D28

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Posted 30 June 2015 - 13:54

Thanks for posting the photos. I consider the Castrol liveried BRM to be one of the handsomest of all Can-AM cars. The original P!54 looked even better without the huge wing, I saw I believe the debut of this car at Mosport in 1970 with George Eaton on board.. It was not too competitive, but it certainly looked great.



#77 layabout

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Posted 03 July 2015 - 17:14

I attended the Martini 200 at Silverstone when Howden Ganley steered the BRM P154 massively through the original Woodcote corner. The entry was over 20 cars but half were only also rans. Impressive all the same. Cannot say the same about the grandstands though - scaffold poles and numbing canvas seats!

What year was that?

That was the 1972 Interserie race at Silverstone & Howden Ganley was in a BRM P167, not a P154. Here's a photo from the Interserie chapter in his book 'The Road to Monaco': 

P167.jpg


#78 19ryanh93

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Posted 14 April 2016 - 17:48

A few from Donington Supersports 2nd September 1990 (wish I'd stored my negatives better! ):

 

decb11ea47a5f958e12e5582e74a332d_4bf.jpg

 

d4606363f1bd41b546188eb3d011b2e0_3f0.jpg

 

d5aa16d26610aa755d261d1dcca6f35a_3ac.jpg

The car above is what is known now as the Kalisch car, it started out as a 154 but then became what it is above which is nothing like the 154 it should be



#79 19ryanh93

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Posted 14 April 2016 - 17:49

On another note, the ex Pedro Rodriguez P154 is currently being restored by us and will potentially be present at Goodwood FoS



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#80 retriever

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Posted 15 April 2016 - 10:25

 

That was the 1972 Interserie race at Silverstone & Howden Ganley was in a BRM P167, not a P154. Here's a photo from the Interserie chapter in his book 'The Road to Monaco': 

P167.jpg

 

Thanks for correcting my memory. He was really impressive taking it through Woodcote. Must obtain a copy of his book before it sells out.



#81 Jerry Entin

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Posted 15 April 2016 - 12:50

brm-riverside_zpswl8n18mf.jpg

BRM P167 at Riverside in 1971

Howden Ganley driving Sid Taylor on the picture left and Ron Bennett and Charlie Agapiou on picture right and at the back Jerry Entin



#82 Mark 13

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Posted 31 October 2016 - 22:40

Looking at this months Motorsport magazine, all 3 Hepworth cars are for sale.

 

The restored yellow P167 (chassis 2), the Castrol liveried P154 and the P167  (chassis 1) currently under restoration.

 

I hope the cars don't disappear into a collection never to be heard or seen again. The value of historically significant vehicles has risen dramatically and with the capital gains tax advantages, it is a dangerous scenario.


Edited by Mark 13, 02 November 2016 - 14:59.


#83 RA Historian

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Posted 01 November 2016 - 13:23

Problem, such as it is, is that historic and/or rare race cars have simply priced themselves to a level so high that it is getting foolish for owners to risk them on a track.



#84 E1pix

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Posted 01 November 2016 - 13:53

That's why I'm a proponent of re-marquing "new" cars and doing it all over again.

Will people get hurt? Probably, yes. Will people take that chance to bring back the Golden Days? Yes, they will.

To Heck with the legal ramifications, let's make RACING great again!

(this is not intended to sound political, though I approve this message)

#85 Slurp1955

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Posted 02 November 2016 - 13:57

I understand that Castrol is replacing Mobil in F1 McLarens next season. It would be great to see that BRM livery resurrected on the MP4-32 :cool:



#86 group7

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Posted 02 November 2016 - 16:39

Jerry thanks for posting, that picture of the P167 at Riverside, also appears in the new Levy/Biro...Lyons Can-Am 50th. Anniversary book.

 

 

Michael



#87 MCS

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Posted 02 November 2016 - 23:54

Hadn't seen the previously posted Riverside picture first time around. Love it.

 

Here's a story. I "visited" the Riverside International Automotive Museum one week after it closed.  I was on my way to Palm Springs and stopped by - it wasn't easy to find.  But it was closed despite the internet saying otherwise.I won't say anything else here just now.



#88 Sisyphus

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Posted 03 November 2016 - 19:27

That sucks.  It's what I get for not visiting when I had the chance.  The website (http://riversideintlautomuseum.org) is now showing that that the Riverside museum is closed.