38 replies to this topic

[Elford68]

Hi

I am helping Steffe Ornerdal to improve his site "F2 Register" and I decided to open this topic, like the CART/USAC/AAA History topic, in order to share our doubts and get some help concerning this series.

I also gave to Steffe the idea of creating car drawings, like ones of Castrol and another book ( I can post but I don't know if they are under copyright) in order to improve the graphical quality of the site.

[philippe charuest]

good idea ,theres never too much F2 , except when they use the name for a new spec series like they intend to do next year

[Elford68]

F2 is the poor relative of World Racing Series

[D-Type]

Let's start at the beginning. I think http://forums.autosp...409#post1256409 says that the CSI instituted Formula 2in 1947 with effect from 1948.

The first Formula 2 for 2000cc unsupercharged / 500cc supercharged ran until 1953.

[Elford68]

Does anyone have complete results, with the starting grid and photos?

[Rob29]

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
F2 is the poor relative of World Racing Series

What is 'World Racing Series'?
I know about;
Renault World Series
GP2
Intl Formula Masters
Euro 3000
Formula Nippon
Indy Lights
Formula Atlantic
Asian FV6


All of these seem to fit between F3 & F1.Not suprising that people may be confused?

Re history of F2-1947-53,57-60 ,64-84 I thought Steffe's site already had all the available info.

[D-Type]

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
Does anyone have complete results, with the starting grid and photos?

It is a greatr help to people if you are more specific.
In your first post you regfer to "F2 Register" which I think is a website so you must have some information.
So what years do you not have any information, incomplete information, specific data missing?

[john winfield]

Duncan, yes, the 'F2 Register' is a website, full of useful results/entry details for Formula 2, Formula 3, non-championship F1 etc. Stefan Ornerdal seems to be the creator and I see that 'Fines' is mentioned as one of the researchers.

Elford, given that you already have lots of F2 detail on the site, what specifically do you want next? Is your priority to complete results first, then add grids, then add photos? Are you working back from 1984, completing years as you go or do you want any details, in any order?
John

[Elford68]

I am helping in F2 Register. I have some photos and I am searching for complete starting grids. I will do also a line-up for several seasons.

[Elford68]

I will explain here my project:

- I decided, after several aborted projects and topics to concern myself on one project: help Steffe to improve his F2/F3 site. Although this, I will keep writing some articles and working more on the forum. I will also give some project ideas too.

- My idea with the articles is very simple, I would like to have several articles, covering many areas of MotorSport history, since his 1st day till nowadays. I think it's important because with so many things on internet and so many collectors and so many Motorsport lovers my idea can be realized. It will be very good because there isn't possible for everyone to collect material and buy books, etc and with the crisis in what we live this certainly isn't the main priority for many people so, having a free DB and free articles, ORGANIZED will be good for all worldwide community.

- I have posted some things before, like the article about Guido Daccó and, I think I had done some Motorsport DB items like Guerrero and Foitek. This can be the 1st step for this.

- I would like, when I have an article, to put some references in that, for example, if I do an article about Reine Wisell I can put a reference to this month MotorSport magazine. So, any Wisell fan can buy the magazine.

- Although many ones can talk about Copyright problems, I think that there isn't any trouble in sharing material like photos and magazines on a private level. Obviously I don't agree with posts here with copyrighted material, but I can do any scan and send by email TO PRIVATE USE.

- About F2 Register I have several tasks:

1. The site has, at the moment, detailed results, championship tables, ... I would like to complete the results with qualifying times and positions.

2. I would like to add more results, concerning on F2 and F3.

3. I have the idea of creating a driver's and cars line-up for every year, with car drawings. It would improve the site. I will post soon my model of the cars. I only ask for a designer because I can find the photos. (some of them)


So please comment my ideas. I would like to ask for an opportunity and trust by all community to put this project as a real thing. I think it would be good to collaborate with other motorsport forums like Aerogi, TBK, FASTLANE ,....



Best Regards

NOTE: The image model. Please tell me if it's copyright infringement

http://www.mediafire...04e75f6e8ebb871

[Elford68]

So please, what you think? I have posted my idea in several big forums, in order to search for more people interested

[Elford68]

F2 1982 line-up

[D-Type]

How do you get to see the pictures on that mediafire site?

I've tried three times. The first time I got sent I got sent to an on line casino; next there was an attempt to download some Apple software; then got a message that said I need some sort of share code to view the image.

[Elford68]

It's a .docx file

[D-Type]

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
It's a .docx file

That answer is as much use as a chocolate teapot!
What is a .docx file?
How do I view it?
Does it require special software? If so what?
How do I avoid the on line casino and other traps on the site?

[Elford68]

.docx means 2007 Word.

And can you download with this link?

http://www.mediafire...php?ild1mmydltw

[Elford68]

* Ralt Racing Ltd. (Ralt RH6-82/Honda):

1. Kenny Acheson
2. Jonathan Palmer (DNA last race)


* March Racing Ltd. (March 822/BMW):

3. Corrado Fabi
4. Johnny Cecotto
5. Christian Danner


* Maurer Motorsport (Maurer MM82/BMW):

6. Beppe Gabbiani
7. Stefan Bellof
8. Peter Schindler (1 - 3)/Eje Elgh (4)/Jean-Louis Schlesser (5 - 8)/Alain Ferté (9)/Jean-Louis Schlesser (10 - 13)


* Docking Spitzley Ltd. (Toleman TG280/Hart):

9. Carlo Rossi (DNA round 9 and 11)
10. Thierry Tassin (DNA round 9 and 12)


* Minardi Team Srl. (Minardi 281B/BMW):

11. Paolo Barilla
12. Alessandro Nannini
14. Siegfried Stohr (5)/"Mister Arriva" (12)


* Merzario Team (March 812-822/BMW):

16. Richard Dallest (1 - 4)/Harald Brutschin (5 - 9)/Guido Daccò (10 - 13)
17. Jo Gartner (1 - 11)/Roberto Campominosi (12)/Lamberto Leoni (13)
18. Oscar Pedersoli


* Horag Racing (March 822/BMW):

19. Mike Thackwell (1)/Stanley Dickens (2)/Mike Thackwell (4 - 11)
20. Hennig Hagenbauer (9)
42. Eje Elgh (11)


* Sanremo Racing Srl. (Toleman TG280/BMW):

21. "Eddy" Bianchi (1 - 3)/Piero Necchi (4 - 10)/Severino Zampatti (12 - 13)
22. Roberto Del Castello


* Motul GPA Nogaro (AGS JH19/BMW):

23. Philippe Streiff
24. Pascal Fabre


* Bertram Schäfer Racing (Maurer MM82/BMW):

25. Frank Jelinski
26. "Pierre Chauvet" (1)/Mike Thackwell (2)/"Pierre Chauvet" (3)/Wolfgang Klein (4)/"Pierre Chauvet" (5 - 10)/"Pierre Chauvet" (12 - 13)
29. Bruno Eichmann (9)


* Formel Rennsport Club (Lola T850/Hart):

27. Fredy Schnarwiler (1,2,13)


* Brambilla Racing (Minardi GM75/BMW):

28. Guido Daccò (1 - 9)/Aldo Bertuzzi (10 - 11)


* Trundle Racing (March 822/BMW):

30. Cliff Hansen (7 - 13)


* Ray Mallock (Ralt RT4/Ford BDA):

31. Ray Mallock (1)


* Marlboro Team Spirit (Spirit 201/Honda):

32. Thierry Boutsen
33. Stefan Johansson


* Formula 2 Team Sweden (Toleman TG208/Hart // March 812/BMW):

35./36. Tomas Kaiser (3,5,6,9,10,11)


* Bo Martinsson (March 812/BMW):

36. Bo Martinsson (1)


* JPS Team Ikuzawa (March 812/Honda):

37. Satoru Nakajima (1,5,6,8,9)


* Franz Konrad Racing (March 812/BMW):

38. Franz Konrad (1 - 4)
39. Harald Brutschin (1 - 4)


* Gebhardt Motorsport (March 812/BMW):

41. Günter Gebhardt (2,4,5,8,9)


* Sewi Höpfer (Toleman TG280/Hart):

42. Sewi Hopfer (1,2,4,5)


* Ebor Motorsport / Rick Whyman (Ralt RT4/Hart):

44. Wyatt Stanley (1)/"Pierre Chauvet" (2)
45. Peter Stürtz (2)


* WRT Weigel-Renntechnik (March 802/BMW):

46. Hubert Striebig (2)


* Caledon Coal Open Cast (Ralt RT4/Ford DBA):

48. David Duffield (10)

[Allen Brown]

I still have no idea what you are trying to achieve and therefore what help you are asking for.

Have you discussed this with Stefan Örnerdal? Does he understand what you're trying to do?

[Elford68]

Yes, I've explained what I want

[Steffe Ornerdal]

Yes, you have, Elford68, but I can't say that I understand

[john winfield]

Hello Steffe,
I didn't realise until recently that the F2 Register was your work. Really interesting and very useful. Thanks.

[Elford68]

Let me explain again:

- You have your site with F2 Results and the Championship tables. What I want to do is complete the results (starting grids, qualifying times/corrrect some things in doubt) and add a line-up with driver's photos and, if possible, to add car drawings like the ones in my link to download.

[Allen Brown]

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
Let me explain again:

- You have your site with F2 Results and the Championship tables. What I want to do is complete the results (starting grids, qualifying times/corrrect some things in doubt) and add a line-up with driver's photos and, if possible, to add car drawings like the ones in my link to download.

OK, that I understand. So tell me how you are going about this? Your request for help is not very specific. Are you already compiling grids and starting times from Autosport, Motoring News, Autosprint, Sport Auto or some other source? Is there one particular race causing you problems? Where are you starting? 1948? 1967? 1984 and working backwards?

[Elford68]

I started by 1982 because I have some magazines from this year. I have some doubts, mainly with the cars used by some drivers and teams. I would like also to ask the members if they find any mistake at the line-up.

My main aim is to put rider's photsos and car drawings like the ones I post and create a kind of season presentation. There are so many things like that in F1 and no one in F2.

[Hieronymus]

Perhaps one must concentrate on the European F2 Championship races from 1967-1984 for a start. My own count suggests that about 460 drivers competed in championship races over this period.

[Elford68]

Yes, for the moment only the "Official" F2 Championship

[D-Type]

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
* Ralt Racing Ltd. (Ralt RH6-82/Honda):

1. Kenny Acheson
2. Jonathan Palmer (DNA last race)
~
~
~

* Caledon Coal Open Cast (Ralt RT4/Ford DBA):

48. David Duffield (10)

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
I started by 1982 because I have some magazines from this year. I have some doubts, mainly with the cars used by some drivers and teams. I would like also to ask the members if they find any mistake at the line-up.
My main aim is to put rider's photsos and car drawings like the ones I post and create a kind of season presentation. There are so many things like that in F1 and no one in F2.

So, although you didn't say so I assume that what you posted is what you know of the 1982 lineup.


Elford 68,

I don't what to harp on about this, but your postings have not been clear what information you are seeking.

I am sure people will willingly help you if they feel you are not wasting their time looking out information you already have.

I think that you have a clear idea of the big picture of what you would like to do but aren't really sure where to start. I don't know how many years Stefan and his collaborators have already spent on this project.

For a start, have you been in communication with Stefan and asked what information he has but has not yet published on his site and asked him what information he would like you to investigate? If you have, you haven't told us.

Can we assume that you have copies the relevant Sheldon "Black Books" and the addenda? If you have that information, you should tell us to save people wasting their valuable time seeking out data you already have.

You say you have a collection of magazines from 1982. If you tell us which ones it will save people wasting their valuable time ~

I suggest you step back apace and look at what you are trying to accomplish then ask a single question about a particular year or race, say what information you are sure of, what information you think is correct and what information you are missing. Once that question is resolved you can go onto the next one.

[fines]

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
* Sewi Höpfer (Toleman TG280/Hart):

42. Sewi Höpfer (1,2,4,5)


* Ebor Motorsport / Rick Whyman (Ralt RT4/Hart):

44. Wyatt Stanley (1)/"Pierre Chauvet" (2)
45. Peter Stürtz (2) [/B]

It's Eusebius "Sewi" Hopfer, no umlaut! And I would think that Ebor Motorsport and Rick Whyman are two different teams, no? I do seem to recall that Stanley drove a Ralt, probably for Whyman (?), but Stürtz I remember as a German hill climber, who ran a March/BMW 802 for a few years - a private entry, no doubt!

[Elford68]

Hi

I am not a good writer so I understand my intentions aren't well explained. I have MotorSport complete year and some L'Automobile. I don't have Sheldon books. What you think about the picture?


With Steffe, I've talked with him and I told him want I would like to do. I am doing the line-up and searching for drivers' photos, I only need the grphic designer.

[Elford68]

Quote

Originally posted by fines

It's Eusebius "Sewi" Hopfer, no umlaut! And I would think that Ebor Motorsport and Rick Whyman are two different teams, no? I do seem to recall that Stanley drove a Ralt, probably for Whyman (?), but Stürtz I remember as a German hill climber, who ran a March/BMW 802 for a few years - a private entry, no doubt!

I think Ebor and Whyman are the same team. I picked this info directly from Steffe's site.

[fines]

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
* Minardi Team Srl. (Minardi 281B/BMW):

11. Paolo Barilla
12. Alessandro Nannini
14. Siegfried Stöhr (5)/"Mister Arriva" (12)


* Horag Racing (March 822/BMW):

19. Mike Thackwell (1)/Stanley Dickens (2)/Mike Thackwell (4 - 11)
20. Henrig Hagenbauer (9)
42. Eje Elgh (11)


* Franz Konrad Racing (March 812/BMW):

38. Franz Konrad (1 - 4)
39. Harald Britsvchin (1 - 4)


* Gebhardt Motorsport (March 812/BMW):

41. Günther Gebhardt (2,4,5,8,9)


[/B]

14. Siegfried Stohr, again: no umlaut

20. Henning Hagenbauer

39. Harald Brutschin

41. Günter Gebhardt

Also, did Schäfer really have three Maurers???

[Elford68]

The 3rd car only raced at Round 9. And I've edited the corrections you told me.

[Hieronymus]

I am sure Elford68 has good intentions with whatever he wishes to accomplish. I have always hoped that someone would do a F2 imitation of Steve Small's GRAND PRIX WHO'S WHO. I do not have the time nor the patience (perhaps knowledge as well) to indulge in such an effort.

[fines]

Quote

Originally posted by Elford68
The 3rd car only raced at Round 9. And I've edited the corrections you told me.

Yes, that's why I wonder: if he had indeed three cars, why would he race one of them only once!? On the other hand, he had a Ralt in 1981 which was driven by Winkelhock on a couple of occasions, maybe he still had it in '82?

[ReWind]

Of course Eichmann didn't drive a Maurer but the old Ralt at Hockenheim in June 1982.

The F2 Register says so, too.

F2 starting grids and practice times are already there in Paul Sheldon's Black Books.

[Elford68]

Sorry, I hadn't seen it.

[Elford68]

Any idea about some of the team changes?

[Frank Verplanken]

F2 being one of my primary loves in motor racing, I would be delighted to contribute to this thread, but won't be able due to lack of time. However, I'll attach with this post an MS-Word file I started a few years ago, which is very much in the same vein, I think, as the work you have tackled here. The file gathers all the entries for the 1964-84 period races, Euro F2 or not, sorted by teams. It is very much inspired by Leo Breevoort's work on Grand Prix teams, only with short biographies in addition to the raw data. The data comes from Stefan's F2 Register site of course (I had send you this, right Stefan ? can't remember for sure). The file is very much a work in progress (particularly on the biographies side) but you might find a thing or two of interest. Or not !

Anyways, feel free to use this material. Errors must abound in there I guess, and of course comments, corrections, insults, etc. are very much welcome, but as I said, no offense if you don't see me around to exchange with you on this - although I wish I had, I don't have the time it supposes .

Have fun guys .

F2 Teams Index 1964_84

[Elford68]

Hi! Many thanks, I will certainly use it.