39 replies to this topic

[J]

Simple question: Max Mosley´s FIA, or the manufacturers FOTA? Which one would you like to control the premier open wheel racing category?

-J

[WACKO]

FIA... minus Max

[AlanB]

FOTA, there seems to be some sanity there at least.

[J]

"FIA... minus Max "

Well, that´s not available at the moment, neither in this poll, nor in real life, as Max is gearing up for another term..


-J

[JPW]

FIA not a doubt

[Szoelloe]

Originally posted by J
Simple question: Max Mosley´s FIA, or the manufacturers FOTA? Which one would you like to control the premier open wheel racing catgory?

-J

No, it is not that simple a question. In this form it is a manipulative question. FIA is not Max's. I vote for FIA, minus Max. The minute you let the teams govern F1, all hell breaks loose, and F1 will cease to be a sport anymore. There has to be a higher council.

edit/ps.: That is not saying FOTA is not just as important to exist and function.

[Slowinfastout]

At least the FIA is clear about bringing F1 towards being a spec series... FOTA are led by manufacturers so they need some sort of diversity for the manufacturers implication to make sense...

What technical and other freedoms will the cost-capped teams have which are not available to the other teams?


Mosley: A different (but standard) under body, movable wings, no engine rev limit, no restriction on the number or type of updates, no homologation requirements, no limits on materials, testing, simulators, wind tunnels and so forth - most of the cost saving measures introduced over the last few years will not apply to these teams. However measures to save money during the race weekend, such as the ban on refuelling and the Saturday parc ferme, will apply to both categories of team. We are also thinking about a much bigger capacity KERS for the cost-capped teams. But all this must be covered by the £30 million - no exceptions and no free or subsidised outside help. Anything supplied by another team or an outside supplier will be included at its full commercial cost except for items supplied to all teams at subsidised rates under the single supplier arrangements negotiated by the FIA (e.g. for tyres), which allow all teams to benefit equally from reduced costs.


But isn't that unfair? With a specially shaped under body and movable wings won't these cars have an unfair advantage?


Mosley: No, we will make sure these advantages do no more than balance the disadvantages the cost-capped teams will have because of their very restricted budgets. As said, we will balance the median performances by adjusting the cost-capped cars should this prove necessary . The other cars will have stable technical regulations in return for which we understand FOTA intend to provide guarantees of continuing participation until 2012, underwritten by the major car manufacturers. The FIA has a lot of experience in performance adjustment and equivalence.

How much trust do you put into that?? He should have said 'NO' when asked if that crap was fair..

[Rob]

FOTA. The FIA is corrupt beyond repair.

[J]

Originally posted by Szoelloe


No, it is not that simple a question. In this form it is a manipulative question. FIA is not Max's. I vote for FIA, minus Max. The minute you let the teams govern F1, all hell breaks loose, and F1 will cease to be a sport anymore. There has to be a higher council.

I disagree with your preception of the FIA as it is now, and that is one reason why I posted the poll the way I did. I understand your wish for a different kind of FIA, but I don´t see it very likely in the near future. I posted this poll in the manner as I did, because the FIA (as it is now, headed by Mr. Mosley), and FOTA have published their visions for the future of the F1, and they seem to be very different. I am simply asking: Which one do you prefer?

We don´t know what post-Mosley FIA will be, or if it even will excist. It is quite hard to evaluate the merits of an option you have no knowledge of, don´t you think?

-J

[Blackdog]

There's a need for a regulatory body, which should be the FIA's role.
What's not needed is Mosely and his cronies whose only aim seems to be to bully the present F1 teams into accepting ever more illogical rule changes.
My only problem with FOTA setting up a breakaway series is that, without a functional replacement for the FIA, it would be likely to result in a resumption of 'hostilities' between the teams.

[BuzzingHornet]

Neither... they both don't have a bloody clue.

[Orin]

Originally posted by WACKO
FIA... minus Max

The FIA is Mosley and will be who ever the next president is. The organisation is nothing more than a rubber stamp for the president. It's broken.

[Szoelloe]

Originally posted by J


I disagree with your preception of the FIA as it is now, and that is one reason why I posted the poll the way I did. I understand your wish for a different kind of FIA, but I don´t see it very likely in the near future. I posted this poll in the manner as I did, because the FIA (as it is now, headed by Mr. Mosley), and FOTA have published their visions for the future of the F1, and they seem to be very different. I am simply asking: Which one do you prefer?

We don´t know what post-Mosley FIA will be, or if it even will excist. It is quite hard to evaluate the merits of an option you have no knowledge of, don´t you think?

-J

To ensure a new FIA, to look after its own interests, that is what a strong FOTA is for. But without the FIA, F1 is no more. I repeat, this is not a simple question, and no matter how much the teams (FOTA) talk about a split, it is never going to happen, because they don'tt want it either. FOTA may split from FOM, yes, that is a more possible scenario, and in my opinion a much more feasible one. And this is really not about my, or anybody's perception of the FIA, beleive me, I think it is disgusting also, but to turn your back and run in the other direction is not the solution, FOTA has the necessary leverage to change things on the short and long term. Sorry to disagree.

[J]

Originally posted by Szoelloe


To ensure a new FIA, to look after its own interests, that is what a strong FOTA is for. But without the FIA, F1 is no more. I repeat, this is not a simple question, and no matter how much the teams (FOTA) talk about a split, it is never going to happen, because they don'tt want it either. FOTA may split from FOM, yes, that is a more possible scenario, and in my opinion a much more feasible one. And this is really not about my, or anybody's perception of the FIA, beleive me, I think it is disgusting also, but to turn your back and run in the other direction is not the solution, FOTA has the necessary leverage to change things on the short and long term. Sorry to disagree.

No need to aplogize for an opinion. I think I understand your point, and I agree that if FOTA would break away, it would be crucial that the new series would need to have regulatory body, that could withstand a, shall we say, less harmonious FOTA than now. I have no doubt that the FOTA also sees this necessary, as have other professional sports where the participants own the sport.

But if we get to all practical difficulties of all options, I doubt there will ever be an understandable poll to conduct. Therefore my simple and simplified question still is: Which one do you prefer?

P.s. Outside of those options, I´d prefer that I would be in charge..

-J

[Szoelloe]

Originally posted by J


No need to aplogize for an opinion. I think I understand your point, and I agree that if FOTA would break away, it would be crucial that the new series would need to have regulatory body, that could withstand a, shall we say, less harmonious FOTA than now. I have no doubt that the FOTA also sees this necessary, as have other professional sports where the participants own the sport.

But if we get to all practical difficulties of all options, I doubt there will ever be an understandable poll to conduct. Therefore my simple and simplified question still is: Which one do you prefer?

P.s. Outside of those options, I´d prefer that I would be in charge..

-J

I understand. But F1, in my opinion needs to be in touch with the bloodstream of motorsport. It needs feeder series, it needs to be the pinnacle of motorsport, as it is now. As a standalone series, it loses and declines on long term. A (relatively) clean and objective FIA is crucial.

[J]

Originally posted by Szoelloe


I understand. But F1, in my opinion needs to be in touch with the bloodstream of motorsport. It needs feeder series, it needs to be the pinnacle of motorsport, as it is now. As a standalone series, it loses and declines on long term. A (relatively) clean and objective FIA is crucial.

What is the feeder series for the F1 at the moment? GP2?, F2? IRL? British F3? Euroseries F3?

IMHO it is not relevant who sanctions the feeder route, as long as the bar for entering the premier league is relevant to the skills that you need to preform compentetly when you get there.

I´d love to have a clean and objective governing body for F1!

Not that we´re implying, that there isn´t one already...;)

-J

[Floyd]

FIA or It All. I apologies for the language.

[metz]

FOTA with Frank Williams as chair.

[HoldenRT]

The teams have some of the best brains in the business, and are held accountable when they fail. Their results are there for all to see. When it comes to KERS or race cars, I'd trust Dr Mario over Max anyday of the week. The FIA aren't accountable at all, if they screw up, they will just try to fix it the next time.

[OnyxF1]

Neither. They are both useless. Both the auto manufacturers and the tag team of Max the Masochist and Bernard the Dwarf have been hugely detrimental to the sport.

[V8 Fireworks]

I wonder if those suggesting FOTA have heard of the similarly named CART...

With such wisdom as farting around with engine spec proposals so Honda and Toyota went to IRL, only to run the Cosworth version of the traditional Champcar motor anyway...

[Karsder]

FOTAs suggestions seems better in the short term atleast, but I doubt F1 would survive as a sport if they were to run it for some years. I believe both are needed with a strong FOTA that can influence but not control the regulations.

[Les]

Originally posted by BuzzingHornet
Neither... they both don't have a bloody clue.

Seconded. Too many geriatrics running this thing that is being termed the show too Mosely, Di Montezemelo, Dennis and Eccelstone etc. F1 could be doing with its own Obama type figure to offer a fresh perspective. Not that it could happen.

[Ferrim]

FOTA. Even if it's only because they haven't had time to piss me off yet.

[senna da silva]

FOTA

[GerardF1]

As the FIA has displayed only leadership in being biased and determined to turn F1 into a cookie cutter series. It has gone long past its best before date.

Give FOTA a chance - they cannot be the santioning body - you do have to get an independant party for that but let them give the rules a try.

[scottb32]

F O T A!

F O T A!

F O T A!

I think all fans can now agree: the FIA is inept. The FOTA has shown a willingness to address issues and provide proposals. The FIA ignores them.

Luca on the Unilateral FIA

Luca! Luca! Luca! (and I'm a McLaren fan).

[J]

After a full day of polling: Fairly brutal numbers... 89/11

-J

[jeze]

The FIA sucks big time. I'm not in agreement with FOTA on all issues, but at least they seem to be interested in what we think!

[thiscocks]

FIA can kiss the ring

[le chat noir]

i couldn't get myself to vote.

i utterly hate the shorter races idea which would change the sport utterly, but then so will the points system.

a third option of secret governance from atlas members and polls would be better - secret so that fanboys wouldn't know to sway the vote - then again maybe open is better, so fans of the sport know to counteract the fanboys

[moonman]

Max and Bernie should be deported to Sibiria and make sure they don't have access to maps or compass there.

[ZenSpeed]

FIA... minus Max

You are quite naive, my friend. That part of Paris where the FIA is needs do be nuked during an FIA council (well, figuratively, of course), so we can get rid of all the cronies that belong to that shameful organization, including prostitutes and dominatrix friends.....

Jean Marie Balestre held the FI(S)A just as much of an hostage as Max does today with FIA. These are well paid incompetent people who do not do anything all day and enjoy multiple benefits. They are there to keep the organization alive, strong and in control of F1 (that's where the money is.....) and guarantee their fat paychecks. That's all. And Emperor Caligula Max, just like his predecessor Napoleon Balestre, is there only to satisfy is personal ambition and power. That's all. The FIA as an organization needs to be erased from the face of the earth.

[Apollonius]

FOTA or a new regulatory body all together. Max or not the FIA is fundamentally flawed and can not be fixed with a change of President, behind the scenes the same corrupt people will be pushing through their same corrupt agendas.

[ensign14]

Lunatics or asylum?

[Raelene]

FIA

FOTa - sure,k this year, they may have agreed on things - but that hasn't always been the case. I dkon't trust manufacturers to look after the sport - or to stay inm the sport when times get too tough...

[Ruf]

I voted FOTA, but the question wasn't very well phrased. Should've been FOM or FOTA (FIA and Max are just clowns caught in the middle). And they're just as bad; they only want money. In past few years they are focusing on casual viewer that might be attracted by "spectacle". But they do pump up the TV ratings whereas the genuine fans interested in sport are relatively few and absolutely insignificant. Sorry guys, F1 is in agony since about 2003 and as of March 2009 is officially dead. It's been fun while it lasted though.

[Raelene]

Sorry guys, F1 is in agony since about 2003 and as of March 2009 is officially dead

seeya then - don't let the door hit you on the way out

[alfista]

I went for FOTA, although I see them having lots of weak points. But at least they seem to be conscious and responsible which I am not sure is the case with FIA.
Long-term I doubt if FOTA is able to govern racing series successfully. Their members interests are too different for that. Now they have one, well, two opponents which unites them. If they break away they lose that boost.

[alfista]

Originally posted by WACKO
FIA... minus Max

I had also temptation to go for that but think once. Who was FIA boss before Max? Jean-Marie Balestre. When Max was elected in 1991, anybody was considered better president than Balestre. Now we have reached the same situation - anybody seems to be better than Max. I don't think so. Imagine if Jean Todt with his Napoleon complex becomes FIA president.