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#51 ghinzani

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 00:11

How shameful that I should spell Gardner incorrectly! The problem with the Gardners were they were so efficient they didnt get hot hence they failed to provide much in the way of heat generation for the admittedly rudimentary heaters in the wagons of those days. The big Cummins 14 litres and the 12 litre Rollers were much better in the winter for keeping the cab warm, although none of them could help you overnight of course because thsi was pre overnight heater days. I recall the AEC's had a very handy feature during the boiling hot summer days wereby they rotted so badly you could see the road through the floor and cooling air found its way in.... not a problem for the plastic cabbed ERFs and Fodens of course.

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#52 Mallory Dan

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 12:31

That station pic is good, TW. I'm fairly sure its not Peterborough, the sidings to the right of the Duff don't look like there. Doncaster perhaps? Intriuging!!

#53 Geoff E

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 13:16

Originally posted by Mallory Dan
Doncaster perhaps? Intriuging!!


It could be Donny - the buildings look similar (although the old picture predates electrification of the ECML in the late 1980s). http://maps.live.com...aster&encType=1

#54 bradbury west

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 19:23

Originally posted by ghinzani
getting out of Cornwall & Devon on the old A30 used to be a mare.

Of course, down your way, over Goss Moor, it used to be all R&O with Gardner ERFs until Peter retired, and Nick Grose with the Atkinsons. I recall Chris Oates starting out with a nice maroon and grey F86 6 wheeler, as did Brixham and Torbay Fish, but then I am very old.......
Roger Lund

#55 bradbury west

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 20:56

It is interesting to see the 2nd Austin with 10 stud wheels, serious kit in those days, presumably for the gvw to take the drawbar.
Roger Lund

#56 brakedisc

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 21:02

Dennis
now there's a good name for a truck.

I started on a Rolls Dennis Fire engine and boy was it fun....................................................until you had to stop. Wish I had a photo of it, 622GVA a WRT that featured in Dennis ads in the sixties. We then had another KVD592L that was too heavy and again had no brakes. Got promoted shortly after being clocked at 70 in a 30 by a rather irate Policeman. We were on our way to a call I may add.

#57 bradbury west

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 21:09

Talking of Dennis, IIRC Alan Brown started off as a salesman for Dennis Bros.
RL

#58 ghinzani

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 21:38

Originally posted by bradbury west

Of course, down your way, over Goss Moor, it used to be all R&O with Gardner ERFs until Peter retired, and Nick Grose with the Atkinsons. I recall Chris Oates starting out with a nice maroon and grey F86 6 wheeler, as did Brixham and Torbay Fish, but then I am very old.......
Roger Lund


Dennis Oates still got an F89 and a 140 as far as I know. I used to like the Suttons Foden 8 wheelers that carried fish from PZ. Our farms just down the road from R&O, they had a lot of nice wagons, tended to be a lot of Seddon-Atkis in my time. NJ Grose and the W Grose outfits from Snozzle had a lot of Atki Borderers, real mens lorries! I share their surname and have always fancied a Borderer in their livery.

#59 JtP1

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 22:51

Originally posted by ghinzani


I share their surname and have always fancied a Borderer in their livery.


Spoken like a man who has never had to reverse a 40ft trailer into a tight door with one. The power assisted steering was putting your feet on the dashboard.

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#60 sterling49

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 22:52

Originally posted by JtP1


The power assisted steering was putting your feet on the dashboard.


:lol: :lol: :rotfl: :wave: Brilliant :up:

#61 bradbury west

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 22:57

Showmans lorry 1970s
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Foden heavy haulage ballasted tractor and trailer, Avonmouth docks, early morning mid 1970s, to collect steam train from East Africa
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Photos copyright Roger Lund

#62 Doug Nye

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 23:05

Short of conducting the Donington Collection Bristol transporter for a clandestine spell in Italy one year, my commercial vehicle experience is pretty much limited to a very elderly Bedford TK horsebox we ran for a while. Its wooden-planked sides and ramp were very rotten, weak and suspect, but I was fascinated by the overhead switch panel mounted on the windscreen header. When rumbling along at 40-50mph it became something of a family habit to reach up, digit poised over the appropriate switch - and to announce (voice muffled - Red Arrows-style) "Smoke on...Smoke on...GO!!!" - before hitting the tab. Infantile really - but it amused us at the time...

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#63 bradbury west

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 23:12

Originally posted by JtP1
Spoken like a man who has never had to reverse a 40ft trailer into a tight door with one. The power assisted steering was putting your feet on the dashboard.

Often also known as "Armstrong" power steering
RL

#64 ghinzani

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 23:21

Originally posted by JtP1


Spoken like a man who has never had to reverse a 40ft trailer into a tight door with one. The power assisted steering was putting your feet on the dashboard.


Youm english poofters with your power steering, get on!

#65 JtP1

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 00:39

Originally posted by ghinzani


Youm english poofters with your power steering, get on!


Well since I am Scottish, I see no reason to disagree with you.

#66 ghinzani

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 01:02

Originally posted by JtP1


Well since I am Scottish, I see no reason to disagree with you.


Oh yeah Albions and Cydesdales..

#67 alansart

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 12:19

Originally posted by Twin Window


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Is this Lincoln? Someone will know...

:up:


Durham. I strolled over that bridge a few weeks ago.

There's a shopping centre on that car park now.

#68 ferdi

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 12:40

...somewhere in Portugal....

(enroute to 1978 Rallye de Portugal)

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#69 Bob Riebe

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 15:41

Love the pictures of the old trucks.
There is something about pre 1970s trucks that has more soul.

Several years ago I was driving down the free-way and passed a semi-truck. Looked over and it was a recent build Marmon.
Sadly a year or so after that Marmon (with direct heritage back to Marmon automobiles) ceased to produce trucks.

#70 JtP1

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 16:15

Originally posted by ghinzani


Oh yeah Albions and Cydesdales..


The Albion works site is just along the road from where my garage was, the garage built by a sometime employee of Albion and some of the tools from the Albion. But that is as far as my interest in the slightly above junk produced there goes. I am quite sure they made some good products in their day, but that would predate their aquisition by Leyland.

At least they never produced the well named Leyland Marathon there. It would go about 26 miles before it broke.

#71 exclubracer

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 20:31

Originally posted by retriever
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This old girl was photographed in Liverpool back in the days of the Overhead Railway as pictured in the background. Burrill the Bradford based haulier had a depot in Liverpool, as did many of the period (late 1940s). Part of the Holdsworth / Hanson empire I think. Note that they were running slicks in those days! This is another Philip Hine image.


Blimey, look at the starting handle, who would be able to hand-crank one of those, Schwarzenegger would be hard pushed !! :eek:

#72 fredeuce

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 02:24

Originally posted by Bob Riebe
Love the pictures of the old trucks.
There is something about pre 1970s trucks that has more soul.

Several years ago I was driving down the free-way and passed a semi-truck. Looked over and it was a recent build Marmon.
Sadly a year or so after that Marmon (with direct heritage back to Marmon automobiles) ceased to produce trucks.


I'm not sure if I would cut off at 1970 perhaps a bit later for me. What i do miss is the noise. As a kid I lived adjacent to the highway between Adelaide and Sydney. This was the route for all interstate road transports. My brother and I become well attuned to the sounds of the various engines of the day like the old GM 8V-71 , GM 6V-53, 6V-71, 555 and 903 Cummins V8's, various other Cummins 6's the odd occassional GM 6-71 and Gardner 8 .

Now they are so politically correct with little noise and what noise there is , is very bland.

Here is a pic of an old R190 International that a friend of mine races on the salt . Equipped with a GM 12V-71 and straight out exhaust. This rig makes the most wonderful and distinctive noise. Fast too. Ran 133+ mph at the recent speed trials at Lake Gairdner in March 2009.

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#73 ghinzani

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 02:41

Originally posted by Bob Riebe
Love the pictures of the old trucks.
There is something about pre 1970s trucks that has more soul.

Several years ago I was driving down the free-way and passed a semi-truck. Looked over and it was a recent build Marmon.
Sadly a year or so after that Marmon (with direct heritage back to Marmon automobiles) ceased to produce trucks.


Marmon always got a mention in the many Lorry and Truck books I have, even though they were size and output wise the equivalent of Dennis over here compared to Leyland. I recall one book from the 70's somewhat patronisingly saying something along the lines of "the obscure Texan built Marmon, constructed entirely to the individual drivers specification. In this case an equally rare black driver" - how times change! Reminds me of Blazing Saddles...

#74 Fubar

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 07:50

For those interested, there is a great collection of old commercial vehicle pics at this link

http://www.chrishodg...truckphotos.htm

#75 fredeuce

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 08:34

Originally posted by Fubar
For those interested, there is a great collection of old commercial vehicle pics at this link

http://www.chrishodg...truckphotos.htm


Wonderful pics.Thanks Fubar :up: :up:

#76 ghinzani

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 11:25

For a very much yank bias, but with some good European stuff too check Hanks site out
http://www.hankstruc....com/trucks.htm
Theres some amazing American rigs from the 30's to the 50's especially. Cabover sleepers that amount to a little box over the cab, with a precarious ladder up to it.

#77 Leigh Trevail

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 19:57

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This new Volvo was operated by Fridged Freight of Diss in Norfolk, which was run by John Wyatt. Originally he used dry ice to keep the load at the correct temperature but after reading about freezer trucks in the U.S.A. he fitted a diesel powered compressor and fridge to one of his own wagons. John and his younger brother Ben were keen on motor racing and in 1951 both men (along with Oliver Sear) were instrumental in starting the racing at Snetterton, in fact John put up a 1st prize of £100 at the circuits inaugural meeting. Ben raced a Bugatti and a F2 Frazer Nash rebodied as a sports car. He had a “muck shifting” company which was based over the other side of the A11, which came in handy to shape up the new circuit. The second picture shows some of his kit working in Maidstone.

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#78 bradbury west

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 22:05

Originally posted by Leigh Trevail

Fridged Freight of Diss in Norfolk, which was run by John Wyatt. He had a “muck shifting” company which was based over the other side of the A11, which.........


....probably explains why he used an AEC Marshall major 6 wheel tipper chassis as a tractor unit under at least one of his self built fridge trailers, hauling hanging meat was a specialist business. He always designed his own kit to do the job, which meant he was always overweight, as we all were in that line of business. I recall one trailer of theirs which would take a full side of beef on the hook, trust me that is serious kit, too much detail to go into otherwise, although a bit of a job with French height limits.......
John Wyatt was always highly regarded, even more so when considering he was in a wheelchair IIRC.
Roger Lund

#79 Bruce302

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 08:37

Can some one refresh my memory on the AEC Mandator, what did they have powering them ?
I am thinking of the Ergo period.

Thanks,
Bruce

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#80 JtP1

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 08:48

Originally posted by Bruce302
Can some one refresh my memory on the AEC Mandator, what did they have powering them ?
I am thinking of the Ergo period.

Thanks,
Bruce


A straight 6 non turbo from AEC possibly the same engine as the Park Royal cab, although there were some V8s. The V8 disappeared I believe in a cloud of excess smoke. The uprated equivalent redeveloped turbo to match the F86 was the Leyland Buffalo, oops.

In the early 70s the 2 best selling 32t tractor units were the Aec Mandator and the Volvo F86.

#81 Bruce302

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 10:03

That's the one. A guy I worked with used to carry one about the V8 Mandator, but i'd never seen one.
AEC's weren't too plentiful, but Leylands were.

Dare I mention the Crusader ? One sat on unsold the dealers lot with Rolls power, and in desperation to sell it, it had to be repowered, with a Cummins from memory, but there were a lot of Detroit powered ones too.

#82 ghinzani

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 10:22

Originally posted by Bruce302
That's the one. A guy I worked with used to carry one about the V8 Mandator, but i'd never seen one.
AEC's weren't too plentiful, but Leylands were.

Dare I mention the Crusader ? One sat on unsold the dealers lot with Rolls power, and in desperation to sell it, it had to be repowered, with a Cummins from memory, but there were a lot of Detroit powered ones too.


In the UK the majority of Crusaders were sold with Roller power as I recall, although DD and even Leyland were an option. Lots still survive as the army had loads of them - plenty are still going as recovery wagons. In fact everytime I drive past Brighton Cross garage near Summercourt I slow down for a good look as they have/had two or three, with the usual military spec RR290L.

As to V8 Mandators, wasnt that the 706 engine? My Dad had one for a while, think it put out 270hp and absolutely flew, but the fitters said it was a nightmare to maintain so they went back to the lower powered Mandators with the fixed head engine that became the TL11 that went into the little T45 (Freighter?) in the early 80s.

#83 Bruce302

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 10:45

I just had to google those and these turned up. Sorry if it is too new.

http://www.webshots....ry=AEC Mandator

http://aec.middx.net...ts/engines1.htm

http://www.roadtrans...lobetrotte.html

which contains this from one of the operators:

The trucks were dreadful, breaking down all over Europe on a regular basis and we got very adept at sending parts by air to all sorts of unlikely places (try Yugoslavia on a Friday evening!)


Bruce.

#84 Leigh Trevail

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 13:26

Bradbury West Quote.."John Wyatt was always highly regarded, even more so when considering he was in a wheelchair IIRC."


Roger, that is interesting, you obviously knew John, you are correct that he built his own trailers and he was noted for running overweight. However your memory is playing a trick, at the age of 2 he contracted polio and had stunted growth, he always walked with two sticks but never had a wheelchair. I am in regular contact with his son Chris; but unfortunately he is not up to speed with computers, on his behalf; may I enquire how you were involved with Fridged Frieght?

#85 Bob Riebe

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 16:15

Are there any pure British semi-tractors still in production?
If not what was the last one?

#86 ghinzani

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 16:21

Originally posted by Bob Riebe
Are there any pure British semi-tractors still in production?
If not what was the last one?


The last pure British manufacturer of large Trucks was ERF and they went out of production in 2007 having been re-badged MAN's for a few years. Previous to that Fodens had been made at Leylands facilities up until a few years earlier. The whole thing is criminal and endemic of Britains demise. We used to make such beautiful lorries, many of which are gone never to be seen again. I think all we have now is maybe Hestair Dennis and certainly Shelvoke & Drewry.

#87 Bjorn Kjer

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 16:47

And these 2 are not semitractors but mainly fireengines and garbagelorries.

#88 Herr Wankel

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 17:05

Originally posted by ghinzani


In the UK the majority of Crusaders were sold with Roller power as I recall, although DD and even Leyland were an option. Lots still survive as the army had loads of them - plenty are still going as recovery wagons. In fact everytime I drive past Brighton Cross garage near Summercourt I slow down for a good look as they have/had two or three, with the usual military spec RR290L.

As to V8 Mandators, wasnt that the 706 engine? My Dad had one for a while, think it put out 270hp and absolutely flew, but the fitters said it was a nightmare to maintain so they went back to the lower powered Mandators with the fixed head engine that became the TL11 that went into the little T45 (Freighter?) in the early 80s.


Ah or should I say AAGH.The Crusader.Mixed feelings.I must have relinered all of BRS Burton's fleet of these 'cos the the tight arsed management wouldn't buy the corrosion inhibitor bags.You had to hang like a bat in the cab to work on the motor through the hatch.The swing rad was a godsend though as they could eat fan belts.The Rolls Eagle had some tug though.Also I remember using all my repertoire of swearwords up when knocking in the rear main bearing seals,which was a piece of wooden dowel rod about 6 inches long.They usuelly snapped when about 3/4 of the way in.You daren't shave them down too much or they would pee all the oil out.The AEC AV505 in our clapped out Guy Big Js' couldn't keep a head gasket on for very long either.But then God invented the Volvo F86 and the way became much clearer!!
ATB HW

#89 Fubar

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 19:02

When I left school I worked for this large haulage firm, who are sadly no longer with us. These ERFs were brand new when I took the pics in 1974.

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#90 ghinzani

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 19:27

Stunners Fubar. We had one as a shunter/spare with a 220 in it, quick but noisey.

#91 ghinzani

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 19:47

Cor! Guys were hard mens motors werent they, remember seeing an Indian guy from Birmingham who had one with a sleeper conversion and it was still a very hardy environment.

#92 ferdi

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 20:24

1976 Budapest - Hungary

Skoda 706MT

http://pics.livejour...an/pic/0003pr3p

http://pics.livejour...an/pic/0003q75w

http://www.tedomtruc...e/liaz_6_en.htm

#93 bradbury west

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Posted 24 April 2009 - 21:41

Originally posted by Bruce302
Can some one refresh my memory on the AEC Mandator, what did they have powering them ?
I am thinking of the Ergo period.Thanks,Bruce


AV760 I thought. straight 6 box, poss with a 2 speed
Roger Lund

#94 Fubar

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Posted 25 April 2009 - 09:59

retriever - thanks for the Smith of Maddiston pics. I'm not sure but I think some of these also may appear in Brian Edgar's vast collection of truck pics ....

http://public.fotki....s_of_maddiston/

#95 Fubar

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Posted 25 April 2009 - 10:14

A few more I took during the 70s .....

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#96 retriever

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Posted 25 April 2009 - 11:06

Fear Fubar,

I am well aware of Mr Edgar and his posting of copyright images onto Fotki - fortunately the Nostalgia Forum respects the untellectual property rights of the copyright holder. We hold those in respect of the Kenney, Hine & Ingram images posted to date.

Thank you for putting up some more of your own collection.

#97 RTH

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Posted 25 April 2009 - 11:46

Some great pictures especially those B&W ones from the 50s & 60s.

#98 Fubar

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Posted 25 April 2009 - 13:10

Originally posted by retriever
Fear Fubar,

I am well aware of Mr Edgar and his posting of copyright images onto Fotki - fortunately the Nostalgia Forum respects the untellectual property rights of the copyright holder. We hold those in respect of the Kenney, Hine & Ingram images posted to date.

Thank you for putting up some more of your own collection.

I respect your point although as he is not making any financial gain from his site I don't think that is such a big issue. :

#99 Fubar

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Posted 25 April 2009 - 22:38

Originally posted by retriever

Dear Fubar,

I really would suggest that in future you submit your images at 76 dpi low- mid range jpeg to protect your rights.

I have just undertaken an exercise of loading two of your 300 dpi images into photoshop and with interpolation and other work have now created two perfectly good 5 x 3 in images that could easily be used commercially as prints or in a publication entirely without your consent and without payment being made.

While I appreciate your concern, to be perfectly honest I'm not that bothered and I'm surprised you went to the trouble of carrying out the exercise you did. I worked as a traffic clerk for Smith of Maddiston for about 7 years and I took a small number of pics along the way. Pure and simple. Its no big deal really!

I have been a photographer at rallying and stock car racing events during my life however and have a couple of websites running with photos from those areas and to "protect" my copyright I have added a watermark to each photo as well as reducing resolution to web quality only. I use the word protect advisedly as no doubt there are ways and means for the unscrupulous to use them to their advantage no matter what I do! ;)

Thanks for your advice and concern anyway.

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#100 Andrew Kitson

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Posted 26 April 2009 - 06:33

A super thread this, terrific photographs.
Occasionally my paint brushes stray away from motor racing subjects. Although not strictly commercial, more agricultural nostalgia, i'm wondering if it fits here or indeed if you would be interested in seeing it? Anyway, here goes.

I painted this Suffolk scene of a 1971 FIAT crawler. It was presented to the farm worker shown ploughing, on his recent retirement. Commissioned by the farming family that he worked for.

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