37 replies to this topic

[jdanton]

I wanted to start this thread, because most of the information I've read about on this forum is distributed and hard to find in searches.

For those of you who don't know--Thursday Night Thunder (and later Saturday night as well, IIRC) was a series shown on ESPN and ESPN2 in the US. Most of the shows I remember came from several short tracks in the Indianapolis area, as well as others in rural Indiana (Winchester) and involved USAC sprint cars.

The show help launch the careers of NASCAR drivers such as Jeff Gordon and Tony Stewart.

I know we have a couple of members here who are more familiar with the show and the racing and can fill in the many wide gaps I'm leaving here.

[Ross Stonefeld]

I really really really want to hear the full version of the Jeff Gordon story someday. There have been some things I've noticed about him the last few years that I couldn't explain but the various hints and partial accounts of his rise clears the haze a bit.

[jdanton]

I really really really want to hear the full version of the Jeff Gordon story someday. There have been some things I've noticed about him the last few years that I couldn't explain but the various hints and partial accounts of his rise clears the haze a bit.

That's actually the main reason why I started the thread. Some more tidbits seem to have come out in the recent IMS thread.

[RStock]

I wanted to start this thread, because most of the information I've read about on this forum is distributed and hard to find in searches.

For those of you who don't know--Thursday Night Thunder (and later Saturday night as well, IIRC) was a series shown on ESPN and ESPN2 in the US. Most of the shows I remember came from several short tracks in the Indianapolis area, as well as others in rural Indiana (Winchester) and involved USAC sprint cars.

Let me see . I know IRP was a main venue . Wasn't there a small , 1/8 mile I think track , right beside IRP where the midgets ran ? And yes , there was Winchester , and I believe Salem also . That's about all the tracks I can remember , other than when they went out West .

The show help launch the careers of NASCAR drivers such as Jeff Gordon and Tony Stewart.

You could add the late Kenny Irwin in with them also .

I know we have a couple of members here who are more familiar with the show and the racing and can fill in the many wide gaps I'm leaving here.

Yeah , we need some Munchkin stories also . A very unique little car . I'd like to know more about it .

[jdanton]

Let me see . I know IRP was a main venue . Wasn't there a small , 1/8 mile I think track , right beside IRP where the midgets ran ? And yes , there was Winchester , and I believe Salem also . That's about all the tracks I can remember , other than when they went out West .

IRP (Indianapolis Raceway Park)
Speedrome (The 1/8)
Winchester
Salem
Maybe Anderson?

[JimInSoCalif]

For at least a few years of that show, they did it out west for the first few weeks of the season. I expect that was due to more predictable weather.

When they started doing that, at first it was Midgets at ASCOT. As I recall, they used half mile and not the quarter mile. After ASCOT closed they broadcast Midgets from the dirt oval in Oxnard. I believe it is a quarter mile.

Gee, can it really be 18-19 years since ASCOT was closed. Time really flies.

[antonvrs]

For at least a few years of that show, they did it out west for the first few weeks of the season. I expect that was due to more predictable weather.

When they started doing that, at first it was Midgets at ASCOT. As I recall, they used half mile and not the quarter mile. After ASCOT closed they broadcast Midgets from the dirt oval in Oxnard. I believe it is a quarter mile.

Gee, can it really be 18-19 years since ASCOT was closed. Time really flies.

Actually, that was the track at the Ventura County Fairgrounds. The Pacific ocean is only a short distance from the stands, maybe 1/4 mile
(?) and there's a mighty cold breeze coming off the ocean at your back.
I remember watching that show on TV one night and I think they started the Midget main 8 times before they completed a full lap. When I was living in Carpinteria I used to go to Ventura for Sprint Car races occasionally.
Anton

[Buford]

Actually, that was the track at the Ventura County Fairgrounds. The Pacific ocean is only a short distance from the stands, maybe 1/4 mile
(?) and there's a mighty cold breeze coming off the ocean at your back.
I remember watching that show on TV one night and I think they started the Midget main 8 times before they completed a full lap. When I was living in Carpinteria I used to go to Ventura for Sprint Car races occasionally.
Anton

Nice place. Larry Rice called it "a racy little joint." I met Tara Hendrick there shortly before she got killed.

[Jim Thurman]

What do you want to know?

The series started out in, IIRC, 1986 with USAC Midget races at the 1/5 mile Indianapolis Speedrome. Production was from Lingner Group.

After a couple of years, they moved across town to Indianapolis Raceway Park's 5/8 mile oval, which allowed for USAC Sprint and Silver Crown races.

I also recall telecasts from Winchester, Salem, Santa Fe Speedway (near Chicago - a rare dirt telecast), Anderson, Toledo.

And on West Coast visits, Ascot, Ventura and Bakersfield Speedway. The Ascot telecasts were always on the 1/4 mile. Near the end of the series, they had at least a race or two from the paved Irwindale Speedway.

Edited by Jim Thurman, 31 May 2009 - 00:30.

[Jim Thurman]

I really really really want to hear the full version of the Jeff Gordon story someday. There have been some things I've noticed about him the last few years that I couldn't explain but the various hints and partial accounts of his rise clears the haze a bit.

Geez Ross, that's far more cryptic than anything I've ever written I have no problem with being direct, I usually leave off simply for attempts at brevity.

Even I would like an explanation of your comments.

[Jim Thurman]

For at least a few years of that show, they did it out west for the first few weeks of the season. I expect that was due to more predictable weather.

When they started doing that, at first it was Midgets at ASCOT. As I recall, they used half mile and not the quarter mile. After ASCOT closed they broadcast Midgets from the dirt oval in Oxnard. I believe it is a quarter mile.

More like they wanted a vacation, and to showcase the superior driving ability of the drivers they were promoting...that flew in with the crew.

I don't recall them televising anything other than USAC Western States Midgets and T.Q. Midgets from Ascot (always on the 1/4), Ventura (which is a 1/5 mile) or Bakersfield Speedway (1/3 mile).

[Seppi_0_917PA]

I seem to recall that the "Fastmasters" races were on Thursday Night Thunder - is that correct?

[jdanton]

I seem to recall that the "Fastmasters" races were on Thursday Night Thunder - is that correct?

I remember Fastmasters being on Saturday nights.

[Jim Thurman]

Correct, the Fastmasters series was after the series moved to Saturday Night.

[jdanton]

Correct, the Fastmasters series was after the series moved to Saturday Night.

What was Walkinshaw's involvment in that deal--I'm sure he was making money on it somehow...

[canon1753]

That Fastmaster concept was interesting, but it lacked something in the execution. I wonder if they used something other than an XJ220, which appeared to be way too much car for that dinky infield road course they used, it would have worked out better?


Thursday Night Thunder was great. It was my first exposure to Midgets and the USAC guys. It was fun and great racing.

Edited by canon1753, 31 May 2009 - 23:59.

[RStock]

What was Walkinshaw's involvment in that deal--I'm sure he was making money on it somehow...

I believe he built , or at least designed the cars .

[martyk]

There was also at least one telecast from the Indiana State Fairgrounds - the 1996 Hut Hundred - I have it on VHS. One of the most entertaining races I've ever seen, IMO.

The Thunder series was also the originator, I believe, of the "tread cam", now known (and over-promoted to death by FOX and DW) as the "Digger cam". Despain even noted this once on his "Wind Tunnel" program.

[Jim Thurman]

There was also at least one telecast from the Indiana State Fairgrounds - the 1996 Hut Hundred - I have it on VHS. One of the most entertaining races I've ever seen, IMO.

Also Terre Haute in later years. It's harder for me to remember the 1999-2000s era than the early years. Their hearts weren't in it by then.

[Jim Thurman]

I really really really want to hear the full version of the Jeff Gordon story someday. There have been some things I've noticed about him the last few years that I couldn't explain but the various hints and partial accounts of his rise clears the haze a bit.

Ross, unless someone gives a "deathbed confession" or a journalist connects the dots and actively pursues it...I doubt anyone will ever hear the full version.

[RStock]

Ross, unless someone gives a "deathbed confession" or a journalist connects the dots and actively pursues it...I doubt anyone will ever hear the full version.

I wish someone would explain . Curiosity is killing me .

[JimInSoCalif]

Well, I don't know how I moved Ventura down to Oxnard - precious senility perhaps. Thanks for that and the other correction.

I thought it was a great program on Thursday nights and wish they would resurrect it. I never saw it much after it moved to Saturday nights as CRA Sprint Cars ran at Ascot on three Saturdays nights a month and sometimes I would follow them if they ran at Santa Maria on the odd Saturday.

It was mentioned that a few races were telecast from Bakersfield. I assume this was the 1/4 mile in Oildale and not the paved 1/2 mile called Mesa Marin. I attended the first race at Mesa Marin, but I think it is yet another short track that we have lost to developers a year or two ago.

[B Squared]

Yeah , we need some Munchkin stories also . A very unique little car . I'd like to know more about it .

Anything specific? I'm friends with its builder and driver from that era, Mike Fedorcak. He also does some fabrication work for us. I've never seen anyone stitch a weld as beautifully as he. I swear, it looks like it was done with a robotic welder. A great, fun guy that will still race on occasion.

Brian

Edited by B Squared, 03 June 2009 - 23:25.

[jdanton]

Ross, unless someone gives a "deathbed confession" or a journalist connects the dots and actively pursues it...I doubt anyone will ever hear the full version.

Jim, If you would be so willing, could you document what you know about Gordon/Stewart/Kahne (?) here--maybe with that in one place some dots could start to be connected.

Thanks

[RStock]

Anything specific? I'm friends with its builder and driver from that era, Mike Fedorcek. He also does some fabrication work for us. I've never seen anyone stitch a weld as beautifully as he. I swear, it looks like it was done with a robotic welder. A great, fun guy that will still race on occasion.

Brian

Ah , great . Tell Fedorcek he's something of a legend in the short track world . We still talk about that car .

As far as specific questions . Just some things to refresh my memory . This was probably all coverd in the original telecasts , but I do good to remember what I had for breakfast yesterday .

Where did he get the idea to build the car in the first place ? Did a light just go on one day , or had someone had something similar before . Seems I remember it having some engine offset . Was it inspired by a supermod perhaps ? And speaking of engines , what did it have , a VW ?

And , wasn't it banned by USAC ? Seems I remember some controversy about that happening , and Fedorcek taking it to the Badger series .

And where is it now . Didn't Tony Stewart buy it and use it to compete ?

That'll do , for now . Thanks Brian .

[Rosemayer]

Ross Here is a bit about Gorden.

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Jeff_Gordon

[B Squared]

I just got off the phone with Mike Fedorcak and first off, he appreciates the nice words and the fact that he and the "Munchkin" are still remembered after all these years.

The name "Munchkin" came about after he had raced the car at the Rosemont Horizon in the Chicago area. The chassis had no name at that time. After the race, he and some of the guys went to a restaurant to eat and the waitress asked if they were racing those "little munchkin cars over at the Horizon?" Hence the chassis name was born. Mike was racing supermodifieds at the time he built the car, but said that their design had little to do with the Munchkin design, that it was based on a "gut feeling" of what seemed right to him. The VW engine was not offset, but he had placed the oil tank, oil filter, battery and transformer on the exterior of the car on the left side which probably gave the illusion of the chassis being offset. He had the track record at IRP (Indianapolis Raceway Park) in either 1988 or '89 when USAC added seven new rules to their rule book, all aimed at specifics of the Munchkin design. So, while the car was never banned, it had to be modified to fit the new rule package for the following season.

Mike still has the original car out at his shop. Tony Stewart races the prototype that Mike built and sent to California years ago, when he looked into having the chassis design built by another company in quantity. If I recall correctly, Tony has won the USAC indoor race here in Ft.Wayne, IN two of the last three years. It might even be a better record than that. I'm sending Mike this link, at his request, and I'm encouraging him to sign up with TNF so he can directly contribute. Thanks for the interest.

Brian

Edited by B Squared, 03 June 2009 - 23:25.

[Jim Thurman]

It was mentioned that a few races were telecast from Bakersfield. I assume this was the 1/4 mile in Oildale and not the paved 1/2 mile called Mesa Marin. I attended the first race at Mesa Marin, but I think it is yet another short track that we have lost to developers a year or two ago.

Yes, Bakersfield Speedway. A 1/3 mile by then - well, they moved the walls a bit.

[Jim Thurman]

Jim, If you would be so willing, could you document what you know about Gordon/Stewart/Kahne (?) here--maybe with that in one place some dots could start to be connected.

Thanks

Willing to yes, but the terms "investigative journalism" and "motorsports journalism" are mutually exclusive terms.

And I'm not aware of anything about Kahne other than he was a young, marketable driver from a part of the country NASCAR wanted to make inroads in who had a surprising run of success in NASCAR during the time frame when NASCAR was negotiating with local politicians in the area. All a coincidence, I'm sure.

Edited by Jim Thurman, 04 June 2009 - 20:58.

[RStock]

I just got off the phone with Mike Fedorcak and first off, he appreciates the nice words and the fact that he and the "Munchkin" are still remembered after all these years.

The name "Munchkin" came about after he had raced the car at the Rosemont Horizon in the Chicago area. The chassis had no name at that time. After the race, he and some of the guys went to a restaurant to eat and the waitress asked if they were racing those "little munchkin cars over at the Horizon?" Hence the chassis name was born.

Ha ! "little munchkin cars" , Great story .

Mike was racing supermodifieds at the time he built the car, but said that their design had little to do with the Munchkin design, that it was based on a "gut feeling" of what seemed right to him. The VW engine was not offset, but he had placed the oil tank, oil filter, battery and transformer on the exterior of the car on the left side which probably gave the illusion of the chassis being offset. He had the track record at IRP (Indianapolis Raceway Park) in either 1988 or '89 when USAC added seven new rules to their rule book, all aimed at specifics of the Munchkin design. So, while the car was never banned, it had to be modified to fit the new rule package for the following season.

Damn short tracks and their stifling of ingenuity .

Mike still has the original car out at his shop. Tony Stewart races the prototype that Mike built and sent to California years ago, when he looked into having the chassis design built by another company in quantity. If I recall correctly, Tony has won the USAC indoor race here in Ft.Wayne, IN two of the last three years. It might even be a better record than that. I'm sending Mike this link, at his request, and I'm encouraging him to sign up with TNF so he can directly contribute. Thanks for the interest.

Brian

Glad to hear he still has the original . It should be popular at some nostalgia shows in the future . Thanks to Mike and yourself for the further info . Is Mike still racing , or involved somehow ?

[B Squared]

Is Mike still racing , or involved somehow ?

On occasion, if he has a decent car available to him, he races. He finished 3rd in the USAC Midget feature at the Ft. Wayne, IN Memorial Coliseum in January. A race won by Tony Stewart. Both were racing Munchkins. I'll see if I can get a little better answer on the frequency of events run next conversation with him.

He runs Fedorcak Fabrications and is usually working on race cars, vintage race cars, vintage aircraft, or industrial type work. His fabrication skills are extraordinary. Again, thanks for the interest.

Brian

[QueenCityMotorsports]

Copies of the Munchkin cars were being built by former Midget driver/buildier (Hawk midget) Mike Streicher

By JIM MORRISON
The Rumble Series
When Tony Stewart and Mike Fedorcak unload their midgets for the Rumble Series of Indoor Racing this winter, they’ll not have the only Munchkins in town.
Since May, Ohio car builder Mike Streicher has constructed four new cars from Fedorcak’s original drawings. Two more will be completed before Toledo’s Rumble in the Seagate Centre and a possibility exists for two more to be assembled.
Fedorcak, creator of the Munchkin midget chassis Stewart’s driven to four Rumble Series wins in the last three years, reached a deal with Streicher in May for Steicher’s company to construct the cars. Since 2005 when Stewart set quick time and won the feature in a Munchkin that just hours before sat in the hinter regions of Fedorcak’s shop, the Hoosier fabricator has received several requests to build more Munchkins.
Fedorcak resisted.
His fabrication business has kept him busy and he’d been burned in the late 1980s when USAC changed its rules. Twenty years ago, Fedorcak had just reached an agreement with a California company to sell the cars and he was left holding the parts for new cars. Some of the chrome molly tubing he bent for those cars remain in his shop.
“I had 10 cars cut up and ready to put together,“ said Fedorcak. “Rule changes put an end to that. I still have the materials here from that.”
In fact, Stewart’s car was the prototype Fedorcak assembled. That car incorporated refinements he wanted to make after completing the first Munchkin.
At last year’s Rumble in Fort Wayne, Fedorcak and Streicher started talking about building more Munchkins. Chuck Rencurrel, who fielded a car an old Volkswagen midget for Tyler Nuckles, approached Fedorcak about a car. As Stewart and Fedorcak talked after the NASCAR star’s win at Fort Wayne, Mike Osite, an East Coast racer, spoke to them at length, offering to find Fedorcak a ride at the Gambler’s Classic in Atlantic City a couple of weeks later. Osite, from Brooklyn, N.Y., also wanted a new Munchkin.
“I made a real effort to get into the car building business and it didn’t go,“ said Fedorcak. “Now I am not trying to get into the car building business and people are wanting me to build them.“
Fedorcak and Streicher reached an agreement in May with Streicher’s Strei-Tech company in Findlay, Ohio, paying Fedorcak a commission to build Munchkins based on the original blueprints, photographs and jigs. The deal includes the chassis setup used on Tony Stewart’s car. Fedorcak also provides a few different anti-roll bars so each can be tuned to a driver’s preferences.
Streicher already built midgets, sprint and Silver Crown cars in his shop in addition to his other fabrication work. Undertaking the Munchkin project went surprisingly well considering it was the beginning of a whole new project, according to Streicher. Since they construct race cars already, his workers were able to figure out the little things they had uncertainty about.
“A race car is a race car,” said Streicher, former USAC midget champion and a winner of the RCA Dome Invitational.
Rencurrel was the first to receive his chassis followed by the three delivered to Cicconi, All are identical to Stewart’s.
Two additional kits will be completed after the Buckeye Bowl Indoor Midget Nationals. He’s had discussions about building two more after those are assembled but nothing has been finalized. Streicher needed to complete work for another customer -- he houses two traditional chassis owned by Rick Daughtery -- that races in the Rumble Series.
Thus far, Streicher’s only delivered kits, but he’s not opposed to providing a roller. It all depends on what the customer wants. Although the parts delivered in the kit are traditional body-style pieces, Streicher said nothing prevents a car owner from attaching different styles of panels.
Over the years, Fedorcak’s Munchkins earned the reputation of being radically different. Other than being constructed lower to the ground and wider, Streicher disagrees with this contention. The parallel bar-style suspension was used by the Kurtis Kraft midgets of the 1940s, he said.
“They are doing the same thing differently,” said Streicher.
So what makes the Munchkin so good?
“It is a combination of things,“ said Fedorcak. “What I got was a happy medium of a lot of things for kind of a specific purpose.“
The car Stewart drives was designed for a short track. Many forget Fedorcak built another Munchkin to run a big track. It established a new track record at O’Reilly Raceway Park.
Fedorcak, a trained draftsman, has ideas for a new car but Cicconi wanted one identical to Stewart’s. He reasoned Cicconi wanted to match driving skills with the two-time NASCAR champion on a level playing field, but another consideration was the expertise on chassis setup included in the purchase of the Munchkin kit.
“I told him it was essential because of the fact that he had his cars figured out already,“ said Cicconi.
Working with a car constructed from an existing design would not present as much of a learning curve on chassis setup for the five-race Rumble Series, according to Cicconi. Fedorcak’s been on the phone with Cicconi just about every other day to answer questions on the car’s assembly and suggestions for chassis setup.
The Munchkin has many differences from the midget he races with the New England Midget Association. The Volkswagen-powered Munchkin chassis is shorter than Esslinger-powered chassis Cicconi drives outdoors. The shorter length makes it turn more easily in the corners.
Cicconi plans to race in the Rumble Series this year. He raced once before at Fort Wayne in Rencurrel’s Kalamazoo Twister.
“I couldn’t hire a driver that made me happy so I am going to do it myself,,“ said Cicconi.
Three Munchkin chassis arrived in Cicconi’s Ashton, Pa., shop in kit form in late September. Cicconi and others worked 10 to 12 hours a day to make a midget identical to Stewart’s. The second car -- for Osite -- was also completed in time to race in Columbus. The third car -- for Jim Morgan -- might not be ready until the Rumble in Toledo on Dec. 19 and 20.
Cicconi’s entered cars at Rumble Series races the last couple of years. Liquid Lou, as Cicconi is know, has a wealth of experience with indoor racing. He competes annually at the Gambler’s Classic in Atlantic City and is a past winner of that event. He raced at the old Niagara Falls Convention Center and competes during the summer with NEMA and ATQMA.
Like Cicconi, Streicher’s has many laps around the tight indoor circuits. Niagara Falls, Columbus, the RCA Dome. The list goes on. He loves that form of racing.
“I don’t know why I like it but I always have,” said Streicher.
Streicher’s racing career started in quarter midgets when just four and a half years old. Today, his son, Richie, races in the division. In fact, last year he finished second in one of the features
Fedorcak began racing in 1974, running go-karts. He purchased a midget in 1979 and raced super modifieds. He also ran an ASA stock car in the early 1990s. His skill with fabrication landed opportunities with the Baker Racing and Hemelgarn Racing teams at Indianapolis. Fedorcak did work on Stan Fox’s car during that time.
Fedorcak attributes the Munchkin’s popularity and the demand for more of them directly on Stewart. Fedorcak won a Rumble Series feature in a Munchkin in 2003 and then parked it. During a poker game, Stewart called Fedorcak just hours before the Rumble in Fort Wayne to buy the car. He dug it out of the back of shop, not even certain it would run.
Stewart sat a new track record and later won the feature. Since then, the NASCAR star’s visited victory lane three more times. He now owns two Munchkins, having purchased a second version that he had learned about during the summer which Fedorcak now drives that at indoor races.
Fedorcak originally developed the idea for the Munchkin during a ride to a surgical procedure in a Louisville hospital. His hands had been burned while racing supermodifieds and as he rode by the exit for the Indianapolis Speedway he filled his mind with concepts and plans started floating around in his head.
“By the time we got to Louisville I had the thing designed in my head,“ said Fedorcak, who had been close to winning at the Speedrome but never successfully.
After Fedorcak drew out his designs on paper, family and friends helped him begin gathering parts even before his hands had healed. In January of 1987 Fedorcak began cutting parts and assembling the chassis. At his first race -- at Grundy County Speedway in Morris, Ill., -- he lapped the field up to third place.
“During hot laps, they threw the green and I thought the other guys had not seen it,” said Fedorcak. “I was that much faster.”
His next race came at the Speedrome where he won a race televised by ESPN. Things evolved from there.
“I have been riding a wave ever since,” said Fedorcak.

[QueenCityMotorsports]

FYI, Many highlights of the ESPN Thunder series are on this youtube site

ESPN thunder on Youtube

[B Squared]

QueenCity - Welcome to the forum and thanks for the great article on Mike and the Munchkin's history.

Brian Brown

[younce21]

Anything specific? I'm friends with its builder and driver from that era, Mike Fedorcak. He also does some fabrication work for us. I've never seen anyone stitch a weld as beautifully as he. I swear, it looks like it was done with a robotic welder. A great, fun guy that will still race on occasion.

Brian

Even though I stopped going to races when I was only 7, I still remember Mike's blue and yellow #5 (I believe) Munchkin. He raced with my dad for many years. Next time you see him, mention Perry Younce to him and see if the name rings a bell. I know my dad raced on Thunder as well, but I couldn't tell you which track. I wish they'd bring it back though.

[B Squared]

younce21 - I remember the name Perry Younce from the Thunder races - glad to see you've join the forum and I'll make sure Mike gets your message.

Brian

[B Squared]

younce21 - I sent an email to Mike Fedorcak in regards to your message. His reply is below.

Brian

Hi Brian. Through my racing years I tried not to become too friendly with any drivers for fear of not racing them as hard as I should. Perry Younce was an exception. He was just too likeable for me. we raced in Florida together and had a great time. When we raced in Michigan, I spent some time at his house and he was enjoying his sons. We had a great day and I was looking forward to racing with him again. I had a drive lined up the following Sunday at Plymouth, following the Sat night race at Michigan Ideal Speedway. My car owner called Sunday morning to confirm the drive and asked me if I had heard about Perry Younces death at Mich Ideal. I said "NO", looked at my helmet bag on the floor, and realized I could no longer drive. That is when I made the decision to quit racing. I have never raced again outdoors since then. I didn't go to the funeral to express my condolences to the family, but he was a good guy. Mike

[younce21]

younce21 - I sent an email to Mike Fedorcak in regards to your message. His reply is below.

Brian

Hi Brian. Through my racing years I tried not to become too friendly with any drivers for fear of not racing them as hard as I should. Perry Younce was an exception. He was just too likeable for me. we raced in Florida together and had a great time. When we raced in Michigan, I spent some time at his house and he was enjoying his sons. We had a great day and I was looking forward to racing with him again. I had a drive lined up the following Sunday at Plymouth, following the Sat night race at Michigan Ideal Speedway. My car owner called Sunday morning to confirm the drive and asked me if I had heard about Perry Younces death at Mich Ideal. I said "NO", looked at my helmet bag on the floor, and realized I could no longer drive. That is when I made the decision to quit racing. I have never raced again outdoors since then. I didn't go to the funeral to express my condolences to the family, but he was a good guy. Mike

B Squared, thanks so much for that. It's always good to read and gather any type of information about my dad from anyone involved in the racing world. I was only 7 years old when he passed away so the memories have faded in the past 13 years. Once again, thanks. Highly appreciated.