25 replies to this topic

[John Cross]

Actually the P3 has been sold already! Seriously, Symbolic Motors sells the kind of cars I used to drool over in the Motor Sport ads. I mention it here because they have some good information on some of the cars and some truly excellent photos. For example:

Alfa Romeo P3 (short article with Tazio bio on page 2):
http://www.symbolicm...ics/p35001.html

Alfa Romeo Tipo 12C-37/316 (truly outstanding article and pics):
http://www.symbolicm...2c37/12c37.html

Bugatti 35/35B/51 (no text, just lots and lots of stunning pics):
http://www.symbolicm...i4925/4925.html
http://www.symbolicm...i4965/4965.html
http://www.symbolicm...1149/51149.html

Ferrari Tipo 166 F2 (really superb article and pics, including glorious painting of Fangio in Mercedes W163 leading Gonzalez in Ferrari 166 at 1951 Buenos Aires GP):
http://www.symbolicm...r166/011F2.html

Ferrari 500 F2 (excellent article and pics):
http://www.symbolicm...cs/3482_52.html

Ferrari Tipo 555 Super Squalo (good article, 1 pic):
http://www.symbolicm...ualo/555ss.html

Ferrari 250LM (chassis history, stunning pics):
http://www.symbolicm.../6045/6045.html

Ferrari 512S (comprehensive article, good pics):
http://www.symbolicm.../1006/1006.html

Ferrari 312PB (superb articles and pics):
http://www.symbolicm.../0880/0880.html
http://www.symbolicm.../0890/0890.html

Maserati Tipo 60/61 "Birdcage" (good article and pics):
http://www.symbolicm...M_birdcage.html

Porsche 908/2 (chassis history, superb pics):
http://www.symbolicm.../908020010.html

Porsche 917 (no info but lovely pics):
http://www.symbolicm...023/917023.html

Porsche 956 (again, no info but super pics):
http://www.symbolicm...12/956-112.html

I better start saving up!

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I'll be back...

[Ray Bell]

They, too, have perpetuated the myth of the twin drive shafts to lower the driver's seat!
Someone should tell these people...
I'll have the P3 any time, you can keep your Porsches.

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[Fast One]

I'll take the P3 without batting an eyelash. I have no use whatsoever for any Porsche, anytime. The 917 is at best a coldly efficient killer. The P3 seduces all who come near.

[Ray Bell]

Come on, Fast One, admit you'd love to see Pedro and Seppi in the rain at Spa in a 917... they were good for one thing, at least.

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[Fast One]

You've got me there, Ray!

[Ray Bell]

I do like your realistic attitude to Porsche generally, Fast One, matches mine... and if you read between the lines, Frank Gardner has a lot of serious misgivings about their design team.
Have you heard his story about the gas pressure gauge on the chassis tubes of the 917? ""What's that for?" "If the pressure drops, you will drive back to the pits for us to find the crack in the chassis.." "If the pressure drops I'll stop straight away and walk home!"
Larry Perkins was pretty amused at the flexible uprights in the 962 he raced in England, fabricated his own for Le Mans.

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[Keith Sawatsky]

For a Porschephile such as myself who actually saw(as an 11 year old kid mind you)that "exact same" 917 win the "first ever" overall victory for Porsche at the 1970 24 hours of LeMans, ownership would be a dream come true.

Unfortunately I don't have 3.5 million USD.

This car is like the "holy grail" to Porsche enthusiasts as it was the start of a record for Porsche that no other manufacturer to this day has been able to surpass....namely more "overall" wins of LeMans than anybody else.

Why this car is not in the factory museum is beyond me....maybe at 3.5 million USD it's even too much money for them.

My favorite Ferrari from the same era is the 512 series of road racing cars that ran alongside these fabulous machines from Zuffenhausen.



[This message has been edited by Keith Sawatsky (edited 04-02-2000).]

[Art]

As I have the cash I will take one of each.

Art

[Ray Bell]

Art's been into the Nurse purse again! Love to see you blast up Main St in the 917, Art, but I want first drive of the P3...
Owning one of them in the good old days WOULD'VE been a great thing..

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[This message has been edited by Ray Bell (edited 04-02-2000).]

[Art]

How did the Crow taste?

Art

[Art]

Ray Bell.

Don't you think it is time we (BOTH) knock off this childish (BULL ****)?? I'm sure the rest of the people on the board are getting tired of it!

Art

[f li]

Art and Ray,

Old men are allows to behave like children - as long as they have money! After all, doesn't the saying goes "The difference between men and boys is the cost of their toys - (and the size of their dolls!) " Speaking for myself, I don't find anything here objectionable as long as the two of you are not offended. To that, I would object.

[Art]

f li.

Did you mean dolls or balls?

Art

[Don Capps]

Sorry, but I am not familiar with the Alfa Romeo "P3." Perhaps y'all are referring to the wonderful Tipo B?

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Yr fthfl & hmbl srvnt,

Don Capps

Semper Gumbi: If this was easy, we’d have the solution already…

[Dennis David]

Eenie, meene, meine, moe I'll have mine a Tipo B.

BTW I've been by their showroom, must keep the good stuff in the back!

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Regards,

Dennis David
Yahoo = dennis_a_david

Life is racing, the rest is waiting

Grand Prix History
www.ddavid.com/formula1/

[Ray Bell]

Okay, if Art cons the nurse out of 3 mil I'll help him find out how the Tipo B goes.
Come on Art, where's your sense of humour?

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[Art]

My sense of humor is still here! (Let the mud slinging begin.)

Art

[Ray Bell]

Mud slinging? Never!
We'd only drive them on paved roads, Art, and your nurse could come along and watch...

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[Art]

I forgot to tell you that I am buying Burpen Gary. You will shortly be living in a tent in the outback with a Solar Panel,Battery & a Laptop have fun. And I'm am impounding your junk cars so you will soon be Donkey Powered.

Art

[Fast One]

Hey Don--

Cimarosti, among others, refers to the Typo B(P3), which he then subsequently refers to thereafter as the P3. That's the way I've always heard it. I'm not enough of an Alfisti to know why it had two designations, but I'm sure someone here does.

You're not turning into a pedant, are you!!!

[Ray Bell]

No doubt it was called a P3 because it carried on the success of the P2...
Everyone calls it a P3, even me. Somebody check on Boddy and Jenks...
Art - if you buy Burpengary you'll have to give up any ideas of owning the Porsche...
And the climate here is too hot for your nurse!

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[Art]

I did a little home work on Burpengary. It sets on 20,000 hectars cleared out of the forest. Population 11,400 Library Swimming Pool and numerous sports facilities. Quite a bit of wild life in the area and an Electrafied survice to Brisbane. The Bruce Highway puts you 45 minutes from the Sunshine Coast and you have a disabled riding school and an enviromentally protected creek for wild life. The Nurse is dark complected and loves hot weather.

Art

[Huw Jenjin]

I cant say im one eyed about Porsches, but the 917 in that particular form (preferably Martini or Gulf)is the one car that would be my perticular holy grail.The noise it made on the Steve McQueen film demonstrated stereo before I knew what stereo meant.The body work looks uncompromisingly aggresive, and the car was just fearsome, but dominant in the hands of fearless heroes like Siffert and Rodriguez.It brings out the goose bumps like no other car this side of a V16 BRM.
The 312P Boxer was a little beauty too.
Those days for me were simply the best, both in Sports Cars and Formula One. The cars all looked different to each other, and the drivers had characters, and raced different types of cars. Or am I just an old duffer, Jaques Villeneuve will be remembered for ever, like the Ferrari er um, what ever number are they on now?
No, the early seventies shone.
Great, great days.

[Ray Bell]

After the early seventies the Sports Cars went into decline. In Europe they reduced the capacity to 3-litres, in America the Can-Am was eventually reduced to rebodied F5000. The glory days of the Sports Car were those days on the way up. When rear engined cars were taking over and V8s were coming in.
As these cars developed there were some real classics, the 917 was merely the last of the line.
Look at the P2, P3 & P4 Ferraris, pure classic lines, fabulous sounds, fast cars. Examine the Can-Am as it grew from modified Lotus 19s and Cooper Monacos to the M8Ds and Chapparals, with the mingling of the Lolas and the optimism of the Shadows.
At the same time the F1 scene swelled with new competitors, stabilised with the availability of a high horsepower reliable engine in large numbers at a time when the capacity had been raised to bring huge reductions in lap times.
All of this while tyre developments were making them all faster everywhere.
It was the mid sixties to early seventies that was the golden age. If you came along in 1972 you only caught a glimpse of it...

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[Fast One]

Guys, sports car racing went into decline when the rules changed for '68 to rule out the big bangers prototypes. The end was inevitable if you ask me. Porsche switched from David to Goliath, losing that which made me love them, Ferrari...er...FIAT lost interest, Ford was iced out, and frankly, who cared about Matra? For me, the last great endurance racer was the P4 Ferrari. Everything since is just cluttering up the pages of the history books.

[Barry Lake]

I am feeling a bit like Rob Shepherd, Australia's amazing motor racing artist, who told me before he died that he lost interest in GP cars when they began putting independent front suspension on them.
However, I ahve to say that sports car racing has never made sense to me since they stopped being closely related to road cars and could be driven to the circuits.
In which case, they became lost from about the 1960s...
I have never, though, lost my interest in GP racing. From 1895 (and I consider those early Paris to Wherever races to be GPs in their day, despite the title not having been coined) to 2000 and beyond, I find it fascinating.