297 replies to this topic

[aditya-now]

While Luca is a sympathetic chap, who is "part of the Ferrari family", his showing at the Valencia qualifying has been appalling.
I pity him, as it must be devastating for him to see how slow he is.

Even Jacques Villeneuve would have done better than being 1 1/2 secs behind the second slowest. Jacques would bring the Villeneuve myth back to Ferrari and was last competitive (sort of) in 2006. Luca Badoer was last uncompetitive in 1999 - I am amazed that Luca Montezemolo has taken such a bad decision.

[aditya-now]

Can anyone remember another Ferrari who was slower (3 secs off Kimi, his number one!!) than Luca - maybe back in the 60s?!

[Conk]

Danica would be quicker

[Enkei]

He's just told BBC that this result is as planned and expected. Right..

[WACKO]

I don't think Ferrari can keep this up. If the gap is 1.5 seconds to the next slowest driver, it's just very unhelpful. They can't waste the seat like that for the rest of the year.
IMO they should get Liuzzi on board for Spa and beyond.

[noikeee]

Danica would be quicker

That sums it up nicely.

I'm truly sorry for Luca, but he's been a good laugh today.

[Francesc]

For a moment I believed that Minardi is back looking at the last place

[aditya-now]

He's just told BBC that this result is as planned and expected. Right..

That´s self-confidence! Wow.

[derstatic]

For me an acceptable result would be 1 second behind Räikkönen. Unless he gets there by tomorrow they should replace him before Spa. I believe in patience and second chances, but he's never during the course of the weekend showed any sign at all of being anywhere close to the pace required to compete in F1. The letters BAD on the timing screen says it all really. Luca is a nice chap, a hard and loyal worker. But he wasn't the quickest when he was at his prime, and ten years of not racing hasn't made him any quicker.

Edited by derstatic, 22 August 2009 - 12:58.

[Ringo]

Michael would have been quicker if his head had fallen off.

You want a decent Italian in that car? Stick Liuzzi in and do it next weekend.

[alfista]

He's just told BBC that this result is as planned and expected. Right..

Maybe it is? What if he ran with full tanks just to prepare for the race? I'm not going to say he did but that can be an explanation. But even so he was horribly slow, +1.3 secs compared to Kimi in Q3.

[Pharazon]

Maybe it is? What if he ran with full tanks just to prepare for the race? I'm not going to say he did but that can be an explanation. But even so he was horribly slow, +1.3 secs compared to Kimi in Q3.

he's in a Ferrari for crying out loud...

and he just qualified LAST...

that shoudn;t be expected or acceptable to ANYONE

[Lazy Prodigy]

He's just told BBC that this result is as planned and expected. Right..

Yes and when the world blows up around him and wins he will say he knew it all along.

[Clatter]

Maybe it is? What if he ran with full tanks just to prepare for the race? I'm not going to say he did but that can be an explanation. But even so he was horribly slow, +1.3 secs compared to Kimi in Q3.

He has 3 practise sessions to do that, I hardly think he is going to get any better by running another half dozen laps in qualifying. Time accept he is just slow rather than looking for excuses.

[BRK]

Poor guy.

Not like it was unexpected,though,although three seconds off the pace is ridiculously slow.

[jeze]

Here are the drivers out of a OW race deal who would deinitely be faster:

Liuzzi
Bourdais
Piquet Jr (yes really )
Klien
Gené (yes, he would)
Carroll
Pantano
Senna

And probably three or four more, so why...

Edited by jeze, 22 August 2009 - 13:30.

[Lewis]

BRUNO SENNA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[D.M.N.]

Piquet Jr (yes really )

You're not the only person that thinks that. Brundle suggested that Ferrari gives Piquet a shot as he never got a proper chance at Renault.

[tormave]

Maybe it is? What if he ran with full tanks just to prepare for the race?

You can't be serious? Badoer was on the softer tyre all through Q1 and guys with the harder tyre beat him by several seconds. The line comparison to Kimi showed him losing 1.5 car lengths in one corner alone. To make matters worse, Valencia is an easier track than Spa. Expect the difference to Kimi to double over there in Q1 (lap is of course longer as well).

[jeze]

You're not the only person that thinks that. Brundle suggested that Ferrari gives Piquet a shot as he never got a proper chance at Renault.

Why not, at times he was less than a couple of tenths behind Alonso. Not as impressive as Grosjean's been on his debut, though.

[Colombo]

As I predicted in another thread, Ferrari currently has its weakest line up since the early 1970s....well, I know this was not an easy task but I didn't expect Badoer to be *that* slow, the slowest driver in the field.
Well, it shows things to me: how quick all the guys currently racing are and that F1 is by no means too easy (meaning that the rookies arrive extremely well prepared).

GC

[Wouter]

Can anyone remember another Ferrari who was slower (3 secs off Kimi, his number one!!) than Luca - maybe back in the 60s?!

Ivan Capelli was pretty bad in 1992, in what was also a bad car, but Alesi could get some semi-decent performance from it. Though I don't think the difference was quite this big.

Maybe Merzario in the early 70s?

[Cenotaph]

Luca's pace was expected really, why Ferrari chose to put him in the seat is what puzzles me. They just don't care at all for what happens in 2009. Not even interested in fighting for 3rd or 4th in the WCC it seems.

[VicR]

One thing is for sure. Performances like these put a bad light on the entire marque. It's not acceptable for a Ferrari to be dead last without any major technical problems. This can't continue. If Enzo would have been a sentimental man his company would never have got off the ground in the first place.

Edited by VicR, 22 August 2009 - 13:47.

[Slowinfastout]

It doesn't look too good.. but to be honest in any other year in history the replacement driver would have pounded a ridiculous amount of laps at the test track with the F60 during that 3 weeks break..

In those circumstances I would have went with Bourdais, or Liuzzi if possible.. it's strange..

[Henrik B]

You can't be serious? Badoer was on the softer tyre all through Q1

Which is a small part of his slowness. From what I saw, he was just doing laps and never came in for new tyres - showing that Ferrari didn't think he could climb up from twentieth spot. A proper low-fuel, new-tyre run would have closed the gap to Kimi by some tenths atleast. He's STILL the slowest driver on the grid, though.

[alfista]

Ivan Capelli was pretty bad in 1992, in what was also a bad car, but Alesi could get some semi-decent performance from it. Though I don't think the difference was quite this big.

Maybe Merzario in the early 70s?

Capelli's worst was +1.8 secs at old Hockenheim

[tormave]

Which is a small part of his slowness. From what I saw, he was just doing laps and never came in for new tyres - showing that Ferrari didn't think he could climb up from twentieth spot. A proper low-fuel, new-tyre run would have closed the gap to Kimi by some tenths atleast. He's STILL the slowest driver on the grid, though.

You saw wrong. He went in for fuel and new tyres midway through the session. His very last lap would have cut the difference to next slowest to about 1 second, had he not overcooked it in the last corner.

[Sakae]

I have been wondering where are all those Schumacher haters who were so religiously advocating to replace Massa with a test driver (who does not tests BTW the car, because of the idiotic testing ban). It's really a sad story. LB was never a racing driver, why he should become one in his advanced age? Well, maybe he can train on a computer, as some other self appointed expert has suggested.

Edited by MiPe, 22 August 2009 - 13:55.

[Henrik B]

You saw wrong. He went in for fuel and new tyres midway through the session. His very last lap would have cut the difference to next slowest to about 1 second, had he not overcooked it in the last corner.

Thank you. Many things going on, everytime I looked his way he was out on the track and he had the most laps run in the first session.

[J-Raid]

Some funny quotes about Badoer's pace, from http://twitter.com/RealBrawnGP and http://twitter.com/BMWF1Talk (note the quotes are in reversal time line, that is newer at the top)

Luca Badoer Update: Is skipping Valencia and going straight to Spa to get a week long head start.

Luca Badoer Update: After recalculating the times, he's actually qualified in 34th position.

Luca Badoer Update: Practice session stopped to give Badoer time to catch up.

Luca Badoer Update: Mixes up KERS button and pit lane speed limiter button.

Luca Badoer Update: Mixes up pit lane speed limit button. Turned it off in the pitlane, and on while out on track.

Luca Badoer Update: Qualifying extended to four sessions to give him a chance.

Luca Badoer Update: Heidfeld suggests he's "just plain slow". Although we may have misheard him...

Luca Badoer Update: "I thought the practice session ended an hour ago?"

Luca Badoer Update: Has never driven at Valencia before, and is relying on his TomTom

Luca Badoer Update: "I was just sticking to the speed limit. And those traffic lights are terrible."

Luca Badoer Update: Misunderstood meaning of 'street circuit' and is driving a Ferrari road car

Luca Badoer Update: "I learned all I know from Kimi." Currently enjoying an ice cream and Coke by the beach. Maybe.

Luca Badoer Update: He's never been to Valencia before, so is looking at the sights.

and

Apparently Badoer is still running on super hard exhibition tyres...or thats the excuse he told to Montezemolo

Badoer gets KERS mode the other way around, giving boost at the braking, and recovering energy at corner exit



You can find there more (too lazy to collect them all here)

PS. Sorry Luca, nothing personal

[Jazza]

Reminds me of Mika Salo at the Hungarian Grand Prix in 99. At least Mika nearly won the German race only two weeks earlier...

[MaxFan1]

I have been wondering where are all those Schumacher haters who were so religiously advocating to replace Massa with a test driver (who does not tests BTW the car, because of the idiotic testing ban). It's really a sad story. LB was never a racing driver, why he should become one in his advanced age? Well, maybe he can train on a computer, as some other self appointed expert has suggested.

And who's fault is it? Teams like Williams, McLaren took away valuable test days from thier main drivers to let their reserve drivers test the car. Ferrari have no one to blame but themselves for being too greedy.

[noikeee]

Luca Badoer Update: Mixes up pit lane speed limit button. Turned it off in the pitlane, and on while out on track.

[giacomo]

Well, it shows things to me: how quick all the guys currently racing are and that F1 is by no means too easy (meaning that the rookies arrive extremely well prepared).

That's the main lesson learned today.

[Rob]

he's in a Ferrari for crying out loud...

and he just qualified LAST...

that shoudn;t be expected or acceptable to ANYONE

Jody Scheckter, WC in 1979, failed to qualify in a Ferrari at the 1980 Canadian Grand Prix.

[Touti]

For all we know he didn't even try to qualify. Ferrari aren't idiots, they must have known better than anyone than there was no way he could be competitive so why put him in the car at the risk of him being humiliated and them looking stupid. Maybe they're just using this as a way to circumvent the testing ban and Badoer could very well be doing what he's paid for..........testing.

[aditya-now]

Jody Scheckter, WC in 1979, failed to qualify in a Ferrari at the 1980 Canadian Grand Prix.

Where was Scheckter relative to Villeneuve in that qualifying?

[aditya-now]

For all we know he didn't even try to qualify. Ferrari aren't idiots, they must have known better than anyone than there was no way he could be competitive so why put him in the car at the risk of him being humiliated and them looking stupid. Maybe they're just using this as a way to circumvent the testing ban and Badoer could very well be doing what he's paid for..........testing.

I like your perspective on things! This would also explain why Badoer said everything went as expected...

[giacomo]

For all we know he didn't even try to qualify. Ferrari aren't idiots, they must have known better than anyone than there was no way he could be competitive so why put him in the car at the risk of him being humiliated and them looking stupid. Maybe they're just using this as a way to circumvent the testing ban and Badoer could very well be doing what he's paid for..........testing.

You could be right, but deliberately wasting one car does not match with Ferrari's declared target of p3 in WCC.

[Beyond]

this choice is really nonsense looking at the times. i hardly think he'll gain one or more seconds in next races. they need someone else, anyone like liuzzi or so

[BRK]

Interesting theory with the testing thing,although they chose Badoer only as a last minute replacement for MS,their intent clearly being to gun for points and keep up the pace.(and keep Kimi fired up) Why would they suddenly change track?

[aditya-now]

this choice is really nonsense looking at the times. i hardly think he'll gain one or more seconds in next races. they need someone else, anyone like liuzzi or so

This August is the blackest for Ferrari since 1988, when Enzo Ferrari died (close third is August 1991...the breakdown of team relations between Prost and Ferrari leading to his ousting).

First Felipe´s crash, then the ridiculous circus around Schumachers comeback and now Luca Badoers performance.
I don´t know what Luca Montezemolo must be thinking - is he serious about bringing three drivers into Ferrari for 2010 with this joke of team leadership?

Alonso, Massa, Raikkönen would be all fire and ice.
Wait a second, reportedly Schumi is also going to drive for the Scuderia in 2010! So four Ferraris next year, Montezemolo wants to emulate Red Bull!

[engel]

You could be right, but deliberately wasting one car does not match with Ferrari's declared target of p3 in WCC.

well toyota isn't exactly flying in Valencia

[Mandzipop]

well toyota isn't exactly flying in Valencia

No but Macca are.

[Wouter]

Where was Scheckter relative to Villeneuve in that qualifying?

8 tenths off.

The 1980 Ferrari was a dog, it was a failed attempt at making a ground effect car around the Ferrari boxer engine (which had been so succesful before the Williams FW07). Villeneuve barely managed to qualify himself.

Scheckter only scored 2 points all season, in the year when he defended his championship.

[primer]

Today, for the first time ever I saw a F1 driver drive a car (in dry) so slowly he was not using the complete width of the track!

Badoer simply wasn't pressing on the pedal hard enough. It was quite sad to see. Even after so many laps, he had no idea how much grip he was wasting. You would think that inbetween the sessions someone at Ferrari would show him Kimi's telemetry and say: "Luca, it's okay, you can press the vroom-vroom pedal earlier and harder when coming out of corners....."

Just pathetic. Given Kimi's pace today, Felipe would have put the Ferrari on front row easily. Ferrari have chosen a terrible replacement.

[alfista]

Where was Scheckter relative to Villeneuve in that qualifying?

Not that bad, only 0.8 s behind. Villenuve was 22nd in the qualification for Canadian GP 1980, Scheckter 26th and DNQ.

[Johnrambo]

Given Kimi's pace today, Felipe would have put the Ferrari on front row easily.

How? Massa has been outqualified 6-4 by Räikkönen this season.

[wewantourdarbyback]

How? Massa has been outqualified 6-4 by Räikkönen this season.

Let's not let the facts get in the way ey?