12 replies to this topic

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

Hi guys! I'm a newbie and just signed on.

My main question is this: I am working with a couple of other model car enthusiasts to try to come up with some good detail photos of the intercooler set-up on the CanAm Porsche 917/30-003. It was the main Penske car, also the Cam2 Talladega record setter, and was sold to Otis Chandler, then Jack Setton.

There is a very nicely made model of the Cam2 car in 1/18 (by Exoto), but is has none of the special changes made to the car to go from the Sunoco road racing car, to the World Speed Record Cam2 car in 1975. Exoto only did a repaint of the Sunoco car (well, they did put the passenger-side cockpit cover and wheel dishes on some versions), and it had none of the special components for the intercoolers made for Mark by Porsche. We've found very few period photos with these details, but fortunately the car kept all of the changes when it passed from Penske to Mr. Chandler. Mr. Chandler was very open about bringing the car to numerous Porsche vintage events, so probably these photos would be easiest to find. I was told when the car rested in his museum showroom, the engine cover was usually off of the car.

So....can anyone help us? We mainly just need a few good clear closeup photos of the intercoolers and its plumbing.

THANKS!

Edited by Cam2InfoNeeded, 18 September 2009 - 02:53.

[Duc-Man]

First: welcome.

Are you sure the car had an intercooler? The only cooler I know of is the oilradiator in the front.

I have the B. Betti cutaway of the sunoco car in a book and it doesn't show an intercooler as well.

I post a small scan in the cutaway threat.

Frank

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

Frank,

The car did not have the twin intercoolers during 193 or 74 Can Am seasons. But Roger and Mark wanted to set a new world closed course speed record in 1975. They tried first at Daytona, but the engine(s) wouldn't survive. They made another attempt at Talladega in August, but with the help of 2 specially made intercoolers. Mark approached the Porsche factory for help, and since he was in a very good position with them, they made him the special set of intercoolers.

The car was moth-balled after Mark's death a week after the Cam2 run was made, but in 1976 it was sold as is to Otis Chandler (the L. A. Times owner). It had all of the modifications it had at Talladega, including the twin intercoolers. Pretty much all that had been changed is that it had been given a Sunoco blue paint job. The car stayed this way the entire time Mr. Chandler owned the car (1976-1983) when it was sold to Jack Setton of France. The car was crashed shortly after receiving it, and the specially made intercoolers were damaged and not put back on the car. In 2001, the car had a restoration at Andial, and a new set of intercoolers were put back on the car. No other 917/30 has ever had these installed.

Edited by Cam2InfoNeeded, 18 September 2009 - 18:38.

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

Hi guys,

Still looking for a few good reference photos of the intercoolers. I was able to get some great assistance from Andial and have created a drawing of what rear chassis mods need to be done.




I am NOT a draftsman or artist, but hopefully this drawing will help as a placement guide for the new chassis extension. This is what you would need to "cobble up" to replace the farthest most rear framework (which held the intercoolers). A couple of notes:

1) This image here was made in Photoshop and placed on a 8.5 x 11" piece of paper (horizontally, of course). I put a 1" reference bar on it, but I'm not sure how your printer might print it out.

2) It is scale to fit the 1/18 scale Exoto chassis. My Sunoco version of the model is in storage (I don't even have one of the Cam2 models yet), so I wasn't able to measure the tubing diameters (I was provided basic chassis dimensions by a fellow modeler). My rendering is mainly to help you get all of the tubing placed properly. When I can get accurate tubing dimensions from the model, I might redo it with the properly scaled tubing.

3) The green colored tubing was done to a smaller diameter to allow people to understand that particular section better in the top view. From what I understand, pretty much all of the tubing was the same diameter.

As soon as I can get better intercooler photos, I draw those up for everybody. If you are interested in working on your own Exoto Cam2 car, drop me an email, and I'll try to keep you updated with info and our progress.

Enjoy!

[917historian]

Photographs of 917/30-003. 1st photos is of the 1975 CAM2 chassis @ Talladega. 2nd photo is of the chassis when owned by Otis Chandler still fitted with the intercoolers. Enjoy




Copyrights: Not Known

Mike

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

Mike,


Thanks!


doug

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

I've been told about the CKNet Porsche site by a few people, and it looks like a great site for the types of things I'm looking for. I've been trying for 3 weeks but can't get my registration completed.

I never get my registration confirmation email, and every one of email emails to them has been undeliverable (returned). I've tried several different email accounts, used several different screen names, and even tried using combination of all of these with both Firefox and IE8, with no success.

I've had a few other people (one in England, too, who frequents there from time to time) try to contact them for me, but their emails are not going through either.

If anyone can help me, I'd appreciate it. It seems like the site is working fine, just no one I been able to reach recently can get an email to them.

Thanks.

doug

[URY914]

Look at the size of that rear tire in the second photo! Those were the days....

[swede917]

Some pictures from a test (driver practice) at Riverside early 1979 when Otis Chandler owned the car. Changing all 24 spark plugs during a lunch break. Hope these are of some help.

Edited by swede917, 07 October 2009 - 18:24.

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

Swede917,


THANKS!

I knew there must be more photos of Mr. Chandler's car out there.

Every photo help get to understand the shape of the intercoolers better. The front end is still not totally clear to me (where the plumbing attaches), but getting better.

doug

Edited by Cam2InfoNeeded, 08 October 2009 - 00:04.

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

I'm slowly getting a few photos here and there to help with this project. Here is one someone sent me from "Excellence Was Expected". I took it into Photoshop, and with the help of a special filter plug-in, I got it a little easier to view. Since I really only needed the intercooler area, I applied the filter to that section of the original image.





If I can figure out how to properly apply it to the entire image, I'll post another photo of that attempt.

Thanks for everyone's help so far!

doug

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

I'm back!!! Well, since first posting my request for help here, I've got several helpful people who have shared their personal photos, and a few photos from various magazines and books. THANK YOU! I also have had the pleasure of being given access to some great shots of the car taken at Riverside back in 1980 while Mr. Chandler owned it. I'm still holding out hope for one other significant person to help me finally get the detail photos of the front of the intercoolers I need. I'm keeping my fingers crossed those will still become available.



Here is photo of the model we are starting from. It is the 1/18 scale Exoto "prototype" 917/30, which as you can see, never existed like it was released. Fortunately, the "prototype" is identical to the red & white Cam2 version of their models, just without the aluminum wheel-dishes and with a different paint job (it has a tonneau cover, but I forgot to put it on for the this photo). A lot of things, like the mirrors and front chin spoiler will have to go for a proper Cam2 car.



Here are the parts that I've removed so far(I just got the model on Monday), that will either be discarded, modified, or replaced with more accurate parts. The most import part of this project is to put the twin intercoolers on the model which Exoto totally left-off. This requires chopping off the rear chassis frame, and fabricating a new rear chassis portion. Also, the intercoolers and their related hardware, must be scratch-built. A lot of body changes will need to be done, so repainting it to the red & white Cam2 colors isn't a big deal.



Here is quick photo of the first mod I did yesterday (just to prove this isn't just a "pipe-dream" project). The model had a modern suede covered steering wheel, which was wrong for the 1973 race cars. The model is beautifully made, and replicates the modern "made-from-spare-parts-car" (probably 917/30-004) perfectly, but many things aren't right for the car in 1975 (or 1973). I still have to make the proper "metal"cover-plate to match the period photo.

I know most of you who take a peak at this posting will have no interest in a model car project (check out our project on www.Scale18.com if you do, we will periodically post updates on the progress of it), but just wanted to give everyone any update on what a few photo contributions can accomplish (and shamelessly ask for more help if you can). I'll be posting up all of our working photos on ImageShack soon in case you want to see the GREAT help we've been given (except for any photos "loaned" to us but were requested to not be made public).

Cheers!

doug

Edited by Cam2InfoNeeded, 04 November 2009 - 23:32.

[Duc-Man]

So how did the project go?
I got a new book about the can-am for christmas and that has some 'I've never seen them before' pictures of the record car.
I won't post them here but I can scan and send them by e-mail if you want. Just let me know your e-mail adress.