20 replies to this topic

[Andy Arnold]

At this years Monza Historic F1 race both David Abbott and Hubertus Bahlsen seem to have driven the same car - Arrows A4/3, any thoughts anyone

[Ray Bell]

Someone's converted it to a sports car with dual controls?

Sorry... back to the experts...

[Thundersports]

I would imagine your not going to get a lot of response here as the peaple in the know tend to keep there info close to there chest when there are two cars with the same chassis number..........

[MODE]

Maybe a part of the answer in this photo, taken at Spa this year :


http://www.gurneyfla...es/DSC_7813.jpg

[Pink Snail]

Yeah bit of a strange one this. Dave supposedly aqquired Hubertus` car earlier this year after running Tiff Needell`s old Ensign for quite some time. Hubertus is involved in the A1 GP team for Monaco and has also campaigned an Alfa Romeo V12 in the Masters meetings when he was available. There are three Arrows now in the HFO in Ragno colours being raced by Rowland Kinch, Dave Abbott and Steve Hartley. Abba Kogan also drove the Warsteiner Gold liveried car at Brands Hatch so there has been a good show for Arrows this year. The Chassis that Hubertus drove at Monza was in a `low flying` incident and I don`t think he`s driven it since. Dave is having his best drive in a long time so the Arrows ust suit him! It`s worth checking out the HFO Website to see the cars that are racing still.. One that I have missed this year is the 6 wheel Tyrrell that Mauro Pane won the title in last year although he has told me that it may be possible to drive it again next year or maybe campaign a different car.

[MODE]

Yeah, would be fine to see again M.Pane's P34 next year or even better with a totally new car, the same for J.Bosch who raced a Ferrari 312T3 in 2006, we didn't see (and hear) it enough. A Matra engined car, a Ligier JS17 for example, would be such a good addition to the F1 field.

[Andy Arnold]

Yeah bit of a strange one this. Dave supposedly aqquired Hubertus` car earlier this year after running Tiff Needell`s old Ensign for quite some time. Hubertus is involved in the A1 GP team for Monaco and has also campaigned an Alfa Romeo V12 in the Masters meetings when he was available. There are three Arrows now in the HFO in Ragno colours being raced by Rowland Kinch, Dave Abbott and Steve Hartley. Abba Kogan also drove the Warsteiner Gold liveried car at Brands Hatch so there has been a good show for Arrows this year. The Chassis that Hubertus drove at Monza was in a `low flying` incident and I don`t think he`s driven it since. Dave is having his best drive in a long time so the Arrows ust suit him! It`s worth checking out the HFO Website to see the cars that are racing still.. One that I have missed this year is the 6 wheel Tyrrell that Mauro Pane won the title in last year although he has told me that it may be possible to drive it again next year or maybe campaign a different car.

Makes sense as I think Hubertus had 2 A4's nos 3 & 5 so could have used 5 at Monza , no 5 now seems to be with Steve Hartley so presumabley sold both to concentrate on his A1 GP team as he hasn't raced in HFO since. I agree it would be good to see the Tyrrell P34 race again as would the JPS Lotus 88B of Kubota although he is now racing his March 761 in Th e Master Series

[Pink Snail]

Katsu has raced the March with some success in the HFO this year, and Dave Abbott & Steve Hartley have both raced Arrows. The Lotus 88 raced by Katsu last year (Dan Collins raced the other one) were run by Classic Team Lotus and Dan has run the later car on occasion this year. Martin Stretton raced a P34 owned by Simon Bull and enters the ex Mansell Lotus that was originally banned then re-hashed to race at Silverstone all those years ago. Dave Coplowe drives that one. Another car that I like is the ex Nannini Minardi that ocasionally ran in HFO up to a couple of years ago by Rodrigo Gallego (it is at `home` now) and he runs a March 761 very competitively.
The car for me though this year has to be the lovely McLaren (Hunt/Tambay) driven by Bobby Verdon-Roe, giving the later cars a real taste of racing and hot on the heels of Joaquin Folch`s Brabham (Piquet) and Rowland Kinch`s Arrows (Baldi).
Next year they will give a real show and are due to support one of the F1 GP races in Europe. Always worth going to watch and real value!! Also if Hubertus races again and we get Peter Sowerby back in a Williams things should really hot up a bit..KM

[Pink Snail]

HFO are at Paul Ricard for their final meeting on the 31st Oct/1 Nov and have 27 cars registered for the weekend. The winner of this years championship will be decided and looks like being a Brit (like Jenson!). Shame I cannot be there but the machinery registered looks good. Just goes to show that it is possible to have more than 22 cars on the grid, enoy great racing and great people!!

[racemechanic]

Just to clarify the A4 chassis numbers
At the end of 2008 Hubertus Balshen actually had 3No Arrows A4s
The one he kept he damaged quite badly at Monza and has not been seen since.
He sold one to Steve Hartley chassis No 4 another one he sold to Dave Abbott this is chassis number 5, both have been rebuilt and are now racing in HFO.
The Abba Kogan mentioned car is an A3 not an A4, it was in the Ragno colours when he bought it but has now been changed to the Warsteiner Gold.
The picture of the (nearly) bare chassis on gurney flap is chassis No 5, we were sorting out steering column, gearchange and pedals early in its rebuild.

hope this clears it all up!!

[Norman Jones]

So where does Mike Wrigleys car come in all this?

[racemechanic]

So where does Mike Wrigleys car come in all this?

Not sure of mike's chassis number but this was the car driven by Dave Karakus a couple of years ago and Bob Berridge before that.
Including the one driven by Rowland Kinch thats all 5No of the chassis accounted for.

[Andy Arnold]

Wow 3 A4's that's just greedy!! Thanks for the inside info, the damaged Monza A4 must then be No 3 and not the David Abbott car as shown in this years HFO results. Didn't realised Bahlsen had No 4 as well do you know if he ever raced it or was just for show as part of his collection. Mike Wirgley's car would be No 1 being ex Berridge

[Pink Snail]

I may stand corrected (racemechanic!) that Dave Abbotts Ensign was in fact an ex-Reggazoni car because Tiff crashed twice whilst trying to qualify at Monaco in 1980. I have some good photos from Brands and Donington of most of the cars thanks to being able to get up close and personal with cars/drivers/mechanics. Sorry cannot be with you guys this weekend in Paul Ricard but hope to see you all soon....KM (good turn out this time - 27 cars and as in GP a guaranteed British Champion - Rowland or Bobby?????

[Pink Snail]

Yeah, would be fine to see again M.Pane's P34 next year or even better with a totally new car, the same for J.Bosch who raced a Ferrari 312T3 in 2006, we didn't see (and hear) it enough. A Matra engined car, a Ligier JS17 for example, would be such a good addition to the F1 field.

In this week`s Autosport, it is reported that Abba Kogan is to race a Ligier Matra V12 later in the year after starting in a Williams. Hopefully it will be on track in time for Brands Hatch for the first weekend in July. The prospect of having the V12s of Matra and Ferrari on the grid with all the Cosworths....wow!! The Ligier is the 1981 car which was driven by Jaques Laffitte and will be well turned out if Abba has anything to do with it!!

[MODE]

What a good news, he could buy the JS7 sold by J.Laffite too, winner of sweden GP.

Edited by MODE, 14 January 2010 - 20:52.

[Pink Snail]

[quote name='MODE' date='Jan 14 2010, 20:31' post='4079502']
What a good news, he must have bought the JS17 which was sold by J.Laffite some weeks ago.
[/quo
You`re right on the money there MODE. :clap: It IS the JS17, chassis number 4, with Talbot, Gitanes livery. :love: Abba has always made sure his cars are immaculatley turned out. He drove a McLaren F5000 in the orange colours at The Oulton Gold Cup two seasons ago, after taking it to Brands Hatch for the Superprix weekend. I am looking forward to the weekend at Brands as I have found a great campsite a mile and a half from the circuit so am turning the weekend into a 5 day stopover!! :up:

[RA Historian]

Lucky you over there! The opportunity to hear a Matra V-12 at full song should not be missed! I saw Laffite win the 1981 Canadian GP is this (?) car and will never forget the sound. Just magnificent. I thought that a Ferrari V-12 sounded wonderful, but somehow or other the Matra V-12 was just a bit "shriekier", to invent a word.
Tom

[Thundersports]

Abba as well as always presenting a beautifal car will always "drive" it as well rather than tooling around like some others.

Edited by Thundersport, 15 January 2010 - 00:41.

[Pullman99]

It IS the JS17, chassis number 4, with Talbot, Gitanes livery. Abba has always made sure his cars are immaculatley turned out.

Looking forward to this too.

The Talbot name returns to an F1 grid. Heavenly.

Is this JS17 being prepared by James Watt Automotive?

[Pink Snail]

Looking forward to this too.

The Talbot name returns to an F1 grid. Heavenly.

Is this JS17 being prepared by James Watt Automotive?

Not so sure as to who is preparing the car, Nicholson McLaren are reworking the show motor to race standard and Liaz Jakhara at Zul Racing has normally looked after the other Matra/Ligier cars owned by Abba. The end result will still be awesome!!