51 replies to this topic

[smokingwheels]

I was just wondering if any body was interested?

[jstan]

I was just wondering if any body was interested?

Details???

[Fat Boy]

From that intro, I'm going to guess a bong instead of just a hitter.

[Grumbles]

I was just wondering if any body was interested?

Does it involve a leaf blower and a reeeeeeaaaallly long extension cord?

[condor]

add some fences to the mix

[primer]

Does it involve a leaf blower and a reeeeeeaaaallly long extension cord?

Ah, the finespun application of a leafblower as 'supercharger'.

[McGuire]

You don't use electric leafblowers. That would be dumb.

[Tony Matthews]

Doesn't the mulch cause pre-ignition?

[Canuck]

That baby is twin-charged!!

[OfficeLinebacker]

Details???

http://twitpic.com/qfqbr
?

[McGuire]

http://twitpic.com/qfqbr
?

Chip Foose's older brother, Clem Foose. Tragic story, bowling accident. Family doesn't talk about it much.

[malbear]

This is how you do it: you turn the rear wheel struts into fan blades and attach a scoop behind the wheels and send a 4 inch flexable tube to the intake. you have to spinn the wheels to be effective at low forward speed.
Malbeare

[Canuck]

http://twitpic.com/qfqbr
?

Let's see how far away from the valve we can introduce the fuel...

[Grumbles]

Let's see how far away from the valve we can introduce the fuel...

The long runners are a result of poor Clems' use of particularly cheap engine simulation software - the blower was added later. Unfortunately the runner length was output in feet rather than inches and Clem failed to notice anything wrong. Pulled like a train at 250rpm though...

[cheapracer]

This is how you do it: you turn the rear wheel struts into fan blades and attach a scoop behind the wheels and send a 4 inch flexable tube to the intake. you have to spinn the wheels to be effective at low forward speed.
Malbeare

From that intro, I'm going to guess a bong instead of just a hitter.

[cheapracer]

Doesn't the mulch cause pre-ignition?

No, mulching = atomising.

[cheapracer]

I was just wondering if any body was interested?

Besides the scarcastic humour around here, of course we are interested!

Thanks in advance.

[smokingwheels]

Besides the scarcastic humour around here, of course we are interested!

Thanks in advance.

You use a wire wheel to port your manifold and ports, I welded an extension shaft to mine, your ports
should look something like this


have a look at my web site too there are intake recording on the sound page.
http://ampair.tripod.com

Beware there are pit really big falls with EFI systems.
1. WOT fuel delivery a 2000 cc engine needs 1000 cc/min with air cleaner removed.
2. Flap airflow meters would go off scale too.
3. there may be some spark timing problems to do with range.

Beware the timing needs to be tuned as carbon builds up.
I dont know why that is.
I have a laptop interfaced to my second engine with my own program.
eg computer controls the engine timing and 2 stage rev limit.

The timing is linear with rpm as far as I can tell to 7200 rpm
eg plot a line 0 deg at 400 and 35 deg at 10000, 6000 is about 20 deg from memory.

If anybody has a flow bench handy you could bore out PVC pipe as a test, before cutting into any alloy head.
Things like feed rate in and out of the tube would have to be noted

I have a 1986 Nissan Bluebird wagon 2000 cc (no EFI on this one)

I have tested fuel efficiency at idle and its in the range of 12 to 14.2 c.c./minute running a mixture of normal to slightly rich.
I have the test video's on Youtube you can go to my web site to see the 5 clips there,
http://ampair.tripod.com/Fuel.html
From what I have read a normal 2000 cc engine at idle consumes 24 to 26 cc of fuel per minute.

I have improve fuel efficiency under highway driving conditions, I have experienced as high as 60 mpg (4.71 L/100km) over a 220 km journey on a hot summer's day cruising around 80 km/h.

I have a stock carby and my vac sec are fully open at 2000 rpm
it used to be approx 4000 so I can only guess at the air flow.

[Greg Locock]

Ok, yes joking aside I can believe that under certain circumstances tripping the flow into turbulent attachment is a good idea. Not so sure about your other ideas.

[cheapracer]

Yes thanks for that, it's very old information actually (refer to Phil Irving's "Tuning For Speed" 1st edition for example) but theres always someone around who didn't know and will benefit from it

By the way, shops 'polish' ports to sell them because they look better.

[Bill S]

Yes the slightly rough port surface is an old idea, it helps establish & control the boundary layer. A mate of mine that used to work at Ford Australia (John Wynne, if you've heard of him, Greg) was doing this in the 60's.
A small bit of taper in the port helps as well.

[cheapracer]

By the way, wire brushes can be very severe on aluminium so be careful, I have always finished with some emery tape.
Take an old stone and break it of it's steel post and hacksaw cut a slot that you slot the emery tape in and wind it around 1/2 dozen times.
Some simply use the shop abrasive blaster/cleaner for the finish too.

[OfficeLinebacker]

Yes the slightly rough port surface is an old idea, it helps establish & control the boundary layer. A mate of mine that used to work at Ford Australia (John Wynne, if you've heard of him, Greg) was doing this in the 60's.
A small bit of taper in the port helps as well.

Which way does the taper go?

[Bill S]

Which way does the taper go?

The inlet is a little larger in area than the valve throat(s).

[desmo]

The inlet is a little larger in area than the valve throat(s).

An old porting "trick" was to reduce the cross sectional area of the intake port in the bend to improve flow. I can't remember the rationale but it once made sense to me in spite of it being counterintuitive.

[Bill S]

An old porting "trick" was to reduce the cross sectional area of the intake port in the bend to improve flow. I can't remember the rationale but it once made sense to me in spite of it being counterintuitive.

AFAIK that trick is kind of explained by something I read that Lotus did many years ago, and I think I figured out how it works - If you have to get airflow around a corner, instead of making the tube constant diameter (like a mandrel bend) you are better off making the tube wider but shorter. This reduces the difference in speed of the airflow top-to-bottom of the tube so it's less likely to get boundary layer breakaway.

[cheapracer]

AFAIK that trick is kind of explained by something I read that Lotus did many years ago, and I think I figured out how it works - If you have to get airflow around a corner, instead of making the tube constant diameter (like a mandrel bend) you are better off making the tube wider but shorter. This reduces the difference in speed of the airflow top-to-bottom of the tube so it's less likely to get boundary layer breakaway.

I'm sure we all have our tricks but mine was to flatten the floor out at the bend getting closer to a D to slow the flow at the inner radius - verified on flow benches too especially at low lifts. Most certainly one trick is too have 1/2" straight flow directly above the valve if possible, too many just hack away at the inner radius and shoot the flow straight across the back of the valve.

I say was because you don't find too many bad ports anymore, times have changed, in my later years in the area I was adding metal rather than taking it away.

[smokingwheels]

Ignition control, well I can't find any around to do what I want
so I put a request into the MSD engineers.
If you might be interested to port an engine like mine you may need a good system to fire the spark correctly i started a thread herehttp://www.msdigniti...ead.php?t=14464
you could express your interest there.
Thanks

[smokingwheels]

Did a rough city test a few weeks ago and got sum surprising results a approx 58% increase in milage.
I also was at a market giving away a dvd of my idle fuel test, there wasent much interest until it was Free.
Also a lot of skepics think that the big boys should have come up with it but if you google it you mainly get "Wire Wheel catalogs"
Anyway my city and hwy consumptions are very similar thats got to be a first! for my type of car.

[cheapracer]

Did a rough city test a few weeks ago and got sum surprising results a approx 58% increase in milage.

Creating turbulent ports, probably bumping the comp a bit and generally a good tune especialy remapping can do wonders for city mileage but you understand that going from 10mpg to 15.8mpg is still bad?

[Grumbles]

This is your car isn't it? Ebay link

Only $200,000 buy it now?

I can't believe it hasn't been snapped up yet.

[Tony Matthews]

This is your car isn't it? Ebay link

Only $200,000 buy it now?

I can't believe it hasn't been snapped up yet.

Especially with twin fuel pumps due to top-end thirst! That makes it even more attractive!

[zac510]

This is your car isn't it? Ebay link

Only $200,000 buy it now?

I can't believe it hasn't been snapped up yet.

Are you being sarcastic? Don't you respect the years of development that have gone into this car? It's almost impossible to put a price on this hard work and what this knowledge will bring the future of the human race.

[gruntguru]

You know people who truly appreciate and understand high level technology actually tend to be cash poor. Anyone with a lazy 200k to throw at Carburetted Bluebirds with 58% improved city consumption can probably afford the higher fuel consumption of the standard Bluebird - or perhaps even a Gumpert or a Veyron or something equally frivolous.

Anyway, I have an idea. Since this forum is one of the few places on earth so exclusively populated by tech aficionados, why don't we pass the hat around, dig deep and see if we can't come up with the readies to snaffle the only example of this technology. We can reverse engineer the intake ports and with our contacts in the industry, get it out there and make a killing before smokingwheels finds some traction and heads for Detroit himself?

[cheapracer]

This is your car isn't it? Ebay link

Only $200,000 buy it now?

I can't believe it hasn't been snapped up yet.

I truly thought I had seen just about everything.

[Grumbles]

Would you tell us a bit more about yourself SW? I'm genuinely interested..
I see your posts in a variety of forums, some of which are frequented by some pretty astute engine guys - eg. Darin Morgan recently replied in one of your threads. You have the piss taken constantly yet it seemingly has no effect - I wish I could be so thick-skinned.
I honestly have no idea whether you really are a somewhat naive experimenter or whether you just have an odd sense of humour and the whole thing is an elaborate troll/hoax.

Which reminds me; does anyone know what became of Roger Cordia?

Edited by Grumbles, 09 October 2010 - 10:26.

[cheapracer]

You have the piss taken constantly yet it seemingly has no effect

Someone puts a $500 1986 Nissan Bluebird series 3 wagon on Ebay for $200,000 deserves to have the piss taken out of him, it certainly falls into the "Looney" category by most anyone's standards.

A $200,000 investment in technology (you're not buying the car obviously) requires technical overview and report, proof of concept and claims backed up by process and analysis not a "hey throw money at me" advert on Ebay.

[McGuire]

An ad from a 1910 trade journal. No, I don't know how it works or what it does. Beats me, honestly. How in blazes would I know? Why are you bothering me about it? Go away. I don't know where it goes, either, though it looks like it might go on the carburetor inlet. However, I suppose it might fit equally well on the tail pipe, who can say.

So maybe one of these units could be installed on each end of the vehicle to achieve double the benefit, whatever it might be. If one HOMO "makes a four cylinder run like a six cylinder on the gasoline consumed by a two cylinder," then two of them should make it run like a 12 cylinder on the gasoline consumed by a one cylinder, and so on, ad libitur. Surely we've all dreamed of the engine that runs like a 72 cylinder on the gasoline consumed by a .083 cylinder and here it is, QED. The device avows to be patented, so perhaps someone with more curiosity than myself (or more time on his hands) could do a search.

[OfficeLinebacker]

Surely we've all dreamed of the engine that runs like a 72 cylinder on the gasoline consumed by a .083 cylinder

*clasps hands together*

I'M NOT THE ONLY ONE!?!?!?! OH, JOY!

[Grumbles]

I'd be careful if I was SW.
I mean, we all know what Big Oil did to the inventor of the 200mpg carburetor don't we?

I often see boy racers with huge Greddy stickers (for example) across their car windows. I wonder if back in the day the Homo users did the same thing?

[Grumbles]

Apparently the Homo was banned after an elite tuner bolted two in series to each cylinder of his Model T and caused a minor environmental disaster.
Once the engine was started, it settled into a steady 4000rpm idle with the throttle fully closed and was efficient to the extent that the carbs made so much fuel that the tank soon overflowed onto the ground. Exhaust sparks set fire to the river of fuel and a nearby orphanage was burnt down. It would have been worse had not a quick thinking fireman knocked the Homos off with his axe and stopped the engine. Homos were widely vilified after the incident and the company went under.

[gruntguru]

Apparently the Homo was banned after an elite tuner bolted two in series to each cylinder of his Model T and caused a minor environmental disaster.
Once the engine was started, it settled into a steady 4000rpm idle with the throttle fully closed and was efficient to the extent that the carbs made so much fuel that the tank soon overflowed onto the ground. Exhaust sparks set fire to the river of fuel and a nearby orphanage was burnt down. It would have been worse had not a quick thinking fireman knocked the Homos off with his axe and stopped the engine. Homos were widely vilified after the incident and the company went under.

Don't listen to him smoking wheels. He's just trying to scare you.

[McGuire]

I did a quick search producing the anticipated result -- the HOMO is an air/fuel homogenizer. There's a little propeller inside, so it's a precursor to the "mini-supercharger" and other such quack devices. The inventor is a fellow named Forrest A. Heath, who also patented a non-refillable bottle... a renaissance man, evidently.

Enjoy:

http://www.google.co...d...&dq=1051369

[cheapracer]

Some threads are just meant to be!!

[scooperman]

From the Ebay ad...

"Porting method will be reviled shown how, to successful buyer."

It would seem from some of the comments above that it has already been reviled.

[smokingwheels]

"Porting method will be reviled shown how, to successful buyer."
Just wanted to see how much interest there is in saving fuel and what I am doing.
I have an EFI car but no funds to develop it.

I have since found there is an engine better that mine Google "Gun Engine" for more info.

I have a few websites now.

you can hear and download my engine sounds
My First Website
New website pretty boring but there is a forum there where I have posted my results Videos etc

In 2002 I had an engine that needed to be fired After Top Dead Center anyway I ended up killing it before I could fix the timing problem, the theory is you pick up firing losses and get more power.
To give an example my first engine would knock when the timing was 3-4 deg btdc above 3000 rpm with no load thus when under load it would need to be fired on the down stroke, I have been unable to find anyone that has got an engine like this so far.

Yes, I dont give up easy LOL

[gruntguru]

Yes, I dont give up easy LOL

This is a forum for folks to discuss technical issues. Either tell us how your device works - or piss off!

[smokingwheels]

This is a forum for folks to discuss technical issues. Either tell us how your device works or **** ***

I have told you and lots of people what I have done, my findings and as to how it works I would not have a clue I am not an engineer of anything its just something I discovered because I was too lazy to smooth out the ports after enlarging them with a wirewheel.

I have a problem in theory with EFI engines that is the injector flow rates minium and maxium, from what I understand at idle you can expect a pulse width of about 2 mS...now the question I have if I only need 1/3 of that fuel, the injector will go dead and not open with a .66mS pulse width, on the other hand the top end needs to be at least double the fuel, easy you say just put bigger injectors in but then that makes the fueling at idle worst.
I know about staged injectors but that means a lot of work to the average car and a new ECM.

PS I have thought about starting a non-profit organisation, Anyone interested here?

[desmo]

"Porting method will be reviled"

Nailed it. Should have stopped there.

[desmo]

PS I have thought about starting a non-profit organisation, Anyone interested here?

If non-profitability is the goal... I like your chances