13 replies to this topic

[mcwidow70]

On 1954 season Manzon drove several time the Ferrari 625, owned by Ecurie Rosier:

01-Aug Germania# 24
05-Sep Monza #6
24-Oct Spagna #20
09-May Bordeaux# 24
15-May BRDC # 24
06-Jun Roma #2
11-Jul Rouen #12
25-Jul Caen #12
15-Aug Pescara ??
05 Sep Monza #6
19-Sep Berlino #12

Usually Rosier's car were light blue but for sure on pescara and monza the car was red.

Do anyone know the reason for this colour change?





MONZA 1954 ITALIAN GP Manzon FERRARI625 #6



PESCARA Coppa Acerbo 1954 Manzon Ferrari 625 #?????

[Bruno]

Pescara #8



you are the résult:
Caen la Prairie and
GP Berlin Avus,
GP de Rouen les Essarts 11/7

Edited by Bruno, 26 November 2009 - 09:00.

[wenoopy]

mcwidow70, on Nov 26 2009, 08:44, said:

On 1954 season Manzon drove several time the Ferrari 625, owned by Ecurie Rosier:

Usually Rosier's car were light blue but for sure on pescara and monza the car was red.

Do anyone know the reason for this colour change?

In 'Motor Sport Racing Car Review' for 1954 season. Denis Jenkinson records that at Pescara, "Manzon was there with his car looking brand new after a refit at the factory... being painted red with a blue undertray" (he had suffered a broken big-end in the German GP).
This explains how, but not why, it became red. Perhaps, because there were no Ferrari factory type 625 cars entered at Pescara (only a type 553 which for various reasons, did not start), the factory looked on Manzon as an unofficial representative and repainted his car to show this. Manzon drove a factory car at the next Championship event, the Swiss GP.

Was this car owned by Rosier, or by Manzon? Did the two French drivers operate as a team rather than as 2 individuals, perhaps.

[mcwidow70]

Bruno, on Nov 26 2009, 09:58, said:

Pescara #8



you are the résult:
Caen la Prairie and
GP Berlin Avus,
GP de Rouen les Essarts 11/7

Caen: Manzon DNF, Rosier 5th
Avus: Manzon DNF
Rouen: Manzon 6th

Are you sure of Pescara 1954 #8?

Have you the race number also for Maglioli Pescara 1954?

[mcwidow70]

wenoopy, on Nov 26 2009, 10:31, said:

In 'Motor Sport Racing Car Review' for 1954 season. Denis Jenkinson records that at Pescara, "Manzon was there with his car looking brand new after a refit at the factory... being painted red with a blue undertray" (he had suffered a broken big-end in the German GP).
This explains how, but not why, it became red. Perhaps, because there were no Ferrari factory type 625 cars entered at Pescara (only a type 553 which for various reasons, did not start), the factory looked on Manzon as an unofficial representative and repainted his car to show this. Manzon drove a factory car at the next Championship event, the Swiss GP.

Was this car owned by Rosier, or by Manzon? Did the two French drivers operate as a team rather than as 2 individuals, perhaps.

I think that the car was private since on my pic the Ferrari logo apparently is not painted on the side.

[mcwidow70]

[quote name='Bruno' date='Nov 26 2009, 09:58' post='4014723']
Pescara #8

Manzon number wasn't 8
I have checked on the relevant AI issue and for sure the #8 was Musso, Maserati race winner




My bet is n.6

[Bruno]

maybe, you're right, this is what I

15/8/1954 GP de Pescara
Jacques Swaters 500 F2/625 F1 "0208" #28 ab
Robert Manzon 625 F1 #8 ab
Louis Rosier 500 F2 "0186" #22 ab
B. Taraschi 166 F2 #14 ab



thank mcwidow70

Edited by Bruno, 27 November 2009 - 06:48.

[wenoopy]

Bruno, on Nov 27 2009, 19:47, said:

maybe, you're right, this is what I

15/8/1954 GP de Pescara
Jacques Swaters 500 F2/625 F1 "0208" #28 ab
Robert Manzon 625 F1 #8 ab
Louis Rosier 500 F2 "0186" #22 ab
B. Taraschi 166 F2 #14 ab



thank mcwidow70

From picture of Manzon car in 'Racing Car Review' of 1954 season(page 28) number could be #4. It is only part-visible on curve of nose of car, but appears to be one number only, with straight lines (1 or 4 or 7), and it seems only even numbers were used (normal practise in Europe at that time) so would not be 1 or 7.

[Bruno]

wenoopy, on Nov 27 2009, 12:02, said:

From picture of Manzon car in 'Racing Car Review' of 1954 season(page 28) number could be #4. It is only part-visible on curve of nose of car, but appears to be one number only, with straight lines (1 or 4 or 7), and it seems only even numbers were used (normal practise in Europe at that time) so would not be 1 or 7.

. . . à suivre.

[rudi]

wenoopy, on Nov 26 2009, 11:31, said:

Was this car owned by Rosier, or by Manzon? Did the two French drivers operate as a team rather than as 2 individuals, perhaps.

First owner of the car was Maurice Trintignant who bought it with the help of some sponsors. When Trintignant got a factory drive his sponsors decided to give the car to Robert Manzon.
The servicing agreement with Louis Rosier seems to have ended after the Pau GP but the entries were still under Rosier's team.
When Rosier ordered a 250F Maserati mid 1954, his good relations with Ferrari ended.
And as Manzon saved Ferrari's honnour at the French GP, he probably got some factory support for his car.

[wdm]

Have just managed to dig out my copy of Pierre Fouquet-Hatelain's "Gordini, vecu par Robert Manzon"...

Manzon's Pescara car is listed as no.13

As to the team, we are told: "With the agreement of [previous team] Lancia, Manzon buys a Ferrari 625. [...] He will also acquire one of Louis Rosier's cars which the latter had bought new from Maranello and which had also been driven by Maurice Trintignant."

A photo from the Rouen GP is subitled: "Superb photo of the Rosier team composed of its two Ferraris, one of them painted red, a 500 F2 owned by Louis Rosier [...] the other, painted blue, a 625 F1 owned by Robert Manzon."

Can we assume that he drove the blue car at the start of the season, then at some point bought Rosier's (red) one?

[Bruno]

15-Aug Pescara ??
8
6
1-4-7
13
. . .

[rudi]

Bruno, on Nov 28 2009, 17:02, said:

15-Aug Pescara ??
8
6
1-4-7
13
. . .

Yes, at least one error on each page of the Manzon book.

Of course the caption of the Rouen photo in the book is wrong: Rosier's Ferrari was blue and it's number was 10 (8 on
the photo...).

[mcwidow70]

wdm, on Nov 28 2009, 09:58, said:

Have just managed to dig out my copy of Pierre Fouquet-Hatelain's "Gordini, vecu par Robert Manzon"...

Manzon's Pescara car is listed as no.13

As to the team, we are told: "With the agreement of [previous team] Lancia, Manzon buys a Ferrari 625. [...] He will also acquire one of Louis Rosier's cars which the latter had bought new from Maranello and which had also been driven by Maurice Trintignant."

A photo from the Rouen GP is subitled: "Superb photo of the Rosier team composed of its two Ferraris, one of them painted red, a 500 F2 owned by Louis Rosier [...] the other, painted blue, a 625 F1 owned by Robert Manzon."

Can we assume that he drove the blue car at the start of the season, then at some point bought Rosier's (red) one?

no.13 is not plausible if you consider the even race number custom.

As far as the Pierre Fouquet-Hatelain's book is concerned I supposed it covers only the gordini period. Does it contain also infirmation and pic (e.g. AVUS 1954) concerning the races attended with the 625 Ferrari?