75 replies to this topic

[robin2c4]

Arnold Farrer handing to KLM 1 over to Frank Cooper at Abingdon in November 1950.

Is something up with a date somewhere? If there is a photo of KLM 1 at Monaco having completed the 1950 Monte in January, how could the car be handed over at Abingdon in November 1950?

[toonarf]

Is something up with a date somewhere? If there is a photo of KLM 1 at Monaco having completed the 1950 Monte in January, how could the car be handed over at Abingdon in November 1950?

I came across a couple of photos of KLM 1 - and it's drivers - in the Monte report from the 10th February 1950 copy of The Autocar magazine.

Link to photo below - if this works!

The reason for the date discrepancy is quite simple............... Frank Cooper competed in the 1950 Monte Carlo in a 1949 Riley RMB KLM 1. By cutting the route rather like Couper did in his Rolls, Frank Cooper arrived at Monte Carlo undamaged (unlike Couper) not classed as a finisher but still eligible for the Concours de Comfort, in which he picked up an award.
In Late 1950 Cooper ordered another 2 1/2 litre from Rileys this time with many more modifications to make the journey more pleasant, this is the car in the picture being handed over, although it went back to Rileys for more modifications before competing in the 1951 event.
I cant prove this but I believe that Cooper intended to drive carefully down again and have another attempt in the Concours, cutting controls as required to stay with the Rally body and arrive with everyone else. However to prevent a situation like the previous years with Couper badly damaging the Rolls in an accident but still winning the Concours the organisers made it nesseary to visit each control to finish the rally and to enter the Concours you had to be a finisher.

David Marsden

[robin2c4]

Thanks David -

I did subsequently come across reference to there having been 2 cars bearing KLM 1 in James Taylor's RM Series book, but thanks for the extra details.

Cheers, Robin

[RS2000]

Just noticed a couple of Monte RM photos here (down the page):
http://www.forum-aut...243862-7630.htm

[RCH]

Some great photos there. That's my Saturday morning plans ruined!

[toonarf]

Just noticed a couple of Monte RM photos here (down the page):
http://www.forum-aut...243862-7630.htm

NS2525 was driven by brothers William and Ian Sutherland with I think their father along as third man. This loops around quite nicely to the original poster's question about the Sutherlands.
OAF 116 was driven by J.T.Spare and Leslie Griffiths I don't know who the third man was and I don't know the finishing positions for these 2


Why was the "third man" rarely if ever mentioned in the entry lists etc.

David

[ColinS]

Hello I am new to this forum.
I am looking for some help and i am unsure where to start my farther has a Ford Zephyr with a Monte Carlo Rally badge 57 on it. it was in a barn we purchased we have no details and the car is now on a Q plate is there an archive we could check of vehicles that have been entered to this event.

Thanks

[D-Type]

Hello I am new to this forum.
I am looking for some help and i am unsure where to start my farther has a Ford Zephyr with a Monte Carlo Rally badge 57 on it. it was in a barn we purchased we have no details and the car is now on a Q plate is there an archive we could check of vehicles that have been entered to this event.

Thanks

To narrow it down a bit, is it a Mk1 or a Mk 2 Zephyr?

[Geoff E]

Allegedly, there was no Monte Carlo Rally in 1957 owing to the Suez crisis http://en.wikipedia....nte_Carlo_Rally

The 1956 list is here http://www.teamdan.c...l/56miscra.html
and 1958 here http://www.teamdan.c...l/58miscra.html

[D-Type]

Geoff, I think he means it had a rally plaque with #57 rather than 1957

[Geoff E]

Geoff, I think he means it had a rally plaque with #57 rather than 1957

Doh!

Edited by Geoff E, 12 April 2011 - 21:34.

[Mistron]

A Monte plaque will also have the year of the event on it, next to the entry number, so that should narrow it down, either to a period event, or a more recent retrospective 'historics' event.

[WillHenderson]

I've just come across this MCR thread..... The Sutherlands in their Riley were 46th in the 1959 Rally. We do have images of the Glasgow start on our website but I'm in the process of adding names to the entrants and correcting the mistake of photos from 1953 being labelled 1954. www.thebillhendersoncollection.co.uk. For those interested in RMs there is a photo of the Potier Godinho/ Baxter Riley and we have a good photo of the Spare/Griffiths, car reg OAF116 although it's not on the site.

[bradbury west]

What an excellent archive this is
http://www.thebillhe...llection.co.uk/
Check out also the Rest and be Thankful shots, with the ATN de Havilland Spl, and the Fisher Jaguar, both of which warrant further details.
many thanks for the link
Roger Lund

[john winfield]

At the moment, replayed later I expect, UK listeners to Radio 4 Extra can hear commentary on the 1955 Monte Carlo, Glasgow start: Ken Wharton, Raymond Baxter, Wheels Hancock etc.  Commentary by Brian Johnstone.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk...io4extra/on-air

[john winfield]

Welcome repeat on later this afternoon, or on BBC  i-player:  includes in-car updates by Raymond Baxter.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk...rammes/b007jzg0

Edited by john winfield, 19 December 2014 - 12:59.

[Rupertlt1]

Has anybody spotted this yet?

 

https://revslib.stan...log/rr719hy6124

 

Update: https://library.revs...h/rr719hy6124/1

 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 09 May 2022 - 19:19.

[robin2c4]

Yes - thanks Rupertlt1.

 

The link you gave is to the George Phillips archive - he was the Autosport photographer back in the day, and the archive has recently been given/sold/hosted(?) on the Stanford website following digitisation.

Edited by robin2c4, 04 March 2016 - 20:19.

[Rupertlt1]

1954 W.R. Sutherland/I. Sutherland, Riley 2,4L #159:

 

Glasgow Departure

 

https://revslib.stan...log/hd611jg0966

 

Looks like NS 2525?

 

https://revslib.stan...log/jb651bn8699

 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 05 March 2016 - 10:35.

[Rupertlt1]

1959:

 

https://revslib.stan...tem/tm670gj6479

 

Update: https://library.revs...h/tm670gj6479/1

 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 09 May 2022 - 19:20.

[Rupertlt1]

1953, NS 2525:

 

https://library.revs...841/default.jpg

 

RGDS RLT

[Eric Dunsdon]

I think that must have been the year that my pals and I spent some time at Bignells Corner on the Barnet By Pass waiting to cheer on Roy Salvadori, John Young and John Coombes.

[Rupertlt1]

OMO 602:

 

https://www.stilltim.../abk/abk113.jpg

 

There was also an OMO 601:

 

https://www.stilltim.../abk/abk115.jpg

 

https://www.stilltim.../abk/abk121.jpg

 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 21 January 2024 - 07:54.

[Seedy]

Rupert

 

The full entry list for the 1955 Monte Carlo Rally is on this link

 

Entry list Rallye Automobile Monte-Carlo 1955 (ewrc-results.com)

 

Entry #101 is John Arthur McLaughlin & Ian Bruce McLaughlin entered in a Riley 1.5 starting from Glasgow.

 

They finished 171st overall.

 

There Riley 1.5 was the only one Riley 1.5 on the whole rally

 

Chris

[WillHenderson]

My father, Bill Henderson, was the official Autosport photographer for Scotland from the start of the publication in'51 and for the following 50 odd years. I have his archive which contains photos from the Monte starts in Glasgow from 1951 until 1963 including one of Riley NS3535 at the 1959 start.

I'm still working my way through scanning the negatives and trying to find time to add to and to make a new website. www.thebillhendersoncollection.com  - also on instagram @thebillhendersoncollection

 

William

[ReWind]

Some of your father's photographs should be there.
 
(By changing the year in the address other years are also visible, for instance 1954.)