31 replies to this topic

[DMatt001]

I started a new topic because I am interested in budget and employees of the 2010 Teams.

I heard this informations: (correct me if this information is incorrect).

Team Name: Employees: Budget:

Vodafone McLaren Mercedes - 850 - 220 Million Euros

Mercedes Grand Prix - 600 (450 - Brackley & 150 - Stuttgart) - 185 Million Euros

Red Bull Racing - 550 - 150 Million Euros

Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro - 900 - 240 Million Euros

AT&T Williams - 500 - 90 Million Euros

Renault F1 Team - 494 - 105 Million Euros

Force India F1 Team - 280 - 80 Million Euros

Scuderia Toro Rosso - 257 - 105 Million Euros

Lotus F1 Racing - 260 - 65 Million Euros

HRT F1 Team - unknown - 40 Million Euros

BMW Sauber F1 Team - 260 - 75 Million Euros

Virgin Racing - unknown - 45 Million Euro

Edited by DMatt001, 07 March 2010 - 17:51.

[TURU]

Team Name: Employees: Budget:
Renault F1 Team - 494 - 105 Million Euros

Petrov brings 15.000.000€ and that is 7% of Renault budget (according to Boullier). Simple calculation leads to a conclusion that Renault budget for 2010 season equals approximately 214 Milion Euros.

[Kooper]

Team Name: Employees: Budget:

Vodafone McLaren Mercedes - 850 - 220 Million Euros

Mercedes Grand Prix - 600 (450 - Brackley & 150 - Stuttgart) - 185 Million Euros

Red Bull Racing - 550 - 150 Million Euros

Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro - 900 - 240 Million Euros

AT&T Williams - 500 - 90 Million Euros

Renault F1 Team - 494 - 105 Million Euros

Force India F1 Team - 280 - 80 Million Euros

Scuderia Toro Rosso - 257 - 105 Million Euros

Lotus F1 Racing - 260 - 65 Million Euros

HRT F1 Team - unknown - 40 Million Euros

BMW Sauber F1 Team - 260 - 75 Million Euros

Virgin Racing - unknown - 45 Millionen Euro

Palmolive Dish Soap USF1 - 3 - (-) 10 Million Euros

[TURU]

You should also add Stefan GP with its (AMCO's) 1 employee and 3.000€ capital, and 42€ income

[DMatt001]

Petrov brings 15.000.000€ and that is 7% of Renault budget (according to Boullier). Simple calculation leads to a conclusion that Renault budget for 2010 season equals approximately 214 Milion Euros.

He brings 15.000.000 $ = 11.044.030 € and that is about 150 Milion € budget.

[TURU]

He brings 15.000.000 $ = 11.044.030 € and that is about 150 Milion € budget.

Then, my fault. I was sure he brings Euros. But still, the budget is bigger then 105 milion.

[Chomsky]

I thought it was 15 million euros=21 million dollars?

[TURU]

Then, my fault. I was sure he brings Euros. But still, the budget is bigger then 105 milion.

I thought so too, but unfortunatelly i cant find any reliable source to confirm this, ATM.

[PompousJester]

Officially Petrov brings 13.000.000£ (pounds).
It is 7% of Renault budget.

Nowadays it is less then 7%.

[TURU]

Officially Petrov brings 13.000.000£ (pounds).
It is 7% of Renault budget.

Nowadays it is less then 7%.

Any source ??

If it's true, then Renault budged equals to 185.714.285 pounds = 205.433.998€

[F1Champion]

Interesting figures when you look at the resources and manpower than McLaren and Ferrari have.

Excluding engine staff Mercedes have less people than Williams, Red Bull and Renault. That's running a pretty tight ship.

McLaren have always had a big budget to spend solely on the chassis as engines came for free, while Ferrari had to split their resources between engine and chassis. It will be interesting to see how McLaren manage the split when they start to make their own engines.

[PompousJester]

Type 'Petrov 7% budget' in Google.

[TURU]

Type 'Petrov 7% budget' in Google.

PlanetF1, a reliable source??
I meant something like RenaultF1.com or so

[BiH]

if those figures are correct then sauber and force india are doing very good considering their small budget to the top teams.

[TenienteX]

according to the "motorsport-total.com" (a usually reliable source) pre-season assessment of renault their budget is around 105 million euros, which seems very realistic.

http://www.motorspor...t_10030610.html

[Chomsky]

We need Barteks to clear this up

[Chomsky]

http://www.motorspor...t_10030610.html

That's a very harsh article

[DMatt001]

Petrov brings 15.000.000€ and that is 7% of Renault budget (according to Boullier). Simple calculation leads to a conclusion that Renault budget for 2010 season equals approximately 214 Milion Euros.

I read many sites, and there are many different news. One site says 10 - 15 million dollars, a other 15 million euros but i believe that 15 milion euros or dollars are too much. If Renault had 200 Million that would be one of the richest teams with many potential, but I think that it is not so.

[TURU]

Wait a minute ..... Boullier said that Petrov brings 7% of Renault budget (it was an official interview). Only concern is how much did Petrov bring. All rumours suggest something near 15 milion (euro, pounds or dollars ). No matter how do you calculate their budget, it is clearly bigger than those 105 milion. Why should I believe some website more than the team principial ??

I read many sites, and there are many different news. One site says 10 - 15 million dollars, a other 15 million euros but i believe that 15 milion euros or dollars are too much. If Renault had 200 Million that would be one of the richest teams with many potential, but I think that it is not so.

Edited by TURU, 07 March 2010 - 10:13.

[DMatt001]

Wait a minute ..... Boullier said that Petrov brings 7% of Renault budget (it was an official interview). Only concern is how much did Petrov bring. All rumours suggest something near 15 milion (euro, pounds or dollars ). No matter how do you calculate their budget, it is clearly bigger than those 105 milion. Why should I believe some website more than the team principial ??

Thinky what you want and continue dream.... My simple human thought says that 15 million is too many for a number two seat and a slow Team. I read on 3 sites that Renault budget is about 105 milion euros and I believe that is true. Renault is not Ferrari or McLaren (200 Million Euros), you can see this on the results.

Edited by DMatt001, 07 March 2010 - 18:13.

[Nustang70]

I started a new topic because I am interested in budget and employees of the 2010 Teams.

I heard this informations: (correct me if this information is incorrect).

Team Name: Employees: Budget:

Vodafone McLaren Mercedes - 850 - 220 Million Euros

Mercedes Grand Prix - 600 (450 - Brackley & 150 - Stuttgart) - 185 Million Euros

Red Bull Racing - 550 - 150 Million Euros

Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro - 900 - 240 Million Euros

AT&T Williams - 500 - 90 Million Euros

Renault F1 Team - 494 - 105 Million Euros

Force India F1 Team - 280 - 80 Million Euros

Scuderia Toro Rosso - 257 - 105 Million Euros

Lotus F1 Racing - 260 - 65 Million Euros

HRT F1 Team - unknown - 40 Million Euros

BMW Sauber F1 Team - 260 - 75 Million Euros

Virgin Racing - unknown - 45 Million Euro

Some of these numbers can't be right. Williams has 500 employees and spends 90 million Euros, while Toro Rosso has 257 employees and spends 105 million Euros. Either Williams is running a sweatshop or Toro Rosso is a huge money pit. Or Force India, with 220 employees less than Williams, but a budget of only 10 million Euros less.

Then again, I suppose Toro Rosso or Force India might outsource some things that Williams does in-house.

[pingu666]

toro rosso used to outsource alot of its stuff, the tubs where made by another company....

i read that usf1 had looked at williams budget for 94 or 93, and had used that as a basis for planning

staff numbers and budgets are pretty insane...

[skipper]

Thinky what you want and continue dream.... My simple human thought says that 15 million is too many for a number two seat and a slow Team. I read on 3 sites that Renault budget is about 105 milion euros and I believe that is true. Renault is not Ferrari or McLaren (200 Million Euros), you can see this on the results.

Not true.

I remember that Kubica said in interview that Renault budget is higher than last year.
It's more than 105 milion...

Edited by skipper, 08 March 2010 - 08:13.

[Dudley]

Interesting figures when you look at the resources and manpower than McLaren and Ferrari have.

Excluding engine staff Mercedes have less people than Williams, Red Bull and Renault. That's running a pretty tight ship.

McLaren have always had a big budget to spend solely on the chassis as engines came for free, while Ferrari had to split their resources between engine and chassis. It will be interesting to see how McLaren manage the split when they start to make their own engines.

Why would McLaren make their own engines? They've got 5 years of Mercedes before it's even an option and even then I imagine they'd get a tie up with a manufacturer instead.

[taran]

All these figures are guestimates at best but that doesn't mean they are all wrong. Usually, it is based on "some" research.

However, you can't simply compare these figures.

For example, Ferrari's budget includes its race and engine budgets. Red Bull only lists its own budget and what it pays Renault, not what Renault spends on its engines. To really compare those teams, you should compare both race and engine budgets.
Same for the other teams. All teams with customer engines only list what they pay for those engines, not what the manufacturer's engine budget is. So the comparison is skewed.

Edited by taran, 08 March 2010 - 09:26.

[JasonSw]

All these figures are guestimates at best but that doesn't mean they are all wrong. Usually, it is based on "some" research.

However, you can't simply compare these figures.

Fore example, Ferrari's budget includes its race and engine budgets. Red Bull only lists its own budget and what it pays Renault, not what Renault spends on its engines. To really compare those teams, you should compare both race and engine budgets.
Same for the other teams. All teams with customer engines only list what they pay for those engines, not what the manufacturer's engine budget is. So the comparison is skewed.

Also the figures are at least a season old!

Plus the 850 McLaren employees include all those working at the MTC, not just those working on the race team.

The Brawn team did have 450 odd employees but cut more than 200 in March last year.

[RoutariEnjinu]

Someone do a graph of budget divided by GP points amassed

[J. Edlund]

Interesting figures when you look at the resources and manpower than McLaren and Ferrari have.

Excluding engine staff Mercedes have less people than Williams, Red Bull and Renault. That's running a pretty tight ship.

McLaren have always had a big budget to spend solely on the chassis as engines came for free, while Ferrari had to split their resources between engine and chassis. It will be interesting to see how McLaren manage the split when they start to make their own engines.

Mercedes GP doesn't make any engines, and as it says, 450 people at Brackley and 150 at Stuttgart. So, that's without the engine operations at Brixworth.

Also the figures are at least a season old!

Plus the 850 McLaren employees include all those working at the MTC, not just those working on the race team.

The Brawn team did have 450 odd employees but cut more than 200 in March last year.

Brawn cut the number of employees to 450 (425 according to some sources), not from 450. When they were Honda they had close to 700 employees.

McLaren Racing has around 550 employees according to their website.

[V8 Fireworks]

Some of these numbers can't be right. Williams has 500 employees and spends 90 million Euros, while Toro Rosso has 257 employees and spends 105 million Euros.

STR is still Minardi with a slightly bigger but still small machine shop. Tubs - outsourced, gearbox - outsourced (probably an RBR one still) etc.

Meanwhile Williams make their own tubs, gearboxes etc etc... that might explain it.

It won't cost STR less but they would have less employees with all this outsourcing.

[V8 Fireworks]

Why would McLaren make their own engines? They've got 5 years of Mercedes before it's even an option and even then I imagine they'd get a tie up with a manufacturer instead.

They are a manufacturer though.

A McLaren-Lamborghini or McLaren-Audi, whilst McLaren are trying to steal Lamborghini or Audi R8 sales away from VAG. A McLaren-Toyota whilst mclaren tries to lure buyers away from the lexus ifa? VW, Toyota or any other manufacturer will be less than impressed... no chance.

You'd imagine they might go for a branding deal with Cosworth or buy their own Judd or Zytek supplied engine.

Edited by V8 Fireworks, 08 March 2010 - 21:45.

[taran]

STR is still Minardi with a slightly bigger but still small machine shop. Tubs - outsourced, gearbox - outsourced (probably an RBR one still) etc.

Meanwhile Williams make their own tubs, gearboxes etc etc... that might explain it.

It won't cost STR less but they would have less employees with all this outsourcing.

Actually, Minardi used to make their own gearboxes with less staff than they have now.

[taran]

They are a manufacturer though.

A McLaren-Lamborghini or McLaren-Audi, whilst McLaren are trying to steal Lamborghini or Audi R8 sales away from VAG. A McLaren-Toyota whilst mclaren tries to lure buyers away from the lexus ifa? VW, Toyota or any other manufacturer will be less than impressed... no chance.

You'd imagine they might go for a branding deal with Cosworth or buy their own Judd or Zytek supplied engine.

Logically, you'd be right but in reality there have been numerous "weird" combinations. The McLaren F1 super car had a BMW engine while their F1 team hooked up with Peugeot and then Mercedes. At the same time the McLaren-BMW was racing at Le Mans and Mercedes was building its own quasi supercars.

Spyker gets Audi engines whilst chasing sales against a bevy of VW's like the Bugatti, Bentlye's, Lamborghini and Audi's.

Wiesmann gets BMW engines but competes with BMW for sales in that class.

I am sure there are many other examples.