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British sportscar photo ID (1970s?)


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#1 pwvalentine

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 12:12

Hi all,

Hope you don't mind me picking your brains - I recently obtained a few motor racing autographs which I believe are from the 1970s - however I'm a bit stumped as to identifying the car. I'm sure somebody here will be able to work it out straight away, and I'll be very grateful for your help.

The bonus would be if anybody recognised or could work out the drivers - the signature on one appears to read 'Brian Weaver' but the name doesn't ring any bells to me. It's dedicated 'To Ray' if that helps. The other two look to be signed by 'Don.'

Thanks in advance,

Paul

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Edited by pwvalentine, 24 April 2010 - 12:13.


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#2 CoulthardD

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 12:39

It looks like a much chopped about replica of a Sebring Sprite, but that's just a guess...

DC

#3 Paul Rochdale

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 14:15

Crikey, something I know at long last! It's a Fairthorpe Electron Minor, or at least one of the Fairthorpe range of kitcars. See http://www.fairthorp...pe_limited.html

The name 'Don' may mean the boss of Fairthorpes, Air Vice Marshal Donald Bennett, DSO, RAF.

Edited by Paul Rochdale, 24 April 2010 - 14:21.


#4 CoulthardD

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 14:17

Ah! So could the 'Don' signature be Don Bennett?

And mention of Brain Weaver and an Electron here.

DC

Edited by CoulthardD, 24 April 2010 - 14:33.


#5 pwvalentine

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 14:49

Thank you both, that's very helpful. It definitely looks like a Fairthorpe - and after you first mentioned that, like you I wondered whether the Don could be Don Bennett.

I've just checked out the link about Brian Weaver - it's a shame the photo showing him in the car is no longer available, but that's something a lot more concrete than I had more.

Thanks again, much appreciated :up:

#6 arttidesco

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 15:28

Looks to me like the top two were taken at Silverstone, couldn't tell you where the bottom one was taken but that telegraph pole with the Leyland Signage ought to jog some ones memory :-)

I also notice that the drivers are wearing full face helmets suggesting these Electron Minors were raced a good decade or more after they were originally built.

On the subject of unusual rwo seaters does anyone recognise the car here

It was taken on June 1st 1957 at Silverstone and looks similar to the the Michelloti designed and Ghia built Lotus of 1957 seen here but without a full width screen or the air intake in the bonnet.

If anyone can point me in the direction of identifying this car I'd be most grateful :-)





#7 CoulthardD

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 16:02

Looks to me like the top two were taken at Silverstone, couldn't tell you where the bottom one was taken but that telegraph pole with the Leyland Signage ought to jog some ones memory :-)

I keep thinking Aintree for the bottom photo.

DC

#8 alansart

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 16:12

I keep thinking Aintree for the bottom photo.

DC


Did Aintree have Armco like that.

It could still be Silverstone, slightly up the Club Straight, with the old farm buidings in the background.


#9 Red Socks

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 17:55

Did Aintree have Armco like that.

It could still be Silverstone, slightly up the Club Straight, with the old farm buidings in the background.


Looks to me like an 8 Clubs meeting from the time of year and two different drivers on the same day.The other car could be some sort of WSM in light of the driver.


#10 Sharman

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 18:05

Looks to me like an 8 Clubs meeting from the time of year and two different drivers on the same day.The other car could be some sort of WSM in light of the driver.

It doesn't look pretty enough for a WSM, possibly an Asnley bonneted Sprite

#11 Paul Rochdale

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 18:35

PGP 182 1954 Lotus Mk VI 1172 Ford E93A Neville Bradshaw. The ex-Peter Kirwan-Taylor car.


#12 arttidesco

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 20:21

PGP 182 1954 Lotus Mk VI 1172 Ford E93A Neville Bradshaw. The ex-Peter Kirwan-Taylor car.

Paul Rochdale your a star :-) Thanks very much :-) Is that insider Lotus historian knowledge or something from a publication ?

Alansart

It could still be Silverstone, slightly up the Club Straight, with the old farm buidings in the background.

I do not recall being able to see the farm buildings from club straight at all (my first visit to Silverstone 1978 so I am not definitively saying you could not) I certainly do not remember any telephone poles being so close to the track and finally if the Electron was going down club straight would it not be going down it the 'wrong' way ?

I thought the Silverstone farm buildings are within the confines of the 'Club' circuit circa 1978 meaning any photo looking into the Silverstone buildings from the outside with cars passing clockwise would be travelling from the right of the picture to the left ?.

See below which a friend just sent :-

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Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Winner John Fitzpatrick #3 Gelo Porsche 935 narrowly leads Brian Redman Essex Porsche 936 Silverstone past the farm buildings. Published with copyright owners permission

I confess seeing this makes me very unsure of the geography of Silverstone and what the straights were called, that telephone pole certainly raises the possibility of the bottom Electron Minor being at Silverstone but you see what I mean about the Electron Minor having to be travelling the 'wrong' anticlockwise way round the circuit ?

BTW Does the club circuit still exist in any recognisable form contemporaneous to these photos ?

I went back to Silverstone for the 6 hours for the first time since 1992 last year and I hardly recognised the place, if it had not been so cold, the burgers so bad and the donuts so over the top I might have thought I'd driven to the wrong circuit :-)

Edited by arttidesco, 24 April 2010 - 20:29.


#13 Alfie

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Posted 25 April 2010 - 10:12

PGP 182 1954 Lotus Mk VI 1172 Ford E93A Neville Bradshaw. The ex-Peter Kirwan-Taylor car.

Paul Rochdale your a star :-) Thanks very much :-) Is that insider Lotus historian knowledge or something from a publication ?

Alansart

It could still be Silverstone, slightly up the Club Straight, with the old farm buidings in the background.

I do not recall being able to see the farm buildings from club straight at all (my first visit to Silverstone 1978 so I am not definitively saying you could not) I certainly do not remember any telephone poles being so close to the track and finally if the Electron was going down club straight would it not be going down it the 'wrong' way ?

I thought the Silverstone farm buildings are within the confines of the 'Club' circuit circa 1978 meaning any photo looking into the Silverstone buildings from the outside with cars passing clockwise would be travelling from the right of the picture to the left ?.

See below which a friend just sent :-

Posted Image

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Winner John Fitzpatrick #3 Gelo Porsche 935 narrowly leads Brian Redman Essex Porsche 936 Silverstone past the farm buildings. Published with copyright owners permission

I confess seeing this makes me very unsure of the geography of Silverstone and what the straights were called, that telephone pole certainly raises the possibility of the bottom Electron Minor being at Silverstone but you see what I mean about the Electron Minor having to be travelling the 'wrong' anticlockwise way round the circuit ?

BTW Does the club circuit still exist in any recognisable form contemporaneous to these photos ?

I went back to Silverstone for the 6 hours for the first time since 1992 last year and I hardly recognised the place, if it had not been so cold, the burgers so bad and the donuts so over the top I might have thought I'd driven to the wrong circuit :-)


I'm sorry that I can't help with a positive contribution, but on the basis that knowing what something is NOT can help....

First two photos appear to be Silverstone; club Woodcote. First picture taken from the outside of the corner, possibly from the gap. The second photo is certainly the exit of Woodcote taken from the area which stood on the inside of the corner where the hospitality suites are now.
I do not believe the third photo is Silverstone at all. The only possible place it could be would be the club straight running down into Woodcote, but the farm and associated buildings seem wrong, and I do not remember anything like the catch fencing or whatever, behind the Armco in that area.

#14 arttidesco

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 00:25

I was curious about that fencing to Alfie although I do remember an access road from the paddock to the Silverstone Bridge that was fenced.

But I am convinced the car would be travelling in the other direction if they were the Silverstone Farm buildings hinted at in RJC's 1979 pic.

#15 Stephen W

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 08:55

Posted Image


I keep thinking Aintree for the bottom photo.

DC


Did Aintree have Armco like that.

It could still be Silverstone, slightly up the Club Straight, with the old farm buidings in the background.



I was curious about that fencing to Alfie although I do remember an access road from the paddock to the Silverstone Bridge that was fenced.

But I am convinced the car would be travelling in the other direction if they were the Silverstone Farm buildings hinted at in RJC's 1979 pic.


With the British Leyland adverts in the background and the tarmac on top of concrete track plus the Armco I don't think this is Aintree. It may be taken on the old Club Straight at Silverstone which ran from Becketts to Woodcote.

:wave:

#16 CoulthardD

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 09:24

It was the houses in the background which made me think of Aintree.

DC

#17 alansart

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 09:30

It was the houses in the background which made me think of Aintree.

DC


It's actually the old farm house which is over near Abbey Curve. I just looked on Google earth and it's still there.

The white posts behind the armco mark the line of the road leading to the bridge over the track between Abbey and the old Woodcote.

So the photo is taken on the Club Straight approaching Woodcote.


#18 MCS

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 11:50

It's actually the old farm house which is over near Abbey Curve. I just looked on Google earth and it's still there.

The white posts behind the armco mark the line of the road leading to the bridge over the track between Abbey and the old Woodcote.

So the photo is taken on the Club Straight approaching Woodcote.


Is it really? There seem to be a number of buildings. Could it be from a sprint somewhere?


#19 alansart

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 12:09

Is it really? There seem to be a number of buildings. Could it be from a sprint somewhere?


Just the farm with an extension plus a barn.

I marshalled at that spot on the Club Straight several times.

Edited by alansart, 26 April 2010 - 13:04.


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#20 MCS

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 12:22

Just the farm with an extension plus a barn.

A marshalled at that spot on the Club Straight several times.


Okay, looks like your memory is a safer bet than mine!

Edited by MCS, 26 April 2010 - 12:22.


#21 Stephen W

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 15:37

Just the farm with an extension plus a barn.

I marshalled at that spot on the Club Straight several times.


I spotted the same farmhouse the other week whilst at Silverstone:
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You can just make out the Farmhouse and the Barns in the trees in the distance.

#22 kartman24

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Posted 03 May 2010 - 18:09

I think the Don you are looking for is probably Don Grant. Brian Weaver and Don Grant raced identically painted Electron Minor mk1`s, both cars competed in the 8 clubs several years running, Don`s car was recently sold abroad and Brian`s is being refettled for racing this coming year. The cars were dark blue and silver..........Martin

#23 kartman24

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Posted 03 May 2010 - 18:11

Just looked at the picture again and it is obviously is in it`s earlier colour scheme which was a tourquise type colour...........Martin

#24 arttidesco

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Posted 17 May 2010 - 19:27

On the subject of unusual two seaters does anyone recognise the car here

It was taken on June 1st 1957 at Silverstone and looks similar to the the Michelloti designed and Ghia built Lotus of 1957 seen here but without a full width screen or the air intake in the bonnet.

If anyone can point me in the direction of identifying this car I'd be most grateful :-)
[/quote]

Just like to thank everyone who chipped in and helped me along the road to identifying the mystery bodied Lotus 6 PGP 182 I asked about above :-)

Turns out that this is a very significant Lotus 6 as Peter Ross of the Historic Lotus Register explains below, a great pity the original body no longer exists but the drawings do, hopefully only a matter of time before someone has a go at remanufacturing the original here is what Peter Ross had to say :-

PGP182

This is a very famous Lotus because it was bought by Peter Kirwan-Taylor who later designed the body for the Lotus 14 Elite.

It was displayed at the recent Club Lotus Show at Malvern (April 17/18th) and below is what was written on the information sheet next to the car.

It was still called a Lotus when the original body was fitted.

Registration: PGP182
Engine: Ford E93A 1172cc
First Owner: Peter Kirwan-Taylor

Peter bought the chassis MkVl No.34 on 13/4/1954. He designed a special body for the frame and asked Colin Chapman to make it for him in aluminium.

The body was made by Williams and Prichard but invoiced by Lotus Engineering. The body was an all enveloping style and this impressed Colin Chapman so much that he asked Peter to style the body of the type 14 Elite.

Peter, being a merchant banker, also helped in improving Lotus profits and the Company’s eventual 1968 flotation on the Stock Exchange. He also designed the Swallow Doretti and the Citroen Bijou.

It was fitted with the Ford E93A engine with all the Aquaplane bits available. Peter had the car for about two years. The next owner is unknown.

From 1963 to 1969 it was owned by Thomas Kikaldy who removed the special body and sold it to an Italian restaurant owner in London.

The body has not been seen since. However Peter Kirwan-Taylor has provided the original drawings of the body and it could be reproduced if required.

The long restoration of this car started in 1983 when Len Prichard of Williams and Prichard made the present body panels bringing the car back to the original Mk Vl styling.

The car was finally completed by Mike Brotherwood in 2004.

Quite a significant vehicle in the Lotus story I'd say :-)

Thanks again for your help especially Paul in helping tracing this car :-)

Best

Art T


#25 pwvalentine

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Posted 18 May 2010 - 18:25

I think the Don you are looking for is probably Don Grant. Brian Weaver and Don Grant raced identically painted Electron Minor mk1`s, both cars competed in the 8 clubs several years running, Don`s car was recently sold abroad and Brian`s is being refettled for racing this coming year. The cars were dark blue and silver..........Martin


That's great - thanks very much for your help.

#26 Sharman

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Posted 18 May 2010 - 18:48

Didn't PK-T design one of the late Fraser Nash body shells as well?

#27 Dutchy

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Posted 19 May 2010 - 12:21

Didn't PK-T design one of the late Fraser Nash body shells as well?


I believe it was chassis 421/200/300 reg 50 LMU which was the 1956 Earls Court show car and fitted with a 2.5 litre V8 BMW engine. It was fitted with a coupe body by Peels of Kingston for Peter Lumsden and prepared for Le Mans in 1957 but didn't race.
Sadly the body has in recent years been removed from the car and a replica Le Mans Replica body fitted in place.

Info courtesy of http://www.frazernash-usa.com/

#28 bradbury west

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Posted 01 June 2010 - 18:58

[quote name='pwvalentine' post='4311689' date='Apr 24 2010, 13:12']Thanks in advance,Paul
Re; Picture3 Post 1.
By chance, a long lens shot of the 1961 6 hr relay race report in Autosport shows another Fairthorpe, Goulding's, in almost the exact same place going down the Club Straight
Roger Lund

Edited by bradbury west, 01 June 2010 - 19:18.


#29 Andrew Kitson

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Posted 01 June 2010 - 19:03

The first set of photos are all definitely Silverstone. Yes, the farm buildings at Abbey across the field.