43 replies to this topic

[Nustang70]

I've been compiling a list of drivers' percentages of retirements caused by either collision, accident, or spinning off (as classified by the FIA). Of course, this is not definitive or exact, especially considering that it does not record crashes that do not result in retirement and does not take into account fault. I also think that drivers that start near the front are less likely to get caught up the the chaotic tangles at the start of GPs.

This is just for anecdotal fun. For any of you wet blankets out there that want to say that my methodology is flawed or that nothing but the championship standings prove anything, please don't. I am not trying to make any definitive claims!

Anyway, I've gone back to 1995 so far. Here's some of the drivers' full records (I haven't calculated drivers that I haven't finished collecting the data on).

Alonso: 4.2%
Button: 9.7%
de la Rosa: 18.8%
Diniz: 25.5%
Fisichella: 13.1%
Glock: 10.0%
Hamilton: 7.0%
Heidfeld: 8.4%
Kovalainen: 10.7%
Kubica: 6.5%
Liuzzi: 22.4%
Massa: 8.4%
Montoya: 11.7%
Piquet Jr: 25.0%
Raikkonen: 9.0%
Rosberg: 9.3%
Sato: 14.4%
R. Schumacher: 15.0%
Speed: 21.4%
Sutil: 24.6%
Trulli: 12.7%
Vettel: 12.5%
Villeneuve: 11.0%
Webber: 11.2%
Wurz: 18.8%


-Massa and Rosberg both had a bunch of crash-induced retirements early in their careers, but have had very few the past couple seasons.

Edited by Nustang70, 14 May 2010 - 16:57.

[Kooper]

you really ought to subtract 1 from Piquet's Jr tally... you know, the one where he took one for Teflonso

[Lights]

What you're claiming here is flawed.

Actually, an interesting topic.

The two drivers that you listed with the highest percentage for some reason did not surprise me.

But this must take quite some time? Are you bored?

[Nustang70]

you really ought to subtract 1 from Piquet's Jr tally... you know, the one where he took one for Teflonso

[Nustang70]

But this must take quite some time? Are you bored?

I'm a high school substitute teacher. Now that I'm done with my own schoolwork for the semester, I have little to do at work after I put on the video or distribute the worksheets.

[OfficeLinebacker]

I thought Montoya would be higher. Reminds me of the old racing phrase, "In order to finish first, one must first finish."

[Jose Mourinho is Special]

Jenson Button 0%

[Henrytheeigth]

Jenson Button 0%

He crashed out in Spa in 2000 was it at the busstop? lol

[Massacrator]

Jenson Button 0%

That's what happens when you drive slow

[Lights]

He crashed out in Spa in 2000 was it at the busstop? lol

2000?

He finished there at least.

He crashed twice in Les Combes, 2004 and 2009.

[Jose Mourinho is Special]

That's what happens when you drive slow

I'll rather be slow and win the WDC and earn big $$ afterwards

[Henrytheeigth]

2000?

He finished there at least.

He crashed twice in Les Combes, 2004 and 2009.

I remember seeing a driver with a union flag on his helmet crashing at the busstop...

[Lights]

I remember seeing a driver with a union flag on his helmet crashing at the busstop...

http://www.formula1....season/2001/47/ ?

[Henrytheeigth]

http://www.formula1....season/2001/47/ ?

Cool 2001

[Fastcake]

That's rather interesting, confirms of course what we all knew, Piquet is an extremely lousy driver and Sutil is unlucky

Wow, Alonso has a fairly low rate

[Jose Mourinho is Special]

Wow, Alonso has a fairly low rate

qualities of a good driver is 'car control'

So long you drive fast, take risks, but you need to control the car while your at it, Alonso does it best eg Malaysia this year

[jjcale]

That's what happens when you drive slow

Nah, that's Heidfeld your thinking of... breaks the record for most consecutive finishes and then cant find a seat for the next season

[Tenmantaylor]

Nustang

Thanks for proving my assertion that Sutil is (probably) the most accident prone F1 driver of recent times. Piquet doesn't count, maybe they tried it other times and it didnt work so wasnt followed up on

[Nustang70]

Nustang

Thanks for proving my assertion that Sutil is (probably) the most accident prone F1 driver of recent times. Piquet doesn't count, maybe they tried it other times and it didnt work so wasnt followed up on ;)

Yeah, you were the one that got me thinking about it.

[Nustang70]

Jenson Button 0%

Sorry, just incorporated the 2000 season (Button's rookie year) into the data. His overall crash-related retirement percentage is 9.7%

[Lights]

From hero to zero then

No, from zero to 9,7%.

[VoRteX]

I've been compiling a list of drivers' percentages of retirements caused by either collision, accident, or spinning off (as classified by the FIA). Of course, this is not definitive or exact, especially considering that it does not record crashes that do not result in retirement and does not take into account fault. I also think that drivers that start near the front are less likely to get caught up the the chaotic tangles at the start of GPs.

This is just for anecdotal fun. For any of you wet blankets out there that want to say that my methodology is flawed or that nothing but the championship standings prove anything, please don't. I am not trying to make any definitive claims!

Anyway, I've gone back to 2001 so far. Here's some of the drivers full records (I haven't calculated drivers that I haven't finished collecting the data on).


Alonso: 4.2%
Button: 9.7%
Glock: 10.0%
Hamilton: 7.0%
Kovalainen: 10.7%
Kubica: 6.5%
Liuzzi: 22.4%
Massa: 8.4%
Montoya: 11.7%
Piquet Jr: 25.0%
Raikkonen: 9.0%
Rosberg: 9.3%
Sato: 14.4%
Speed: 21.4%
Sutil: 24.6%
Vettel: 12.5%
Webber: 11.2%

A few comments:
-Massa and Rosberg both had a bunch of crash-induced retirements early in their careers, but had very few the past couple seasons.
-So far, M. Schumacher looks set for a pretty low rate, Frentzen, Barrichello, and Heidfeld are all pretty good too. Button, Coulthard, Fisichella, R. Schumacher, and Trulli all look like they'll probably be above 10%.

Alonso: 4.2%
Kubica: 6.5%
Hamilton: 7.0%
Massa: 8.4%
Raikkonen: 9.0%
Rosberg: 9.3%
Button: 9.7%
Glock: 10.0%
Kovalainen: 10.7%
Webber: 11.2%
Montoya: 11.7%
Vettel: 12.5%
Sato: 14.4%
Speed: 21.4%
Liuzzi: 22.4%
Sutil: 24.6%
Piquet Jr: 25.0%

[Marbles]

Thanks for taking the time to put that together, Nustang. Was fun to read and even more fun to mull it over.

[Nustang70]

Thanks for taking the time to put that together, Nustang. Was fun to read and even more fun to mull it over.

Yeah, no problem. I'll probably keep working back so I can add people like Fisi, the Schumachers, Trulli, DC, Heidfeld, Hakkinen, etc. I'll update this once I've gone back to '96 or so and I'll have stats for Fisi, Trulli, Ralf, and Heidfeld. Maybe some others I'm forgetting. For the most part I'm leaving out drivers that aren't mainstays to F1 such as Pantano or Burti.

[FNG]

Both Red Bull drivers well up there. Interesting...

[Hairpin]

Stats. I remember Kimi's steering wheel coming lose in his Sauber, his rear wing came off at T1 Hockenheim, his front exploded at Nurburgring and he got his Ferrari full of McLaren while waiting at a red light. You can do that for all the drivers. Not saying the stats is not interesting, just that one should be careful drawing any conclusions from them.

[korzeniow]

Alonso: 4.2%
Kubica: 6.5%
Hamilton: 7.0%
Massa: 8.4%
Raikkonen: 9.0%
Rosberg: 9.3%
Button: 9.7%
Glock: 10.0%
Kovalainen: 10.7%
Webber: 11.2%
Montoya: 11.7%
Vettel: 12.5%
Sato: 14.4%
Speed: 21.4%
Liuzzi: 22.4%
Sutil: 24.6%
Piquet Jr: 25.0%

I'm supprised, with all this mechanical failures which happened to Kubica he is still second best

[V8 Fireworks]

I'm a high school substitute teacher. Now that I'm done with my own schoolwork for the semester, I have little to do at work after I put on the video or distribute the worksheets.

:
Could you not develop some kind of "paradigm" - they seem to be popular for all Humanities related areas.

[Tenmantaylor]

Stats. I remember Kimi's steering wheel coming lose in his Sauber, his rear wing came off at T1 Hockenheim, his front exploded at Nurburgring and he got his Ferrari full of McLaren while waiting at a red light. You can do that for all the drivers. Not saying the stats is not interesting, just that one should be careful drawing any conclusions from them.

His front susp exploded at Nurb because he flat spotted his front tyre so heavily the vibration ripped the car apart, and nearly Jenson in the process IIRC. I dont think you can miscount that one.

[Messi10]

His front susp exploded at Nurb because he flat spotted his front tyre so heavily the vibration ripped the car apart, and nearly Jenson in the process IIRC. I dont think you can miscount that one.

we can omit crashes for every driver.. Everyone on that list has been involved in a accident where they were simply a victim..How many times has Webber botched up the starts knocking down front wings.. Drivers running into the back of other drivers or taking them out during overtaking attempts.. Alonso in Valencia was taken out at the start.... Vettel rammed into Kubica last year.. Jo.V rammed into Montoya, Shumi took out Hill in 94...etc..etc..etc

[Marbles]

:
Could you not develop some kind of "paradigm" - they seem to be popular for all Humanities related areas.

Hey, don't knock paradigm's!

Unlike the physical sciences, with their well behaved atoms and dependable forces, social scientists are stuck dealing with people. Flakey, irrational, peevish people. Theories, much less Laws, are well beyond our capabilities!

With the murder of Homo Economicus, the last of our pretenses toward anything more formal than a paradigm bit the dust. Which is a good thing. World Wars tend to happen whenever we come up with half-baked formal theories and laws. So I'm very happy with the trend toward paradigms and analytical frameworks ;)

[Hairpin]

His front susp exploded at Nurb because he flat spotted his front tyre so heavily the vibration ripped the car apart, and nearly Jenson in the process IIRC. I dont think you can miscount that one.

Flat spots are not included in the stats, neither is Alonso's spin at the start the other race. I am just saying stats are stats. You can prove anything and nothing with them.

[Nustang70]

Stats. I remember Kimi's steering wheel coming lose in his Sauber, his rear wing came off at T1 Hockenheim, his front exploded at Nurburgring and he got his Ferrari full of McLaren while waiting at a red light. You can do that for all the drivers. Not saying the stats is not interesting, just that one should be careful drawing any conclusions from them.

I was waiting for one of you guys to show up. See the OP.

Also, those mechanical failures wouldn't count toward his percentage of crash-induced retirements. Definitely check the OP.

Edited by Nustang70, 13 May 2010 - 02:08.

[krapmeister]

we can omit crashes for every driver.. Everyone on that list has been involved in a accident where they were simply a victim..How many times has Webber botched up the starts knocking down front wings.. Drivers running into the back of other drivers or taking them out during overtaking attempts.. Alonso in Valencia was taken out at the start.... Vettel rammed into Kubica last year.. Jo.V rammed into Montoya, Shumi took out Hill in 94...etc..etc..etc

I'm not sure but I bet its not as many times as you think it is - why don't you do some research and let us know?

[Messi10]

I'm not sure but I bet its not as many times as you think it is - why don't you do some research and let us know?

It happened several times when he raced for Williams and Jaguar..

[Hairpin]

I was waiting for one of you guys to show up. See the OP.

Also, those mechanical failures wouldn't count toward his percentage of crash-induced retirements. Definitely check the OP.

I've been compiling a list of drivers' percentages of retirements caused by either collision, accident, or spinning off (as classified by the FIA).

A crash is always classified an accident, regardless of the reason. In the Nurburgring case Kimi was probably classified as 'Suspension/Accident' and you do not say you omit those. Check your data.

"One of you guys" is pretty unnecessary. Remember that most of the people on this board can not see the difference between a headline and a quote.

[Henrytheeigth]

Both Red Bull drivers well up there. Interesting...

I wonder how Fuji calculated in this. After all that git vettel took out Mark like, well like a git lol

[Pilla]

I'm surprised Webber isn't higher, he seems to have an accident whenever theres a car in front of him.

[Lights]

Don't forget it's only when you retire. You can be in 5 incidents in a race, retire 3 other drivers in the proces, and still finish yourself so you're not classified under 'accident'.

[Onyemaechi]

Scott Speed and Tonio Liuzzi over 20%. This must still stem from their bizare and unfatefull Torro Rosso days.

Well you have to give Adrian Sutil some credits. Kimi Raikkönnen crashed into Adrian Sutil twice in the course of these last 3 years

[Nustang70]

A crash is always classified an accident, regardless of the reason. In the Nurburgring case Kimi was probably classified as 'Suspension/Accident' and you do not say you omit those. Check your data.

Sorry, I didn't count that one because it was listed as "Suspension/Accident" because I didn't know which caused the other. Only ones that were explicitly listed as either "Accident," "Spun Off," "Collision," or "Collision Damage," counted, although I did include one instance of a driver that was DQ'ed for causing an accident. Your other example of the rear wing failure was classified as such by the FIA, so that one didn't get included in my list.

"One of you guys" is pretty unnecessary. Remember that most of the people on this board can not see the difference between a headline and a quote.

I'm not clear what this is supposed to mean. Anyway, I was being facetious, although in the OP I made it clear that these stats were just for amusement, not to be taken as anything definitive.

[Nustang70]

A few more additions (updated back to 1995):

Heidfeld: 8.4%
Villeneuve: 11.0%
Trulli: 12.7%
Fisichella: 13.1%
R. Schumacher: 15.0%
Wurz: 18.8%
de la Rosa: 18.8%
Diniz: 25.5%

I'll add these to the list in the OP.

[undersquare]

A few more additions (updated back to 1995):

Heidfeld: 8.4%
Villeneuve: 11.0%
Trulli: 12.7%
Fisichella: 13.1%
R. Schumacher: 15.0%
Wurz: 18.8%
de la Rosa: 18.8%
Diniz: 25.5%

Sauber must really have had some kind of bust-up with Heidi, to have preferred Pedro. Well I suppose we knew that, this does make it even more glaring though.