50 replies to this topic

[dhill39]

What do you guys think about changes to quali,they keep Q1 and Q2 the same,but for Q3 each driver get a single lap by themselves to set the grid.

[paliyoes]

What do you guys think about changes to quali,they keep Q1 and Q2 the same,but for Q3 each driver get a single lap by themselves to set the grid.

Unfair, the climatology is really random.

[V8 Fireworks]

What do you guys think about changes to quali,they keep Q1 and Q2 the same,but for Q3 each driver get a single lap by themselves to set the grid.

The track will get faster so it will be very unfair.

Removes the TV advantages of 1-lap which is really for the benefit of Sauber, Lotus etc and not for the top 10 who get on tv plenty anyway.

It's a fine and fair idea ... but of course F1 being so sensitive to grip on the track... it will be very difficult for earliest runners to beat the later runners on the faster track.

[Clatter]

What do you guys think about changes to quali,they keep Q1 and Q2 the same,but for Q3 each driver get a single lap by themselves to set the grid.

Why not leave it alone?

[JForce]

WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK ABOUT LEAVING THINGS THE FECK ALONE FOR MORE THAN 5 BLOODY MINUTES

[SeanValen]

WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK ABOUT LEAVING THINGS THE FECK ALONE FOR MORE THAN 5 BLOODY MINUTES

How can you leave alone what does not work.



The quality of Q3 is affected by these things:

In terms of a championship show down, if you have a few drivers going for the title, I think Q3 is over l too soon for the top names, you miss the reply of fast times to each other between gladiators. E.g would Suzuka 2000 qualifying been the same if Mika and Michael only had 8 minutes, there's no build up, no chance of them concentrating and making changes to their car, it's too much of a rush.

Race set up with low fuel does not work, it's a step up from quali with race fuel, but it's not good, because race set up can go different ways for drivers working their compounds and tyres with the race in mind, so is the actual focus on saturday Q3 for qualifying only? I think not, you cannot touch the cars on Sunday race day because you have no warm up. Saturday qualifying is still not seperate from race day decisions, that's my problem with qualifying.

I think the easiest way would be for say the slowest 8 drivers to go out after 30 minutes, get everyone to do a banker, and mostly the top names would survive, less worry about trafffic.

Q1/Q2 is about survival, Q3 is race set up quali, not quali set up quali if get what I mean, so qualifying still isn't what it used to be.



Or to make things even more simple, before 2003, we had great qualifying sessions with the old system that no one had a problem with, and that system always worked, now there has been too many changes to try and out do the initial first system, but still the current qualifying invites randomness and race day decisions to enter the quali day decisions, they are separate days and shouldn't be linked, yence pole position is questioned more in relation to the race. You shouldn't question a pole position, the fastest quali set up for everyone should be the key, not race day set up with quali, it's not qualifying then.


Now that there have been changes, and cars coming out early, the old system only needs a rule where at least one hot lap is done in the first 20 minutes perhaps. All drivers need time to fine tune their cars and not guess set ups and make estimations for race day while their doing their quali set ups, the return of sunday warm up is needed to improve qualifying.

Edited by SeanValen, 17 May 2010 - 23:19.

[Risil]

I'm still not sure I understand why they changed it after 2002. It's only qualifying after all.

[Dragonfly]

We have a fresh example of the wisdom in the "Do not repair something that works" saying. Why do you want to break the current working scheme? It was put together after years of stupid try and error attempts.

[scynaz]

This is the sanest system of qualifying we have had in a long time after getting rid of that fuel burning nonsense, and as a bonus we don't have the 40 minute wait for people to come out any more. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DON'T MESS WITH IT. I am sure it can be made a bit better, but knowing the FIA, they will **** it all up in trying to improve it, so please please please don't give them any ideas.

[SeanValen]

This is the sanest system of qualifying we have had in a long time after getting rid of that fuel burning nonsense, and as a bonus we don't have the 40 minute wait for people to come out any more. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DON'T MESS WITH IT. I am sure it can be made a bit better, but knowing the FIA, they will **** it all up in trying to improve it, so please please please don't give them any ideas.

Fuel burning was bad

Race set up in quali 3 is bascially sunday warm up on Saturday, no need for it, that's why it's silly, as the old system worked best, it's like their's a certain pride with the fia that they don't want to admit mistakes, just like Michael Schumacher's overtaking on Alonso and the green flags, again FIA mistakes, the fans get punished, the FIA rarely actually tell the truth on what is obvious, that's the headach!!!!

[SeanValen]

I'm still not sure I understand why they changed it after 2002. It's only qualifying after all.

Changed because of the panic of a top team/driver running away, a overaction to Schuey and Ferrari winning, so in 2003 they introduced lets REMEMBER, ONE LAP QUALIFYING, 2 sessions, in the first THE CHAMPIONSHIP LEADER COMES OUT FIRST to basicially do his lap on a green track, less grip, be the track sweeper, how is that IN ANY BLOODY WAY SPORTING? Peanalising the team and driver for their hard work, bascially setting up the race and grid to create random uinsporting grid to maybe spice up the race which goes against the actual point of teams testing and working hard to get a advantage by being fast in the most fairest and possible purest of rules which there was never a question raised until 2003.

2003 the worst formula one year for the FIA brains, and were still suffering from those morons who didn't repair what they broke.

They damaged the sport big time in 2003, yes ferrari did well in 2002, the competition like mclaren and williams, renault put on more of a performance in 2003, tyre wars changed things up front, the season was interesting enough without the changes in rules, but the FIA got lucky, because when you change rules everyone has no choice but to watch it play out for interest, wow one lap quali, what's that, lets take a look, it was interesting because it was different, but in the long run it was still a panic move at the time to pray ferrari and schuey wouldn't dominate, but they did in 2004,, there was no need.


THE FIA ARE SOOOOOOOOOOOOO STUPID, Max, and whoever involved, the teams, all these brains, and they can't revert what wasn't broken, it's so stupid. F1 can be so much better that's why it boggles the mind why they can't, it's one of the biggest mysteries of our time, why tinker with such great history, traditions and rules that always worked....

fck yem. :smoking:I've been waiting 7 years for them to go back to how it was pre 2003. Tennis and golf fans don't need to worry about their sport changing like f1 does.

Edited by SeanValen, 17 May 2010 - 23:38.

[George Costanza]

Go back to the old format before 2003.

[mark f1]

I said this in the live forum at the time, Q3 needs to go from a 10min session to a 15min session. At tracks like Bahrain this year, where it was a long lap time, there is not enough time for them to do 2 runs. It was reduced to10min because of the fuel burn issue, which no longer happens.

[ViMaMo]

Lets just leave it alone. No more nonsense on changing of qualifying.

I really dont care about setting the pole on qualifying setup vs race setup. They are doing it on fumes, so fine by me.

Setting up purely for qualifying makes no sense just like the super soft qualifying tires, super powerful fragile qualifying engines. I just dont see the purpose it serves. 1 lap wonder setup that wont be used in the race, lets move on from the old format. It was a yawn sometimes, the old format.

Solution is very simple: Since there is no fuel burn phase anymore, Q3 needs 15min.

Edited by vivian, 18 May 2010 - 02:23.

[Eff One 2002]

I have always thought qualifying should have never been changed from what it was pre-1996. 1 hour and 12 laps on Friday, same on Saturday and the best times from either day determine the grid. That was a fine system that should never have been changed in the first place.

[Alfisti]

The old systekm was ****. Nothing happened for 40 minutes anyway then they all rushed out last minute. THAT'S WHY THEY CHANGED IT!!!

Now we force them to run the whole hour, with no refueling they could change the Q3 session back to 15 minutes I reakon.

[OS X]

Go back to the hour long qualifying with a limit of 12 laps like before. Split the session into three contiguous timed portions of 20 minutes (i.e. no break in between). At the end of timed portion one (20 minutes in) all drivers can now only complete 9 laps in the remaining 40 minutes. If you haven't been out for a run, you have in effect forfeited three laps. At the end of timed portion two (40 minutes) all drivers can now only complete 6 laps in the remaining 20 minutes. Again if you don't use 'em, you lose 'em. Obviously, in the third timed portion, all of the drivers would use up their remaining laps.

This would have the benefit of varying strategies 3 x 4 laps (one run per timed portion) or 4 x 3 laps (1-1-2 for the timed portions).

[Jazza]

I reckon they should just keep it exactly the same as now, but get rid of reseting the time every segment. If you set a fast lap in Q1 it should stay for the whole session. It would actually make Q1 and Q2 valuable. If MW had set his 1:13 lap in Q1 there would have been a great build up to see if anyone could beat it through all of Q2 and Q3.

This year almost every Q1 had the 6 new cars with whoever gets the short straw from the mid pack, while Q3 is basically confirmed to have 2 Ferraris, 2 McLarens, 2 Redbulls, and 2 Mercedes, with the Renult of RK and someone else. Its not exactly a shock who gets in, making both Q1 and Q2 somewhat processional.

Edited by Jazza, 18 May 2010 - 03:57.

[slideways]

No. Leave the current system as it is (maybe some minor tweaks of session length), but sort out the limitations on tyres, gearboxes and engines so the drivers can get some decent track time. We made a huge step in the right direction with the engine and gearbox penalties recently and that needs to be slowly tweaked so that the cost savings stay in place but we see less punishments on the drivers, and more motivation to go out there and provide some entertainment, be it in Free Practice or Qualifying.

[ViMaMo]

Go back to the hour long qualifying with a limit of 12 laps like before. Split the session into three contiguous timed portions of 20 minutes (i.e. no break in between). At the end of timed portion one (20 minutes in) all drivers can now only complete 9 laps in the remaining 40 minutes. If you haven't been out for a run, you have in effect forfeited three laps. At the end of timed portion two (40 minutes) all drivers can now only complete 6 laps in the remaining 20 minutes. Again if you don't use 'em, you lose 'em. Obviously, in the third timed portion, all of the drivers would use up their remaining laps.

This would have the benefit of varying strategies 3 x 4 laps (one run per timed portion) or 4 x 3 laps (1-1-2 for the timed portions).

Problems:
1. Slower cars will hinder faster cars much more
2. In a drying track, teams have very limited laps to compete

The old system wasnt great either
1. Action in the last half hour, while you keep waiting
2. Track is not clear of traffic
3. Same problems as today, too many cars on hot laps, lots of missed action.

I'd try this:
1. Only top 8 go to Q3
2. Make Q3 into 30 min.Q3 split into two sessions.
a.15 min session where drivers get a single lap free of traffic. Order: Slowest to fastest from Q2.
b.15 min session where all 8 cars are free to compete in whatever amt of laps.
3. Best time from the session counts


Im happy with the current system. Although they need to improve the tracking big time.

Edited by vivian, 18 May 2010 - 04:01.

[Atreiu]

No, qualifying has never been so exciting.
Ban parc ferme and bring the warmup back.

[slideways]

They should allow setup changes up to and during qualifying, but the cars go into parc ferme once qualifying is complete.

[Craven Morehead]

WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK ABOUT LEAVING THINGS THE FECK ALONE FOR MORE THAN 5 BLOODY MINUTES

I have to agree with this sentiment

[Clatter]

They should allow setup changes up to and during qualifying, but the cars go into parc ferme once qualifying is complete.

That, and having to start on the tyre they set the time on are the only things I would change, other than that the system works.

I can see no reason why the teams should not be able to make as many setup changes as they like, just mandate that they cannot change components. Best of both worlds then.

[RedBaron]

This is all minor detailing.

Let's get the car regulations perfect so drivers can follow, pass and battle on the limit in a race. The rest is just masturbation.

[pgj]

No. If there is a change to qualifying, I would like to see it return to the free hour format. It gives everyone more test time in race trim.

[teejay]

This is all minor detailing.

Let's get the car regulations perfect so drivers can follow, pass and battle on the limit in a race. The rest is just masturbation.

Amen

[stevewf1]

Draw from a hat for grid positions. Will "spice" up the race. Will save money. That's what we all want - right?

[sherer]

the problem with qualifying is that it works out who is the quickest driver and then lets them start first with the slowest driver last. We than have a race on the Sunday where we expect cars that were slower on the Saturday to suddenly be able to pass faster cars on the Sunday.

The natural progression of F1 and the fact that the teams are now so professional means that this is killing the racing. Yes we can come up with so called gimmicks to muddy up the water but then they don't really work very well either.

Either you have qualifying with boring races or you get rid of it and use a completely random system. The problem with that is you have an hour less to sell to TV companies and advertisers

[noikeee]

WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK ABOUT LEAVING THINGS THE FECK ALONE FOR MORE THAN 5 BLOODY MINUTES

Yeah, pretty much.

I wouldn't be against increasing the length of Q3 to 15 mins though, but I doubt it'd do much. Maybe that would be a good incentive for the teams to always do at least two attempts in Q3, but they're tight on tyres and could also end up doing what they're doing now which is to wait for the very last minute - so then we'd end up with 5 extra minutes or nothing.

The reason why qualifying has been a bit underwhelming this season is because Red Bull has got a car miles faster than the others, also 6 of the 7 places for being knocked out in Q1 are reserved. The format itself is perfect, leave it the **** alone.

[Jazza]

the problem with qualifying is that it works out who is the quickest driver and then lets them start first with the slowest driver last. We than have a race on the Sunday where we expect cars that were slower on the Saturday to suddenly be able to pass faster cars on the Sunday.

The natural progression of F1 and the fact that the teams are now so professional means that this is killing the racing. Yes we can come up with so called gimmicks to muddy up the water but then they don't really work very well either.

Either you have qualifying with boring races or you get rid of it and use a completely random system. The problem with that is you have an hour less to sell to TV companies and advertisers

It doesn't have to be that way. A quick car in qualifying does not always equal a quick car in the race. Get rid of parc ferme and bring back Sunday warm up and it could mix the races up a bit. Even this year Redbull looks faster in qualifying then it does in the race and thats with the cars locked up between sessions.

However, if it doesn't mix it up... fine! Let the best team win no matter how boring it is. Its meant to be competition, not luck.

[noikeee]

It doesn't have to be that way. A quick car in qualifying does not always equal a quick car in the race. Get rid of parc ferme and bring back Sunday warm up and it could mix the races up a bit. Even this year Redbull looks faster in qualifying then it does in the race and thats with the cars locked up between sessions.

However, if it doesn't mix it up... fine! Let the best team win no matter how boring it is. Its meant to be competition, not luck.

[stevvy1986]

I reckon they should just keep it exactly the same as now, but get rid of reseting the time every segment. If you set a fast lap in Q1 it should stay for the whole session. It would actually make Q1 and Q2 valuable. If MW had set his 1:13 lap in Q1 there would have been a great build up to see if anyone could beat it through all of Q2 and Q3.

But then what if it pours down? That'd make Q2 and Q3 a waste of time, and nobody would go out in it.

[Tenmantaylor]

I enjoyed when they did this back in 03 was it? It really added pressure to the driver on track knowing that everyone was watching and there was alot of onboard footage which allowed you to compare driving styles.

By doing this twice (once in reverse order the next day IIRC) and aggregating the two times the problem with track conditions was slightly negated unless it started raining in the middle of one.

[One]

I would like to see tire agreements removed, meaning that any car can start race with any tire.

Besides for Qualify I could imagine giving them the thrid compound... yes pre scribed super soft for all the teams, like two sets per car? Then Q1 team will most definetively runs it on Q1, which makes the 8th car in danger so he would run on Super Soft, and so on...

[Lights]

Don't change it. It's fine.

[Jazza]

But then what if it pours down? That'd make Q2 and Q3 a waste of time, and nobody would go out in it.

True, but how often does that happen? Maybe once or twice a year. Even when it does rain it can just as easily go the other way with a wet track getting dryer.

[Henrytheeigth]

Why it is called qualifying nowadays anyway? It should be called grid lineup or similar, pure idiocy!

Eh unless you think one has to qualify to get into q2 q3 etc lol. then I guess I can't be that fussed...

Edited by Henrytheeigth, 18 May 2010 - 11:55.

[CPR]

Leave it alone!

[finignig]

I reckon they should just keep it exactly the same as now, but get rid of reseting the time every segment. If you set a fast lap in Q1 it should stay for the whole session. It would actually make Q1 and Q2 valuable. If MW had set his 1:13 lap in Q1 there would have been a great build up to see if anyone could beat it through all of Q2 and Q3.

I really like this idea, top teams fighting it out for the perfect lap from top of the hour, will sure give us an amazing build up through all sessions.

[Fastcake]

The current qualifying is the best thing the FIA ever introduced under Max, leave as is please.

[Tenmantaylor]

I really like this idea, top teams fighting it out for the perfect lap from top of the hour, will sure give us an amazing build up through all sessions.

Agreed, thats a pretty good idea but the last thing we want is someone sitting out Q3 because they know they can't or dont have to improve. Q is best when 3/4 cars are on their best lap at the same time as the flag drops.

Edited by Tenmantaylor, 18 May 2010 - 15:13.

[dhill39]

You now what i really miss about qualifying,I remember in the 90s,when driver A would set a fast time,driver B would be in the pits watching waiting for is time to respond,now they just drive around there is no build up.

[Clatter]

You now what i really miss about qualifying,I remember in the 90s,when driver A would set a fast time,driver B would be in the pits watching waiting for is time to respond,now they just drive around there is no build up.

The thing I miss is the teams being allowed to tinker with the car to try and find the extra speed.

[Rubens Hakkamacher]

This is the sanest system of qualifying we have had in a long time after getting rid of that fuel burning nonsense, and as a bonus we don't have the 40 minute wait for people to come out any more.

I concur, it's one thing they've sort of gotten right out of all to the screwed up stuff...

Get rid of parc ferme it would be even better.

[Zakiruz]

I love it the way it currently is. I do however would like to see like an extra part to Q3. The first part of Q3 is the usual 10mins or so of free for all, but straight after you have a bit where each driver does 1 flying lap in turn. It would have a nice build-up.

[Gyan]

In Q3 we should abolish the time limit,and give each driver a 1 lap shot at glory,according to their Q2 times in reverse.Very,very interesting shoot-out then.

[ViMaMo]

In Q3 we should abolish the time limit,and give each driver a 1 lap shot at glory,according to their Q2 times in reverse.Very,very interesting shoot-out then.

1 lap qualifying is the worst idea ever. I shudder the day when FIA thinks about getting it back. Absolutely moronic. Drivers should have freedom to do more laps, and when they want.

[30ft penguin]

1 lap qualifying is the worst idea ever. I shudder the day when FIA thinks about getting it back. Absolutely moronic. Drivers should have freedom to do more laps, and when they want.

Yes, 1 lap qualifying is insanely stupid. The drivers won't have the same track conditions. I absolutely hate any qualifying system which increases the influence luck has on the starting grid, and also any system which messes with the starting order to "improve the show".

[Clatter]

1 lap qualifying is the worst idea ever. I shudder the day when FIA thinks about getting it back. Absolutely moronic. Drivers should have freedom to do more laps, and when they want.

It's also the most boring format to watch, especially if you are trackside.