97 replies to this topic

[Coupe Kawasaki]

I nearly bought one of these in 1977 to race..I have an old TS to work with Any info would be great




That's not mine..this is though



Daisy

Edited by Coupe Kawasaki, 05 July 2010 - 17:32.

[fil2.8]

I nearly bought one of these in 1977 to race..I have an old TS to work with Any info would be great

That's not mine..this is though



Daisy

Looks like one of your better projects , Daisy

[Coupe Kawasaki]

hey you...at least it's been saved from the knackers yard

[fil2.8]

hey you...at least it's been saved from the knackers yard

not yet it 'aint

[Russell Burrows]

I nearly bought one of these in 1977 to race..I have an old TS to work with Any info would be great




That's not mine..this is though



Daisy

Looks the business David, what did they do to them to make them go? There was an Aussie who rode one of those, I think for Vic Camp, by the name of....Gregg Bailey was it? who was sadly killed around 77? Anyone remember him?

[Coupe Kawasaki]

I have no knowledge on these..maybe Mark Carkeek rode one along with Chas Blay?..anyway it just fired up amazingly
From what I can gather it used the standard TS250 frame and porting was similar to a T500. I've got wheels and forks etc. Cross reference bearings and stuff, cannibalize what I've got I suppose Russ


Daisy

Edited by Coupe Kawasaki, 05 July 2010 - 18:14.

[picblanc]

Looks the business David, what did they do to them to make them go? There was an Aussie who rode one of those, I think for Vic Camp, by the name of....Gregg Bailey was it? who was sadly killed around 77? Anyone remember him?

Yes sadly died a few days after crashing at the very first Donington Park meeting at the newly opened circuit.

[Robin127]

I have no knowledge on these..maybe Mark Carkeek rode one along with Chas Blay?..anyway it just fired up amazingly
From what I can gather it used the standard TS250 frame and porting was similar to a T500. I've got wheels and forks etc. Cross reference bearings and stuff, cannibalize what I've got I suppose Russ


Daisy

Mark Carkeek rode Andy Barr's YZ based bike and I'm pretty certain that Chas Blay rode a twin cylinder Suzuki. While most clubs ran a single cylinder 250 class the Southern Sixty Seven Club allowed twins as long as it wasn't a Yamaha and I raced against Chas regularly in those races.

Vernon Glashier raced a TS based 250 although I'm not too sure whether his was a Vic Camp bike.

[Coupe Kawasaki]

Thanks for that Robin I'll be finding a bit out about them with some investigation though it looks an easy build. Ragged Edge have a seat unit same as above at a reasonable price

[Herr Wankel]

Looks the business David, what did they do to them to make them go? There was an Aussie who rode one of those, I think for Vic Camp, by the name of....Gregg Bailey was it? who was sadly killed around 77? Anyone remember him?

Russell,I think Greg Bailey was killed at the very 1st Donnington meeting,riding the Vic Camp TS250
Atb HW

[picblanc]

Russell,I think Greg Bailey was killed at the very 1st Donnington meeting,riding the Vic Camp TS250
Atb HW

Err post #7 HW WAKE UP!!

[Herr Wankel]

Err post #7 HW WAKE UP!!

Ere,leave it out,I'm jet lagged
HW

[picblanc]

Ere,leave it out,I'm jet lagged
HW

I'm P***ed

[fil2.8]

I'm P***ed

No , not you , , makes a change

[Steve O'Brien]

I started racing on a Vic Camp 250 in 1984 at Three Sisters great little bike I had the bike for about 4 or 5 years I was Northwest ACU 250 single cyl champ on it in 87 or 88 mine had a 2mm spacer fitted between the barrel and crankcases it was there when I got the bike, it was pretty quick bike I managed to beat Bill Swallow on it at Three Sisters on his 500 Macthless I do have loads of photo's of it but no scanner.

[Herr Wankel]

I started racing on a Vic Camp 250 in 1984 at Three Sisters great little bike I had the bike for about 4 or 5 years I was Northwest ACU 250 single cyl champ on it in 87 or 88 mine had a 2mm spacer fitted between the barrel and crankcases it was there when I got the bike, it was pretty quick bike I managed to beat Bill Swallow on it at Three Sisters on his 500 Macthless I do have loads of photo's of it but no scanner.

Must have pedaled hard to beat Bill,Steve
HW

[Steve O'Brien]

Must have pedaled hard to beat Bill,Steve
HW

I did,I have a photo somewhere of him stuck right up my ar-e

[fil2.8]

Came across this the other day








Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[Robin127]

Came across this the other day








Uploaded with ImageShack.us

So Chas did ride a single as well. Actually the more I think about it I do remember him having two bikes.

[Coupe Kawasaki]

Thanks for the info particularly on the spacer Steve ...that was done on some of the GT750s too. I reckon this could be a good competitive bike and cheap too

I don't like that SP370 thing though Phil



Daisy

[Herr Wankel]

Thanks for that Robin I'll be finding a bit out about them with some investigation though it looks an easy build. Ragged Edge have a seat unit same as above at a reasonable price

Start scouring the globe for barrels and pistons now David
HW

[fil2.8]

I don't like that SP370 thing though Phil



Daisy

Oh , Daisy , my globe-trotting chump , , what's wrong with it , prey ???

[Coupe Kawasaki]

It's a road TS250 based bike Andy, pretty easy to get those cylinders needing a bore job, pistons shouldn't be a problem.. I think but thanks for reminding me to keep an eye open mate

[Russell Burrows]

[Coupe Kawasaki]

I was wondering when we'd get one of the Dukes up There were a lot of Duke singles about on the club scene back then What was the difference between a Vic Camp Ducati and an over the counter one?

[Russell Burrows]

I was wondering when we'd get one of the Dukes up There were a lot of Duke singles about on the club scene back then What was the difference between a Vic Camp Ducati and an over the counter one?

Camp modified road going Dukes to order from around the mid sixties to early seventies. I'm no expert on this, but I think I remember learning from him (he gave me these pics) that there wasn't huge amounts done to them - perhaps a lumpy cam and lots of polishing? His own bikes ridden by blokes such as Paul Smart and Alan Dunscombe must have been fairly special though as they were relatively quick. I think Smartie was using one in GP's until about '69 or perhaps even '70?. I think too he had some help from the factory. Spagiarri's factory bike was pretty successful in the late sixties as I think I remember him giving Passolini's Bennelli some hurry up somewhere or other. The late Dennis Rapley, who was a regular on here, bought a Mach I based, ex Smart bike from Vic, some pics of which should still be here.

[Coupe Kawasaki]

Oh , Daisy , my globe-trotting chump , , what's wrong with it , prey ???

Because you'd have to spend a fortune to get that to go quick at all and it's outside any sensible class to ride it in

[fil2.8]

Because you'd have to spend a fortune to get that to go quick at all and it's outside any sensible class to ride it in

Exactly !!! perfect for you !!!!

[Coupe Kawasaki]

Listen mate...I know how to make gaskets out of cornflake packets...giss a job..go on gissit

[fil2.8]

Listen mate...I know how to make gaskets out of cornflake packets...giss a job..go on gissit

Is there no beginning to your talents ???

[Coupe Kawasaki]

chain links out of tent pegs and guy rope clips eh?

[Herr Wankel]

It's a road TS250 based bike Andy, pretty easy to get those cylinders needing a bore job, pistons shouldn't be a problem.. I think but thanks for reminding me to keep an eye open mate

Is it on contact breakers David?If so,that would a good starting point for your tuning regime (i.e. get rid of em) Theres still a class at Darley for 250 singles although its a long way for you to travel
HW

[fil2.8]

Is it on contact breakers David?If so,that would a good starting point for your tuning regime (i.e. get rid of em) Theres still a class at Darley for 250 singles although its a long way for you to travel
HW

Don't tempt him HW

[Coupe Kawasaki]

Is it on contact breakers David?If so,that would a good starting point for your tuning regime (i.e. get rid of em) Theres still a class at Darley for 250 singles although its a long way for you to travel
HW

Yes it is so that's a good idea...though we'll see how we get on with points at first..(cheapskate eh? ) I think there's some class here too as there are a few Yamaha singles and stuff running
I just checked ebay and there's loads of pistons and a few cylinders too. I'd say it'd be an easy bike to build and race over there too!


Daisy

[Steve O'Brien]

Yes it is so that's a good idea...though we'll see how we get on with points at first..(cheapskate eh? ) I think there's some class here too as there are a few Yamaha singles and stuff running
I just checked ebay and there's loads of pistons and a few cylinders too. I'd say it'd be an easy bike to build and race over there too!


Daisy

David check your pm's

[Steve O'Brien]

My TS did not have points I dont know if it had been changed at some time or maybe they started putting the ignition system off the mx bikes on the later models.

Edited by Steve O'Brien, 11 July 2010 - 08:07.

[Herr Wankel]

My TS did not have points I dont know if it had been changed at some time or maybe they started putting the ignition system off the mx bikes on the later models.

Apparently they use the TS250 pistons in Lambretta 225cc conversions for racing,so good ones should be available.Is it ready yet David?
HW

[Ray Oldam]

Russell,

Lovely photo of a lovely bike there Russell!! ( That centre stand would have to go before using it on a track though! ) As mentioned, there were a lot of these around in the mid 70's. Jerry Fiford was very quick on one, and I can remember North Gloucester staging a Ducati singles race, I think it was in 75. My brother Dennis got a third in it on the Desmo 250 roadbike we used to share - he was absolutely flying on it, but looked barely in control a lot of the time. We both raced it over two seasons, taking turns in different classes- God knows how many racing miles the thing did. We just put fuel and oil in it, and every 6 meetings or so one of us would take the cylinder head up to Vic Camp to re-set the valve clearances. It was a shimming job and quite fiddly. We tried to do it ourselves first, and he would invariably have to have another go as we either got them too tight or too slack!!

I have fond memories of the old yellow Desmo. It only ever failed to finish one race, and then only because the a swinging arm pin pinch bolt came loose- the pin worked its way out far enough to stop Dennis changing gear and he had to pull in, thankfully with an inch or so of pin still in the other side. I must get a scanner sorted out and put some more photos on here, but here's one with yours truly on it at National Championship round at Mallory - needless to say I was thrashed by all the Yamahas!! Photo courtesy of Phil Masters



Alll the best.

Ray

Edited by Ray Oldam, 11 July 2010 - 16:53.

[Coupe Kawasaki]

David check your pm's

Sorry Steve...just got up I'll check right now



Smashing photo Ray I remember being T-Boned by a Red Ducati in practice at Wellesbourne and the paddock was full of them when I went to find the nutter My 400 Kwak was slightly quicker on the straight but was heavier and didn't stop as well though it was better than the T500s and H1s through the corners
You had to dodge the gravel and potholes on that place


David

Edited by Coupe Kawasaki, 11 July 2010 - 15:40.

[Ray Oldam]

David,

Oh dear! It wasn't one of us guv!! - ours was in a nice 'see you coming miles away' yellow! I never raced at Wellesbourne but Dennis did a few meetings there, and had the same comments as you. Your guy must have got it badly wrong - the Ducati handling was brilliant, they just went round on rails, and we reckoned you had to really abuse them to actually fall off though I managed it a couple of times! Just a pity they weren't a little quicker though.

Our bike was road registered (PCE 28M as I remember!), and our sponsor Stafford Coulson added it to his insurance, saying he 'might just need to test it out now and again'. Quite a few times we got down to the workshop to find the door open, his road bike still there, but a space where the Ducati should have been and race numbers on the bench (usually on nice sunny Saturdays) We would then have to hang around for an hour or two until he had finished having fun and brought it back!

All the best.

Ray

[Coupe Kawasaki]

I think the testing on the roads could be as much fun as racing the beasties I just like messing about with old bikes so hopefully we shall have a few years fun...I just hope my son wants to race again out here..I think he's getting a bit disillusioned with the cost of going to University and working in a service industry. (Whatever happened to 'hands on work'? ) Maybe he'll come and work with me sometime . We live in hope


Nice one Ray


Daisy

[mba21]

I think the testing on the roads could be as much fun as racing the beasties I just like messing about with old bikes so hopefully we shall have a few years fun...I just hope my son wants to race again out here..I think he's getting a bit disillusioned with the cost of going to University and working in a service industry. (Whatever happened to 'hands on work'? ) Maybe he'll come and work with me sometime . We live in hope


Nice one Ray


Daisy

You work then daisy. ? .................

[Ray Oldam]

Daisy,

We had a nice little road circuit we used for runs out with the Ducati - Emsworth-South Harting-Lavant and back home again, but we used it just to dial back in to the bike before a meeting. To be honest I much preferred it when everyone was going the same way!! Dennis did once take a TZ out in the van at 5am to test it on the Tangmere bypass near Chichester, where he could get flat out in top! Thinking ahead, he and his mate had left the ramp in place so he could ride it straight back into the van. Just as well - they were packing up smartish when, not the police, but the local gypsies turned up to complain about the noise and they had to make a hurried getaway!!

Hope your lad wants to come back and give you a hand sometime, I'm sure that would be fun. Has he raced over there already then?

Here's a link to a road test I found of the Desmo:



That takes me back!

All the best

Ray

Edited by Ray Oldam, 11 July 2010 - 21:16.

[Coupe Kawasaki]

Good stuff Ray My friend Tim Lee had a 350 Mk III which he liked after his T250 hustler though he had a lot of trouble with the rear wheel as the spokes kept breaking, think he had it replaced under warranty twice but he liked it though he had a Trident after that. He worked for Lunn Poly the travel agent as a courier delivering urgent tickets so they provided the bike for him

My lad Chris hasn't raced since a huge off at Croft in '02 and he hadn't recovered properly by the time we moved here in 2004 and we've taken a few years to get sorted out. He'd just got on the pace as well and it was his first ride on a TZ250


Here's a pic of him chasing Dave Chandler (on the TZ he crashed a few weeks later)..at least the bike is an '89 so it's not too out of place here



This is Pre-Edwinas too...he thinks Mallory is pretty stupid too now, his run into the Esses was a favourite place to pass the quicker bikes on the brakes, you can't do that now.


Daisy

Edited by Coupe Kawasaki, 12 July 2010 - 13:24.

[jaybee49]

A Vic Camp Ducati won a 350cc 'Stars of Tomorrow' race at Brands ridden by Alan Dunscombe and I came fourth on my 7R Metisse, David.

Bugga. I asked my bro to loan me one of his Seeley things and I was confident on winning it, but he did not want to play ball at the time. To make it even more difficult for me he suggested to sort out my 'rear chatter' handling problems (specially around Paddock Bend ) to turn my rear Girling Shocks upside down which was not a good idea in hindsight..

Edited by jaybee49, 13 July 2010 - 08:35.

[Ray Oldam]

Daisy,

Nice pic from Mallory - your lad looks to have been quite handy on the TZ - obviously not hanging about and still with his bib on too! I reckon looking at that photo, and the one of the Ducati, he and I are almost on the same piece of tarmac at the Esses, but separated by a good 27 years!! Sorry to hear about his fall at Croft, but hope he's fully recovered now.

I have to say when I see Mallory on the TV these days it hardly looks like the same circuit. I was always a little bit worried by the place back in the seventies. Run off was definitely in short supply back then, with plenty of things to hit if you got it wrong. That has definitely improved, but now it looks like a constant chicane all the way round!

All the best.

Ray

Edited by Ray Oldam, 12 July 2010 - 22:30.

[Coupe Kawasaki]

Chris is about to go past the TZ on the 55 hp KR1S Ray Dave Chandler was back in a bib like I was after years not riding I think...he's on the TZ Chris was 17 then
I hit the tyre wall after highsiding going into the Esses on my first lap on my first practice...Austin Hockley (didn't know who it was at the time ) braked after screaming past on a TZ 350 on the back straight and I didn't so I fell off
Did 40 laps after that until the plastic screw in level came out of the oil tank and I nearly did it again Anyway, I told the boss I'd have two days off as I was going to crash.


Hi there Jim Nice to see you back after your trip to the Land of Greengrass I had a set of Girling Gassers on my KH400 11/2 " longer for the clearance. They were really good...I think they're Hagon now? I bet your shocks didn't have adjustable damping either did they? These youngsters don't know what some of the animals we rode were like



Daisy

[Russell Burrows]

Yeah, neat looking things. Big old Dell Orto? there too. I remember thinking of buying one and going to his shop to discuss it. Tony Nash was pretty quick on a similar (looking) bike, although I seem to remember my old 7R had the legs on his down the long straight at Snetterton. Mention of Alan Dunscombe reminds me of watching a race from that little grandstand that used to be near Paddock at Brands. In a race that probably consisted almost entirely of strokers, he was up front in the first gaggle and riding his nuts off on the corners, particular at Paddock, to stay there. Can't recall the eventual outcome, but I distinctly remember the booming engine note of the little Duke amongst the massed screaming ring a ding of the strokers and little Alan, all guts and determination, staying right with them.

[Rennmax]

Hi Russ, any idea of power output, weight etc ? There were offered as 250 and/or 350, but I faintly remember that Bruno Spaggiari raced a 450 version as well. Already Desmo engines then or based on the (non Desmo) Mach 1 ? Thanks

[Russell Burrows]

Hi Russ, any idea of power output, weight etc ? There were offered as 250 and/or 350, but I faintly remember that Bruno Spaggiari raced a 450 version as well. Already Desmo engines then or based on the (non Desmo) Mach 1 ? Thanks

Hi Renn, fraid I don't recall too much about them on the grunt front. The bike pictured though is a 1970 MK 3 desmo, a 350 I think. Yeah, 250, 350 and a bit later 450. Some of the big engined bikes seemed to be around and going ok in 500 races well into the seventies.