30 replies to this topic

[The RedBaron]

An old topic I guess -

Schumacher: Senna was my hero


'Competing on the level as Senna means a lot to me'


Formula 1 World Champion Michael Schumacher has spoken about his feelings towards the late Ayrton Senna, whose tally of 41 grand prix wins he surpassed this season.

The German, whose ice-cool demeanour cracked in the post-race interview when he equalled Senna's record at Monza, said it was special to be regarded in the same class as his childhood hero.

"He was my idol," said Schumacher on the BBC's Sports Personality of the Year programme. "I was 10-years-old, I saw him racing go karts and I thought, 'who's that guy being so fast?' Driving in the way he did and overtaking in the way he did, I felt, when I was 10, that he was something special. There's probably only one statistic that counts after the championship, and that's how many victories you have. Competing on the level of a person like Senna, that means a lot to me."

Schumacher's third world championship also equals Senna's tally of titles, but he believes winning it for Ferrari is another reason to be proud: "The words to explain what is Ferrari is as difficult as to say what my emotions were when I won finally. As a racing driver there are certain dreams of what you can achieve - here, my dream has come true."

Although his brother Ralf has been critical of young drivers like Kimi Raikkonen coming straight into F1 from the lower categories, Michael has no problem with the arrival of the likes of Jenson Button on the Grand Prix grid, despite his lack of experience.

"People were very critical when they heard Mr Button is arriving in F1 without experience of Formula 3000," he said. "I am always of the opinion that if somebody is able to get in the car and immediately is fast, and doesn't crash basically, then he has the right to be in Formula 1. I think he has the ability and talent to do it, given time, and then we'll see."

Schumacher also talked about David Coulthard's near-death experience in a plane crash in May. He thinks the Scot became mentally stronger after the tragic accident, which claimed the lives of both pilots, and admitted DC was a thorn in his side at times.

"Certain things in life may give you a boost," added Schumacher, who himself came back strongly after breaking his leg in a big crash at Silverstone in 1999. "After this, knowing he survived, maybe it gave him even more confidence. He gave me a tough run at quite a lot of races."

[Frans MSH]

.[p][Edited by Frans MSH on 12-11-2000]

[magic]

at last someone who has an opinion on senna after having seen him drive.

great insight, and at least something i and ms agree upon.

too bad ms wasn't able to fight senna in '94'95'96'97'98'99'00.

too bad for us fanz, too good for ms's sleep ans record.
cannot blame ms though.
after monza pressconference i've got less of a problem with ms.
pity that some of ms's fans don't listen to his words.

daer ms fans, ms admired senna and nowadays respects mh.

[The RedBaron]

No one ever disputed that Senna wasn't a great driver and one the best ever, even if at the time I was a Prost fan.
Maybe MS followed his idol too closely and copied some of Senna's more dubious tactics....shame for both great drivers that there image will always be somewhat tarnished. Prost wasn't an angel either!.

[p][Edited by Andy on 12-12-2000]

[t@nk_girl]

I pretty much like Shueys comments about relatively 'inexperienced' young drivers in F1. It makes sense. True champions are not afraid of real competition and oppose protectionism which isn't based on real concerns.



note: I said something nice about MS

t@nk_girl[p][Edited by Andy on 12-12-2000]

[t@nk_girl]

The post was about the Shuey interview, which I liked. Good statements there. I'm not exactly his biggest fan, but he was good in this one.

Maybe we should get back to F1 and Shuey

peace,

t@nk_girl

[Harald]

Hello RedBaron

'Birds of a feather flock together.' In this case, one eagle noticed - and respected - another.

I have read in three places now that, during Brazilian GP weekend, Michael goes alone to Senna's grave and cries while he is there. Sort of reminds me - just a wee bit - of Alexander the Great, supposedly crying because he had no worlds left to conquer.

In Michael's case, I think he genuinely thinks he will just never know how well he measured, or eventually would have measured, up to Ayrton. As shall none of us. And, once Button, Heidfel, Montoya or Raikkonen start us talking about Michael in the past tense, the way we talk about Senna now, maybe that is as it should be.

I continue to suspect, though, that, like Senna and other great drivers before him, half the time Michael is 'racing' Michael and no one else. His growing respect for Daddy ;) Hakkinen is, I submit, developing from the fact that he almost always has to race Mika on the track the way he is racing Michael Schumacher in his head.

[In eight different places in his book on competition driving, Senna - like Fangion and Stewart before him - emphasizes that, ultimately, the only standard you can really measure yourself by is the one you set for yourself.]

At some point, for champions like Michael and Ayrton, there are only your own standards and those of the up-and-coming champions behind you anyway.

As someone who still tends to rank Alain as without question a peer of either Michael or Ayrton, I will be interested to see what happens if Michael wins a fourth title and when he wins his 52d GP, since that standard will probably be standing somewhere in the paddock watching him surpass him. [And it is Alain I plagiarized all of 1999 when I quoted him that 'Michael still has work to do in F1. He cannot leave yet.']

The Faithless Elector
DC

[senninha]

FINALLY, I read a MS fan say something good about AS.

The problem is that MS fan is ... MS !

As I said before, I didn't like MS because Mercedes stolen Moreno's unic chance in F1. Moreno is the 2nd most well liked brazilian driver ever.

But, he gained my admiration due his achievements. In reallity, his attitudes makes me remember Senna's on his F1 times. For that reason I believe MS is saiyng the truth about beeing fan/like Senna.

MS is better than some of his fans. Now, I can separate MS from these fans. Some fan's attitudes makes people(me, specially) dislike the driver. JV is the best example, nowdays.

[Nikolas Garth]

Senninha,
I was a Senna fan before he died, then I switched to Schumi.

I was quite surprised when I got on the internet that there aren't more people who were fans of both. For sure there are a lot of people who did support Senna, then Schumi, but it appears that the Prost fans have en mass switched their allegances to Schumi.

With Schumi rising to the top in the year Senna died, perhaps the Senna fans feel that to support Schumi is being disloyal to Aryton??

[westendorf]

Nick, that's exactly right! I couldn't be a Michael fan because he was The Great Senna's rival [post Prost] I've grown to accept him and having growing respect for him but I will always be more of a Ferrari fan than a MS fan. ~GFW~

[Nikolas Garth]

Westendorf,
Schumi reminds me of Senna, so the switch seemed very logical and natural to me.

[Samurai]

Nik....


They're worlds apart....

[Frans MSH]

yeah Nik, there are no simularity's in sportmanship terms.

[Nikolas Garth]

Originally posted by Frans MSH
yeah Nik, there are no simularity's in sportmanship terms.

Frans,
That's some of the greatest similarity.

[Frans MSH]

.

[magic]

for me it's a bit different.

first there was lauda.
lauda was good.
prost killed lauda.
and bored us to death.
so i was not a prostfan.

enter senna.
senna made things happen.
in a toleman against prost, mansell, piquet, rosberg, lauda.
all wdc's driving the topcars.
in the end senna beat 'm all.
including the best driver of all time, prost, in equal cars.
senna king of his generation.

enter ms.
steps directly into a top 3 car.
ms starts to beat piquet.
piquet is kicked out.
mansell goes carting.
prost retires.
only senna left for ms to challenge.

ms can focus on senna.
backed up by brawn, byrne, briatore, walkingshaw and ford zetec.
the williams '94 was a lemon.
senna has bad luck.
senna dies.

it took senna a decade to reach the top.
fighting bad cars and teammates like prost.

before the fight for supremacy between senna and schumacher had started, it was already over.

only second driver hill, rookie dc and mh in a rotten mac
challenging ms, jv still a rookiecarter.

as soon as jv and mh have decent rides ms starts losing wdc's.

i'm not impressed and waiting for a new prost/senna to challenge ms in equal cars.

and all the while ms is left alone to break senna and prost's records.

i'm afraid that when the kimis and buttons are on song, ms is already out with all the silverware.

man, i hate to see this all happening in front of my eyes.

only ms's monza breakdown is a sign ms too realises how lucky he has been that senna wasn't around to stop him.

[Samurai]

amen to that, magic.

[DJS]

I think that Michael really came of age in the 1993 season. If the Williams team was removed from the results, then Michael would have won 7 GPs that year... As opposed to the single victory he did manage.

[Frans MSH]

DJS, dUh

Let's remove half the field, who won then?

[DJS]

Originally posted by Frans MSH
DJS, dUh

Let's remove half the field, who won then?

Which half? front or rear?

That was merely to indicate that Schumacher proved to be consistantly the best 'other' driver that year (ie NOT Senna or Prost).

[The RedBaron]

The very first guy i rooted for in F1 was Jochen Rindt...he died, the next person to grab my attention was Nikki Lauda....I followed him to the day he retired... a little lull appeared as I struggled to find a new favourite....I grew to like and then support Alain Prost (also had a soft spot for Nigel Mansell too).....in walks Michael Schumacher and I've supported him ever since.

Who will I follow after Michael retires? Currently it would either be Ralf or Trulli.

As far as the comments from the 3 bandidos (Samurai, Frans & magic) -thank god that many..many millions of F1 fans don't share your warped views.

Like him or hate him you have to respect the abilities of the current World's number 1 driver. I had to bite a similar bullet when Senna was racing......I didn't like him at all, wanted him to lose to anybody & everybody...but I accepted his greatness, his awesome driving skills, his speed and his competitiveness. That's the difference between an honest F1 fan and 3 looney tunes!

[Frans MSH]

oooops
[p][Edited by Frans MSH on 12-12-2000]

[The RedBaron]

So Senna's driving skills were psycho were they? I beg to differ and probably most of this BB would to. [p][Edited by Andy on 12-12-2000]

[magic]

Like him or hate him you have to respect the abilities of the current World's number 1 driver. I have to bite a similar bullet now ms is racing......I didn't like him at all, wanted him to lose to anybody & everybody...but I accepted his greatness, his awesome driving skills, his speed and his competitiveness.

where's the difference between a F1 fan and a bit confused ms-fan?

[The RedBaron]

magic, when you learn to read properly, you'll know what I meant....that paragraph was referring to the driver I disliked...Senna.[p][Edited by Andy on 12-12-2000]

[Frans MSH]

What magic posted is what I thought to have read.

Okay, stupid!! [ from me ]
[p][Edited by Andy on 12-12-2000]

[magic]

redbaron.

relax.

try not to get emotional.

or personal.

i dislike ms, but admit that of the current crop he's probably the best package.

ms admired senna, senna respected ms.

i liked senna.
you like ms.

i respect the skills of ms.
you respected the skills of senna.

i will not force you to like senna.
stop forcing me to like ms.

plain enough for ya?

[The RedBaron]

Now its clear!

[Harald]

Bom dia Senninha:

I consider myself an admirer of Ayrton's immense achievements in F1. I do however, tend to lump Alain Prost and, as his own achievements increase, Michael in the same league with Ayrton, Fangio, Lauda and, perhaps, Jackie Stewart, who certainly would have won one, and perhaps might have won two, more titles had he not - IMHO - retired somewhat prematurely.

In the case of each of these drivers, something fundamental in F1 today is what it is because of a major redefinition of the sport achieved by one of these drivers. I readily concede, on this website anyway, that there is a pretty substantial consensus - which I only partly share - that Ayrton probably redefined more of the sport, more dramatically, than any other one driver.

[Although the advent of pit stops probably has diminished what to me should be a major, defining contribution that Alain would otherwise be given more historical credit for: winning races in some pretty sick cars and finishing races in cars that his peers - including Senna - probably wouldn't have lasted the race in.

[Anyway, I said I only partly share that consensus, because I tend to except Fangio from this historical verdict about Ayrton. I would suggest that winning four titles in a row is a pretty big redefinition, especially since no one else has come close to repeating the feat since then.]

But, all that said, Ayrton was the dominant figure of his generation and, partly because of his tragic death and when it happened, Michael is the dominant figure of his generation. He clearly seems genuinely frustrated that Ayrton did not live to provide the only benchmark that Michael himself seems willing to really be evaluated by. (Which probably explains why he, again, has stated that he expects to be long gone from F1 before anything like an objective assessment of his achievements will be possible. Something I completely agree with.)

In any case, I would at least like to think I was a fan of Ayrton's, although I found some of his behavior on the track as problematic, controversial and, at times, downright boorish as I find some of Michael's 'attacks' of poor judgement. I suppose I can say of both these great drivers what Sir Stirling Moss said of Michael:

I am not under any intellectual strain to abhor Michael's {and Ayrton's} antics on the track while, at the same, time admiring, revelling in really, [their] superb skill once [they are] in the car.

Até amanhã

The Faithless Elector
DC[p][Edited by Harald on 12-12-2000]

[Andy]

Now then, if we could all just stick to the topic at hand and stop bashing the hell out of eash other, the rest of the members here may actual enjoy reading and adding to this thread!

For those of you who do not know what I am talking about, please ignore this post and continue on. For the rest of you, you will notice some 'editing' has been done to this thread, please keep it on track from here on.

Thank you,

Andy.

[senninha]

Originally posted by Nikolas Garth
Senninha,
I was a Senna fan before he died, then I switched to Schumi.

I was quite surprised when I got on the internet that there aren't more people who were fans of both. For sure there are a lot of people who did support Senna, then Schumi, but it appears that the Prost fans have en mass switched their allegances to Schumi.

With Schumi rising to the top in the year Senna died, perhaps the Senna fans feel that to support Schumi is being disloyal to Aryton??

No, i think that's not the main trouble.

I think the lack of good drivers after Senna's death make Senna's fans find everything so unfair, easy for MS. Senna batlled with Prost, Piquet, Mansell and Schumacher. Schumacher has only Damon Hill (argh)!

Normal attitude - support the weak. So, i supported Hill and Villeuneve. You can add, in my case, I don't like Ferrari. Until MH appear, MS was so ahead ...

And MS fans implying AS death has some to do with MS's pressure on him sicken AS's fans.

I know it's normal, in order to increase his idol, to compare with Senna, but it AS's fans didn't accept.