43 replies to this topic

[Japan Time]

I saw yesterday night the Ayrton Senna movie (I was invited by
F1 Sokuho, a Japanese F1 magazine, for the Premiere in Tokyo).

Very emotional, especially as they used the actual Japanese TV
footage for death's announcement - many people started to cry
around me.

A tad bit biased towards Prost, who is primarily presented as a
political animal more than an accomplished sportsman... Shame !

A few things missing: "that" 1st lap in Donington Park in 1993, his
in-board greetings to Prost during warm-up at Imola in 1994. No
interview of Berger, even though they were close friends...

Still, a great, intense 1 hour and 48 minutes watch. I liked it a lot.
Please give me your thoughts once you have seen it.

[Craven Morehead]

I am jealous over here on the other side of the globe..

Edited by Craven Morehead, 02 October 2010 - 02:32.

[klyster]

Thanks for the info, I can't wait to see this.

[nordschleife]

A tad bit biased towards Prost, who is primarily presented as a
political animal more than an accomplished sportsman... Shame !

I knew it! Disgusting! And I'll bet Senna himself would say as much.
Their bias diminishes their work.

[IMOA]

How understandable is the japanese version for someone who has very limited japanese and no portuguese?

[Polle]

I knew it! Disgusting! And I'll bet Senna himself would say as much.
Their bias diminishes their work.

YES! DAMN those people who share a different opinion to you!

[kissTheApex]

I am jealous over here on the other side of the globe..

So am I. Very very jealous as I don't think it will ever hit the movie theaters here in the US. Most probably I'll have to wait for the DVD release a year after the release

[fastlegs]

There already is a thread on this topic.

http://forums.autosp...;hl=senna movie

[Japan Time]

How understandable is the japanese version for someone who has very limited japanese and no portuguese?

The movie contains at least some footage in English, Brasilian,
French, Japanese - and probably a few other languages - but
it is subtiltled, no worries...

[Japan Time]

There already is a thread on this topic.

http://forums.autosp...;hl=senna movie

Thanks for your contribution.

I understand - but I was actually interested in getting the reviews
of people after they see it. The other thread is kind of speculative
and I believed the whole thing (arguably the 1st serious F1-related
stuff broadcasted in cinemas since John Frankenheimer's 1966 film)
was exceptional enough to have 2 threads...

If this is a problem, then the Mods can of course decide to merge
this with the existing thread - no problem with that.

[IMOA]

The movie contains at least some footage in English, Brasilian,
French, Japanese - and probably a few other languages - but
it is subtiltled, no worries...

Subtitled in English even for the version being shown in japan? I'm there for the race this weekend so I'm just trying to decide how much effort I need to put into finding a theatre where its showing.

[Bunchies]

This isn't about the movie but...could you elaborate on the general attitude of Japanese people towards Ayrton Senna? How do they see him and his life? I was always under the impression that he was highly revered. Does this tend to be universal or is there a very clear split between Japanese Senna supporters and those who look at him in another light?

[Reinmuster]

When is worldwide opening?


Not sure if my country will show it.

[Japan Time]

This isn't about the movie but...could you elaborate on the general attitude of Japanese people towards Ayrton Senna? How do they see him and his life? I was always under the impression that he was highly revered. Does this tend to be universal or is there a very clear split between Japanese Senna supporters and those who look at him in another light?

Yes, you are so right: there has always been something
extremely "special" between Senna and Japan. A sort of
vivid, fervent devotion towards him. I have not seen this
anywhere else, and fail to find any rationale behind it.

Do not bother to discuss Senna's antics and dirty driving
here in Japan - you will just get (politely) rebuffed.

At the peak of the Senna-Prost antagonism at McLaren in
1989, Soichiro Honda (head of the eponymous company)
made no secret of his unrestricted preference for Senna.

Maybe Senna was the Last Samurai ?

[Japan Time]

Subtitled in English even for the version being shown in japan? I'm there for the race this weekend so I'm just trying to decide how much effort I need to put into finding a theatre where its showing.

Sorry, I now realise it was actually subtitled in Japanese...
I guess you can watch it anyway, you will understand what
they are talking about without any difficulty.

Will you be staying in Tokyo ?

[Lifew12]

Yes, you are so right: there has always been something
extremely "special" between Senna and Japan. A sort of
vivid, fervent devotion towards him. I have not seen this
anywhere else....

You might find it in Brazil.

[man]

Sports/Sports personalities and films just don't mix. I just don't see how Senna's life is worthy of a film.

To sum up he was a guy that was obsessed with racing, turned out to be pretty good at it, was a bad loser and his rivals didn't like him because of it. End of story.

[as65p]

Sports/Sports personalities and films just don't mix. I just don't see how Senna's life is worthy of a film.

To sum up he was a guy that was obsessed with racing, turned out to be pretty good at it, was a bad loser and his rivals didn't like him because of it. End of story.

Racing itself certainly doesn't qualify as "worthy" in the grand scheme of things. Let alone talking about it for hours on end. Yet here we all are...

[IMOA]

Sorry, I now realise it was actually subtitled in Japanese...
I guess you can watch it anyway, you will understand what
they are talking about without any difficulty.

Will you be staying in Tokyo ?

Just the monday night after the gp in tokyo, rest of the time down in nagoya.

From what I've seen of the trailers and what you've said here it certainly looks like I do need to make the effort, seems to be quite a limited release though

[highdownforce]

You might find it in Brazil.

It's different.
Here in Brazil, the memory of Ayrton is the one of a fighter and someone with a spirit that you probably won't find in a Brazilian racer ever again.
Senna as the last representative of a string of successful (in F1) Brazilian drivers that become notorious in the country when Fittipaldi was driving for Lotus. Then there was Piquet and after him Senna.

The memories of the average Brazilian people about him, despite of great admiration, are memories of a dead hero.
Always in the past tense, always nostalgic and always regretful.

Nelson and Ayrton, but specially Senna, were capable of making F1 attractive even for viewers that didn't follow any other sport, or even the average public for soap operas!

I know a lot of people that never boded to watch a full race again after Imola 94.
Austria 2002 was another blow for Brazilian viewers/fans.
As Germany 2010 also was.

I see the Japanese fans with a much more optimistic view of Senna.
Definately, Senna is more alive in Japan.

In Brazil, he is greatly missed.

[Collective]

I knew it! Disgusting! And I'll bet Senna himself would say as much.
Their bias diminishes their work.

Haven't even watched it and I already hate it. Guess it's the easy way to get people behind the main character.

One word for doing that: LAME

[kosmic33]

Haven't even watched it and I already hate it. Guess it's the easy way to get people behind the main character.

One word for doing that: LAME

One word for this post: YAWN

[molive]

I see the Japanese fans with a much more optimistic view of Senna.
Definately, Senna is more alive in Japan.

In Brazil, he is greatly missed.

Well put.

[King Six]

I think it's bordering on ridiculous the almost god like figure the late Ayrton Senna is becoming

[mtknot]

I think it's bordering on ridiculous the almost god like figure the late Ayrton Senna is becoming

sadly, I do believe this is an opinion thats shifting from subjectivity to objectivity...

[Dolph]

his
in-board greetings to Prost during warm-up at Imola in 1994

Could you ellaborate on that please?

[kenny]

Could you ellaborate on that please?

Prost was commentator for TF1, and Senna would, live during the warm-up commentate on 1 lap of the Imola track... before he began he said from onboard his car: 'I would like to say hello to my dear friend Alain, we miss you.'...

[Craven Morehead]

Ayrton addresses Alain on TV broadcast Imola 1994

[Thunderpants]

I think part of the explanation for Senna's popularity in Japan is because of the large number of Brazilians living in Japan and Japanese living in Brazil.
Other reasons are that Senna was just phenomenal, committed and brought Honda so much success.

[Chezrome]

YES! DAMN those people who share a different opinion to you!

There's a big difference between opinion and fact. Fact is that Senna showed very clearly at the end of his career that he considered Prost the best opponent he ever had, and also, after the hatred of the competition, he considered Prost a friend. And even the Brazilians knew that, shortly after Senna died. Hence, Prost could go to Brazil and talk to Aertons fans without problems.

You can jump and down about your own opinions about Prost, but you can't deny THAT fact. So if a movie does not show that respect, it's a minus.

[FlatOverCrest]

I truly could not care less about the petty juvenile 'my driver is better than your driver' crap that often goes on here on this forum... suffice to say, that Senna was one of F1's greats and I for one will be looking forward to watching this film, even if I just learn a tiny amount more about the guy, that I didnt know before I walked into the cinema.....

[Ferrim]

Ayrton addresses Alain on TV broadcast Imola 1994

If you look at the timing, that lap by Senna was around 1 minute and 22 seconds. I took the bridge at the straight as a reference.

Senna's best lap of the weekend was... 1 minute, 21 seconds, 548 thousands. I'm stunned right now, I can't believe he could drive nearly as quick as a qualifying lap while he was giving all that info about the track and the corners. When I began watching, I was expecting a lap time clearly over the 1 minute and 25 seconds...

[Craven Morehead]

Yes. It's a fantastic clip. Senna was something else..

[FlatOverCrest]

If you look at the timing, that lap by Senna was around 1 minute and 22 seconds. I took the bridge at the straight as a reference.

Senna's best lap of the weekend was... 1 minute, 21 seconds, 548 thousands. I'm stunned right now, I can't believe he could drive nearly as quick as a qualifying lap while he was giving all that info about the track and the corners. When I began watching, I was expecting a lap time clearly over the 1 minute and 25 seconds...

To be honest, it's not that surprising.

A driver is thinking these things every lap he goes out, he just isn't verbalising them. It's not as if he is having a two way conversation for the whole lap, he is simply saying what his brain is thinking anyway. You could probably get a similar effect with any of the modern F1 guys if you mic'ed them up and asked them to do the same.

What is certainly impressive is how consistent he was.

[Bunchies]

To be honest, it's not that surprising.

A driver is thinking these things every lap he goes out, he just isn't verbalising them. It's not as if he is having a two way conversation for the whole lap, he is simply saying what his brain is thinking anyway. You could probably get a similar effect with any of the modern F1 guys if you mic'ed them up and asked them to do the same.

What is certainly impressive is how consistent he was.

We saw that last GP with Timo Glock.

Yeah, drivers are constantly going over what is ahead. "Bumpy x centimeters from the right side, touch the kerbs a little bit to maximize exit speed."

[BullHead]

I beleive most competitive circuit driving is subconscious anyway. If a driver thinks about what he doing in real time he slows himself down...

[Tenmantaylor]

Was under the impression Senna was Big in Japan due to having a Honda engine in the back of his McLaren's he acheived much of his success in. Did Senna have input in the development of Honda's NSX road car as claimed thusly? http://video.google....69878817702526# Amazing vid.

Edited by Tenmantaylor, 06 October 2010 - 00:18.

[aditya-now]

Was under the impression Senna was Big in Japan due to having a Honda engine in the back of his McLaren's he acheived much of his success in. Did Senna have input in the development of Honda's NSX road car as claimed thusly? http://video.google....69878817702526# Amazing vid.

Just blows you away - thanks for the link!

[aditya-now]

Oh, and, Tenmantaylor, nice new version of your avatar!!!

[hotstickyslick]

Was under the impression Senna was Big in Japan due to having a Honda engine in the back of his McLaren's he acheived much of his success in. Did Senna have input in the development of Honda's NSX road car as claimed thusly? http://video.google....69878817702526# Amazing vid.

All of the above and for his 'samurai' like attitude to F1.

Edited by hotstickyslick, 06 October 2010 - 02:42.

[Japan Time]

Was under the impression Senna was Big in Japan due to having a Honda engine in the back of his McLaren's he acheived much of his success in. Did Senna have input in the development of Honda's NSX road car as claimed thusly? http://video.google....69878817702526# Amazing vid.

Look how well he drives the NSX around Suzuka... Beautiful !

He would probably be ruling the WTCC now if he was still with us.

Or maybe he would be fighting Prost in Trophee Andros every winter ???

[Polle]

There's a big difference between opinion and fact. Fact is that Senna showed very clearly at the end of his career that he considered Prost the best opponent he ever had, and also, after the hatred of the competition, he considered Prost a friend. And even the Brazilians knew that, shortly after Senna died. Hence, Prost could go to Brazil and talk to Aertons fans without problems.

You can jump and down about your own opinions about Prost, but you can't deny THAT fact. So if a movie does not show that respect, it's a minus.

If I could remember, this is a movie using archived footage which could confuse people thinking that it was a documentary. If this was a documentary, then yes I agree. Getting the facts 100% right is not a movie director's job. Movie's will distort information to create tension and cause people to form oppinions. In this case it succeeded.

So

Movie =/= Doco

If you were looking for facts only then well this movie wasn't right for you

[agent99]

Thanks for the review. Looking forward to seeing it next year.

I've a couple of questions about the film that should satisfy my curiosity until its UK release:

Presumably it does actually mention the friendship between Berger and Senna, even if Gerhard himself isn't interviewed?

Also, as a film soundtrack nut (almost as big as my obsession with F1) I'd be interested to find out whether the score is mainly new composed music or whether they've used actual songs, if so what? I know it's a random question but the use and choice of music in TV and film is a strange interest of mine.

Thirdly, how human interest is it? Do we get a mills and boon chapter about him and Xuxa etc or are we spared that?

Oh and what sort of 'exclusive footage' is there? More holidaying in Angra sort of thing or something different?

Ta for the info.

[holiday]

A tad bit biased towards Prost, who is primarily presented as a
political animal more than an accomplished sportsman... Shame !

Can't they still stomach the fact that the Prost lead him in 30 or so of 32 races in the championship?