40 replies to this topic

[Igor_E]

Hi all,

Here is my first "new" topic. I'm looking for an article, or story about people who waved checkered flags at GPs back in 60s, 70s, and 80s. I came across few bits and bites and I want to find out more. I read about one guy in Australia (80s) who had absolutely crazy moves and waves, another guy in Spain (that was 70s), who was wearing red pants, there was another guy in Canada, making mad leaps (60s). They were there on the track, just few feet from the cars crossing the finish line at full speed. Here are few absolutely amazing photos from my collection, they will "tell" you why I'm interested in this topic.


Berger - 1987 Australian GP



Lauda - 1974 Spanish GP


Brabham - 1967 Canadian GP

Best Regards
Igor

[RA Historian]

Then there is Toto Roche, who probably deserves a thread of his own for his various antics with flags in France.

Tom

[Igor_E]

Then there is Toto Roche, who probably deserves a thread of his own for his various antics with flags in France.

Tom

Hi Tom,

Yeah, that guy was in 50s and I've seen only few images of him. Is there a good article or site with more info?

Igor

[Rob]

IIRC, Glen Dix was the Australian flag waver.

[Quixotic]

IIRC, Glen Dix was the Australian flag waver.

and he is still going strong I believe..........

[watkins]

There was also Tex Hopkins, famous for his jumping style of waving the green and checkered flags (along with his lavender suits and big cigars) for many years at Watkins Glen. You can see him in action in the following video:

[RA Historian]

Hi Tom,

Yeah, that guy was in 50s and I've seen only few images of him. Is there a good article or site with more info?

Igor

There should be something around on him, I would imagine. I recall back in the fifties that just about every report on the French GP made mention of Roche making a fool of himself and bungling the flag duties in some way or other. I recall one year when he almost got run over.
Tom

[f1steveuk]

And at the other end, those that dropped the flag at the start. I recall a start at Brands' in the 60s, with the starter up a moveable stair case, by the time he'd drop the flag, and they had start to pull the stairs back, the cars were on him. A very close call, that caused some "antics"!!!

[Igor_E]

There was also Tex Hopkins, famous for his jumping style of waving the green and checkered flags (along with his lavender suits and big cigars) for many years at Watkins Glen. You can see him in action in the following video:

This is getting interesting. BTW, another two images, both French GP - 1961 and 1964, both signed by Gurney, 1961 his great battle with Baghetti and a victory in 1964.

Then the fat guy with the flag on 1961 photo must be Toto Roche, the second one is another mad man ready to be run over





Igor

Edited by Igor_E, 19 October 2010 - 16:19.

[bill p]

Then there is Toto Roche, who probably deserves a thread of his own for his various antics with flags in France.

Tom

Didn't Louis Chiron at the Monaco GP perform life threatening flag dropping as well??

[Macca]

In the '74 Spanish GP finish at Jarama, I think it is Luca de Montezemolo leaping in the air, celebrating Lauda's first GP win and the first for Ferrari for nearly 2 years.

The man with the flag is some prince who was Clerk of the Course, I forget his name but he was in the prgrammes of old F1 highlights which have been on ESPN Classic regularly in the UK over the last few years.

Paul M

[alansart]

Then there is Toto Roche, who probably deserves a thread of his own for his various antics with flags in France.

Tom

...and had to run at the start in Casablanca!

http://jbbassibey.fr...oche_depart.jpg

[Igor_E]

In the '74 Spanish GP finish at Jarama, I think it is Luca de Montezemolo leaping in the air, celebrating Lauda's first GP win and the first for Ferrari for nearly 2 years.

The man with the flag is some prince who was Clerk of the Course, I forget his name but he was in the prgrammes of old F1 highlights which have been on ESPN Classic regularly in the UK over the last few years.

Paul M

That's right. The "leaper" is di Montezemolo. I hope to have that photo signed by him as well. One of the books about Ferrari says that after the finish when Montezemolo phoned Enzo, old man commented on Montezemolo's suit

[ReWind]

The man with the flag is some prince who was Clerk of the Course.

José María Padierna y Avecilla, Conde de Villapadierna?

[john winfield]

Rather like Suzy, on another thread, who was amazed that more officials and photographers weren't mown down as cars left grids in the 1960s and 1970s, I was always expecting a start/finish line flag official to be upended or worse. As well as those mentioned above, the one that sticks in my mind is the flag official at Monza in 1971 who does his best to wave the tricolore at Peter Gethin and the rest as they thunder past, and is nearly hit by Jo Bonnier who is politely trying to keep out of the way on a tight line out of the Parabolica. Old Silverstone Woodcote looked risky too, standing on the track stretching out towards the racing line, hoping that some Mad Dog wouldn't lose it in a final corner do or die effort.
Talking of Silverstone, I like the flag work at the beginning of the 1971 British GP. From the safety of the pit gantry, poor Dean Delamont raises the Union Jack, holds it aloft a little too long, Regazzoni goes, DD still holds the flag high, Regga stops (half way to Copse), Fittipaldi follows the Ferrari, the front row is swamped, Ickx comes through from the third row, Oliver hits Hill at the back...all good fun. These modern lights are so dull by comparison!

Edited by john winfield, 19 October 2010 - 20:06.

[raceannouncer2003]

Didn't Louis Chiron at the Monaco GP perform life threatening flag dropping as well??

1962 Monaco GP start. Photo by Ted Langton-Adams, copyright Eric Faulks.

Vince H.

[john winfield]

1962 Monaco GP start. Photo by Ted Langton-Adams, copyright Eric Faulks.

Vince H.

Vince, I just love the complete fearlessness / lack of imagination of the man! I think I would have at least stood just behind that piece of Armco.

[raceannouncer2003]

Vince, I just love the complete fearlessness / lack of imagination of the man! I think I would have at least stood just behind that piece of Armco.

I think he jumped back over the Armco just after this!

Vince H.

[jj2728]

From dad's archives, Mid-Ohio 1973....

[scheivlak]

Not a flagman, but certainly in a strange position:

http://www.racehisto...rix/gp67(2).JPG

[Lee Nicolle]

Glen Dix, the Aussie starter waved flags for several decades and I am sure could still do it now.He did it at most forms of motorsport here in South Australia and on occasion some other states too. He was an excellent starter with the flag and later with the lights. And 10 seconds meant 10 seconds.And very flamboyant with the chequered flag.
He is well involved with the Mallala circuit, sometimes selling souveneirs, collecting money for shed rental and doing general work with Clem Smith around the facility.
And he does know about the dangers, in the early 70s he was run down by an errant TQ midget at Rowley Park speedway which broke his kneecap. But he stayed until the end of the meeting to watch the Supermodified Feature race! before going to hospital.
In those days he is well remembered for riding around the track on the nerf bars of Bill Wigzells Supermod with the chequered flag on the victory lap. A feat he replicated on the final night of that track in 1979.

[AnnieOz]

one of the great things about Glen Dix was that he gave every driver the exact same quality of wave regardless of where they finished. Always with a great flourish, and as Lee suggested, with an eye on the cars. He used to start handicaps on track as well, starting flag, clipboard and stopwatch in hand and he never got them mixed. A total gentleman who sadly gave up when powers to be said that he couldn't wave the flag on the track but had to be behind the barrier.

[wenoopy]

Surely "Tex" Hopkins of the Watkins Glen was the earliest "flamboyant" chequered flag waver (and starter) in Grand Prix racing. Was he an "original" or simply carrying on an earlier flag-waving tradition from oval-track racing in the USA.

His style is very clear in my mind, but pictures are hard to find. Phil Kerr's book (To Finish First) has one (page 254), and Googling his name produces 2 mid-leap US GP photos ; one start and one finish (and also Anthony Hopkins!!). Do any Watkins Glen regulars have any pictures?

[MCS]

Not a flagman, but certainly in a strange position:

http://www.racehisto...rix/gp67(2).JPG

Now that is definitely worrying. What on earth is the story behind this one?

[RA Historian]

Now that is definitely worrying. What on earth is the story behind this one?

We can eliminate deranged clergy wearing a kilt.

[theracer120]

Not a flagman, but certainly in a strange position:

http://www.racehisto...rix/gp67(2).JPG

That could have been tragic.

[raceannouncer2003]

Surely "Tex" Hopkins of the Watkins Glen was the earliest "flamboyant" chequered flag waver (and starter) in Grand Prix racing. Was he an "original" or simply carrying on an earlier flag-waving tradition from oval-track racing in the USA.

His style is very clear in my mind, but pictures are hard to find. Phil Kerr's book (To Finish First) has one (page 254), and Googling his name produces 2 mid-leap US GP photos ; one start and one finish (and also Anthony Hopkins!!). Do any Watkins Glen regulars have any pictures?

Yes. I checked on the 1959 and 1960 USGPs at Sebring and Riverside. Jesse Coleman was apparently starter for both. I looked at British Pathe footage of the Sebring start, and Coleman didn't appear to be a "leaper." I believe TNFer Frank Sheffield worked with Coleman, who has been mentioned elsewhere on the forum.

Vince H.

[rateus]

Now that is definitely worrying. What on earth is the story behind this one?

Mike Lang's report on this race (Dutch GP '67) merely notes that an "over-enthusiastic official" was still standing on the grid between the 2 Coopers on the second row when the flag was dropped. The man with the best view, in the middle of row 3, was that year's WC, Denny Hulme. Somehow he (and everyone else) managed to avoid the interloper...

[john winfield]

Mike Lang's report on this race (Dutch GP '67) merely notes that an "over-enthusiastic official" was still standing on the grid between the 2 Coopers on the second row when the flag was dropped. The man with the best view, in the middle of row 3, was that year's WC, Denny Hulme. Somehow he (and everyone else) managed to avoid the interloper...

I can understand how, more recently (1980s?), a mechanic wasn't seen by the start line officials as he tended to the back of a car well down the grid, but this incident beggars belief! Perhaps the flag man had a grudge against him...
'Plenty of time yet old chap, could you just check row three are lined up properly? Good fellow. No, no, of course I won't drop the flag early.' (Snigger)

I wonder if young Mr. Hugenholtz knows anything about it.

[ryan86]

From Wikipedia

The Belgian Grand Prix of 1981 was marred by two serious incidents involving mechanics, one fatal. In Friday practice a mechanic from the Osella team, Giovanni Amadeo, stumbled off the pitwall into the path of the Williams of Carlos Reutemann. Reutemann was unable to avoid the mechanic, who suffered a fractured skull. He died from his injuries on the Monday after the race. Before the start of the race the mechanics of all the teams staged a protest over the safety measures protecting them, which was soon joined by several drivers who left their cars. The race organisers nevertheless flagged the warm-up lap at the normal time, leaving several cars delayed on the grid, either stalled or with their cockpits vacant. The resulting chaos when the grid formed up again at the end of this lap was exacerbated when Nelson Piquet missed his starting position and was sent round on another lap, with the other cars being held in position. As the cars began to overheat, several drivers turned off their engines, among them Arrows driver Riccardo Patrese, expecting another formation lap due to Piquet's error. However, the organisers began the start sequence as usual once Piquet had regained his position. Patrese was unable to restart his car and waved his arms to signal that he could not take the start. His mechanic, Dave Luckett, instantly came onto the track to restart the car from behind. But after he got onto the track, the lighting sequence to start the race had already begun, and the start went ahead despite the presence of Luckett and Patrese's gesticulations. In the confusion and likely unable to see Patrese's stalled car, the other Arrows driver, Siegfried Stohr, ploughed into the back of his team-mate's car, hitting Luckett. Luckett suffered a broken leg and lacerations but survived the incident. As a result of these events, a new rule was introduced forbidding mechanics from being on the grid within fifteen seconds of the formation lap, and the race starter would use greater caution

[Tim Murray]

Mike Lang's report on this race (Dutch GP '67) merely notes that an "over-enthusiastic official" was still standing on the grid between the 2 Coopers on the second row when the flag was dropped. The man with the best view, in the middle of row 3, was that year's WC, Denny Hulme. Somehow he (and everyone else) managed to avoid the interloper...

Here's what DSJ wrote in Motor Sport:

With 30 seconds to go and the engine notes rising, an official was seen wandering amongst the cars, trying to persuade Rodriguez to move back a bit! As he turned to Rindt’s car the flag dropped and Hulme and Surtees were completely put off as they avoided the man, and they in turn baulked those behind them. More by luck than judgement the man was not killed, and he joined the other race officials by the side of the track.

[Tufty]

With 30 seconds to go and the engine notes rising, an official was seen wandering amongst the cars, trying to persuade Rodriguez to move back a bit! As he turned to Rindt’s car the flag dropped and Hulme and Surtees were completely put off as they avoided the man, and they in turn baulked those behind them. More by luck than judgement the man was not killed, and he joined the other race officials by the side of the track

Idiot!!! I didn't think start procedures required accurate placings back then anyway - what on earth was he playing at?

[tyrrellp346wheels]

Does anyone know the last time a flag was used to start a world championship f1 grand prix.

This is a great thread by the way and imo, Glen Dix was probaly the most enthusiastic and best.

[scheivlak]

Does anyone know the last time a flag was used to start a world championship f1 grand prix.

This is a great thread by the way and imo, Glen Dix was probaly the most enthusiastic and best.

The search function brought me this: http://forums.autosp...w...284&hl=flag post #4

So, the last time a flag was used to start a WDC GP would have been the 1977 German GP.

[Frank S]

The search function brought me this: http://forums.autosp...w...284&hl=flag post #4

So, the last time a flag was used to start a WDC GP would have been the 1977 German GP.

Not to offend, but I'm sometimes a little disappointed when someone answers a question like that; I'm afraid it will put an end to a nicely rolling thread of information and conjecture.

[tyrrellp346wheels]

There was a person who used to wave the chequred flag at the hungarian grand prix on the track in the early 90's but not as enthusiastic as glen dix.

http://en.espnf1.com.....page=2;page=2

Btw thanks for the link.

Edited by tyrrellp346wheels, 22 October 2010 - 07:35.

[Igor_E]

Hi all,
Thanks to everyone. This is great info, I really appreciate it. Keep the topic rolling :-)
By the way, does anyone know how to contact Glen Dix?
Best Regards
Igor

[tyrrellp346wheels]

Don't know whats going on here, that photographer looks close

http://gforcef1.file.../untitled31.jpg

[Igor_E]

Here is another interesting pic. Sir Stirling's great victory at the 1960 Monaco GP. (actually, one of my favourite photos) Who is the finisher? I heard or read somewhere that it was his father. It it true?

[oldtransamdriver]

Hi all,

Here is my first "new" topic. I'm looking for an article, or story about people who waved checkered flags at GPs back in 60s, 70s, and 80s. I came across few bits and bites and I want to find out more. I read about one guy in Australia (80s) who had absolutely crazy moves and waves, another guy in Spain (that was 70s), who was wearing red pants, there was another guy in Canada, making mad leaps (60s). They were there on the track, just few feet from the cars crossing the finish line at full speed. Here are few absolutely amazing photos from my collection, they will "tell" you why I'm interested in this topic.


Berger - 1987 Australian GP



Lauda - 1974 Spanish GP


Brabham - 1967 Canadian GP

Best Regards
Igor

This looks like Wally Branston, long-time starter at Mosport and former stock car racer at the CNE oval track in Toronto.

Robert Barg

Edited by oldtransamdriver, 22 October 2010 - 17:04.

[SJ Lambert]

Hi all,
Thanks to everyone. This is great info, I really appreciate it. Keep the topic rolling :-)
By the way, does anyone know how to contact Glen Dix?
Best Regards
Igor

Yes, you could try making contact through the Mallala Raceway (racing track near Adelaide).