72 replies to this topic

[jannyg]

Im just curious to see everyones reasoning as to why Chandhok is rated so highly on these forums. I read alot of the topics on here, particularly the silly season thread and it seems forumers mention Chandhok's name as a contender for most of the empty seats.

Obviously there is the financial benefit of KC driving for Force India, but as everyone nowaydays complains about the best drivers not getting the best seats i see the opinion of him driving for FI as very contradictory. Some reasoning is that Chandhok is a nice guy; this is not a valid reason for a good f1 drive.

KC did well under the circumstances in Bahrain, however Senna was faster than him much more times than not.

Would like to hear some opinions on this.

[Andy35]

Interestingly I remember him more as a commentator now than a driver .. already! Speaks a lot, a lot makes sense, very intelligent. Speaks a lot.

Speaks a lot

Andy

[KateLM]

Im just curious to see everyones reasoning as to why Chandhok is rated so highly on these forums. I read alot of the topics on here, particularly the silly season thread and it seems forumers mention Chandhok's name as a contender for most of the empty seats.

Obviously there is the financial benefit of KC driving for Force India, but as everyone nowaydays complains about the best drivers not getting the best seats i see the opinion of him driving for FI as very contradictory. Some reasoning is that Chandhok is a nice guy; this is not a valid reason for a good f1 drive.

KC did well under the circumstances in Bahrain, however Senna was faster than him much more times than not.

Would like to hear some opinions on this.

I don't really get it either, but I suspect that it is the fact that he's such a nice guy influences quite a few opinions of him.

He's not terrible at all, but I haven't seen anything from his entire career to suggest he is anything special either. He could probably have a fairly decent career in a series like Superleague or even GT1, but I don't think he will ever be more than competant in F1.

[sosidge]

His popularity is entirely because he was an occasional guest commentator on BBC 5Live practice threads and came across and very knowledgeable and an all-round "good chap".

I don't think anyone is under the impression that he is a great driver. He probably outperformed expectations relative to Senna this year, but then again, perhaps Senna was actually weaker than the pre-season assumptions.

His popularity on this board is understandably bewildering to the non-UK-resident contributors!

Edited by sosidge, 12 December 2010 - 12:46.

[SparkPlug]

Im just curious to see everyones reasoning as to why Chandhok is rated so highly on these forums. I read alot of the topics on here, particularly the silly season thread and it seems forumers mention Chandhok's name as a contender for most of the empty seats.

Obviously there is the financial benefit of KC driving for Force India, but as everyone nowaydays complains about the best drivers not getting the best seats i see the opinion of him driving for FI as very contradictory. Some reasoning is that Chandhok is a nice guy; this is not a valid reason for a good f1 drive.

KC did well under the circumstances in Bahrain, however Senna was faster than him much more times than not.

Would like to hear some opinions on this.

KC generally had the upper hand on Senna if I remember correctly.

However neither he or Senna are worthy of their seats IMO, atleast not on the basis of their 2010 performances. Chandhok was only very slightly faster than Senna, and Yammamoto who is possibly one of the worst drivers of all time was very very close to Senna.

[jjcale]

Its a myth that he is rated highly... by anybody.

He liked. That's different.

[marcoferrari]

Im just curious to see everyones reasoning as to why Chandhok is rated so highly on these forums. I read alot of the topics on here, particularly the silly season thread and it seems forumers mention Chandhok's name as a contender for most of the empty seats.

Obviously there is the financial benefit of KC driving for Force India, but as everyone nowaydays complains about the best drivers not getting the best seats i see the opinion of him driving for FI as very contradictory. Some reasoning is that Chandhok is a nice guy; this is not a valid reason for a good f1 drive.

KC did well under the circumstances in Bahrain, however Senna was faster than him much more times than not.

Would like to hear some opinions on this.

I like Karun as a person, too... It is true, that he wasn t quicker then Senna, BUT he was clearly more reliable... He brought the car home in 8 out of 10 races, which is something that Senna wasn t able to achieve... And when you look at results, both have almost the same... Karun finished 2x 14th and Senna only once, in later part of the season... I think both are drivers, who showed more pace during race then in qualifying, which is good, cause there are also drivers, who just show some strong pace in qualifying and then in race they just slowly fade (Yamamoto, Hulkenberg, Buemi, for example)... If I had the possibility to make a decision, I would give to Karun another chance, maybe in Force India beside Adrian Sutil... I think he said his big idol is Alain Prost and he quite raced in his style - being not the quickest, but one of those most reliable...

[johnmhinds]

Its a myth that he is rated highly... by anybody.

He liked. That's different.

Yeah I feel that is the case overall, he didn't really blow away anyone with his performance on the track, but the off track PR he was doing for himself was excellent.

I wouldn't be surprised if Bernie was acting behind the scenes trying to get him into a team because of the new Indian GP this year.

[primer]

People have a positive opinion of KC because everyone was expecting another Narain, if not an Alex Yoong. KC has hardly set the lower series on fire, and he was erratic (to say the least) in GP2. So when people see him not being as bad as they expected, they swing in other direction and praise him undeservedly.

It is the same reason people are down on Bruno Senna, due to his name and some GP2 results people started expecting way more than he could possibly deliver. Thus he is rated lower in most people's estimation.

I'd rate Bruno as better than Karun, but not by any wide margins.

[SpeedFanatic]

His recent GP2 test shows once again he is not F1 material.

[Ashitank]

I think Karun has the ability to deliver but needs good opportunity and bit of Luck.

Compared to Bruno who has been provided all the assistance & coaching & grooming all the way up-to GP2 & F1 , Karun has not only performed equally well but beat senna , I think to me that conforms he has got the talent and will shine given the right opportunity.

[primer]

His recent GP2 test shows once again he is not F1 material.

He tested a GP2 car? What for, I thought he was angling for a drive at Force India.

[Longtimefan]

Given a FULL season in F1, I think he would impress.

and yes, he is a very likable guy, his twitter is one of my most favourites and as a commentator he embarrassed the regulars with his insight and passion for F1 and its history.

he deserves a seat imo..

[ManiaMuse]

I think he's probably going to go the way of Anthony Davidson.

Shame he didn't get more of a chance to make a name of himself. But I just don't think he has a chance to get back into F1 now, there are way too many young and fast drivers competing for very few seats, especially with guys like Barrichello and Schuey sticking around for so many years.

Karun is a pretty clever guy, I'm sure he is considering any possibility of getting back into F1, but I'm sure he is looking at alternative options as well. I just don't think he is quite quick enough, nor does he have enough sponsorship right at the moment. I'm sure he would be capable of doing well in other series.

I do rate him above Bruno Senna though.

Edited by ManiaMuse, 12 December 2010 - 15:32.

[primer]

and yes, he is a very likable guy, his twitter is one of my most favourites and as a commentator he embarrassed the regulars with his insight and passion for F1 and its history.

he deserves a seat imo..

A seat in the commentary booth?








(har, har)

[sushantf1]

I think he deserves a race seat at Force India to see how he performs in a comparatively stronger car....he is a nice bloke but F1 is not about being nice see the world champions of past......and I think Bruno senna lalli desilva or whatever god knows what???? needs to write a book on his Uncle

[DavidJoeF1]

There are so many good drivers moving through the junior ranks that a driver has to demonstrate his ability quickly and have backing from sponsors usually. Chandok definitely does not meet this requirement. Problem for him is that Senna has shown his ability in GP2 and was more importantly quicker in 2010. Being quick is the most vital ingredient for an f1 drive.

And with Hulkenberg available, Mallyah cannot be expected to use nationality as the deciding criteria.

[ManiaMuse]

I think he deserves a race seat at Force India to see how he performs in a comparatively stronger car....he is a nice bloke but F1 is not about being nice see the world champions of past......and I think Bruno senna lalli desilva or whatever god knows what???? needs to write a book on his Uncle

Not going to happen. There's quite a bit of bad blood between KC's dad and VJ.

[DavidJoeF1]

I think he's probably going to go the way of Anthony Davidson.

Davidson is now part of the Peugot endurance team and demonstrated his speed at Le Mans. Nothing wrong with that.

Anyway, Chandhok should forget f1 and investigate a drive in the US. He is not an incompetent driver and in the US drivers that have not done too well in Britain and the Continent have done well. Maybe even try for the DTM because he did very well in v6 Asia.

[DavidJoeF1]

Not going to happen. There's quite a bit of bad blood between KC's dad and VJ.

If Chandhok were a Vettel, it would be amazing how quickly they would overlook any differences!

[highdownforce]

KC generally had the upper hand on Senna if I remember correctly.

Sorry to point that out to you you, but you remember it very wrongly.

I don't think that HRT is an option.


Edit: For anyone looking for data, I offer this article by Sidepostcast. It's not updated (October) by it has nice info about the matter:
http://sidepodcast.c...m-like-hispania

More info about Bruno against his team mates for every race on the season:
http://www.f1fanatic...team-mate-2010/ (with really useful graphs)

Also, lots of info about the HRT season:
http://www.f1fanatic...010-statistics/ (take a look at average grid position and average finish position)

And, again and again, in Singapure, Korea as in Brazil Bruno lost the window for his hot lap. Be it by spinning on the previous lap or by not changing the tires.
He could have being beat any way, but this margin is not real.

I think that within the links that I've suggest you there's enough information about what to think concerning his season.

Edit2: As not everybody enjoys links...

Racing laps completed
Pos - Driver - Laps completed
18 - Timo Glock - 821
20 - Lucas di Grassi - 769
22 - Bruno Senna - 700
24 - Karun Chandhok - 479
25 - Sakon Yamamoto - 331
27 - Christian Klien - 149

Retirements (Drivers who complete more than 90% of a race distance are classified as finishers and not counted as retirements)
Driver - Mechanical - Accident - Total retirements
Bruno Senna - 7 - 2 - 9
Timo Glock - 7 - 2 - 9
Lucas di Grassi - 6 - 2 - 8
Karun Chandhok - 0 - 2 - 2
Sakon Yamamoto - 1 - 0 - 1
Christian Klien - 1 - 0 - 1

Average grid position
Pos - Driver - Average starting position
22 - Timo Glock - 20.1
23 - Lucas di Grassi - 21.9
24 - Bruno Senna - 22.3
25 - Sakon Yamamoto - 22.7
26 - Christian Klien - 23.0
27 - Karun Chandhok - 23.5

Average finishing position
Pos - Driver - Average finishing position
21 - Karun Chandhok - 16.88
23 - Bruno Senna - 17.44
24 - Lucas di Grassi - 17.60
25 - Timo Glock - 17.60
26 - Sakon Yamamoto - 18.17
27 - Christian Klien - 21.00

Qualifying comparison gap
Average advantage over team mate in seconds in the last part of qualifying in which both appeared.
Pos - Driver - Average gap to mate in same session
1 - Timo Glock - -1.86
4 - Christian Klien - -0.58
5 - Bruno Senna - -0.54
19 - Sakon Yamamoto - 0.21
26 - Karun Chandhok - 1.00
27 - Lucas di Grassi - 1.86

Edit: I've added Virgin's numbers in order to illustrate the HRT drivers performances better.

Edited by highdownforce, 12 December 2010 - 17:28.

[arknor]

His recent GP2 test shows once again he is not F1 material.

GP2 isnt a test of f1 material.. people have been good at gp2 and flopped in f1

[HopkinsonF1]

GP2 isnt a test of f1 material.. people have been good at gp2 and flopped in f1

And vice-versa. Lauda wasn't anything special in lower formulae, and Kobayashi's performed better in F1 than his feeder-series performances would have suggested.

[SpeedFanatic]

He tested a GP2 car? What for, I thought he was angling for a drive at Force India.

Here Abu Dhabi GP2 Test 2010

Day 3: 14.
Day 4: 19.

No mid field team is going to give him a seat.
HRT again or the commentary box.

Edited by SpeedFanatic, 12 December 2010 - 20:44.

[Rubens Hakkamacher]

Just to pile on, I think he's a great commentator as well. Although I'm not certain his on-site "inside" view doesn't have something to do with that - but he always seems to be on the strategy game perfectly, as well as having "driver perspective" comments that seem to translate to the Armchair Racer well.

[Kraken]

Chandhok was the best of the new team drivers by quite a margin when he lost his seat. There was an article in Autosport Plus that gave points on the basis of the old turbo/non-turbo days and he was 21 points up on Kovalainen before he went.

Edited by Kraken, 12 December 2010 - 21:26.

[Jackman]

His recent GP2 test shows once again he is not F1 material.

Why? Because he did a favour for his old team who had a rotten year with two rookies, and wanted to sort the car out?

[Jackman]

Not going to happen. There's quite a bit of bad blood between KC's dad and VJ.

Vicky and VJ have been great mates since before Karun was born.

[ivanalesi]

In general when there're just a few drivers in a championship(like in the second-tier F1 championship), often you can get very surprising results because of reliability issues. Some drivers have more luck & finish, but these results don't represent their true pace.
Karun is a very, very nice guy. He's very good with the media & he can explain things very well, but that's not enough to be a good driver. Otherwise he was slow in GP2, wasn't impressive for me at all even though he raced with iSport. It was normal that FI are overlooking him, actually Kartakayan(I can't spell his name) had much more impressive results in F3 & WSbN before F1.
Actually it's the same with Petrov, his performance was quite bad, but he was in such a good car that he managed to look impressive compared to all the other rookies. Actually he had just a couple of races where he managed to be on the pace.

[noikeee]

Chandhok was the best of the new team drivers by quite a margin when he lost his seat. There was an article in Autosport Plus that gave points on the basis of the old turbo/non-turbo days and he was 21 points up on Kovalainen before he went.

Mechanical retirements in the 10 races Chandhok did:

Chandhok - 1
Senna - 5
Glock - 5
di Grassi - 5
Trulli - 4
Kovalainen - 3

[DavidJoeF1]

And vice-versa. Lauda wasn't anything special in lower formulae, and Kobayashi's performed better in F1 than his feeder-series performances would have suggested.

Niki did not have loads of results, but he was notably quick from the get go during his days in Austria and in March f2 against established f1 drivers. He proved himself to be quick and, regardless of results, teams can spot someone with such natural ability.

Kobayashi was fortunate that he had the opportunity to race in the Toyota. If not for Timo Glock's accident his f1 career would have been over before it even started. But today it is different from Lauda's day and depending on lucky breaks such as Kamui's is not recommended. Furthermore, unless another team picks him, in 2012 then Kamui-san will be out of f1 as another Mexican driver is installed as Sauber by Mr. Carlos Slim.

At no point has Chandhok shown that he is better than average and with drivers like Vergne, Riicciardo, Mortara, Bianchi and Bottas for example on the horizon, all younger and solidly supported, his f1 career is now a hope only.

[Henrytheeigth]

Not to mention he was was a pain the behind backmarker at times as well lol, well most were

[jannyg]

It would be nice if somebody could place some accurate stats regarding Chandhok vs Senna.

The opinion that Chandhok was FASTER needs to be proven because me and quite a few others are not convinced

[Gyan]

He's done enough to get another shot at F1, by doing nothing wrong in a dog of a car.

He's a nice guy, and that helps at times too.

[tifosiMac]

He's a great commentator.

[Beyond]

he was not faster than senna. they were pretty close, on gp senna was better one gp karun, maybe senna a bit faster overall.

[Amphicar]

In many ways Karun Chandhok reminds me of Adam Khan, a British born driver of Pakistani descent, who drove for Pakistan in GP1 and drove the Renault F1 demonstrator. I met Adam at the Renault F1 open day at Enstone last year. Like Karun, Adam is charming, knowledgable and articulate (in Adam's case fluent in six languages). Excellent ambassadors for India and Pakistan respectively - and a dream from Bernie's point of view in their potential to spread the F! gospel to new markets. Unfortunately neither of them has really proved fast enough to break through into F1.

[Slam]

He's never set the world alight in any of the formulae he's competed in. I think in his 3 seasons in GP2 he finished 15th, 10th, and 18th in the championship. I think he's a decent bloke, and whilst he's not done a particularly bad job or anything, I think there are definately faster drivers who have not made it to F1.

[kenny]

It would be nice if somebody could place some accurate stats regarding Chandhok vs Senna.

The opinion that Chandhok was FASTER needs to be proven because me and quite a few others are not convinced

See highdownforce's post... it clearly shows Chandhok was not at all faster and I am amazed where people seem to get that idea...
AND they didnt even race the same car, all he new bits were on Chandhok/klien/yamamoto's car...

[Tsarwash]

Very strange. He seems to talk in a Welsh accent. A few times, I have tuned into 5live and thought to myself, 'who on earth have they managed to dig up from Wales that's interested in f1?'

[SparkPlug]

Sorry to point that out to you you, but you remember it very wrongly.



Edit: I've added Virgin's numbers in order to illustrate the HRT drivers performances better.

Ahh, thanks for that. I was just too busy looking at the Red Bulls, the Mclarens and the Ferraris fight it out at the front to notice the last 2 guys

Just thought that everytime I glanced down the order in Live timing, KC always seemed ahead.

[highdownforce]

Ahh, thanks for that. I was just too busy looking at the Red Bulls, the Mclarens and the Ferraris fight it out at the front to notice the last 2 guys

Just thought that everytime I glanced down the order in Live timing, KC always seemed ahead.

That's because the huge number of retirements from Senna and also from the Virgin's drivers.
Both used to be placed ahead of Chandhok when they have some mechanical failure.

[F1Newbie]

Based on his relationship on twitter with some journalists, he seems an acquiescent person. He should stick to the commentator role.

[TheCustomer]

Yeah, Karun is clearly a nice guy, with a lot of F1 knowledge, who adds colour to commentaries.

And he's also the guy who was heading the 'unofficial' junior teams' championship, ahead of Heikki K, until he lost his drive. So that should count in his favor.

HRT had less pre-season track time than any other team, so their drivers had to bring the team up to speed quickly. For one of those drivers to be best of the new teams by mid-season is no mean feat.

There's the 'package reliability' argument. Yeah, the new teams struggled with mechanical reliability [usually hydraulics] , and drivers struggled to keep their cars on the road.
We don't know how often a 'driver error' was triggered by being distracted (or caused) by a mechanical degradation.
& remember, some drivers break their cars... and it goes down as a 'mechanical' retirement.

Compare…
Retirements (Drivers who complete more than 90% of a race distance are classified as finishers and not counted as retirements)
Driver - Mechanical - Accident - Total retirements
Bruno Senna - 7 - 2 - 9
Timo Glock - 7 - 2 - 9
Lucas di Grassi - 6 - 2 - 8
Karun Chandhok - 0 - 2 - 2
Sakon Yamamoto - 1 - 0 - 1
Christian Klien - 1 - 0 - 1
[from Highdownforce, above - thanks!]

You'd have to look at that list and say there's only one driver that didn't cause a retirement. Karun Chandhook

Qualifying differentials tell a similar story - Karun 1sec ahead of his teammate - only Lucas di Grassi has a better record.

====

I can't help feeling that if Karun could buy himself a seat, he'd be on the list for any team looking for a pay-driver. especially with so many GPs in Se asia, + the Indian event.

& if you were looking for a 3d driver who's great at PR, and can clearly jump into a car, drive it quickly, and bring it home… and not looking for a stellar salary…

Who else would you choose?

Edited by TheCustomer, 13 December 2010 - 13:40.

[hughcdavies]

Very strange. He seems to talk in a Welsh accent. A few times, I have tuned into 5live and thought to myself, 'who on earth have they managed to dig up from Wales that's interested in f1?'

ME

I'd like to see Karun in an F1 car (HRTs are not F1 cars in my opinion) just to see what he could do. I rate him better than Bruno, but that's because I don't rate Bruno at all.

[highdownforce]

You'd have to look at that list and say there's only one driver that didn't cause a retirement. Karun Chandhook

Qualifying differentials tell a similar story - Karun 1sec ahead of his teammate - only Lucas di Grassi has a better record.

Sorry mate, but you have misunderstood the stats.

It's exactly the opposite to what you're saying.
By F1Fanatic numbers (those above) Karun is the only driver that DID NOT retired because of a problem with the car.
Average Qualifying differences implies the Karun was the second WORST qualifier when compared to his team mate, just ahead of Di Grassi.
Note that even Yamamoto had a better record.

By this average, obviously Glock had the better results, Klien was 4th on the list and Senna behind him as 5th.

the only stat that could make him look good is the Average finishing position, but that is related to retirements from other drivers.

[TheCustomer]

Sorry mate, but you have misunderstood the stats.

It's exactly the opposite to what you're saying.
By F1Fanatic numbers (those above) Karun is the only driver that DID NOT retired because of a problem with the car.
Average Qualifying differences implies the Karun was the second WORST qualifier when compared to his team mate, just ahead of Di Grassi.
Note that even Yamamoto had a better record.

By this average, obviously Glock had the better results, Klien was 4th on the list and Senna behind him as 5th.

the only stat that could make him look good is the Average finishing position, but that is related to retirements from other drivers.

ah, ok - thanks!

hmmm... if he's that slow... and retires... how the heck did autosport have him leading the junior champ at silverstone?!
He must've you know, overtaken some people!

[Collective]

According to Sniff Petrol there was a proposal for the 2013 rules that re-classified Karun Chandhok as a "removable device."

It didn't go through.

[kenny]

ah, ok - thanks!

hmmm... if he's that slow... and retires... how the heck did autosport have him leading the junior champ at silverstone?!
He must've you know, overtaken some people!

Reliabilty... cars in front of him just kept retiring...

[sosidge]

ah, ok - thanks!

hmmm... if he's that slow... and retires... how the heck did autosport have him leading the junior champ at silverstone?!
He must've you know, overtaken some people!

The new teams were almost completely crap in the early part of the season, and rarely finished. Meanwhile Chandhok got a lucky result (Malaysia? Australia?) which was what made HRT finish ahead of Virgin in the constructors at the end of the season. This may well account for him "leading" the second division at that point.

Anyone watching the actual races could see that he was not as quick as Senna (although he was not as far behind him as was expected).